Why leather is best motorcycle protection [video]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwuRUcAGIEU

219 184 12 months ago

adzm• 12 months ago

In my experience, working with plastic surgery offices will certainly impact your desire to get a motorcycle. Wear helmets and gear up, everyone.

Also this is a truly well done video. Entertaining, week executed, witty dialogue.

rjsw• 12 months ago

Or work with any area of disabled sport, the two main routes into it for participants are the armed forces and motorbikes.

lm28469• 12 months ago

People working in hospitals would rather have their kids smoke crack than ride motorcycles from what I personally gathered.

diggan8• 12 months ago

Sounds like they would need to read up on "guaranteed effects" vs "probable events" if that's the case.

frereubu2• 12 months ago

I would love to get a motorbike - I enjoy cycling and love speed - but I've had three people in my wider circle of friends suffer life-changing injuries while riding motorbikes, including one just before his wedding that they had to cancel because he was in hospital. They were all careful riders too, the incidents being caused by distracted / aggressive drivers. The odds just don't stack up for me.

diggan8• 12 months ago

They were all careful riders too, the incidents being caused by distracted / aggressive drivers.

I'm not sure how true that is, even when the cause is distracted/aggressive drivers, unless the drivers actually hunted them and collided with them on purpose. Defensive driving is a thing for motorcycle drivers too, and if you take care you'll avoid even distracted/aggressive drivers too.

With that said, it of course isn't risk free, I think in my country (Spain, lots of motorcycles in/around the cities/towns), just about 60% of those who drive motorcycles have never been in any accident ever[0], and that's including very dumb ("average") people so if you're more careful than the average driver, I'm sure you could get those odds to stack in your favor.

- [0] https://www.dgt.es/export/sites/web-DGT/.galleries/downloads... Table 59. "ACCIDENTALIDAD"

AdrianB12• 12 months ago

Go offroad. For me, after 20 years on motorcycles, it is more interesting to cross the mountains than to cross the continent on 2 wheels and I did both, several times. I ride on the road only when needed, when I want to have fun I leave the asphalt. On a bicycle it is even more clear: I never liked riding on roads, I used to race amateur XC competitions for ~ 10 years. As much fun as it can be.

xlii• 12 months ago

Isn't it true for every occupation that deals with the falloff of any activity?

E.g. https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2024/01/19/s...

monster_truck• 12 months ago

Recently had to deal with some unusual wisdom tooth bullshit, they sent me to a fancy oral surgeon who deals with the unusual. Guy sitting next to me in the lobby had his whole face caved in when he crashed his motorcycle (no helmet), he looked completely normal! The 'before' xrays he showed me on his phone were gruesome, completely unrecognizable as a human skull.

Wear a helmet.

slau3• 12 months ago

F9 truly has no business being this good. Their previous video [1], about hub-center steering, has an absolutely fantastic oner where Ryan gets heckled by not one but two kids on scooters passing by, and still manages to finish the 3 minute take discussing path dependence and fitting a Robert Frost poem into a motorcycle review video. That segment starts around minute 7.

[1] https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JtBgv-SJEQg

HPsquared• 12 months ago

Also Italjet popping into the comments to say they're still around.

n1b0m• 12 months ago

What a pro :)

Luc• 12 months ago

Yeah, those heckles are added in post IMHO. Microphones don't work that way.

slau3• 12 months ago

It’s the same voice for both kids, so yes, but doesn’t mean he didn’t get heckled.

bartvk3• 12 months ago

I agree but every now and then, he comes with truly exhausting things. Like protectors being not worth it.

https://youtu.be/nINIJ1cAbYM

kryogen1c• 12 months ago

truly exhausting things. Like protectors being not worth it.

What do you mean? The video is very convincing, I don't see a hole in the logic.

deelowe• 12 months ago

Many in the racing community share his opinions. All these things seem to accomplish is making you hot.

JKCalhoun2• 12 months ago

I've seen a few of his videos — I think I am more put off by his lack of nuance. This is the RIGHT thing and all other opinions are idiotic.

slau3• 12 months ago

Fully agreed. I t-boned a car that cut me off, doing approximately 60-80 km/h. My shoulder dented the car's roof through the door frame. I went flying through the air and landed on my back, on cement-cast stones protruding slightly from the cement (the decorative edge of the roundabout).

