Google Secretly Invested In Zynga, Preparing To Launch Google Games

http://techcrunch.com/2010/07/10/google-secretly-invested-100-million-in-zynga-preparing-to-launch-google-games/

by daniel_levine • 16 years ago

171 116 16 years ago

niekmaas• 16 years ago

Wasn't Zynga threatening to leave Facebook or start a (long) legal battle? This is ideal for Google of course since they have been struggling to get their social networks to really take off. Getting Zynga to move to Google exclusively could be the boost they have been waiting for so long.

awa• 16 years ago

I think it would be suicide for Zynga to abandon Facebook completely, afaik, they make games which can easily duplicated and hence alternatives would pop up on Facebook soon.

there• 16 years ago

http://techcrunch.com/2010/05/07/zynga-gunning-up-and-lawyer...

and soon after, they released their standalone ipad farmville app

dieterrams2• 16 years ago

Does this mean we can finally abandon the idea that Google's mission is "to organize the world's information"?

gruseom• 16 years ago

Not if the article's argument is correct and this is really about the social graph.

dieterrams2• 16 years ago

There's tons of money to be made off social games alone.

And to the extent that it's about "the social graph", it's about making money off the social graph. There's nothing inherently wrong with that, but as Google becomes increasingly involved with owning, controlling, and/or providing content, as opposed to just "organizing" it (indexing the web, organizing email, etc.), their mission statement becomes more PR fluff than truth.

With Search and Gmail, their ability to obtain user data at least hinged upon Google's superior ability to index web and email information and make it "universally accessible and useful." Obtaining social graph data through an existing social games developer isn't like that at all.

snprbob86• 16 years ago

I don't think so. Games are a gateway into the living room, which plays into the other half of their mission: making that information universally accessible and useful.

neilk• 16 years ago

They've been off that course since at least 2005 or so. Notice how now they're putting money into social when things like Book Search are relatively stagnant.

Their real mission is something like "exploit cloud computing".

SoftwareMaven• 16 years ago

It is still organizing the world's information. They've just learned that there is a prioritization people see in that organization: information from people they know trumps information gleaned from Page Rank.

Sember• 16 years ago

In my opinion Google is all over the place, everywhere at the same time which could lead to overextension of resources and finances. This could ruin Google at some point in the future, they are losing focus.

ippisl• 16 years ago

Yes , they are all over the place, but some see it as trying to optimize and defend the whole value chain of their main products. sort of vertical integration , in the unique form it shows on the internet.

dirtyaura• 16 years ago

Big tech companies should be all over the place. If they focus too much, they will die, because ability to change is a survival strategy in tech sector.

And this particular case seems to very strategic for Google. It's believed (inside Google too) that Facebook could be the major thread to Google, if people start searching in Facebook first and go to Google only as a second option. Thus, attacking Facebook directly is very strategic move.

And it seems to fit nicely to Android strategy too.

lhnz• 16 years ago

You can have a mission, but you also need to make money. Business.

CoachRufus87• 16 years ago

Zynga games will tie into the GoogleMe ecosystem nicely.

hunterclarke• 16 years ago

Is it just me, or is Zynga raising an absolutely obnoxious amount of money?

bpm1402• 16 years ago

They've been profitable since their very first quarter and, according to the TC article, they will likely make as much in profit next year as they've raised in the last three years.

The fundraising is almost exclusively used for acquisition, so what's the obnoxious part?

po• 16 years ago

Farmville is evil; Zynga makes Farmville; Google invested in Zynga.

Q.E.D.

;-)

seldo3• 16 years ago

Google bought DoubleClick. They were tainted from then on, as far as I'm concerned. DoubleClick had a known shady history, and executives from DC moved into positions of influence within Google.

EricBurnett• 16 years ago

Just curious, what terrible things has DoubleClick done since being bought by Google? If anything, I'd say Google 'tainted' them and not the other way around.

speek• 16 years ago

I don't quite understand how this fits into the grand scheme of Google. Now I think Google is just buying stuff to buy stuff. Though I could see acquiring user-interaction data being useful, especially in the casual space.

jgilliam• 16 years ago

Google is freaking out over Facebook. This gives them both a chance to build out their own social graph (say as a launch partner for Google Me), and access to a copy of most of Facebook's.

