Amazon closing its Fresh and Go stores

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/amazon-closing-fresh-grocery-convenience-150437789.html

by trenning • 6 months ago

315 545 6 months ago

finance.yahoo.com

https://www.cnn.com/2026/01/27/food/amazon-fresh-go-closures

https://www.wsj.com/business/retail/amazon-to-shut-down-all-...

Once their vision for "grab and go" vanished due to technological infeasibility [1] the entire premise for the stores vanished as well.

I suspect that they wanted to take a hail marry to see if somehow it was possible to get much greater efficiency compared to standard grocers, and it looks like that failed.

[1] it may come back. The technology is rapidly improving but they have bigger fish to fry ATM.

ge96• 6 months ago

What's interesting I know of a company in the industrial space that is trying to do this still (stuff on a shelf, grab and go, no human interaction).

add-sub-mul-div• 6 months ago

Did the humans pretending to be the AI unionize?

willio58• 6 months ago

I thought they already did close them.

I know at some point they got caught basically paying people to watch cameras to figure out what products people we're grabbing. I'm sure were either at the point or very close to the point where AI can successfully do this basically 100% of the time.

So I doubt it's the tech aspect of this, more just the grossness a person feels walking into a store with Amazon's name on it. Compare this to whole foods.

fencepost3• 6 months ago

I think the Go stores mostly bit the dust after that reveal, but they were also mostly small convenience store operations. I actually saw one at the airport recently, that's a situation where I can see it making sense as an option.

The Fresh stores are basically a conventional grocery store, with electronic tags for every item and quirky pricing. They also have "smart carts" with built in weight sensing and multiple cameras so you can basically put open bags in, say "ready to go" then shop by scanning a UPC before placing each item in the cart. Unscanned item? Error. Weight mismatch? Probably an error but I've never tried. The carts are running what looks like a Linux-based UI with some stuff in docker, I grabbed a picture of a shutdown screen on one not too long ago.

xnx• 6 months ago

Coincidentally(?) they are open their first big box retail store: https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2026/01/09/amazon-plans-first-big-b...

brightball• 6 months ago

That will be interesting to watch.

rob74• 6 months ago

When I saw the picture at the start of the article, I briefly thought they would do it like IKEA and let people pick the articles directly from the Amazon warehouse...

joezydeco• 6 months ago

If you've ever been in a Fresh store, that's kind of what it was as well. I saw maybe 20% off-the-street customers, the rest were AMZN workers filling delivery orders.

cmiles83• 6 months ago

Their fate seemed sealed when it was revealed a bit back that the “just walk out” technology was more hype than substance. Just lots of people watching what you’re doing on camera vs an actual AI that worked well at mass deployment scale. A good idea, poorly executed.

Reports said the “AI” was largely 1000+ people in India watching the cameras.

If Amazon actually managed to build AI that worked well at a decent cost point it would have been great since nobody likes those silly self checkout machines.

What’s amusing about all of this is that before it got leaked that it was basically a bunch of people in India watching cameras Amazon folks spoke about the tech like there was some super secret AI they developed. Since that story broke nobody there seems to want to talk about “just walk out” anymore.

lumost• 6 months ago

Even that didn't work well, when I was at an airport recently I had investigated 4-5 items as I had some time to kill. When I was walking out it wanted to bill me for 70 dollars even though I only had a bottle of water and a candy bar.

I have little trust that a corporate behemoth will do right by me and refund the discrepancy at an unspecified later time as it says it will on checkout.

itsamario• 6 months ago

They pay the most for human involvement. Wages, special conditions, and insurance are exponentially higher than their plans of warehouse to end-user via lockers and drones.

rurp• 6 months ago

This keeps me away from these sorts of stores if I can avoid them, which is pretty much always (so far, anyway). I would be absolutely shocked if the error rate was comparable to a normal checkout process and I don't want to waste the cognitive overhead of either wondering how much I'm getting ripped off by a corporation or having to go back and review and try to resolve overcharges.

usefulposter• 6 months ago

AI: Actually Individuals¹

¹ Individuals manning a labyrinthine system of cameras and sensor fusion, like hawks, logging the precise moment you plop a Twix into your basket! Praise Bezos!

hackingonempty• 6 months ago

There is no difference from the customer perspective so the store failed for reasons that have nothing to do with the "just walk out" technology or lack thereof. Why spend lots of money doing R&D only to find out that the concept doesn't sell? Wait for the product to be successful before spending the money to scale it up. Same as anything else.

"Do things that don't scale."

cmiles83• 6 months ago

I think the idea could work well but the execution in the field was consistently very poor. There were a few of these at airports with just an intimidating gate and generally non-engaging human standing there.

It was as if they expected everyone to know what to do, but when I’d watch 99% of people just sort of looked at the store, saw the odd gate things, and then just shrugged and walked off. The stores were almost always completely empty amidst a busy concourse.

Even if the tech worked (reports say it didn’t work well) they completely missed the boat on creating a clear customer experience that navigated the new tech.

bsimpson• 6 months ago

That 90s IBM commercial was pretty rad though.

chilmers• 6 months ago

Yeah, we had one near us, close to the metro exit, and it was genuinely great when you needed to grab something for dinner on the way home. Once you knew where things were, you could be in and out in 20 seconds. That said, it never seemed busy compared to other grocery shops in the area, so I think a lot of people were put off by it feeling "weird" to shop without checking-out.

goatforce5• 6 months ago

You can use the Apple Store app to purchase physical items at Apple retail locations (smaller items like cables or cases). I've used it a couple of times, and I feel very awkward using it, so much so that I'll walk out kinda waving the receipt/acknowledgement screen around so that staff/security can hopefully see I'm not nicking something.

ryukoposting2• 6 months ago

IIRC the Fresh near my old job required you to have a Prime membership, otherwise it was just a normal grocery store. I only went in there a few times, but I don't have a Prime membership, so there wasn't much of a point.

bayarearefugee• 6 months ago

Since that story broke nobody there seems to want to talk about “just walk out” anymore.

Optimus and Robotaxi are just as fake and Elon Musk never shuts up about them.

I guess Amazon never learned the important lesson that the OP meta for modern technology companies is just to consistently and blatantly lie.

in_a_hole• 6 months ago

A.I. = Actually Indians

Fernicia• 6 months ago

Reports said the “AI” was largely 1000+ people in India watching the cameras.

This was totally fake news though. Those people were labeling training data and reviewing low confidence labels, after the fact. There wasn't ever live monitoring of shoppers.

AppleAtCha4• 6 months ago

Do people really have problems with self-checkout? I use it all the time in box stores like Kroger, Walmart, Home Depot, etc. It seems to work just fine for me and doesn't add more than a minute or two vs just walking out of the store.

vikingerik• 6 months ago

Self checkout is fine, if the happy path works. If everything scans once and doesn't accidentally scan a second time, if everything scans at the price you thought it was posted for, if you don't have any controlled substances requiring approval, if the weight sensor doesn't freak out incorrectly or from putting your bags on it, if it accepts any coupons you have, if it accepts and processes your payment method correctly.

If everything goes fine, self checkout is fine. But the exception handling process for any of those is thoroughly aggravating, as you wait and try to get the attention of the one overworked attendant dealing with a dozen of these machines constantly throwing exceptions, as the computer screams at you for whatever it thought you were doing wrong.

SHAKEDECADE• 6 months ago

If you find value in it, that's fine. I not only find value with interaction with the lovely checkout people, I dislike the cost of scanning and managing the items during checkout being my problem so a huge company can save money. If they were to implement a discount as a way to say "we'll pay you for your work to give us your money" I would consider it.

That's not to say the value of the convenience is never worth it. I exclusively use Sam's Club scan-and-go because the time I save is much larger than the publix/walmart/ect.

jillesvangurp• 6 months ago

Here in Germany, the newer generation self checkout terminals are fine. I use them all the time. No issues. The first generation ones were terrible.

The issue with the first generation was that they were too strict with bag placement, weight sensors, etc. They were impossible to use without having to call a very grumpy shop attendant to unlock them. Sometimes multiple times. They were grumpy because all this was technically user error but when a largish percentage of users run into the same issues over and over again, it gets really annoying to deal with.

They fixed most of the glaring UX issues with the newer generation. No weight sensors. No prompts to put the item in the bag it is already in, etc. The new ones basically only need people to unlock things like alcohol purchases, but are otherwise fine. The first generation was over engineered and had way too many failure modes. They still have them in some super markets but they are getting replaced with better ones.

Anyway, it's getting harder and harder to hire staff for supermarkets. These are low wage jobs and most of these people can get better paying jobs. Self checkout creates some opportunities for shop lifting of course. But that is offset by the wage savings. They compensate with security, cameras, etc.

MengerSponge• 6 months ago

AI: Actually Indians

GorbachevyChase2• 6 months ago

I’m a bit surprised a publicly traded company is allowed to make materially false claims about their products and capabilities without getting into a major lawsuit for defrauding shareholders. Maybe Amazon is just above such trifling things such as law.

justonceokay2• 6 months ago

I’m in an interesting place. Here in Seattle I am two blocks from one of the largest Amazon Fresh stores. It was built on the former location of a local grocer. The construction was almost complete before Covid hit, but Amazon shuttered the store during that time. As a result there was no groceries in my neighborhood from 2018-2023.

Now it seems Amazon is going to leave us a grocery desert yet again.

