Poll: Have you ever clicked the wrong upvote/downvote arrow?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2241980

by bouncingsoul • 15 years ago

106 79 15 years ago

news.ycombinator.com

TeMPOraL• 15 years ago

Oh noes, I've accidentally upvoted this poll :(.

(joking ;))

arctangent• 15 years ago

I was going to make a similar comment :-)

zackattack• 15 years ago

it's a known bug. everyone hates it. suggest an appropriate solution. maybe the arrows should straddle the reply link

chaosmachine• 15 years ago

Reddit has an appropriate solution: you can unclick the arrow.

billswift• 15 years ago

Not just Reddit; every site that I read that has voting, except HN, has unclick.

kmfrk2• 15 years ago

This is a bad solution; a voting system on a discussion site should allow people to undo their vote, but not let people change opinions on a whim.

People can stand by their point or concede that they were wrong somehow.

If your opinion does a 180, it's probably for the better that your - new - opinion doesn't count.

burgerbrain• 15 years ago

Even slashdot will let you unmoderate by commenting in the same article that you moderated in. Works well.

nopinsight• 15 years ago

It's a good idea. But its side effect could be that people are more encouraged to write replies instead of just voting (resulting in too many me-too comments). We will never know without trying it out though.

An alternative is to have the arrows straddle the top line of a comment instead. The down-vote button will be right beside the 'flag' link which may or may not have a desired side effect.

Yet another idea with possibly least side effect is to have them straddle '[x] points'.

kgermino• 15 years ago

Yes. The question shouldn't be "have you ever?" but rather "How often do you?"

bouncingsoul2• 15 years ago

It has to be more than just a solution: it has to be a solution that requires close to zero coding from time-constrained PG.

I think adding a hover effect to the arrow would provide the most benefit per second coding. The following line of CSS can do it without requiring image editing:

    a:hover img {opacity: .6;}

That gives a little feedback about what irrevocable action is about to take place – which is especially useful when mousing the area in between the arrows, where currently a single pixel of movement can invisibly turn an intended upvote into a downvote.

Other solutions are better, but this is an easy 80% one.

mckoss• 15 years ago

Doesn't solve the iPad problem.

krschultz• 15 years ago

Well on my screen the arrows go from the top of the line showing points and user name, to halfway down the first line of comment text.

Every comment has to have at least 1 line of text, why not make the arrows go from the top of the user line to the bottom of the first comment text line. That is about a 25% increase in size.

huhtenberg• 15 years ago

http://i55.tinypic.com/3177hqt.png and have a per-account preference of whether to use this or current layout.

(edit) Having actually thought about it for a minute, I think a simple "Undo last vote" in the title bar next to the account name would work just fine for reversing accidental votes. And, say, call it unvote for brevity. I really like how clicking on either arrow makes them disappear, this is very much in line with general minimalistic design of the site, so I would rather have it stay.

http://i53.tinypic.com/24dljeq.png

msluyter• 15 years ago

The iPad and iPhone are especially dangerous when it comes to accidental downvoting. Separating or enlarging the arrows would help those of us with fat fingers.

ronnier• 15 years ago

You can use my http://ihackernews.com which works great for mobile devices.

itsnotvalid2• 15 years ago

http://www.icombinator.net can't vote, which is not as useful.

onik69• 15 years ago

Thanks - that's very cool. I'm new here. What are some other cool sites that I can use to access this site?

dgallagher• 15 years ago

Possible fix: Put the up-vote graphic to the left side of a comment (e.g. where it is now), and place the down-vote graphic to the right side (spaced a little bit away from the "link"). That makes it pretty hard to accidentally press one when you mean the other.

EDIT (example): http://dave-gallagher.net/pics/hnVote.gif

T-hawk2• 15 years ago

> Possible fix: Put the up-vote graphic to the left side of a comment (e.g. where it is now), and place the down-vote graphic to the right side

I'm seconding that suggestion. It's the minimal possible coding workload, and solves the problem instantly for all time.

makecheck• 15 years ago

Might want the arrows side-by-side, and just further apart. To me, the separate down-triangle in your screenshot almost looks "menu like" and may occasionally make me hit it for that reason.

saurik• 15 years ago

I find that the key problem is that the reply on the parent comment is right next to the upvote on a child, so I often find myself accidentally upvoting responses to things I want to reply to.

pschlump• 15 years ago

Just think - In this poll some folks may have clicked the wrong button too.

noahc3• 15 years ago

While we all click the wrong arrow from time to time in the grand scheme of things it's probably a small percentage of the overall clicks.

I've probably clicked two or three wrong arrows out of thousands of clicks, which makes it pretty much a non-issue.

antirez3• 15 years ago

Yes but when you really liked/disliked a comment, and for an error you click in the wrong way, it's a really bad feeling.

noahc3• 15 years ago

So is this a statement or an argument? I would agree it sucks, but what would the cost of pg's time be to create, test, and implement this?

Other than your emotional state, I don't see a huge win here.

antirez3• 15 years ago

like a shitload of times? Either should be harder to mis-click or there should be some way to undo.

us• 15 years ago

No downvote open yet

rabble2• 15 years ago

Yeah, i've got 290 karma and have never seen a downvote button, not that i mind really.

TeHCrAzY• 15 years ago

You need 500 or 600 now I think. I lost the ability a few months ago. No great loss :)

kloc• 15 years ago

I don't remember ever upvoting by mistake, but sometimes I do want to save a link but not upvote. I think it will be useful if one can save a link without upvoting.

marknutter• 15 years ago

Yes, but then I remember that it's not really a big deal, and then I move on.

kmfrk2• 15 years ago

It happens <1% of the time for me. It's not that big of a deal to me.