I walked out of the hospital a couple of days later. I wouldn't have been walking then, nor today, if it wasn't for the protective shoulder pads and spine protection in my jacket. It took about 18 months of physiotherapy to stand and walk normally again, but still.

Edit: I realise this is a POV with n=1, but it convinced me.

delichon• 12 months ago

  "And that doesn't even count the stiffy you'll get every time you change tires on two single-sided swing arms."

I thought that this man was brave when he allowed himself to be dragged across pavement in a nylon jacket, but his script writing is even more courageous.

scythe• 12 months ago

Is it really nylon? Don't we have lots of polymers tougher than nylon? Sure they're expensive, but it's your life, isn't it?

ubermonkey3• 12 months ago

It's nuts, right? I mean, I ride, but I know plenty of folks who are subscribed to the F9 Youtube channel who don't just because so much of the content they do scratches nerdy itches.

Some of my favorites, in case anyone's interested:

* Ryan's periodic "check out this weird bike from the past" clips are always great, but I really LOVE the one about the Honda Rune: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjuWiKz9zno

* Their "trilogy" of sorts about Harley, and the hows and whys of their odd and honestly self-defeating decisions, are all great, but my favorite is the one that compares an Indian Scout to its then-corresponding Harley model; the Indian made 43% more power, and it's all down to Harley's genuflection at "tradition". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ooue7i73zo

The other two are "why millions ride HD" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeuXShFIgyc), which kinda lays the background for the tradition at work in the aforementioned video; and "How HD killed itself" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOwxxsPaogY), which is more about their demographic problem.

* They did a "how to deal with dealers" video that is really a thinly veiled tribute to a particularly excellent and longstanding dealership, which is just lovely: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fbr3JZAXDxA

* And my personal favorite is the FANTASTIC film homage built into Ryan's vid about the Ducati Desert X, which he ended up buying: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcFqVIadWYo

stickfigure• 12 months ago

Here's my favorite F9 video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fbr3JZAXDxA

Without offering any spoilers, I bought a couple new dirt bikes recently and went out of my way to find a "Kenco equivalent" in the Bay Area. Glad I did.

aunty_helen• 12 months ago

I took a bet this would be a F9 video before I opened the tab. Top quality content.

A lot of motoring YouTube seems to have fallen away, or become so big it feels unreal “let’s race these 2000hp lambos.”

draven• 12 months ago

I love FortNine, they always manage to be both funny and informative at the same time. And the way they do really long takes in their videos is really cool. Even the segment about the sponsors is well integrated into the video.

The first video I saw from them was about the different motorcycle engine types: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOTz0Ol8fLA

One of their latest videos (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpVMsqSW6pk) contained a teaser about a documentary they're going to release in December: around the world in 17 days. Can't wait to see it.

cs02rm02• 12 months ago

I was terrified for his head. Great review though, as someone who's been mulling over getting a bike licence and struggling to wrap their head around gear ratings, this was eye opening.

cjrp• 12 months ago

Not sure where you're based, but the Safety Helmet Assessment and Rating Programme[0] in the UK is my go-to for.. well, helmet ratings.

[0] https://sharp.dft.gov.uk/

cs02rm02• 12 months ago

That's sort of what I mean.

I looked up an Arai Tour X5, thanks for the link. It gives four stars and some colours for different zones at set impact speeds in m/s in a lab. It tells me it meets standard UN ECE REG 22.06 with a double D ring retention system and composite fibre materials. Super objective and necessary.

But I've read a lot of similar information and, somehow, seeing the results of a person being dragged down the road, for some unknown amount of time, which is pretty super subjective, still feels (perhaps wrongly even) as though it gives me a better understanding than just reading numbers/letters/colours.

thih9• 12 months ago

The speed was relatively low. But yes, the lack of head protection was still scary.

gherkinnn• 12 months ago

A silent upvote does not do this video justice, it is simply amazing.

TheChaplain• 12 months ago

Getting a motorcycle license was a very good thing I've done for my life. Cruising on long roads, beautiful views, wild camping and meeting other people in a like-minded community. It really heals your mind and body.