They were piloting smart carts at the location. The cart scans your items so checking out you just push the cart through a scanner that weighs it. But this invention was like a microcosm of Amazon’s whole fuckup with groceries. The problem with the store wasn’t that I couldn’t check out fast enough, it’s that it was a shit grocery store. They had popular products but they were missing all the unpopular, low margin products you need to actually cook (baking powder, shortening, tomato paste, soy sauce…). They only hire non-union jobs program people at the registers because Amazon believes that cashier is a sub-human role.

The previous store had an owner who would wander the aisles and chat with customers. The new store has Europeans with clipboards who watch you as you shop.

SirFatty• 6 months ago

"non-union jobs program people at the registers because Amazon believes that cashier is a sub-human role."

What grocery stores still have union workers?

The-Bus• 6 months ago

The UFCW claims they represent at least 800,000 grocery workers across the US.

I had a job as a union worker in a supermarket, and am glad that's still available to others.

https://www.ufcw.org/actions/campaign/albertsons-and-safeway...

crysin• 6 months ago

Jewel-Osco: https://www.local881ufcw.org/about-us/#local-881 Meijer and Kroger: https://ufcw951.org/about/

quietsegfault• 6 months ago

Literally all the grocery stores in my Northeast US city are unionized.

buildsjets2• 6 months ago

My brother has worked as a stocker for King Kullen in New York for 20 years and is a union worker.

In the Seattle area where the poster is from, pretty much all the grocery stores are unionized. Workers at big stores like Safeway, Fred Meyer, QFC, and Albertsons, and local stores PCC, Uwajimaya are represented by UFCW3000. https://ufcw3000.org/shop-union

Additionally, Teamsters 174 organizes a lot of the grocery freight workers. https://teamsters174.net/warehouse-and-grocery/

seanmcdirmid3• 6 months ago

Most grocery stores in the US are still heavily union. I don't think the unions ever left the grocery stores.

dlcarrier7• 6 months ago

The more-expensive stores sometimes do. My friend's wife works for one, and the store is closing because it's too close to a discount grocery to get enough traffic to stay open. The union is making her transfer to a much further location or lose her seniority, for some nonsense reason involving the closer locations historically being part of a different union, despite them now all being the same one.

jacquesm• 6 months ago

So now you are off worse than before?

MattDamonSpace• 6 months ago

Not to be rude but there’s 4 Amazon Fresh locations in the greater Seattle area and each of them is next to multiple other large/small grocery options.

For instance, the one in north Seattle (Shoreline) is within eyesight of a Safeway, a Sprouts, two international markets and a chef wholesaler.

The other three locations are similarly crowded with options.

What food desert are you referring to?

guyrt• 6 months ago

Jackson St location is the only walkable option in its neighborhood. It wasn't very good (terrible selection, stocking issues, slowly increasing locked section) but it was convenient.

chronny903• 6 months ago

What food desert are you referring to?

His food desert that doesn’t exist.

marshmellman• 6 months ago

I wouldn’t describe central district as crowded with options…

nightpool• 6 months ago

It's literally highlighted on the map you sent: https://postimg.cc/Cn8BGP4S

There's no walkable grocery store in that area. My friend lives in the area and uses a wheelchair, and Amazon Fresh was the only actual grocery store she could go to.

As much as I'm hoping they do, I would be very surprised if they open a Whole Foods in that area.

operatingthetan• 6 months ago

It's in Seattle, not Shoreline.

freedomben3• 6 months ago

They only hire non-union jobs program people at the registers because Amazon believes that cashier is a sub-human role.

The implication being that humans who aren't in a union are "sub-human" in your opinion? If so, that's pretty messed up man.

12_throw_away2• 6 months ago

A giant, multinational, multi-trillion-dollar corporation that will only bargain with individual people living paycheck-to-paycheck? Huh, what a weird power imbalance!

Surely it doesn't have anything to do with their documented history of treating their blue-collar workforce like utter garbage.

nothercastle• 6 months ago

They never made sense to have but I’m sure someone made a huge career and got lots of bonuses for this initiative

dlcarrier7• 6 months ago

John Mackey, the founder of Whole Foods, mentioned at the end of his autiobiography The Whole Story that that there wasn't much collaboration within the higher-ups at Amazon. From the gist of it, I wouldn't be surprised if the internal retail division was trying to outshine the Whole Foods division by throwing technology at everything, useful or not, because that's what Amazon corporate appreciates.

mjr003• 6 months ago

On April 4, 2024, it was revealed that Amazon's "Just Walk Out" technology was supported by approximately 1,000 Indian workers who manually reviewed transactions. Despite claims of being fully automated through computer vision, a significant portion of transactions required this manual verification. ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Go )

Wonder how much of this is due to economics since computer vision tech never reached the expected performance + outsourced workers got (relatively) much more expensive after COVID.

theanonymousone• 6 months ago

Why did "outsourced workers get (relatively) much more expensive after"?

mjr003• 6 months ago

Great question. I'm not an economist so I have no idea why. The outsourcing rates I've all seen have gotten way higher in the past ~10 years though.

foxyv• 6 months ago

Essentially the thinking went. If everyone is remote, why not hire remote workers from countries that are a lot cheaper. Suddenly you had a hard time finding contractors and FTEs from those countries because everyone was hiring them. At the same time it got really hard for entry level developers in the USA to find work.

The supply/demand curve shifted and now those workers are becoming more expensive while domestic workers are becoming cheaper.

giraffe_lady4• 6 months ago

India specifically is in the middle of a massive years-long labor movement that is changing the terms of work there and I believe shifting the degree of alignment with western corporate outsourcing though I'm not very informed about the details.

Scale is beyond comprehension though, there were 250 million people on strike one day last summer. This is not ever really covered in western media or mentioned on HN for reasons that are surely not interesting or worth pondering at all.

thinkingtoilet• 6 months ago

Another case where AI = "actually Indians". It's funny how often this has happened.

Dylan16807• 6 months ago

Maybe. I'd really want to know what percent of items (not transactions) needed review. 1,000 people to oversee how much revenue?

Theoretically if it was 99% computer and 1% human, that's enough to mess up the economics but it's not a bait and switch like some companies have done.

kkkqkqkqkqlqlql• 6 months ago

I remember this case the one who put "Actually Indians" in my mind. What other instances do you know?

(Not to refute your point, of course, I am just curious)

Cornbilly4• 6 months ago

It's great that they faced essentially no consequences for this. A sure sign that we have a functional and sane market.

colinplamondon2• 6 months ago

Why would they face consequences? Every store has video surveillance that can be reviewed.

They trusted their tech enough to accept the false-positive rate, then worked to determine / validate their false positive rate with manual review, and iterate their models with the data.

From a consumer perspective the point is that you can "just walk out". They delivered that.

jandrese5• 6 months ago

What's the crime? If lying about AI capabilities is a crime we have some billionaires in big trouble.

madeofpalk• 6 months ago

Isn't the consequence that that they're shutting the stores down?

dyauspitr2• 6 months ago

It’s autonomous 80% of the time. That’s significant. Put another way, they only had to hire 1000 people instead of 5000.

swiftcoder• 6 months ago

It's also pretty par for the course from Amazon automation initiatives. Like Glacier being marketed as robotic tape drive loaders, where in reality it is mostly just regular old S3 running on the outdated server clusters.

ed_mercer• 6 months ago

This was proven to be false on the WAN show. Only 20% of transactions were low confidence and handled by mechanical turk.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=433kipkEERY&t=8479s

larrik• 6 months ago

20% seems like a "significant portion" to me

mjr003• 6 months ago

20% is an incredibly high number though, if a store has 400 people/hour that means you're manually reviewing 80 transactions per hour, over one transaction per minute. That's multiple human employees.

pessimizer3• 6 months ago

Proven "false." I've noticed that if one admits the truth with a dismissive or offended tone, you can just continue to claim the lie and through sheer force of will people will still go with it.

I think people just think that they must be misunderstanding something; that nobody could claim one thing while offering evidence of its opposite. 1/5 of purchases lose their significance.

whateveracct• 6 months ago

Transactions or grabs? Cuz I grab >5 things every time..so it stands to reason Indians always reviewed me.

EdiX2• 6 months ago

Nothing has been "proven". The original story was The Information (paywalled article) reshared by Business Insider [1] and claimed that 70% of the transactions were reviewed by an indian. The source was an anonymous source.

Business Insider also reached out to Amazon at the time and a spokesperson denied that actually reviewed any transactions.

This "proven false" thing is just another anonymous source claiming that actually it was only 20%.

So you actually have no proof of anything, you just have three persons claiming three different things (0%, 20% and 70%).

[1] https://www.businessinsider.com/amazons-just-walk-out-actual...

adamsb6• 6 months ago

People don’t know what the H is in RLHF.

davidst7• 6 months ago

I left the following comment some months ago, duplicating it here:

[Disclaimer: Former Amazon employee and not involved with Go since 2016.]

I worked on the first iteration of Amazon Go in 2015/16 and can provide some context on the human oversight aspects.

The system incorporated human review in two primary capacities:

1. Low-confidence event resolution: A subset of customer interactions resulted in low-confidence classifications that were routed to human reviewers for verification. These events typically involved edge cases that were challenging for the automated systems to resolve definitively. The proportion of these events was expected to decrease over time as the models improved. This was my experience during my time with Go.