This data is important for search, but critical for ads.

seldo3• 16 years ago

Oh Google. The sharks are circling and you're strapping on your waterskis.

mynameishere2• 16 years ago

Can you imagine working on Farmville? I mean, it would be like going into work every day to refine the equivilent of the Fisher Price moo farm toy [1] except a) for adults and b) relatively juvenile. Imagine the meetings, mostly run by marketing idiots.

"Okay, we need the new chewy coco grove coconut tree special item out by next Monday. So that means everyone's coming in on saturday."

But how can you argue with 85 million users and a billion in revenue? Google sure can't.

[1] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ek_qxoGDyAw

code_duck6• 16 years ago

How is this different than the rest of the game industry?

alnayyir• 16 years ago

Replace moo moo with desert eagle.

People have an easier time taking themselves seriously when guns and demons are involved.

Cf. comic books, authors, goth teenagers

traskjd• 16 years ago

Exactly right.

I present on game development to local user groups in New Zealand and I always get a good response when citing "It's fun to write games - wouldn't you much rather be writing a class called SuperLaserWeapon than MembershipIdentityProvider" :-)

mynameishere2• 16 years ago

You have to play farmville, first of all. It isn't a game. It's just as I described it--"cow goes moo" and that's the extent of it.

patio11• 16 years ago

I hate to say it for fear of giving aid and comfort to my Gender Studies professors, but I think a major portion of the reason why Blizzard et al get geek cred and FarmVille does not is because FarmVille is played by women.

jfarmer• 16 years ago

Do you know anyone who works at Zynga? From this comment, I'd bet you don't.

Wovon man nicht sprechen kann...

glhaynes2• 16 years ago

Or maybe it'd be fun because you'd be making something that people can relax and enjoy and that adds a little extra social interaction to their everyday experience, often with people that they don't have another "reason" to be in contact with.

naner2• 16 years ago

No, actually, it is just a stupid waste of everyone's time.

MartinCron2• 16 years ago

That's how I felt, as a guy who feels pretty "meh" about lolcats, when I was working at Cheezburger Network.

Even now, I know that software that I wrote is helping to make literally millions of people happy every day. That feels a hell of a lot better than helping a big cable company with video DRM, that's for sure.

raquo• 16 years ago

That reminds me of "provide liquidity"

contextfree• 16 years ago

Presumably Fisher Price itself employs people who go to work every day to refine their moo farm and other toys. I doubt most of them see the nature of their jobs as particularly embarrassing or degrading.

spot• 16 years ago

that's because they make moo farms for kids...

nzmsv• 16 years ago

Some people really like designing toys. And at least IEEE thinks it's a cool job: http://spectrum.ieee.org/consumer-electronics/gadgets/shanno...

WEREA• 16 years ago

I gotta agree with your comment about marketing idiots

nnash• 16 years ago

Hey now, don't talk smack about the Fisher Price moo farm. Memories right there.

bemmu2• 16 years ago

You get to run experiments on a huge number of users. Do a split test and get a significant result in an hour. Figure out a way to make it just 1% stickier and suddenly you created value worth millions to the company. It sounds fascinating and I could easily imagine working there.

timcederman2• 16 years ago

Yeah, you'd think that, wouldn't you? The more users you get though, the more conservative you become. "But if this drops conversion by 0.1%, that will cost us $100k/week." Gets old fast and stifles change.

Keyframe• 16 years ago

On the other hand I think it would be a blast to work on pixel art and be paid for it.

trickjarrett• 16 years ago

I know the guy in charge of in game economics, he used to work for Upper Deck Entertainment as lead on a few of their games. He's a smart guy. When we talked he was hesitant to discuss Zynga too much because he knows that people are not fond of the brand, but his job sounded interesting.

blader• 16 years ago

The people at Zynga are many things, "idiots" would not be one of them.

"Okay, we need the new chewy coco grove coconut tree special item out by next Monday. So that means everyone's coming in on saturday."