But obviously it comes with higher risk as you are more exposed and higher demands on your abilities. And good gear can help, but if it is not combined with training and of course a sound attitude, you may sooner or later find yourself in an undesirable situation.

Go to refresher courses. I do it every year to update myself and get an idea of my current limits. It really helps.

To see what I meant about attitude, just go on Instagram and check for motorcycle reels, you'll see soo many examples of how to not act in traffic or what to do on a motorcycle.

xandrius3• 12 months ago

I love the idea but our roads almost worldwide are cursed with ever-present cars which do not cars about anything else. I've heard lots of and lots of near-misses, accidents and bullshit interactions between bikes/motorbikes and cars.

I just finished reading a travelogue about the dude who cycled around the world in 1800s. Sure, one could do it today but the roads he was riding on were almost empty, now you would have to be cautious every time, since 1 asshole and you're out.

diggan8• 12 months ago

our roads almost worldwide are cursed with ever-present cars which do not cars about anything else

Kind of feel like you're over-generalizing here. Where I live, there is almost more motorbikes than cars a lot of the time, which considering the rush hour traffic, kind of makes sense as most people don't wanna get stuck in those queues. Of course, there are accidents and near-misses (almost by definition, since those on motorbikes tend to go between car lanes), but it's not like there is a 99% chance of you dying every time you use a motorbike.

I think it depends a lot on how used to motorbikes the car drivers are. Since I live in a place where there is a bunch of them always (and cyclists!), I feel like most of us pay attention to where they could show up. Compare that to countries where motorbiking isn't as popular, I could understand how it's more risky to go with the motorbike as the car-ists aren't as used to them appearing wherever.

potato37328423• 12 months ago

There was literally 1/5th as many people on earth in 1900 as there were today. Of course the roads were empty. Even if you compare to 75yr ago there's been a doubling of population in many countries.

lifis• 12 months ago

I think that motorcycle and e-bike safety can be greatly enhanced by never doing things a car couldn't do.

Always stay in the middle of the lane (unless you need to avoid a pothole), never overtake unless a car would have space to overtake, never enter an intersection alongside a car in the same lane.

On a bike, you also have the option of behaving like a pedestrian (cycle on the sidewalk slowly) occasionally.

If you don't do this, it's only a matter of time before a car hits you because it didn't expect a vehicle or pedestrian doing what you are doing.

travoc• 12 months ago

The middle of the lane is where cars drip years of oil and coolant.

giantg23• 12 months ago

"Always stay in the middle of the lane"

Usually the middle is more slick from oil drips and contains more debris. That's why most people ride in one of the tire tracks from the cars.

mynameisash• 12 months ago

I was coming home from work on my bike very late a few years ago, and I was on the side of the lane where your car tire would be -- not in the center. It was a good thing, too, because there was a full size ladder in the road, lined up exactly in the direction of traffic. Cars could safely drive 'over' it. I missed it by maybe a foot. If I were in middle of the lane, I would have taken a serious spill.

bpc7772• 12 months ago

Always stay in the middle of the lane

This is wrong. Use the whole lane to be in the best spot to see and be seen. Use lateral movement to increase your visibility in driver mirrors.

TacticalCoder• 12 months ago

I've done MX (Yamaha YZ 250 two strokes: a monster), enduro (big mono-cylinder) and road driving on a variety of motorbikes. Road driving is by very far the most dangerous of them all.

I just quit about 15 years ago.

Now I'm a petrolhead at heart so I still enjoy scenic roads but with a car. It's much safer.

theshackleford3• 12 months ago

Now I'm a petrolhead at heart so I still enjoy scenic roads but with a car. It's much safer.

I've tried it in a car, but it's not the same. For me, it's not even 1/10th of the experience of being on a bike. It's like all the soul has been sucked out of it. I might as well be in a minivan on the freeway for all the joy it gives me.

I'm not riding at the moment due to an unrelated (incomplete) spinal cord injury and some long term issues relating to that, and so i've been trying it in a car, and I even bought a "fun" car thinking it would help. But it just feels so...meh that i've largely just given it up full stop and am going to just sell the car.

I'd been riding since I was five years old, I dont think anything will ever touch it for me honestly. It was my zen place, the place I was truely happiest and at peace. It's been the biggest loss for me since my injury.