2. Training data generation: Human annotators played a significant role in labeling interactions for model training-- particularly when introducing new store fixtures or customer behaviors. For instance, when new equipment like coffee machines were added, the system would initially flag all related interactions for human annotation to build training datasets for those specific use cases. Of course, that results in a surge of humans needed for annotation while the data is collected.

Scaling from smaller grab-and-go formats to larger retail environments (Fresh, Whole Foods) would require expanded annotation efforts due to the increased complexity and variety of customer interactions in those settings.

This approach represents a fairly standard machine learning deployment pattern where human oversight serves both quality assurance and continuous improvement.

The news story is entertaining but it implies there was no working tech behind Amazon Go which just isn't true.

londons_explore• 6 months ago

As soon as you get to ~99% accuracy, you probably don't need to go further.

If the customer is accidentally billed for an orange instead of a tangerine 1% of the time, the consumer probably won't notice or care, and as long as the errors aren't biased in favour of the shop, regulators and the taxman probably won't care either.

With that in mind, I suspect Amazon Go wasn't profitable due to poor execution not an inherently bad idea.

BoredPositron2• 6 months ago

I get being proud of the work done but if they scrapped the project after 10 years because of feasibility I don't think the tech rolled out at the start was "working" as intended.

scoot2• 6 months ago

Obligatory /disclaimer/disclosure/. (Don't worry, most HNrs get this wrong for some reason. I will be downvoted for pointing this out, but whatever. It's a meaningful difference to those that understand.)

LPisGood• 6 months ago

What’s still not clear to me about this story is if there was ever live human monitoring of shoppers. Did the low confidence resolution occur in real time, at some point between the customer grabbing the item and getting their bill?

throwaway_15612• 6 months ago

Could it be improved by requiring the customers to use a "smart" shopping basket that can read RFC codes from the product packaging? In combination with vision tech it should give a relatively higher accuracy.

If so, is the reason why it is not used related to cost?

grogenaut• 6 months ago

The go tech is amazing in 2 places: airport and stadium beverage tunnels. There's a premium price and high volume in those areas. The go tech has basically revolutionized the speed of getting a beer and a dog at the stadium here in Seattle. I can be back in my seat in 4 minutes including the bathroom now which for NFL means I can literally be back in a commercial break sometimes.

no idea how much they make on it, but it's a game changer in that small area.

gorgoiler• 6 months ago

I’m skeptical of this scoop.

It’s reasonable to expect a system like Amazon’s to use human feedback in training, and to quote the article linked on Wikipedia:

Amazon said that the India-based team only assisted in training the model [and validating] a small minority of shopping visits.

hereonout2• 6 months ago

I went to Lidl UKs first walk out shop a few weeks ago. You get the bill and receipts about 40 minutes after you've left.

It certainly felt like it could have been sent off to a lower paid country for a human to tot up.

Also consider you're in the store for what, 10 mins - that's a lot of video processing presumably using state of the art CV models. It's quite possibly cheaper to pay a human than rent the H100 to do it.

andoando• 6 months ago

I wonder if they were doing the same thing for palm recognition

nayroclade• 6 months ago

I always found the "Amazon 4-Star" name funny. Presumably when it was first pitched internally it was called "Amazon 5-Star", then they realised that meant they basically couldn't sell anything, since nothing popular gets a full 5 stars. So they changed it to "4-Star", which just sounds awkward, and lacks the suggestion of top-quality that "5-Star" would. Instead, it's like the "Amazon Not-too-bad" store. I was amazed that they actually went ahead with it.

boredtofears• 6 months ago

Also funny because there are many product categories on amazon where if its not above 4.5 its probably shit

giraffe_lady4• 6 months ago

Shoulda just bit the bullet and gone with "4.8-star." I'm sure they talked about it and yeah it's goofy and awkward but it would get the meaning across and maybe show a bit of a sense of humor and that's exactly why they never ever could.

ainiriand• 6 months ago

Good sense of humor at Amazon... Yeah right.

bootlooped• 6 months ago

They could have followed the lead of TV manufacturers and called it "5 Star Class" (4.5 star)

paulddraper• 6 months ago

Yeah it’s kinda like a dollar store but instead of focusing on the upside (cost) it reminded you of the downside (quality).

eithed• 6 months ago

When did naming things have to reflect reality? ie it's "Burger King" and not "Bearable Burger"

PaulHoule6• 6 months ago

It was a pretty good burger until 2013 when they changed the machine they used to cook the burgers. Now it's worse than McD's and that's saying something.

calvinmorrison• 6 months ago

who is this appointed this beef monarch anyway?

FireBeyond• 6 months ago

My fiancee used to work at a place called "Decent Pizza". Their motto "Not the best but not the worst."

mjmas2• 6 months ago

Something interesting I found while looking up Hungry Jacks (the Burger King franchise here in Australia) is that the angry Whopper is a normal menu item here but it seems to be only a seasonal/special item for Burker King.

adolph• 6 months ago

"'Amazon Not-too-bad' store" sounds pretty reasonable. Maybe a too-clever work around for the 5-Star problem would be to call it "100-Star," which would be 4 in binary notation. Or they could call it "5th-Star" since 4 stars is the fifth number of stars b/c the range of starts is zero indexed.

  Ordinal : Cardinal
  1 : 0
  2 : 1
  3 : 2
  4 : 3
  5 : 4
  6 : 5

polshaw• 6 months ago

The range of stars is very deliberately NOT zero indexed, you cannot rate a product below 1.

divbzero2• 6 months ago

They should have left it as “Amazon 5-Star” with nearly 5-star products.

reaperducer2• 6 months ago

Presumably when it was first pitched internally it was called "Amazon 5-Star", then they realised that meant they basically couldn't sell anything, since nothing popular gets a full 5 stars. So they changed it to "4-Star"

This would not be the first off-by-one error at Amazon.

s08148692• 6 months ago

Shame, shopping there felt like magic. I hope the technology is developed in future without having to rely on remote workers validating transactions. Definitely felt like the future of shopping

amelius• 6 months ago

In what ways?

slipnslider• 6 months ago

Isn't the same tech used in stadiums? At least in Seattle we can just walk out without paying, even alcohol. Obviously we have to scan our CC or something similar to get in but I always thought it was using the same Amazon tech.

So even though these stores are closing, the tech is widely used and likely expanding and succeeding

cheeze• 6 months ago

Still kind of pointless though. Someone has to check ID and im WA state, open the beers for you.

Kind of defeated the purpose of just walk out. Since I couldn't... Just walk out.

kilroy1232• 6 months ago

I quite liked the ones in London. I loved the experience of just walking in and out really quick.

I knew someone who worked at Amazon UK and they told me years ago they were doing very baldy and there was talk of them closing.

So I'm not surprised to hear this at all.

blinding-streak• 6 months ago

The headline in their corporate press release says "Amazon doubles down on online grocery delivery and Whole Foods Market expansion to reach more customers"

That's one way to spin things I guess.

fencepost3• 6 months ago

The Fresh store near me that I stop in at seems to double as a warehouse for some of those delivery orders, so I wouldn't be surprised if some of them just stop having customer access and shift to entirely staffed pick-and-pack for delivery.

proee• 6 months ago

Has anyone used their go stores? I'm curious how the experience felt from a consumer standpoint. Do you feel welcomed or more like a thief?

I remember WAY back in the day when Arby's implemented touch screen ordering (on CRTs!) and it was a very quirky process. An Arby's employee would sit behind the counter and stare at you while you spent 5 minutes poking a CRT display. Very slow and very impersonal. They discontinued them in a short period of time.

semiquaver• 6 months ago

They’re fine and work as advertised. One weird thing is you don’t get the receipt for 10-20 minutes, presumably while humans are viewing the footage.

The main thing I use it for is convenient returns, which is why I’m disappointed in this news. I hardly ever buy things there other than things like gum or chips.

sheept• 6 months ago

our university has been rolling out just walk out markets across campus due to rampant stealing. shopping there doesn't feel like stealing, but the store design feels oppressive with racks of cameras and thick black shelves because it's designed for sensors first not humans

one minor downside (especially since I don't live on campus anymore) is that in order to walk around and peruse the shelves, I have to give them my payment info just to enter

catgirlinspace• 6 months ago

Here they replaced all the markets that were staffed by people with these big vending machines that are 3 or 4 refrigerated cabinets (even chips are refrigerated). You pay, wait a bit for it to process it, and then it unlocks the doors and you grab whatever. And if it gets it wrong there’s no dispute process to tell it you didn’t pick something up (I think there is an email listed but I didn’t care enough the time it messed up to send an email). And half the time when you click the pay button to finish, it’ll complain about a door not locking.

kube-system6• 6 months ago

Every time I walk into a McDonalds I see people who will rather stand 5 minutes at the counter waiting for a human cashier than use one of the available kiosks. I'm sure some are paying cash but there are certainly people who are just not comfortable with technology.

The Go stores were a great experience but they would certainly be uncomfortable for anyone other than early-adopter or tech-forward types of people. I would just walk in with my own bag, and put items directly from the shelf into the bag, and walk out the door. It was extremely convenient and fast once you got over how weird it felt.

I think they could have done a lot more in giving social clues on both the way in and way out.

giraffe_lady4• 6 months ago

A lot of people have trouble using those and it's not just tech discomfort or whatever. You have to be able to hold your arms up in front of you, touching specific points in space. The UI is not good and does not provide good moment-to-moment feedback about whether you've pressed a button or which one. You have to be moderately-to-strongly literate, you have to wrap your head around the menu organization, know what you're looking for by name and be able to guess where it is in this system.