Of course, something might as well be done to prevent it entirely. It's weird how I get a hover icon on what is supposed to be the void between the upvote and downvote arrows.

jtregunna• 15 years ago

I wonder how many people have been caught by this bug on this post alone. ;)

fuzzythinker• 15 years ago

Your poll may be skewed by those who don't have downvote power voting "No".

yoyar• 15 years ago

No, because I don't make misteaks.

fosk• 15 years ago

Lucky you.

motters• 15 years ago

Yes, but not often.

sabat• 15 years ago

Just now. D'oh!

sudonim• 15 years ago

I've never seen a down arrow (405 karma as of this writing). I've been imagining it would look just like the up arrow except upside down? My mouse precision is superior, so I will only be accidentally clicking the down arrow when I'm on my CR-48.

xiongchiamiov• 15 years ago

Damn, I've got a long time 'til I see it, then, since I've only reached 136 karma in 192 days. I suppose that means I shouldn't be able to downvote, then. :)

Bossman• 15 years ago

Wow. 405 and still no down arrow? I'm only a little over 100 and was wondering what the threshhold was...

chanux• 15 years ago

I once had a comment from a guy came here from reddit apologizing for an accidental downvote.

I have accidentally clicked the wrong arrow several times. I can remember I wished if I can fix my mistake each time.

mariuolo• 15 years ago

No, I mean yes.

kloncks• 15 years ago

One could simply put the arrows next to each other instead of above one another.

Ex: [up] [down] x points by username 17 hours ago | link

Instead of:

[u] x points by username 17 hours ago | link

[d]

Eliezer• 15 years ago

Proposal: If it's desirable that votes not be undoable, make them non-undoable after 5 minutes, but undoable until that point.

kingkawn• 15 years ago

On the measure this is a small problem for something that is already relatively inconsequential.

mmphosis• 15 years ago

I would like an option to hide the downvote arrow. I very rarely downvote anyways.

nhangen4• 15 years ago

I don't yet have sufficient karma to downvote, but personally, I'd like to see all downvotes accompanied with a note or counter-point.

Perhaps an additional "are you sure" popup after a downvote would serve the purpose. From there, instead of downvoting spam, we could use a flag button.

tokenadult2• 15 years ago

See pg's comment on downvoting from 1099 days ago:

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=117171

Yes, I am aware that pg and other long-time curators of this site are still thinking about ways to refine the user interface. I personally, having observed many online discussion sites with many kinds of interfaces, think that active curation of the community members (including participant bans) is more important than the specific details of technology for commenting or karma voting. On some sites, administrators lack the spine to use their mops to clean up the mess.

http://lesswrong.com/lw/c1/wellkept_gardens_die_by_pacifism/

There has been consideration of using more flagging and less downvoting for certain kinds of posts, and I'd be happy to see what management here comes up with by way of experiments with new interfaces.

nhangen4• 15 years ago

My problem with PG's take in that comment is that it borders on passive aggressive behavior. Just today, I achieved enough Karma to downvote, but I don't plan on using it.

Why? Because I don't think it's necessary, and I find more value in promoting value, than trying to tear down something that I disagree with.

I believe that making it easier to lose Karma than to gain it is counter-productive, and will lead to bashful expression. In other words, that downvoting exists, without the necessity to back up said downvote, leads to a feeling that you can't openly express yourself, which is why we see comments like "I'm probably going to get downvoted for this, but..."

xiaoma• 15 years ago

>I don't yet have sufficient karma to downvote, but personally, I'd like to see all downvotes accompanied with a note or counter-point.

I downvoted you because I disagree with you. Is that the kind of note, you'd like to see clutter up comment threads?

Lots of little notes about why various readers downvoted various comments would be a net loss for the reader. Also, I don't see a reason why downvotes should require any more justification than upvotes. If people hardly ever downvote, then the way to get a lot of karma is to write a lot of comments. If there's anything the internet provides more than enough of it's volume. I'd gladly sacrifice half the commenting volume in exchange for higher comment quality, but an upvote-only system gets the opposite.

Worse still, if downvotes are rare, then many of the top comments will be those that are particularly controversial or divisive since readers who agree will upvote, but many who disagree just don't feel like taking the time to write a note or counterpoint. In the long run, a mostly upvote system will lead to more inside jokes, more inane internet memes and more loud but poorly reasoned assertions.

nhangen4• 15 years ago

And that's why I like the idea - because you replied - dialogue can exist.

I could care about the "I downvoted you because I disagree with you" part. I'm more interested in what you said next. And even though I disagree with what you said, I don't feel the need to downvote you to say that. That's what discussion is for.

Second, you downvoted me when I was already in the positive, and I find that less aggravating than downvoting to the negative, which reduces readability of a comment, and reduces the opportunity for dialogue.

I find that the quality of the community makes a much greater difference than the problem of upvotes as you describe it.

uvdiv• 15 years ago

Sorry, I meant to vote "No" but accidentally clicked "Yes". Which makes my vote true -- but only if it is not true.

rabble2• 15 years ago

For confused noobs or folks who don't spend too much time on hacker news, you need 500 karma points to be able to downvote.

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1853529

cletus• 15 years ago

Stackoverflow solves this problem by giving you a (fairly narrow) window to rescind the cote or change your mind.

I've never had this problem on a laptop/desktop but on the iPhone/iPad? Lots of times unfortunately.

wicknicks• 15 years ago

It would be great even if we could change our option later. I sometimes think an article is really interesting, and upvote it -- but later think "maybe not". Vice versa, sometimes "boring" articles just need some time to sink in.

Devilboy• 15 years ago

Every day.

Ben_Dean• 15 years ago

hahahahaahahaha.

Poll: Have you ever clicked the wrong upvote/downvote arrow?

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