There is still a chance I could one day return to riding, so i've kept the bike (a 2012 BMW F800GS) out of sheer hope, but I must admit that it's likely by the time I can physically, I may no longer be mentally capable of the return.

JKCalhoun2• 12 months ago

I tell people worried about motorcycles (I've had motorcycles around more or less since I was 12) — if safety is the most important thing for you, skip motorcycles (and bicycling, etc.).

I'm surprised how often people project their own fears on me with comments like, "Aren't you afraid you'll get killed?" As though that never occurred to me, ha ha.

Obviously I choose to do some things in life that are not the safest — but I do them because they make life more worth living. (Sound like a bumper sticker? Hopefully you get the point though.)

Likely there are things others do that add a degree of risk to their life but they feel are worth it.

lylejantzi3rd• 12 months ago

If you're really worried about it you could buy an airbag.

FortNine on motorcycle airbags: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2jZryt607U

ubermonkey3• 12 months ago

I'll chime in here and note that, until very recently, there wasn't an airbag system that really appealed enough to ME.

The affordable ones, now long in the tooth, required a tether. The nicer ones were built into vests that weighted more, were hotter, and sometimes required a subscription, meaning a billing error could result in a nonfunctional safety device. Um, no.

AlpineStars released one that was ALMOST right a year or two ago called the Techair 5. It was (is) accelerometer driven, so no tether, and while it has an app it doesn't require a subscription. However, it IS heavy, and it IS hot, and it DOES require that you mail it in to be serviced after a deployment, so that was still a no-go for me.

However, last year AStars released the updated TechAir 5 Plasma, which has all the goodness of the original TechAir 5 while also being materially lighter and cooler -- plus, the canister can be replaced by the end user. It's spendy ($800 or so), but I bought one immediately. I wear it more or less every time I get on the bike. I live in the American South, so when I say I'm not any hotter wearing it than I would be without it, you know it's vented well.

(In fact, I wore it on a 4-day road trip between where I used to live (Houston) and where I live now (Durham) 2 weeks ago. Was it a hot trip? Absolutely; I was riding a motorcycle in TX, LA, MS, TN, and NC in the summer. Did the airbag make me less comfortable? No.)

jpgvm2• 12 months ago

Hopefully these go from being expensive pieces of gear that only few have to being completely normal/common-place. They are a great technological improvement but right now they are out of the budget of most of the motorcycling world (which outside of the West skews heavily towards lower incomes).

xnyan2• 12 months ago

but if it is not combined with training and of course a sound attitude, you may sooner or later find yourself in an undesirable situation.

I ride motorcycles, so this is not a argument against it, but even with all the best safety gear and perfect habits you’re still significantly more likely to die in an accident compared to a motorcycle per mile driven.

bityard4• 12 months ago

Motorcycle fatality and injury statistics don't control for a rider's skills, experience, or attitude. Add to that the fact that motorcycles tend to attract a large number of young thrill seekers on crotch rockets and counter-culture types on choppers--neither of which put much, if any, level of effort into safety--and you get studies and statistics saying that motorcycles are basically two-wheeled insta-death machines.

Yes, a motorcycle rider will never be as protected as a person in a car surrounded by a steel frame and airbags. That should go without saying. But it would be nice if we can acknowledge that people who actually make an effort to wear their gear and maintain situational awareness generally aren't well represented in the statistics.

Mawr3• 12 months ago

People who seek to ride a motorcycle rarely do so out of a desire to religiously stick to the rules of the road, particularly speed limits.

Take the low motorcycling population and the extreme self selection bias and you end up with an average that paints a very misleading picture.

hilbert4210• 12 months ago

"Go to refresher courses. I do it every year to update myself and get an idea of my current limits. It really helps."

I'll preface this by saying I love motorcycles but haven't been on one for decades.

As a driver of four-wheeled vehicles, the biggest problem I have with motorcycles is seeing them. Fortunately, I've never had an accident with a motorcycle but have had some near misses. All of those were because (a) I did not see the rider and (b) they were in positions where I did not expect them to be—on my wrong side, quickly switching lanes seemingly appearing out of nowhere, etc.

