Ask YC: How many hours do you sleep on average ?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=114846

by VinzO • 18 years ago

38 127 18 years ago

news.ycombinator.com

Since years I tried to wake up earlier and reduce my sleep time. But it is a daily struggle for me. By reducing sleeping hours I hope to be able to do more everyday. I know that some people need only 4h sleep and they are full of energy. I wish I could do so but I usually need 8.5 hours. I would like to know how many hours you guys sleep and if you have some tips to reduce sleep time. Do you think we are "born" with a needed amount of sleep or can we change it? I am also interested to know at what time do you wake up every morning.

ejs• 18 years ago

I find it depends on whats on my mind. Many times I will wake up earlier then I wanted and cannot get back to sleep because I start thinking of things I need/want to get done. Currently I probably get around 6 - 7, 8 would be a good sleep and 4 - 5 hours on a bad night... I wouldn't worry about it too much, even sleeping 9 hours leaves 15 hours for the day.

dkokelley4• 18 years ago

Different people do need different amounts of sleep, but also, the same people will need different amounts of sleep at different points in their life. Young children don't need as much. Teenagers need quite a bit because their body is growing rapidly. College level people through their 30s can usually get by with little sleep, then you need more as you get older.

I try and shoot for around 8 hours of sleep each night. You could argue that I could get more work done if I only got 5 or 6 hours, but the quality of the work would not be the same. I also find that going to bed at 11 and waking up at 7 is not the same for me as going to bed at 2 and waking up at 10.

Einstein and Donald Trump supposedly needed very little sleep which is why they could work so hard.

aaco2• 18 years ago

"Einstein and Donald Trump supposedly needed very little sleep which is why they could work so hard."

Interestingly, I read in a magazine from my country that Einstein slept at least 10 hours each day (and more if needed).

So, reading your statement, I decided to search more about this typing "einstein hours of sleep" using Google.

I found some links like:

"... while others have been known to require 8 to 10 hours (such as Albert Einstein)." - in http://webhome.idirect.com/~readon/sleep.html

"She points out that Albert Einstein sleep nine hours a night and was still able to get plenty done." - in http://evenstaronline.com/resources.html

"Einstein, on the other hand, demanded 10 hours of sleep every night for himself." - in http://www.quickiesheets.com/

I'm not sure if this is really true, but I do believe that a lot of hard work people can easily sleep during 10 hours.

mechanical_fish2• 18 years ago

Misdirection. If you accomplish enough when you're awake people will assume that you must not sleep.

dkokelley4• 18 years ago

I probably should have researched before posting that. I was just stating what I had heard from others. At least I qualified it with "supposedly." :)

run4yourlives4• 18 years ago

>Young children don't need as much.

Um, yes they do, in fact they need more. Toddlers can sleep up to 14 hours a day, children up to 5 usually need 10-12.

dkokelley4• 18 years ago

Sorry for the confusion. I wasn't referring to infants and very young children, but those around 5-10. Children in the years you point out are growing significantly and of course need a good deal of sleep.

jsjenkins1683• 18 years ago

Studies have shown you need at least 8 hours of continuous sleep if you are on a traditional monophasic sleep schedule. Anything less and you start to accumulate "sleep debt" and performance decreases, among other things.

If you are very very serious about reducing total sleep time, you can attempt polyphasic sleep: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyphasic_sleep

I recommend trying to find Why We Nap by Dr. Stampi. Its the only detailed research on the subject. Basically, dont trust much of the info about polyphasic sleep around the net as much of it is false.

VinzO6• 18 years ago

Did you try polyphasic sleep yourself? I did a fast search, this book seems not so easy to find...

pchristensen4• 18 years ago

I'm (sort of) doing it right now. Steve Pavlina's right, it's hard to integrate with the rest of the world (and he was self-employed with older children, and I work for the Man and have babies). I write about it sometimes on my blog - it's less instructive as an ideal case compared to Pavlina, but probably more inline with what a normal person could expect. I've got to say, if there's a lot of inflexible time requirements in life (day job, family, etc), polyphasic sleep is a great way to get some focus time to get in the zone. I've written more blog posts and more code since I restarted in earnest a couple weeks ago than I think I did in the 6 months before that. It really has given me a new sense of freedom to act.

http://www.pchristensen.com/blog/articles/category/polyphasi...