I've watched so many people struggle to use these machines for so many different reasons. Pretty much anyone with a physical or cognitive disability will be better off with the cashier. Sucks they have to wait much longer for one now.

bluedino• 6 months ago

McDonalds solved that problem by basically not having employees go up to the counter anymore.

freedomben3• 6 months ago

I'm probably not a typical case, but I felt like my privacy was massively invaded. The concept was cool, but I felt like every muscle twitch was being scrutinized and recorded forever. I was also in constant fear that the computer would charge me for things I didn't buy and getting it corrected would be a nightmare. I also felt like if there was a bug or malfunction in the system and it didn't charge me for something (which I wouldn't know about immediately) they would come after me as a shoplifter with the full force of a mega corporation with unlimited resources. It felt like there were a thousand high powered lawyers that I couldn't see, watching my every move waiting for some mess up (even though I have no intention whatsoever other than finding and paying for the product I wanted).

So no I didn't feel like I was a thief. But I felt like they assumed I was a thief. My guess is most stores are heavily surveilled nowadays, so it might be unreasonable for me to feel this way with Amazon but not Walmart or Target or Kroger, but that's how it felt.

themaninthedark• 6 months ago

Walmart and Kroger near me now have one way metal cattle gates that you have to pass through when you enter. Makes me feel like cattle and that their assuming I am a thief. Trips to those locations have dropped.

The Home Depot cameras and screens that "BING BONG" loudly as you pass by to get you to notice them showing that they are recording you are also highly annoying.

I wish there was a greater variety of hardware stores near me...

mitaphane• 6 months ago

I use the one situated in Seattle, Amazon HQ. It's just like self-checkout at a grocery store with fewer steps. The entrance/payment mechanism is Amazon One (a palm scan associated with a payment wallet). At Whole Foods, it's used as an optional payment option at checkout.

It's convenient; I only ever remember one problem where it thought I had purchased an item that I picked up and decided on something else. I disputed it online and it was resolved in a day.

PKop2• 6 months ago

I disputed it online

Oh man this is what consumers would love to do, have to constantly adjudicate false positives online which they'd have to track to make sure didn't happen. What nonsense.

tshaddox2• 6 months ago

I went to the first couple of Amazon Go stores in San Francisco several times. I've also been to our local Go store a few times in LA County. The experience has always been perfectly fine, and the invoices always correct. It's basically just a small junk food and liquor store similar to a 7-Eleven.

thoughtpalette• 6 months ago

Loved the Go store in Chicago (Ogilvy), had some great lunch options and even a take home "dinner for two" bag of premade ingredients.

dlcarrier7• 6 months ago

The regular Fresh stores have a scanner and screen on the cart that you can use to track your purchases while shopping, then the cashier could pull up the contents in one go, without scanning scanning at the register. There's also some discounted products for Prime members that can be applied by pulling up your account on your phone and displaying a barcode.

I went there the first week they opened, and the whole store was a mess with shoppers standing still or walking slowly, completely unaware of their surrounds, while messing with the phone or their cart trying to figure it out.

I'm sure that with enough time, shoppers could figure out there system, but I was in a hurry so I just grabbed the few items I wanted and paid cash, which was just as fast as it is everywhere else.

I do want to stop by before it closes, and see if customers figured out their systems, in the year and a half the location has been open.

dionian2• 6 months ago

i didnt use their system, but the experience wasnt that great, it felt like a target grocery store in terms of product quality and selection. its a grocery store, but the regular grocery store is better.

minimaxir• 6 months ago

The Amazon Go stores in San Francisco were weird. They always had no people shopping in them, which would make sense given the increased efficiency, but it amplified the "am I stealing?" vibe. And the cost of goods wasn't made any cheaper than comparable stores in SF despite the touted increased efficiency.

frogperson• 6 months ago

LOL, any found efficiency doesnt go to the consumer. The evidence is the widening wealth gap over the last 40 years. Its trickle up economics.

jgbuddy3• 6 months ago

does competition not naturally drive competitors to reduce margins?

1980phipsi• 6 months ago

The lack of people in them was the thing about going to one that always felt weird to me.

pwthornton• 6 months ago

The pitch from Bezos -- and it's a dumb pitch -- was basically just to make checking out faster by avoiding interacting with humans (but this can be achieved by increasing the number of cashiers and baggers). The pitch was never lower prices. The combo of all the tech and the army of Indians watching video was not cheap.

And because they were relying on computer vision and Indian vision, they had to get rid of all their fresh meals because they were too hard to calculate prices for. So, it ended up being a half-assed 7-Eleven concept. The whole concept was made by someone who hates humanity.

I personally prefer stores with actual cashiers. What I don't like are lines, but that is very solvable. The organic grocer near me is super fast to check out.

_fat_santa• 6 months ago

I don't live around any Amazon Fresh stores so I never saw them though I did see the technology in use at several airports (though I've never personally used it). IMO I think places like airports are the best place for something like this, people are usually in a rush so not having to wait in line to checkout is nice and you don't have to worry about security as much because everyone there is a ticketed passenger (only saw them post-security) and even if someone did try stealing they wouldn't get very far.

onetokeoverthe• 6 months ago

not get far? at an airport?

vel0city• 6 months ago

I saw these in several different airports. It usually had multiple people staffed at the gate to get in and out meanwhile most of the other snack vendors often only had a single person employed.

So you spend a few hundred thousand dollars extra on all the cameras, many millions on all the design, pay all the overseas contractors to manually review the transactions, and you still end up with twice the in-person staff than the average store in the airport.

wolvoleo2• 6 months ago

Hmm Amazon fresh was useless anyway. It was this weird niche of grocery delivery but for small urgent orders. I just don't have that need like ever, if I need a bottle of shampoo or a head of lettuce urgently I'll just go to the corner shop.

Edit: oh oops I see this is about physical fresh stores, we never had those in the first place. Here in Europe Amazon fresh is a weird service for quick small grocery orders. For the bigger ones they partner with a local supermarket ("dia" here in Spain). But I never do grocery delivery because I never make any plans, I just make my life up as I go along :)

But Amazon fresh here is expensive and still slow (2hrs) so really not good for anything.

Amazon go I'm not even sure what that is.

dangus2• 6 months ago

What you’re talking about is the delivery product, not the brick and mortar grocery stores, which are not much different from your typical big chain standard grocery outlet.

wolvoleo2• 6 months ago

Yeah we don't get those here, sorry. Didn't know they even existed

MikeTheGreat2• 6 months ago

Amazon go I'm not even sure what that is.

And now you don't have to!

Ba-dump-ching! I'll be here all week, folks! :)

direwolf207• 6 months ago

Amazon go I'm not even sure what that is, must be something like Pokémon go to the polls.

jgbuddy3• 6 months ago

Yeah these are all going to be wrapped up into their same day delivery service. Amazon fresh was very expensive and required a fee on top of prime which unsurprisingly nobody wants to do

bushbaba2• 6 months ago

Amazon fresh in the Bay Area was equivalent to Safeway but for better price/quality

ryukoposting2• 6 months ago

I just moved here, but WOW Safeway's prices are absolutely criminal. We'll shop anywhere else. It'd be hard to be worse than Safeway.

I haven't been to a Fresh here, but we had one in IL and it was just a normal grocery store but more confusing. There's a constant sense of "am I stealing?" And the whole "just walk out" thing doesn't work if you don't have a Prime membership, so it all felt a bit overwrought and pointless. Some of the prices were good, others were bad, others were stupid (produce by item count instead of weight). I'd rather just go to a normal grocery store.

wnevets• 6 months ago

Fortunately my Amazon branded subcutaneous chip still works at Wholefoods.

g947o2• 6 months ago

These bastards drove out some nice stores near me (supposedly the lease ended and did not renew) and rebuilt the buildings in order to open an Amazon Fresh location. That Amazon Fresh store never opened. Now we have a giant empty storefront nobody uses.

barbazoo• 6 months ago

But for a brief moment there was a chance it would make the shareholders more wealthy. Surely that’s worth it. /s

Wondering what the municipality’s responsibility there wrt zoning.

bumblehean• 6 months ago

Same here. A local grocery store and several other local businesses got bought out and demolished so Amazon could build a new Fresh store.

I guess Amazon pulled out of the project halfway through, since for the last ~2 years there's been a half-finished building just sitting there completely abandoned in our town center.

happyopossum• 6 months ago

Wait, how does a store that never opened drive out an existing store? That’s not how commercial leases work…

Given that a supermarket abandoned that location, and Amazon never opened on their either, perhaps that location or the lease price simply doesn’t work for a grocery store?

g947o2• 6 months ago

The tenants needed to vacate before the owner tore down the building.

esseph2• 6 months ago

They got word of the development and decide to not renew their commercial lease? Then you either move business somewhere where you don't have to directly complete, or shut down.

nebula88046• 6 months ago

Reminds me of the time they made towns all around the US do a dog and pony show to attract "HQ2" and then just located it where Bezos wanted to be all along. I remember AOC getting it right all along, she did the most milktoast of pushback in her district and it caused Amazon to huff and puff and just walk away(causing many property speculators to lose out). She got raked over the coals but a few years later and the place HQ2 ended up didn't fare so well. AOC was vindicated.