Whilst hardly in that league, I experienced an incident only three days ago that illustrates the point. At a shopping centre on a busy road I found a parking spot tight enough to require multiple maneuvers to park. When about to leave a motorcyclist pulled in behind me without me being aware of it (I was arranging shopping stuff so it wouldn't go everywhere when vehicle was in motion and there was no noise to indicate his presence).

He wasn't there when I got in the vehicle and I couldn't see his motorcycle both from my rear vision and side mirrors. I reversed slowly and felt a resistance and stopped immediately (I touched so gently there was no noise—and not even a scratch to show). (He wasn't on the motorcycle or I definitely would have seen him.)

What this motorcyclist did was to sneak into an illegal parking space so small that he effectively blocked my exit, I could not leave before he did. Sure, I wasn't really inconvenienced as he was delivering something to one of the businesses so he wasn't long.

Motorcycles offer conviences other vehicles do not, here being able to park in a small space. Motorcyclists get used to such conviences without realizing that other motorists might not be aware of them. For example, motorcycles allow for easy maneuverability which tempts riders to make illegal maneuvers that car drivers wouldn't even consider doing in the same circumstance. If the last thing on a car driver's mind is an unexpected maneuver by a motorcycle then it doesn't bode well for its rider.

From my experience, many motorcyclists drive from their perspective and not that of four-wheeled driver's. It's why I don't own a motorcycle, if I did then before long I'd be in motorcyclist thinking mode, and that'd be damned dangerous for my health.

snozolli7• 12 months ago

on my wrong side

What's a wrong side?

I couldn't see his motorcycle both from my rear vision and side mirrors.

You seem inattentive. The motorcyclist didn't "sneak" into a spot, he simply minded his own business and parked. You didn't even notice a motorcycle park behind you while you were moving things around inside your car? I'm sorry, but you're simply inattentive.

many motorcyclists drive from their perspective and not that of four-wheeled driver's

This statement strikes me as extremely ironic.

Workaccount25• 12 months ago

Probably the single most important thing is learning good defensive driving. Which is different than "good driving".

Lots of "good drivers" T-bone the guy who ran a red light. Defensive drivers see him barreling towards the intersection, as they check both ways despite it being green.

On a motorcycle, even if a crash is not your fault, you're still dead.

jpgvm2• 12 months ago

The road to heaven is full of bikers who had right of way.

SoftTalker• 12 months ago

Every time I make this point to bicycling communities I'm told that I'm "victim blaming." OK, you were a victim. You're still dead.

ubermonkey3• 12 months ago

I learned to ride in my 50s, and I am 100% convinced it made me a better driver.

mianos• 12 months ago

As a motorcyclist myself, I always felt drivers should be forced to do a certain number of hours on a motorcycle to make them more aware. But, those atrocious drivers would probably get injured so quickly that the idea would never fly. Now they are just driving.

EdwardDiego• 12 months ago

Yeah my mindset was "Everything that happens is my fault" when riding - obviously false, but it was a good way to approach defensive riding.

That car that changed lanes into me? My fault for being in its blind spot and assuming they'd actually check it. So make sure to never linger in blind spots.

The car that did a u-turn in front of me that I nearly hit - my fault for not interpreting the car's body language. Make sure to note the angle of the front wheels of cars pulled to the side of the road in my scans in future.

That time I low sided because I was thinking about work not my ride and then hit a corner slightly too fast right as my front wheel hit a pile of small gravel from a road resurfacing - that was entirely my fault for not focusing on the ride.

Havoc• 12 months ago

Wow that slide was much longer than expected. I had always assumed it's good for a second maybe two

142• 12 months ago

FortNine is a hidden gem of a YouTuber. Many of his videos are just showing his passion for riding and interesting facts like "different ways to mount a motorcycle" and are entertaining to watch him climb up the back tire and hop onto the bike. But then some of the videos are actually highly educational and he incorporates tested science and studies and explains why things are they way they are like the science of different leaning styles while riding and their science.