VinzO6• 18 years ago

I found the book on amazon.ca but it's not in stock and it costs over 240$ !! How can it be so expensive??

seren6ipity• 18 years ago

It is expensive because it is no longer in print. However, walmart in-store has it for 110$ http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.gsp?product_id=182980...

run4yourlives4• 18 years ago

Steve Pavlina: http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/ did polyphasic sleep for a while, and does a good job relating his experiences.

His conclusion: It sucks because life isn't set up for that sleep pattern.

jsjenkins1683• 18 years ago

How did you reach that conclusion from what he said? From what I remember he loved it while on it, and noted improvements in mood and concentration, in addition to having time for additional hobbies such as cooking.

He switched back to monophasic several months later so that he could spend more time with his family during their traditional awake hours. He also simply got bored of being awake when no one else was...

euccastro4• 18 years ago

Sorry about the ad-hominem, but I think it's relevant to keep in mind that this is the guy that proposed that you could manifest one million dollars into your life just by declaring your intention everyday.

gregwebs• 18 years ago

there is not much practical advice in why we nap (which I recommend checking out from a library), but after reading it I realized how little research has been done on irregular sleeping patterns. I tried polyphasic for a while, but life is not setup for it, and you will be tired while trying to make the transitions- it takes an incredible amount of will power.

What I have found though is that you can sleep less at night if you take more naps during the day. Whether everyone can make a full transition to polyphasic is unclear. When I can manage, I sleep less than six hours at night and then take one or two 15 minute naps during the day.

Lucid dreaming is another approach to take to sleep- instead of avoiding sleep trying to be productive while sleeping. (inventor Ray Kurzweil does this)

kingkongrevenge2• 18 years ago

> at least 8 hours of continuous sleep

You need as much sleep as leaves you alert and non-drowsy, even when bored. That's less than eight hours for me or any other adult I've lived with.

jayant• 18 years ago

I actually tried polyphasic sleep for a while (6-7 weeks), and it was great after I adjusted. It was a little creepy being up all night, but I wrote a lot of code, and felt fine.

The only problem is the nap schedule makes it impossible to have any scheduled commitments. As soon as school started, I just couldn't keep up with the naps.

My advice: polyphasic sleep is great, IF you don't have any scheduled time commitments.

(If you're curious about polyphasic sleep, I suggest you try it. It's an interesting experience, regardless of whether or not it's practical.)

xirium2• 18 years ago

It is possible to power-nap ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_nap ) on public transport. Your timing has to be good but it will quickly improve with practice. Masters of the art are able to nap while standing on a train and wake shortly before their destination.

tjr• 18 years ago

Rarely more than 9, rarely less than 6.

edu• 18 years ago

I usually sleep about 7 hours.

ivan2• 18 years ago

If you procrastinate your tasks, it means you sleep not enough. That's all.

VinzO6• 18 years ago

How come? Can you explain?

jdavid3• 18 years ago

i don't think he meant long term procrastination, but rather daily procrastination. if you stay in bed, then you may need more sleep in your week.

once i wake up, any additional sleep is usually meaningless, i find a nap after lunch to be of much better use to me.

aaco2• 18 years ago

9 hours. But I can easily sleep up to 10 hours!

Anyway, I don't care about my time of sleep if I can be very focused in my work for several hours. And this does happen often (when I'm not reading News.YC, heh).

I believe there are enough hours to work each day if you are really focused in what you do and if you're really feeling rested with your sleep time.

brlewis2• 18 years ago

I usually sleep 6-7 hrs, but I need 7.5 to be at my best. I wake up at 6:45 normally, 6:30 this morning to shovel snow.