My hope is that more towns learn from your experience and don't tolerate this nonsense anymore.

netsharc2• 6 months ago

John Oliver analyzed state's tax rebates, 8 years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bl19RoR7lc , he concluded that giving 1000 people Ferraris to drive around a pile of $30 million cash on fire would be more fiscally responsible...

darknavi• 6 months ago

It's the same story over and over again with large businesses. See Boeing and WA state as well.

What's the Matter with Kansas? (2004) by Thomas Frank goes into this in part of it. While a bit repetitive (because history) the book is quite good.

khuey• 6 months ago

milktoast

fyi since you may not have ever seen it spelled before it's milquetoast

snowwrestler• 6 months ago

HQ2 ended up in Crystal City, Virginia, which is a commercial district of Arlington County, and it’s fine. The pandemic-driven remote work trend led Amazon to scale back the number of buildings.

The state and localities did a good job structuring incentives so everything was tied to milestones, some of which Amazon ended up not hitting. My recollection is that NY was offering to give a lot more away, which helped fuel the backlash, but don’t quote me on that.

It also helped in VA that Crystal City has been a commercial wasteland for many years thanks to DoD decentralization. A lot of offices moved down to Fort Belvoir and surrounding areas, leaving Crystal City with a lot of vacant office space. Nothing was being “lost” by Amazon coming in.

Local real estate agents put “HQ2” in their listings for a few years but it didn’t matter much because homes near Crystal City were already super expensive.

knowitnone33• 6 months ago

sounds like you have an opportunity to open a grocery store?

ozten• 6 months ago

This is the tragedy of the commons.

augusteo• 6 months ago

The "1000 people in India watching cameras" reveal was the moment the magic died. Once you know the wizard is just a guy behind a curtain, you can't unsee it.

The interesting question isn't whether the tech was ready. It wasn't. The question is whether Amazon learned anything useful from the attempt.

Computer vision for retail checkout is a legitimate hard problem. Occlusion, similar-looking products, people changing their minds. I've worked on CV pipelines and the gap between "works in the demo" and "works at scale" is brutal.

My guess: they collected a ton of training data from those human reviewers. Whether they'll use it for a v2 or just write it off, who knows.

PKop2• 6 months ago

Aside from the magic dying, which I agree with, another commenter in this thread says there could be false positives (whether from Indians or AI doesn't matter) you'd have to 1) notice by studying your bill later and 2) resolve by requesting refunds online.

Knowing this, it was over before it ever started. Beyond the masses of people already having aversion to the oddness of how it worked and likely never wanting to try it, these and others would swear off the store forever the first time they ever got charged for something they didn't take. No one wants to monitor and fix erroneous purchase errors.

GorbachevyChase2• 6 months ago

I wonder if this is what FSD really is sometimes.

qwerpy• 6 months ago

You might think so because of how human-like it drives, but I’ve driven for quite a few miles out of signal range and it still works.

timmg• 6 months ago

My wife will be heartbroken. We moved recently and she loves shopping at Amazon Fresh. (Though part of the reason was that it was never busy :)

MikeTheGreat2• 6 months ago

I don't know what your life/lives are like, and far be it for me to tell you how to live, but if your schedule allows it try shopping later at night.

I show up at CostCo, on weekdays, like 30 minutes before closing time and it's _wonderful_. Few people, nobody blocking lanes while they consider their choices, etc. Same goes for Safeway, Fred Meyer, Trader Joe's, etc.

It doesn't work so great if you've got young kids, or you want to come home from work and just stay home (reasonable), but it's worth considering :)

SeanAnderson• 6 months ago

Well, that article made me nervous for a second! I love my Amazon Fresh grocery delivery. I started using it during Covid, but could never go back. It's so nice having groceries feel automated instead of a semi-daily chore. I eat much healthier and the rationale for using DoorDash evaporated.

Absolutely zero interest in a physical version that lets me check-out easier, though. So, I can see why they're making this switch.

dylan604• 6 months ago

It's so nice having groceries feel automated instead of a semi-daily chore

One of a my previous jobs had a grocery store on the way home. I took to stopping in pretty much daily. It allowed for a bit of decompression after work before coming home. It was very convenient to always have exactly what was needed for that night while being therapeutic at the same time. After switching jobs, losing that was probably the most noticeable thing about the new job

jordemort• 6 months ago

I really liked the local Amazon Fresh, until they discontinued "just walk out" and replaced it with those hellish smart carts. I scanned one item successfully with the cart, got completely stuck trying to get it to scan a second one, handed the cart back to the employee, and never went back.

dlcarrier7• 6 months ago

I just pay cash at the regular cashier. The smart carts aren't the speed-up Amazon wants them to be, but at least the faster traditional shopping method is still an option, unlike Amazon Go.

dangus2• 6 months ago

I’m not surprised about Amazon Go but I’m surprised about Amazon Fresh.

They almost seemed like an extension of Whole Foods to a more mainstream suburban market, and I thought they had solid foot traffic.

dfajgljsldkjag• 6 months ago

I like Whole Foods because it feels warm and the food looks good. The Amazon stores felt like walking inside a vending machine and that is not how people want to buy dinner.

kotaKat2• 6 months ago

Curious thought - will they be shutting down other “just walk out” powered stuff like Hudson Nonstops in airports?

I also know some Amazon warehouses had an entire Just Walk Out powered concessions area in their breakroom for purchasing snacks in partnership with one of their canteen vendors.

count• 6 months ago

Nah, they're still actively selling/implementing the backing service/tech for other orgs.

kotaKat2• 6 months ago

That’s kinda what I figured. At this point it seems like they all have the same general configuration of coolers and shelves and the same cameras all angled in the same setup everywhere so I assume it’s all down to one very strict CV model or something…

otikik• 6 months ago

Oh no! Anyway

maininformer• 6 months ago

This will forever be a masterpiece

https://youtu.be/CNoa-9TBH30?si=Zl7hdZ1fBqeXHM_8

Bluecobra7• 6 months ago

Doesn’t surprise me. I frequently shop at Amazon Fresh in store and it’s a mediocre experience. It’s a poorly run store with no visible manager making sure things are in order. You constantly have to work around employees fulfilling online orders and they aren’t helpful. I always find expired groceries/produce on the shelf so I have to spend a lot of extra time inspecting each item. The only reason I put up with their nonsense is that some of their prices are insane and they have easy returns, for example $0.85 for a box of Barilla pasta. They actually don’t accept returns in store and just refund you automatically in the app (Returnless returns). It’s pretty silly and rife for abuse.

I also found a loophole with the Amazon.com return grocery credit. The systems are separate for the $10 off $40 coupon and you just scan a QR code in the store to get it. It turns out you can just take a photo of their QR code and reuse it over and over again.

liveoneggs3• 6 months ago

The delivery shoppers are especially bad at whole foods. There really must be a critical mass where having a grocery warehouse makes more sense than these people meandering around.

Bluecobra7• 6 months ago

Yep, my local Amazon Fresh store felt like it was already a distribution center with the cold fluorescent lighting, gray shelves and gray concrete floors.

cjrp• 6 months ago

See Ocado, although things aren't going so well for them at the moment.

kevstev2• 6 months ago

There is actually. I used to work in grocery e-commerce. The model is pickers in a store --> a "dark store" that looks more like a home Depot with only pickers, not open to public --> warehouse like environment with various levels of automation.

This was a bit before the model of having Uber driver type delivery though. I am guessing that having the deliverers be close to the deliverees make it more economical to keep them in stores until a larger scale is reached. The dark store+ model was also predicated on a more factory floor like environment with only FTEs present. Think pallets moving about among the pickers- not too hard to work around IMHO but maybe the lawyers and insurers feel differently.

I still feel the overreaching factor is that in dense urban centers there is no cheap commercial/industrial space that is also in close proximity to customers.

PaulHoule6• 6 months ago

Wegmans opened a store at the Brooklyn Navy Yard just to show people in NYC what a real supermarket looks like. I mean, you might be impressed with Whole Foods if all you know are those bodegas that have around NYC but if you've been to a real supermarket Whole Foods, Amazon Fresh and such are not impressive at all.

ceejayoz6• 6 months ago

I'm in Wegmans' home town, and the enshittification process has hit them hard in recent years.

aqme28• 6 months ago

I think this is why Lidl is taking off in parts of the US.

moregrist2• 6 months ago

I don't know the Wegman's in NY at all, but the one I used to use in the Boston area was ... okay?

It was a good grocery store with decent produce, a good frozen section, some nice specialty items, and some decent prepared meals. I would put it at roughly the early-2010s era of Whole Foods with slightly better prices. Now that I'm no longer working near there, I don't miss it much.

So I've never understood the hype. But I've also been told that the Boston stores were pretty mediocre compared to the ones in NY and especially Ithaca.

hshdhdhj4444• 6 months ago

This comment completely misunderstands why NYC (and the core of most major cities) is not impressed by a supermarket.

Wegmans is popular because Wegmansnis good. But if you have a local baker, a local grocer, a local deli, and a small grocery store within the same block, all within walking distance of your apartment, you don’t need to deal with the hassles of finding stuff within a massive supermarket.

You get the highest quality products from people who specialize in those products.

Further, when you don’t have to drive 20-30 mins to go to a grocery store but the stores you need are within a 5 min walk, or more likely, right by the subway exit when you’re returning from work, you buy stuff as you need it, rather than stocking up for days.