The video that has always stuck with me is when he explained the science behind how motorcycles are hard to gauge their speed and distance and related it to how pigeons see. It showed me that a lot of why drivers have a tendency to pull out and cut off riders is more to do with not being aware that it can be very difficult to calculate the distance and speed of a motorcycle the same as we do with a car. With that knowledge as a rider I have actually changed my driving and really make sure I fully check both directions before pulling out. I also, as a rider, pay attention to side roads and driveways and always assume the car is going to pull out. I have never almost pulled in front of a rider but I can say I have many times avoided cars by riding defensively.

postsantum• 12 months ago

2M subscribers
hidden gem

vinodkd• 12 months ago

not in number of subscribers - they know the channel already, but in quality of content and production values. I think that's what OP meant.

F9 could get 2M subscribers by just doing product reviews because they're an ecommerce website in Canada like Revzilla is in the US, and that Youtube channel (https://www.youtube.com/c/RevZilla) has 1.5m subscribers.

F9 has a few product reviews, but they have a ton of just top quality content that shines for not just the motorcycle content, but how its presented, the attention to filming and editing, etc.

Oh and if you're interested, they even have a video about cheese (it was an april fool's prank, but still informative about cheese).https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1T7NzCtWHo

Xenoamorphous2• 12 months ago

I think that we haven’t reached the insulation to weight ratio of down feathers, so that’d be another example where artificial fabrics haven’t reach some qualities of natural materials.

meindnoch• 12 months ago

I'd doubt feathers would be better insulators than aerogel.

Xenoamorphous2• 12 months ago

I don’t think you can use that for clothing, too brittle.

bartvk3• 12 months ago

Yeah but it goes the other way round, too. Gore-Tex laminated textile jackets are amazing. Suppose you ride through rain, and it clears up 15 minutes before your destination, you arrive with a dry jacket. Leather just soaks it up.

notpushkin• 12 months ago

[video]?

raffael_de• 12 months ago

The final segment starting at 6:00 makes me think that he can wear as much leather as he wants protecting his body while sliding over asphalt when he's anyway intent on braking with his face and chin.

  “There are many things you can point to as proof that the human is not smart. But my personal favorite would have to be that we needed to invent the helmet. What was happening, apparently, was that we were involved in a lot of activities that were cracking our heads. We chose not to avoid doing those activities but, instead, to come up with some sort of device to help us enjoy our head-cracking lifestyles. And even that didn’t work because not enough people were wearing them so we had to come up with the helmet law. Which is even stupider, the idea behind the helmet law being to preserve a brain whose judgment is so poor, it does not even try to avoid the cracking of the head it’s in.”

– Gerry Sinefield

theelous3• 12 months ago

Internet comment safety policing, when you have no idea what went in to making the content, is one of the more tiresome things a person could ever do.

Dilettante_• 12 months ago

They have a couple of quite good videos on helmets, I assume this time it was just to get a nice shot of him smiling empty-headedly for comedic effect.

potato37328423• 12 months ago

Humorously, I have less than nothing to do with motorcycles but find the sponsor's product relevant. I never knew such a product existed but it makes perfect sense that motorcycle people would create it for those reasons. Kinda expensive though.

dazzawazza2• 12 months ago

I've come off two motorbikes in the UK. On the first occasion I wore a leather jacket, on the second I had a synthetic jacket on (because it was more comfortable in hot weather).

Both were completely safe. On both occasions I slid along the tarmac for about 10-15 meters, I was travelling at around 30-40 mph. I still wear the same leather jacket 30 years later (not for riding) but the synthetic jacket was a right-off.

On both occasions I really smacked my head: don't mess about with sub-standard crash helmets.

So even though leather is better, we're not racing the TT, we're just going from A-B and if you want to wear synthetic you'll be fine at normal speeds. So if you can't wear leather, for whatever reason, don't let that stop you.

loloquwowndueo• 12 months ago

* write-off, not right-off.

dazzawazza2• 12 months ago

Forgive me. I've banged my head a few times.

the_sleaze_2• 12 months ago

Same thing here. Slid on black ice in the north-east USA winter. Big -big- hit to the side of the helmet, road-slide for 100 feet and got up with a bruised ego.

I'd add 1 point for the pads, shoulder elbow and back for impact. Mine happen to be `D3o` and are comfortable

Workaccount25• 12 months ago

That's a big factor for me, my leather jacket is tough as nails, and has eaten one slide before with only minor scuffs.

But my synthetic jacket has armor as well, and while thankfully I have never tested it, it should provide pretty good protection even if the nylon burns through.