Surprisingly accurate portrayal of actual meetings here though.

code_duck6• 16 years ago

Well, good luck to Google. Given that the public donated $175k to a group of inexperienced, unknown programmers who did little more than say they were out to replace Facebook, I'd say the market is ready for an alternative.

peter123• 16 years ago

It's strategic for both parties. Google wants to get Facebook users onto their own network and Zynga needs to reduce their sole dependence on Facebook.

metachris• 16 years ago

Anyone has heard of "Google Games" before? It seems to be a social gaming platform which will be available on Android as well. Couldn't find any info about it though.

Jun83• 16 years ago

I think Google's worry about Facebook (partly justified, partly not) is starting to cause them to make pointless (and time wasting) decisions.

If I had 5mins with Sergei and Larry, I would say (after taking a long sip from the free organic drink I just got from the snack bar we're standing next to)

"Look, the real enemy is not FB but Apple (and sometimes your own engineering hubris, e.g. Buzz), so focus all your troops on this front. Don't dilute your strengths with topsy-turvy fads like Farmville. Remember the last time you tried that route when you tried to copy Second Life's act, does anyone even remember them now? Concentrate on (i) getting an Android tablet out, and (ii) get a $99 Google TV box running on Atom with cool software (not the sorry thing you showed at the I/O) to beat Apple to the punch.

It's that simple."

joubert• 16 years ago

They have a pretty disappointing track record when it comes to consumer hardware. I bet it is not in their DNA.

donw2• 16 years ago

I think that their hiring and internal quality-control process excludes it, actually.

For building Google's search engine, you need people who know search and sorting algorithms backwards, forwards, inside-out, and upside down. You need hardcore A/B testing based on statistical significance, and rigorous respect of the data you collect.

To make the iPhone and the iPad, you need neither of those.

You need one guy who will walk around like an idiot for months pretending that a deck of cards is his telephone, and writing down every observation and thought that he has on usability. You need a master craftsman who can direct the entire experience, without losing his head in the tech specs.

Google doesn't hire people like that. Decisions are made by committee, backed by data and research, which gives them their edge in technical excellence, but also cripples them in hardware and marketing.

It kills me. I really want Google to succeed here; Apple has effectively zero competition in the smartphone and tablet market other than Google.

Ok, what follows is a bit of a rant. :)

Personally, the first thing I'd do with Android is revamp the market and distribution model to standardize the OS across platforms and vendors, so that an Android works the same no matter where you got it. Vendors can add in custom content (wallpapers, extra apps, ringtones, etc), but the interface (icons, look-and-feel) needs to be the same.

The vendors will go with this. They're getting their asses handed to them by Apple, and Google is their lifeline, because they're saving a ton on development costs.

Second, I'd market the hell out of the areas that Apple cant match, but that matter to the consumer, namely voice search, and maybe being able to hold the phone in the human hand without losing reception.

And whatever you do, don't play the celebrity card. Apple's iPhone and iPad ads make it look like you're using the device. Google could steal a page from that, but with Android devices being used in the real world, not in the Apple cleanroom.

Perceval• 16 years ago

>Look, the real enemy is not FB but Apple

The first thing I thought of when I read this news was precisely that it was targeted at matching Apple. All of a sudden Apple has come out of nowhere as a gaming force, threatening even Nintendo's portable gaming systems. Google investing in gaming looks like a move to reinforce their offerings in this department.

angrycoder• 16 years ago

And the funny thing is, Apple doesn't give a shit about gaming.

marcusbooster• 16 years ago

And I like to think they'd respond,

"Look Jun8, in 12 years we've built a company worth upwards of 150 billion dollars, and you've amassed roughly 844 karma points."

code_duck6• 16 years ago

Well, how much karma has Larry Page racked up on HN??

waterlesscloud• 16 years ago

It's good to know that companies worth billions never make mistakes that drive that value down. Certainly never down to nothing.

Jun83• 16 years ago

LOL, I've collected that much karma in less than a year. Given 12 years, God knows where I'll go!

Seriously, I'd like to think that your comment was a joke. Because if a company cannot learn from foot soldiers in the domain and gets cocky, stagnation and eventually death is close at hand. I hope Google is not at that point (like Microsoft)

ErrantX• 16 years ago

Apple would be a hard battle, I think. On the other hand facebook has the potential to actually enroach onto googles main revenue stream.

I see what you are trying to say but zynga are much more than a fad - at least for now. They have big profits and, more importantly for google, an instant social graph.