Thats why Wegmans opened a store in Brooklyn Navy Yards in an area that’s close to no mass transit, because supermarkets are valuable in car centric areas and not as useful in walkable dense neighborhood.

mgce• 6 months ago

Strong disagree, and I used to go to that Wegmans regularly. It's fine. Solid market. Whole Foods is equally fine, and excels in some ways. Neither is obviously better.

subpixel• 6 months ago

Give me a Kroger with a Murray's Cheese counter thank you!

mangodrunk4• 6 months ago

Wegmans is good, but I find Whole Foods to have much better quality of products. Whole Foods used to be even better, we will see how Amazon manages it.

mike505• 6 months ago

I can list like five mass market supermarkets in NYC. Western Beef, Food Bazaar H Mart, City Fresh the regional chains like Stop and Shop Target.

wat10000• 6 months ago

What's so special about Wegmans? I have one a mile away but I almost never go there. It's a little pricey and they don't have anything particularly special. Although I pretty much never go to Whole Foods either. Amazon Fresh isn't (wasn't) near me so I only went to one once, also nothing special.

wan23• 6 months ago

I like that store but it's not exactly convenient. I'm a New Yorker - my apartment is small and I've never had a driver's license in my life. I need to buy small amounts of food frequently rather than load up, so going to a place that has kind of middling versions of everything isn't super useful compared to places that have smaller selections of good things. I spend a lot of time at Trader Joe's for example, though I buy bread from a bakery, tea from a tea shop, meat and cheese from a specialty shop, etc.

randycupertino• 6 months ago

I feel like they artificially made their prices super low for the last couple years and intentionally operated at a loss as a business tactic to force out competition and kill off local grocery stores. There were instances of their prices being lower than Walmart or other budget stores. The avocados were $0.25 each and carrots were half price of ones in Safeway, even ground beef was weirdly cheap. One time as a comparison I put the same items in my cart for Amazon fresh and Walmart and it was $21 at Amazon fresh and $36 at Walmart. WAY cheaper than Instacart too.

lelandfe3• 6 months ago

operated at a loss as a business tactic to force out competition and kill off local grocery stores

Wouldn't surprise me. I know a guy who invented a device for truckers that became ubiquitous in truck stops across the US. This would've been like 2014.

He refused to sell on Amazon, so Amazon duped his product and sold it at something crazy, like half price, until he agreed to list (at which point they dropped their competing product)

noboostforyou• 6 months ago

I feel like they artificially made their prices super low for the last couple years and intentionally operated at a loss as a business tactic to force out competition

iirc that's exactly what Amazon did to destroy diapers.com over a decade ago

kkukshtel2• 6 months ago

This is basically the playbook of every "disruptive technology" startup or FAANG initiative of a similar stripe - set prices incredibly low to bleed out competition and gain market share, then raise them once you are in the dominant market position.

pessimizer3• 6 months ago

Walmart isn't a budget grocery store, though. Its prices are higher than actual grocery stores (like Safeway.) Also, everyone is WAY cheaper than Instacart.

knowitnone33• 6 months ago

That's literally their MO. They've been doing that forever.

mattmaroon2• 6 months ago

And then they can’t figure out why the economics don’t work.

Phase 1: bankrupt the competition

Phase 2: ???

Phase 3: profit!

spike021• 6 months ago

You constantly have to work around employees fulfilling online orders

To be fair I've noticed this in multiple supermarket chains the last few years. Although they aren't usually employees, they are instacart runners or whatever.

I go fairly often to a Sprouts grocery store and there are times I need to avoid multiple people clearly doing an Instacart run with 2+ carts full of items.

Shelves are often emptier than they used to be also at these times.

coredog642• 6 months ago

Walmart is particularly bad for this: The employees do the picking and they have giant carts that monopolize the aisle. You're stuck waiting for them to scan and bag 8-10 popular items before you can get in there and grab the one thing you need.

phatfish• 6 months ago

Having watched these people when I do my own shopping, it made me realise, if i ever needed get someone to shop for me, it wouldn't be on a busy weekend.

RIMR2• 6 months ago

For a while, they had two stackable 10-off-40 coupons, and a 2-off-10 coupon, and it activated $36, so you could buy $36 worth of groceries for $14.

tshaddox2• 6 months ago

Interestingly, we only went to our local Amazon Fresh store a handful of times but it was always a perfectly fine experience. It seemed reasonably clean, well-stocked, and well-organized. Other than those new self-checkout shopping carts (which also actually worked well, even weighing produce), it was fairly indistinguishable from other grocery stores in our area.

Amazon Go, on the other hand, always seemed like a dead man walking. It's a fun novelty to check out and grab some junk food, but it must be far more expensive to build and run than a 7-Eleven, and it's not even meaningfully more convenient.

I should also add that we've been pretty happy Amazon Fresh delivery customers for a couple of years now (we resisted regular grocery delivery for a long time...until we had a child).

malfist• 6 months ago

You should also know that the AI that enabled the Amazon Go experience was the Actually Indians type of AI. https://www.businessinsider.com/amazons-just-walk-out-actual...

none_to_remain• 6 months ago

They had Amazon Go by Grand Central Terminal and it was great to grab a snack and drink on the way to the train, with no worry about being delayed by the checkout line. I figured they had people in India verifying things but saw no reason to care as a customer.

_delirium• 6 months ago

those new self-checkout shopping carts

I'm going to miss those. Two nice things about them compared to a normal self-checkout: 1) you see things ring up as you shop instead of at the end, which is nice in case of errors or unexpected prices, 2) you can shop directly into a reusable bag or backpack instead of repacking everything at the end.

hung• 6 months ago

lol are you me? There was also a loophole with the coupons where it only used the total before discounts to validate the limit was met, so you could buy something that was $10 or 2 for $15, but the 2 would count as $20 towards your $40 limit.

I moved away from Seattle a while back so I'm not sure if they ever closed that one. I really miss getting all those cheap groceries!

sylens• 6 months ago

Spot on assessment of an Amazon Fresh store. Their big gimmick is a cart where you can scan your groceries as you put them in it, then you just walk through a designated check out lane and it charges your card automatically for whats inside. I've tried it a few times and I can't say its preferrable for any type of shopping trip. Only picking up a few things? You're faster with a basket and self checkout. A big weekly food order for a family of four? All of your groceries won't fit in their special cart because it needs room for the scale and the scanners.

The prices are indeed pretty insane and the produce is always great, but the stores are ghost towns most of the time. The only people inside are those using it as a spot to drop off Amazon.com returns and those fulfilling pick-up orders

Bluecobra7• 6 months ago

They could never get that cart right. I tried using that cart again last week and it was still glitchy and it seems like you waste more time screwing around with the cart. I found it quicker to just use the normal check out since nobody shops there anyway. At my local store, you could go there on a Saturday afternoon and find only one cashier with no line. The Trader Joe’s nearby would be absolutely jammed.

drysine• 6 months ago

$0.85 for a box of Barilla pasta

That's cool. Which one? The cheapest one in Russia costs about $1.20 [0]

a photo of their QR code and reuse it over and over again

Don't you think it's a wrong thing to do?

[0] https://5ka.ru/product/makarony-barilla-dzhirandole-n-34-450...

danans• 6 months ago

These stores were solving for an Amazon problem (brick and mortar stores without the expense of workers), and not any significant customer problem.

They often put them in places, hoping that people would be attracted by marginally lower prices and brand extension, all while removing one of the primary appeals (for most people) of in person grocery shopping: impromptu community socialization, even if it is simply greeting the checkout worker.

I'm not surprised they failed.

jedberg• 6 months ago

I don't know about other areas, but here in the Bay Area (or at least Silicon Valley) our Whole Foods has subsumed all the services provided by Amazon Fresh (and Go really never worked). So we're not really losing any services, just the brand name.

testfoobar• 6 months ago

I miss the old Whole Foods.

NickC255• 6 months ago

I do too. Completely different vibe from when it was independent to when Bezos bought it.

DrinkingRedStar• 6 months ago

Doesn't surprise me either. Anecdotal story coming, but there is physical location on Philadelphia, and I stopped by as I needed an item for dinner that night, and it was on my way home.

Store was kind of bare, and poorly organized. But the kicker is they didn't accept any form of mobile wallet! They had an identical POS system to wholefoods which takes it just fine.

So I quickly put my items back and headed to Giant.. Haven't been back since

thijson• 6 months ago

They have a good price on take out pizza. Unlimited toppings, and with Prime membership it's $8 something for a large pizza. It was probably their loss leader to get people in the store. I felt like the store was usually pretty empty when I was there. I wonder if Amazon will keep Whole Foods too.

benbristow• 6 months ago

They literally only put them in unaffordable areas. Like the only one I know is in a residential area of Southwalk in London not far from the TATE Modern museum. I don't even live in London.

Been in one once for the novelty as they've never been useful.

advisedwang• 6 months ago

The technology lives on, as Amazon "Just Walk Out". But rather than general grocery stores, it is used for concessions at stadiums and places like that.

I guess it turned out that the need more human intervention than they hoped, so the cost is too high for regular stores. However at places where a premium can be charged for high throughput or a low friction experience then the cost of the human intervention can be recouped.