Zambyte4• 12 months ago

This summer I got into electric scooter riding, and along with that I have been interested in finding appropriate gear for my riding. My go-to so far has been to wear a fairly cheap half helmet that I used to wear longboarding, and a pair of well-padded cycling gloves. Wearing more protection sounds nice, but: at the speeds I'm going < 20 mph / 30 kph, and impact protection (from cars) is more important than sliding to me, and I'd also like things that are easy to get on and off and carry around at my destination.

I've been thinking about getting a nice, full face helmet (helmets marketed for mountain biking seem like a good fit), but they seem like a pain to deal with at my destination. A lot of times I'll just loop my current helmet on my scooter completely unlocked, because it's cheap enough that I'm not really worried about it being stolen. The full face helmets I have been looking at are an order of magnitude more expensive though, and I wouldn't really feel comfortable just leaving it unlocked by my scooter. Does anyone have any recommendations on this? Or recommendations on other appropriate safety gear for my kind of riding?

the_sleaze_2• 12 months ago

Vespa scooters are awesome because they have a huge storage compartment under the seat where you would store things like helmets and gear.

The full-face mountain bike helmets sound exactly the ticket, and would protect your face from abrasion if you have an unexpected rapid dismount.

I used to use a small wire cord and padlock that you can store wrapped up tightly onboard. You're never going stop someone determined to get your old lid you just want to prevent opportunists and not be too cumbersome about it otherwise you won't actually do it.

I will say I have heard enough stories about 5k+ electric bikes getting scooped that I'd only ever store one behind locked doors rather than buying a huge bike lock setup.

Zambyte4• 12 months ago

Locking the helmet to the scooter with a cable definitely sounds like an interesting option! I'll have to look more into that. Unfortunately I can't store gear under the seat on my scooter because it is a standing scooter :D

I'm actually not too worried about the scooter itself being stolen - I have two kryptonite locks, one of which includes an insurance policy covering the vehicle from theft if it is taken by cutting the lock. Also for long term storage (like in the bike room at my apt) I remove the battery, which I believe is another layer of theft deterrence.

snozolli7• 12 months ago

at the speeds I'm going < 20 mph

At those speeds, I wouldn't worry about a full-face helmet. Those are completely ordinary cycling speeds for a road cycling enthusiast. Your primary risk is probably rear and side impacts. Your body is really good at instinctively protecting the head, so you should worry more about surprise impacts, like t-bones and rear-ending.

I don't know what your helmet looks like, but modern cycling helmets have migrated toward a longer back side for better rear impact protection.

For what it's worth, one of the reasons that my motorcycle has a big top box and aluminum panniers is simply to store my gear when I get to my destination. Thieves suck and if something can be stolen, someone will steal it.

Zambyte4• 12 months ago

I may ultimately stay away from full face helmets, but surprise impacts like t-bones and rear-ends are precisely why I find full face helmets appealing. For one, I can't really control how I fall in a surprise crash. And two, I'm less worried about the initial impact, and more about being slammed into the pavement. Especially from a higher center of gravity like I have on my standing scooter. Being rear-ended and slamming my head back against the hood of a car will hurt, but my current helmet will probably suffice for that. Being slammed forward into the ground, it seems like my face will become very familiar with the pavement.

Another instance that a full face helmet seems appealing is in in getting doored. I often don't have a choice but to ride near a bunch of cars parked on the street.

Road cycling enthusiasts are a good reference point, but the differences I see are in that I am not as focused on being aerodynamic and lightweight, since I have an electric throttle doing 100% of the work for me. In the tradeoff between efficiency and safety, I have the luxury of leaning much more into safety before negatively impacting the ride itself very much. Most of the negative impacts of additional safety gear are on either end of the ride (gearing up and down)

seadan83• 12 months ago

The stats for collisions from rear are surprising, rarest way to get hit on a bike (and most of those are no lights at night).

It turns out, moving closer to the center of the lane reduces the chances of the most likely directions of impact - namely turning traffic. Either turning left as an oncoming vehicle, turning out from a side road or driveway, of someone that is overtaking you and then turns right.