If you are at your best after 8.5 hrs, listen to your body and don't try to reduce sleep time.

davidw2• 18 years ago

"6:30 this morning to shovel snow."

... and you guys were trying to convince us that the NE isn't so bad?;-)

llimllib2• 18 years ago

Shoveling snow is my favorite chore. It's quiet, solitary, beautiful, moderately but not overly hard work outside.

brlewis2• 18 years ago

The guy hailing from Innsbruck, Austria has a problem with snow? ;-)

pistoriusp• 18 years ago

I usually sleep 6.5 hours each night. I don't have a set "bedtime," but I'm awake every morning at 07h30.

One of the most important things that you can do is just get up, once your alarms rings don't hit snooze, just get up! It's easier once it becomes a habbit.

I usually drag myself out of bed with my blanket, turn on the kettle and do some stretching on the lounge floor. I drink tea, eat cereal and then I shower.

dylanks• 18 years ago

5-6 on weeknights, 7-8 on weekends. Wake-up time is all across the board, which is not a good thing, but I spend a lot of time in different time zones.

nextmoveone3• 18 years ago

4-5 hours per day.

VinzO6• 18 years ago

Have you always sleep that few?

nextmoveone3• 18 years ago

No only recently, like the last 2 months. Before that 8 hours, before that, 12(when I didn't work).

mechanical_fish2• 18 years ago

It doesn't work. You can't change the amount of sleep you need by any significant amount. If you consistently shortchange yourself by a small amount each night, you may be able to convince yourself that you're getting more done ... but you'll actually be less sharp, less productive, less healthy, and much less happy (seriously -- it has big effects on your mood).

Read a book like Maas's Power Sleep :

http://www.amazon.com/Power-Sleep-Revolutionary-Prepares-Per...

I'd recommend a better book but I don't know of one yet. I spend my time sleeping rather than hacking sleep.

You can tinker with when you sleep (using naps, etc.) to try and improve the quality of your sleep and adjust the times of day when you are most awake for maximum productivity. Just realize that you're basically rearranging your sleep and not magically reducing it.

If you can't find time to sleep the 8.5 hours that you need, you need to fix something else. Find a partner. Hire an assistant. Outsource. Prioritize. Postpone unimportant features. Get a better paying job with fewer hours. Play less World of Warcraft. Kill your television. Read David Allen or Tim Ferriss. Set noprocrast to numbers like "1024".

cstejerean• 18 years ago

Excellent point. A while ago I was determined that sleeping less would make me more productive. Then I started actively paying attention to how much time I was wasting one way or another during the day (it wasn't anything obvious like playing WoW or watching too much TV).

One of the key things I discovered is the need to have a chunk of undisturbed time so I can really be productive. So I started going to work later in the morning (flexible schedule) and working more at night (guaranteed to have less distractions, even if you wanted to watch TV you can't find anything on).

iamelgringo2• 18 years ago

Good point. Your body needs what it needs. You can self-medicate with caffeine or other stimulants to try and hack the system, but they end up cutting in to your next nights sleep.

As an ER nurse, I've worked nights for 14 years. And, for the last 5, I've gone completely caffeine free. I've felt better than I have in years. It's amazing how easy it is to get into a (sleep deprivation -> stimulant -> sleep deprivation) cycle. Why? Because caffeine stays in your system for 24-26 hours. So, that cup of coffee that you had yesterday is still in your system when you go to bed the next night. And, the caffeine is stimulating you while you sleep preventing you from getting the normal cycles/amounts of the stages of sleep that you'd be in normally.

It takes a few weeks to come down off the caffeine addiction, but after you do, you feel so much better.

randallsquared• 18 years ago

~24 hours? Interesting. I've used coffee as a sleep aid: when I really need to go to sleep at X in order to get 8 hours before some important event, drinking coffee at 4 hours before X seems to help me sleep, due to the huge crash between 3 and 4 hours after the caffeine hits.

kingkongrevenge2• 18 years ago

I once read that there's a window of time between 11pm and 1am when your adrenals recharge most effectively. If you're not asleep during this window you miss the benefit and will tend to have higher levels of stress hormones. I used to have some moderate acne and I found that being in bed by 11 usually cleared it right up, which makes sense if you consider the link between hormones and acne.

zeantsoi• 18 years ago

Play less WoW? No way... get real.

tbx• 18 years ago

I did polyphasic sleep. Three days. Got a stomach ache and colitis...