Google desperately wants to be your login provider and social graph. Really desperately.

wslh• 16 years ago

Well, I don't know you but many people around me are living their lifes deep into Facebook.Facebook is an Internet inside Internet and that's very dangerous.

matwood• 16 years ago

Google needs to be concerned about Apple, but FB threatens their main revenue stream. As more and more people get on FB and put all their information on FB, those same people have less incentive to go to Google to do any searching and instead will just search FB.

It's interesting how the internet exploded and had content popping up all over the place and now the content has ended up self aggregating to a few sites like FB and youtube.

124816• 16 years ago

I know it seems retarded, but things like copying second life cost the company pretty little. Ten or twenty people's work for two years, thrown out and discarded. We're looking at a couple million down the drain. A lot for you or me, but not worth worrying about for them.

Sure, those things might be somewhat embarrassing, but I doubt they have a significant effect in the long term. (Except, that is, when they turn out to be a good idea and succeed.)

Also, for Apple to be a real competitor to Google, they would have to threaten Google's core money-maker, online ads, especially search ads. It's possible iAds will end up being such a competitor, and were I Google, I'd be concerned. But I'd be much more worried that for many people, "the internet" would become "facebook," and thus I wouldn't be able to show them ads.

llimllib• 16 years ago

Google -> Google!

joshu• 16 years ago

Ouch

code_duck6• 16 years ago

maximum recursion depth exceeded in line 1

ojbyrne• 16 years ago

Every day I go to 7-11 for coffee. And cringe at the zynga branding everywhere.

ephermata• 16 years ago

Is it possible to buy 7-11 coffee with points from zynga games?

code_duck6• 16 years ago

Really? I miss the good old days when Jedis and Jabba were on 7-11 glasses, in that case.

We don't have 7-11 here.... Let it be known that I pine for Super Nachos.

bd• 16 years ago

Interesting. Both Google and Zynga are very much data driven companies.

Remember story about Google choosing shade of blue by testing 41 variants?

That's how Zynga designs its (extremely successful) games. Everything is measured and analyzed. They are basically conducting one massive experimental psychology study of what makes people (s)tick.

barmstrong• 16 years ago

This sounds like TechCrunch editorializing and trying to make a story out of nothing.

I don't think Google cares about this.

alanh• 16 years ago

Just throwing this out there: I consider it unethical to invest in Zynga.

Edit: They are essentially using psychology, social and otherwise, to ultimately trick people out of their money. A classic on the topic: http://techcrunch.com/2009/10/31/scamville-the-social-gaming...

s3graham• 16 years ago

Care to expand? I'm not especially familiar with them other than they make some casual games.

Tichy4• 16 years ago

A while ago they were involved in a scandal, when it became clear that most of their money came from ads for scams. Don't have a link for you, but should be easy to find. (Edit: "Scamville" might be a good keyword to try).

JMiao• 16 years ago

not disagreeing with you, but you could say the same thing about gilt groupe, groupon, etc.

one man's "scam" could very well be another man's "deal."

pclark2• 16 years ago

Keeping someones attention is almost the winning or losing factor in startupa

cybernytrix• 16 years ago

And when did corporations start having morals or even ethics? Google is just interested in the $$$.

greenlblue• 16 years ago

The article says something about social graph but that doesn't make sense. Gmail basically rules the world when it comes to email so they already have a lot of social graph information just from email correspondences. There must be some other strategy they are pursuing.

Encosia• 16 years ago

In terms of userbase, GMail is still third behind Hotmail and Yahoo. I would bet that current Farmville users overlap less with GMail than other email services too.

naturalized• 16 years ago

This is great news for China. While the Silicon Valley gets rotten from inside, making this useless stuff, they will be buying bankrupt US chip companies and making their own microprocessors.

pclark2• 16 years ago

You consider Zynga, a company with a ridiculous amount of attention from users, and expected to hit $1Bn revenues next year, useless?

Vorcha• 16 years ago

The potential of this is astounding, across Google web, Android, and Chromium.

Eternal_Cowboy• 16 years ago

Isn't TechCrunch a terribly unreliable source? I thought after the last.fm debacle that you shouldn't exactly trust them.

Google Secretly Invested In Zynga, Preparing To Launch Google Games

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