I've found low speed crashes really want a helmet. Things like you roll sideways off the bike. You are not moving fast but are rotating quickly. (So back hits ground followed by back of head)

FWIW, I just noticed the common irrational rational fear of being run over from behind. It is a common mistake. Riding to the extreme right can make it worse, it is an invitation to pass when instead the cyclist is just afraid. Taking a little more room on a road (situationally) can make a person a lot safer.

AdrianB12• 12 months ago

This is one of the few articles where F9 makes statements not supported by any science or experiments. Cow hides are strong, but they were not built for the purpose of protecting people from road rash. I had slides on asphalt at 60 km/h in textile suits (Klim) and I am still wearing that suit as a secondary one, it got stitched back and partly cleaned and it is just fine, it just has the scars to tell the stories. In 20 years on bikes the only leather items I bought are gloves and boots; this is because this is the only option (not talking about MX/enduro boots that are mostly plastic). Never had a problem with textile equipment and never felt the need for leather. Modern Cordura and kevlar layers are fine.

392• 12 months ago

Is the video not one long science experiment? With you confirming your one textile experiment resulted in a tear?

throw7• 12 months ago

Is there a difference between leather performance? Like genuine vs top grain vs full grain? Would a very thin genuine leather still perform better than synthetics?

I am not familiar with textiles in this area, but they don't make bullet proof vests out of leather last I checked... I presume there are good synthetics (better than leather?) out there?

gethly• 12 months ago

it does not matter that much. only thing of importance here is that the leather will be still usable whereas the synthetics are "one crash only" type of thing. leather does not breathe either. i am not arguing for one or the other, that is an endless debate, i am merely saying there is no "best". each has its positives and negatives. if i would be riding a sport bike on a track or doing high speed freeway riding, leather is a no-brainer. anything else, synthetics will be more user friendly. also, understand the difference between nylon and polyester. one is tough and rough(ie. cordura), the other is soft and weak. most cheap product use polyester that provides very little protection so they layer it whereas nylon(like cordura) will be much safer choice.

PS: if you crash, for the love of anything holy, do not slide but roll(ie. be active during the event, not passive). it is better to get bruises rather than getting your skin peeled off.

snozolli7• 12 months ago

the leather will be still usable whereas the synthetics are "one crash only" type of thing.

Leather may still be usable. Also, one of the primary failure points is the stitching, which is synthetic. It can especially be a problem if the gear is older and dust has abraded the stitching for years, particularly if leather conditioner was used that is oily and attracts dust.

Synthetic can be repaired, which is why it's often worth it to go with a more expensive brand. I've had my Aerostich Roadcrafter for 25 years and it's served me well, though it aged out of their servicing policy a decade ago.

skhameneh• 12 months ago

How far along are developments with natural leather alternatives based on fungi like mycelium or mushrooms?

My understanding is they are not quite there yet, but coming along and looking promising.

pas• 12 months ago

or lab grown leather?

(but it seems leather is not a very interesting target for substitution as there's no market for it? https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2019-08-18/america-is... though this is from 2019)

elcdodedocle• 12 months ago

F9 produces such a consistently and ridiculously good, cool, fun, and educational *social media content*; that it is installed permanently as a cognitive dissonance in the back of my mind.

FirmwareBurner• 12 months ago

Agree. I'm not into motorcycles and never plan to own one, but I still follow their videos because of the mix between intriguing and entertainment. Kind of why I used to watch top gear back when I was in school even though I didn't own a car.

skeptrune• 12 months ago

Not only is Ryan good, but he has brought on additional staff who are equally good. Incredibly impressive creator and team.

Simon_O_Rourke• 12 months ago

There's a massive fat guy in the local area here who goes blasting around the place on some over-powered, over-noisy bike - but doesn't (or can't find the right sized) leathers, so instead goes out wearing bluejeans and a denim jacket. Just waiting for him to take a slip one of these days to see the folly.

jonex3• 12 months ago

Maybe he's actually wearing protective gear? Jeans with slide tolerant layers and padding are pretty common as warm weather gear and there are jeans style jackets as well. If you don't know what to look for it can be hard to tell the difference to regular clothing.

CaninoDev• 12 months ago

Aerostich Roadcrafter enters the chat.

Why leather is best motorcycle protection [video]

Related Stories