RIMR2• 6 months ago

Just a heads up that only the Amazon Go stores did the "just walk out" shopping thing. Amazon Fresh stores were pretty much just regular grocery stores. They had shopping carts with the self-checkout built in, but that was the extent of the technology.

rawrenstein• 6 months ago

There was a concept Amazon Fresh store with “Just Walk Out” technology on Capitol Hill in Seattle. They closed it down a couple of years back but the brand was absolutely Amazon Fresh.

dopamean• 6 months ago

I honestly thought they closed them alreay.

a-dub• 6 months ago

amazon fresh never really made much sense to me alongside wfm.

justincormack• 6 months ago

Every time I check I am still amazed that the Amazon Hair Salon in London is still open. https://www.amazon.co.uk/b?node=26247109031

kilroy1232• 6 months ago

I live close to that place. When I walk by I'm dumbfounded too and often think who would go there?

vlaksh365• 6 months ago

I guess that is curtains for the Amazon Go kiosks in Seattle's Climate Pledge Arena? That whole arena was setup as a poorly veiled Amazon store...

fencepost3• 6 months ago

The Fresh stores are kind of a weird shopping experience with a mix of normal, overpriced and bizarrely cheap at different times.

I've gotten into the habit of stopping in to wander the aisles and check prices because of it (e.g. I stocked up on a bunch of canned soup when most (but not all) Progresso soups were $0.44 a month or two back, and I picked up some microwavable rice+quinoa pouches for my wife at $0.35 each a couple weeks ago, but the inconsistency and overall not great prices mean it can't be my go-to grocery destination.

I'm sure the one by me will be closing since there's a significantly larger Whole Foods just a few miles away.

system22• 6 months ago

They had cherries for $1.99 per pound while Ralphs or trader joes sold them for $5.99 per pound. I ate as much as I could while it lasted.

golbez9• 6 months ago

In my town they redeveloped an empty corner lot at a busy intersection just for the Amazon Fresh store. I guess it'll go back to being empty again...

deepflow• 6 months ago

We have Żabka Nano which is self-serve cashierless shop in Poland. You just swipe you card at the entrance, get whatever you want and walk out. I think they use computer vision system to detect the products taken from the shelves. It kinda amazes me because it's what Amazon promised but failed to deliver.

dionian2• 6 months ago

Yea well the other thing is zabka is an awesome store, the amazon store sucked

wagwang• 6 months ago

If we lived in a high trust society, you could just trust people to scan their own items and walk out.

throwaway2037• 6 months ago

Can you name some high trust societies?

jandrese5• 6 months ago

Human nature probably prevents that from ever being a reality, at least at scale. In a tiny tight knit community where literally everybody knows everybody else maybe you could pull that off, but even then you have to get a bit lucky.

In a world where anonymity is a thing there will always be at least one inherent shithead who ruins it for everyone. Even if you do have a community where it's true, that can change anytime someone has a kid or someone moves in.

IvyMike2• 6 months ago

The Dash Cart was pretty close.

dlcarrier7• 6 months ago

Most grocery stores I shop at have merchandise outside the front doors and between the doors and the registers. You could easily walk out with unpaid merchandise and no one would notice.

surlyadopter• 6 months ago

Disappointing. The shopping experience is mediocre and prices/quality are no better than other local supermarkets.

However, I love my local Amazon Fresh store because it's a super convenient Amazon return location...

jgbuddy3• 6 months ago

The general force behind this is the expansion of sub-same-day delivery which they have been pushing hard for the last year. Amazon fresh was a more traditional model which didn't fit in well with amazon's strengths (fulfillment, automation) because they tried to enter a market they were directly competing with (in-person shopping) and charged users for delivery in addition to their existing membership.

It's a welcome change IMO, amazon groceries are super cheap online and now delivery is free. They have been removing the fresh name from products for a few months now and replacing with amazon grocery. Certainly less confusion for consumers, at least

vondur• 6 months ago

Not surprised. Unless the item is on sale (which can be very good deals) their pricing is no better than a standard supermarket and usually far more expensive than a Target or WalMart. And they quickly gave up on the scan and go where the smart shopping card read everything in the basket and automatically charged your Amazon account, so it was back to regular checkout.

tempire• 6 months ago

It's a trap!

IvyMike2• 6 months ago

The "just walk out" surveillance system sucked, but the Dash Cart shopping was actually pretty nice/

saos• 6 months ago

Not surprised at all

EngineerUSA• 6 months ago

Amazon keeps shutting Restaurants, their retail stores, etc., but I for one am glad they are at least trying. I agree that the fiasco around the Indians running the show was a PR nightmare for their idea, but large companies running startup like ideas should be encouraged rather than disparaged (and I am no fan of Amazon just to be clear). I think this is one of those ideas where execution failed. If you are a busy worker, it is great to just head there and grab what you need, and walk out. Just faster all around.

CamouflagedKiwi• 6 months ago

Yeah, they've just closed the one near me. I think they underestimated how hard it would be, at least in the UK - the existing supermarket chains are already competitive, mostly pretty good, and people have surprisingly high brand loyalty to them. I don't think I've even talked to anyone who has shopped in Amazon Fresh, or even wanted to.

maxfurman• 6 months ago

Wow, they just opened a brand new one in Philly less than two months ago. I've yet to shop there and I guess now I never will. It must have cost millions to clear that site and build a whole new building there. Just to abandon it. I wish I had money to waste like that.

Edit: it actually opened in August, so it was around for about six months instead of two.

nunez• 6 months ago

This was the more surprising bit for me: https://www.geekwire.com/2026/amazon-supersizes-its-walmart-...

Amazon straight up wants to just become Walmart. Or maybe Sears is a more apt comparison given their mail-order beginnings.

dgunay• 6 months ago

I've only been to the Amazon Fresh in my neighborhood, haven't been to other locations, here is what my experience was like:

They resisted implementing self checkout for years before eventually folding. No digital wallets though, you have to either use plastic or link it to your Amazon account.

The whole dash cart system was a solution in search of a problem IMO. I'm already able to check out about as efficiently as possible. Frontloading the scanning time isn't really an amazing improvement. The store was never crowded enough for it to matter.

My biggest problem with the store was that it was lacking random pantry staples and supplies that you would expect from your primary grocer. Several times I showed up in desperate need of something for a recipe or household task and they just wouldn't have it.

The produce was actually decent quality and competitively priced, but my alternative (the local Ralph's) I think just had some kind of curse or something on it because the produce at that specific location was a consistent level of awful observed over 5 years.

I hope they replace it with a whole foods, much better store IMO.

spprashant• 6 months ago

I guess I am in the minority but I really liked the dash cart. Apart from the occasional niggle, it worked as advertised once I understood the system. I get my own bags to the store, so I can directly bag items as I go and just walk out when done.

sodafountan• 6 months ago

I stopped into the Amazon Fresh in Broomall, PA, to check it out not too long ago. It just looks bland and dystopian from the outside, and not much about it is impressive from the inside. I've worked with computers and technology my whole life, and the entrance to the store just confused me. If I remember correctly, I had to scan the Amazon app on my phone to enter the building. Once inside, it felt like a warehouse; the aisles were too small, and the food selection wasn't even really that great. (From memory, it was a few years ago that I went)

All in all, it's a cool concept on paper with absolutely terrible execution.

Only went once, bought some snacks, and left.

julianozen• 6 months ago

Amazon Fresh had no reason to exist. They closed down a great Whole Foods near me and replaced it with a store with minimal changes to safeway/albertsons. Heavy carts for automatic scanning that barely saved time at checkout.

I will miss the grab and go tech in the Amazon stores. I was hoping they would successfully manage to sell that to other stores and make the tech wide spread in bodegas, gas stations and 711s

awill• 6 months ago

this is pretty surprising. Didn't they spent a fortune on the camera tech for Amazon Go?

aendruk• 6 months ago

For about five years an Amazon Fresh in Seattle was literally my closest grocery store but I never once set foot in there, simply because it felt icky and dystopian to let Amazon any further into my life. I wonder how many others felt similarly.

dlcarrier7• 6 months ago

I went to one once, and it still worked like a regular grocery store, too. The only reason I never went back was because they were expensive and in an awkward location. There were some items only discounted to Prime members, but for everything else, you could forgo the technology and Amazon integration and pay with cash or a card. It's not like the Amazon Go stores where you have to use their system.

bahmboo2• 6 months ago

Amazon Fresh provided lots of good jobs in my community. Family members worked there. Good pay and they employed locally (or can walk to work). Same with whole foods. Too bad Amazon couldn't make it work. Interesting timing with their push for more online grocery offerings.

bahmboo2• 6 months ago

Went to return some packages at the local Fresh store on Jackson. Huge long line to get in. Eventually wound up doing some shopping. Place was very full (within fire regulations of course). Some good security and organizing folk. A tip bowl at the return desk that said "help the employees get wasted". All the pricing is electronic and puterized so I'm expecting that at the last minute on the last day the last product will sell for within a cent.

Actually knowing Amazon they'll give the staff a huge gimme and nice bonuses. People crap on Amazon but they are a good employe for the little guy. They can't rewrite society so go for that take. Otherwise people are bummed they lost good jobs.

netfortius• 6 months ago

While https://abc7chicago.com/post/orland-park-village-board-vote-...

mcintyre1994• 6 months ago

I noticed the other day the Amazon store near me has closed but it says a whole foods market is coming soon, which is another company they own. I wonder how many of them they’ll rebrand and keep in some form like that.

bilalq• 6 months ago

These were absolutely incredible when they first opened up right on until covid. The blue-apron style meal kits they had were actually really tasty and the gimmicky integration with Alexa to tell you the next step in the recipe was actually kind of useful when you were busy stirring a pot or cutting something and too busy to pull out the recipe card. It was like a 7-Eleven, but with the prices of a normal grocery store and higher quality prepared food. Not needing to deal with checkout felt freeing. I substituted many grocery store runs with a quick walk over to the original Amazon Go back in the day.

After covid, it was never the same. Open for shorter windows, closed on Sundays, reduced selection, no more meal kits etc.

I had many friends who worked on Amazon Go, so it's a bit sad to see that work come to an end.

bob_theslob646• 6 months ago

I had many friends who worked on Amazon Go, so it's a bit sad to see that work come to an end.

What did they do?

arjie2• 6 months ago

I used one in San Francisco once because I wanted to try it out. It was honestly a rather flawless experience for me and I liked it because the scan gate and minders (it was when it launched - I don't know if they kept them) kept the shoplifters out. Shoplifters are unpleasant to share a store with. Unsurprisingly, those who skip some social norms also skip other ones.

Anyway, I didn't go back after the first time because it was more like a corner store than a grocery store. Bags of chips and sandwiches in plastic boxes and so on. Overall, the modern Whole Foods is a much better experience. Guards at the entrance to keep unpleasant people out, a fairly quick check-out experience, and the ability to scan your palm instead of having to pull out a credit card or tap your watch.

About the only improvement that I would personally like is a Fast Shopper bonus where you scan something that maps you to your Amazon Prime profile and if you finish checking out fast you get access to a faster lane. The only downside is when people with large bags of things insist on using the self check-out counters and then stand there having mis-scanned items.

Speeding up check-out is a personal life improvement but realistically it would not cause me to shop more, so I understand discontinuing the store.

arjie2• 6 months ago

Absolute tragedy is checking my email and finding out that Amazon is going to discontinue the palm scan.

solfox• 6 months ago

It's confusing why they are discontinuing that feature. It seemed incredibly accurate/fast and was a great way to pay at Whole Foods.

divbzero2• 6 months ago

The local Amazon Fresh is closed this afternoon with a sign reading:

  We are closed
  for the
  remainder of 
  the day.

  We apologize for any
  inconvenience. Please come
  back tomorrow during our
  normal business hours.

sparkler123• 6 months ago

The Amazon Fresh in North Seattle had Just Walk Out. Initially you had to "scan in" and "scan out" and then they eventually removed the "scan out" (or scan in? can't remember). From a shopper's perspective, it was pretty good, and I was hopeful they'd figure out the tech. One time they overcharged me for a paper bag and there was no way to dispute it. It was only $0.08, but really rubbed me the wrong way. I know I got a fair bit of stuff for free as they seemed to err on the side of not charging vs. charging if they weren't able to figure it out, though.

I actually did find it saved me time. I would go in, grab a couple things, and leave, and it was actually a good experience to do that. I never did full grocery store runs there, though.

The aisles were always packed with workers picking/packing orders, which was frustrating to deal with.

One thing that was bad about it was that produce was all fixed price. At a normal store you pay per pound for an onion, but there every onion was $1 (or whatever the price was). Giant onion, tiny onion, all the same price. The produce got picked over in weird ways because of that.

Then one day they said, "okay, Just Walk Out is gone, it's just a normal grocery store now." Then it just became just a mediocre grocery store. There were definitely periods where aisles could be nearly empty, but lately it's been okay. Prices were great, though -- by far the cheapest in the area.

Their hot bar was extremely mediocre. I like the Whole Foods one, but theirs was just... not good. Half the time they didn't even have it stocked with food.

They had a little stand up front where kids could get a free piece of fruit, which mine liked.

It also had convenient returns for Amazon purchases, which was about half of what I went there for.

It was a convenient place for me, and I like it better than Safeway, but I can't say I'm too heartbroken that it's going away. QFC/Sprouts/Town&Country/Safeway are a few minutes in any direction, but they're more expensive. I doubt they'll turn this one into a Whole Foods either.

RandallBrown• 6 months ago

You were overcharged .08 cents for a paper bag? Like you were charged $0.16? Or did you not use a bag and were charged anyway?

sciencesama• 6 months ago

Amazon is losing its freshness

erickhill• 6 months ago

I wonder this will impact the "just walk out" booze stores at T-Mobile Park (MLB)? Those seem pretty successful.

joshgachnang• 6 months ago

Damn. I just got an email that they'll be discontinuing the palm payment June 3. I've barely used Fresh and Go, but I use this at self checkout at Whole Foods all the time. Beats finding the code to scan and using Apple Pay.

We're reaching out because you have an active Amazon One account. Amazon One palm authentication services will be discontinued at retail businesses on June 3, 2026. You can continue using Amazon One at participating locations until that date.
Amazon will automatically delete Amazon One user data, including palm data. No action is needed from you.

voodoo_child• 6 months ago

Same. Bummed about Amazon one palm, I use it all the time.

mattmaroon2• 6 months ago

They built one in my area a few years ago and then never opened it. It’s just been sitting vacant the entire time.

thegreatpeter2• 6 months ago

What! I loved the Amazon fresh in my neighborhood. It was way better than any other grocery store. I can’t believe this. I hope it at least gets converted to a Whole Foods

another_twist• 6 months ago

I have never been to an Amazon Fresh store. But I do remember that French chain that trolled Amazon with their humans first approach.

jzymbaluk2• 6 months ago

I live right down the street from an Amazon Go store, and I like it because it's convenient when it's open, but the hours on this store stunk: it closed at 4pm sometimes. I found it very funny that this store advertised itself as a fully automated experience, when in fact there needs to be a worker/manager there all the time for it to be open. If it were actually automated, it could've been open 24/7

Schlagbohrer• 6 months ago

Meanwhile in East Asia they have no problem with tons of 24/7/365 stores, even fully vending machine stores. Heck even Europe has vending machine stores that are constantly open without even a door that could be closed, selling grocery basics.

seanmcdirmid3• 6 months ago

America had 24/7 grocery stores, convenience stores, restaurants, and even some Walmarts before COVID. Now, at least in my area, thats a thing of the past. Still not as bad as Switzerland where everything closes early on Saturday and is closed on sundays.

China has had 24/7 McDonald’s since forever, well, and lord of other things as well. But not grocery stores at least.

lopis• 6 months ago

And wasn't it revealed some time ago that Amazon Go stores were not really that automated to begin with, because they heavily relied on off-shore cheap human labor?

jzymbaluk2• 6 months ago

I wonder why that hasn't caught on in the states. My first thought is vandalism/people destroying or stealing the automated equipment, but surely that's not a unique problem to the US

bamboozled• 6 months ago

Another one of these ideas that was the future but for various reasons wasn't.

I honestly think in some ways, going to a store is about being around other people, the same as going to a cafe, not necessarily talking, but just being in the presence of others seems to be what many people crave. I largely think it's the appeal of shopping malls.

dbspin• 6 months ago

The only time I tried one of these it locked my credit card, while visiting the US. Not a fun time.

Blackstrat• 6 months ago

As one who has spent substantially since Amazon's inception, Amazon in recent years has become an unreliable supplier in my area. Much of the product sold by Amazon is sourced from China and until recently Amazon did little to distinguish name-brand products from knockoffs. That's why companies like J&J weren't making product available on the Amazon site. Amazon Prime is laughable here, frequently taking a week or longer. The local Whole Foods is a mere shadow of its previous incarnation. Of course, most of the bookstore alternatives have been driven out of business. The B&N strategy is more appropriate to competing with Books-a-Million than the old Borders. Overall, Amazon seems more focused on its movie/TV business than it does what created it. And Bezos? Well, it's obvious that righting the ship at Amazon isn't nearly as important as being a jet setting celebrity with a new younger wife and playing with his space ahips. And BTW, I'm in a major city, not some rural town.

stefap2• 6 months ago

And Amazon also discontinuing Amazon One palm authentication services in whole foods. I wonder if these are related events. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46790734

rpncreator• 6 months ago

There are around 12 Amazon Go / Amazon Fresh in the metro Chicago area. Unless all employees are part-time employees (and assuming around 10-ish employees per store), I seriously wonder how they got around Illinois WARN requirements [1] requiring 60 days advance notice of the closures.

[1] https://labor.illinois.gov/laws-rules/conmed/warn.html

freejazz5• 6 months ago

What a joke. In the end all it did was effectively outsource the cashiers to India. I'm so exhausted with "tech".

janicerk• 6 months ago

Never saw these in europe

erratic_chargi• 6 months ago

Of course it failed, nobody want to shop at a limited selection with mandatory signing up amazon store that closes at like 8.

But a 24/7 data driven store that is a last resort would have succeeded.

Put slop bowls at business areas, Junk food where there are clubs for drunk people.

Moving season in college town, put some stationary and some tools for DIY stuff.

In valentines cheap wine and chocolate for the singles, and flowers with top rated gifts for couples.

system22• 6 months ago

Amazon Go had one of the best turkey pesto sandwiches you could buy for $6. It was my treat after driving back from the dog park. I felt sad after they closed that Go store. Coffee (Starbucks) was free with a minimum purchase of $5, which the sandwich covered. I miss that, but only that. There was literally nothing useful to buy on the go. All weird Amazon products, nothing close to 7-Eleven.

Amazon closing its Fresh and Go stores

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