Don't recommend it.

jules• 18 years ago

I did it too. 3 or 4 days (can't remember). I couldn't fall asleep fast enough so I didn't sleep at all. Wasn't tired at all the last day but I stopped because I couldn't sleep. The result was some memory loss.

mrtron3• 18 years ago

A buddy of mine did it for about a month.

He was continually out of it for the last two weeks. It if isn't for the faint of heart.

mqt• 18 years ago

It's not polyphasic sleep if you've only tried it for a few days, it's deprivation. It takes weeks for your body to acclimate to this sort of thing.

Read Steve Pavlina's polyphasic sleep log if you're interested in doing it right.

http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2005/10/polyphasic-sleep/

pchristensen4• 18 years ago

The first week is a $#%^$#^@$%@@#$% pain. The trick is to train yourself to fall asleep quickly (5-10 min). This takes tinkering (link below). Now, especially if I'm in one of my three comfort places (bed, couch, or car), I know can fall asleep in 5 minutes or so.

Another key is DON'T try to sleep for more than 30 minutes. The deeper you fall asleep, the harder it is to get up. If I snooze my alarm even once for 10 minutes, I'm probably going to be too asleep to bother getting up when that 10 minutes is over.

The good news is that my experience (Steve Pavlina echoes this) is that once you train your body to work on the schedule, then even if you revert to a normal schedule, you can switch back to polyphasic sleep without having to go through the painful first week again. Right now I sleep polyphasic 5-6 days a week and have 1-2 days a week where circumstances prevent me from napping during the day and I then take a full night's sleep at night. Interestingly, I feel terrible after the full night sleep but pretty darn alert during polyphasic sleep.

Here are some of my experiences:

http://www.pchristensen.com/blog/articles/category/polyphasi...

http://www.pchristensen.com/blog/articles/sleeping-in-your-c...

http://www.pchristensen.com/blog/articles/what-happens-when-...

jsjenkins1683• 18 years ago

Agree with everything you said. I also think its easier to "ease" into the schedule. Keep a few hours of core sleep at night and still take your 30min naps every 4hrs until you feel like you're starting to get on the schedule. Then shrink and eventually eliminate the block of core sleep and you're there. Its never perfect, but at least it helps with the brutal agony of the adaptation period.

The biggest benefit of polyphasic is not squeezing every possible minute of awake time. Its the improved concentration and mood. If you want to leave 3-4hrs of core sleep at night thats perfectly fine.

llimllib2• 18 years ago

In college, I experimented on myself to see how much I needed. I found that <5 hours over time led to bad things for me (hallucinating, shaking), and surprisingly that >7 made me groggier than anything in between 5 and 7.

So that's what I shoot for.

wlievens• 18 years ago

It doesn't seem to matter to me how much I sleep, I just feel like crap when I have to wake up early, and for me that's unfortunately any point before 8 in the morning. Sometimes I sleep 9 hours, sometimes 6... the only way to not feel crappy is to wake up at 9 in the morning.

Same goes for waking up after, say, 9:30 because then I feel guilty about wasting so much time.

I have a job and since I need to be there at 9, I have to wake up at 7:30, which means setting the alarm to 6:30 and snoozing for an hour.

jkush2• 18 years ago

Lately, about 4 hours a night. With a full night rest every 3 days or so.

sosuke• 18 years ago

5-6 hours a night, I use up until 12 or to work and then wind down for an hour or two playing games or watching a movie with my wife

I should be getting more, but there is just too much to do and not enough time to do it all in.

8:30-9 commute, 9-5 work, 5-6 commute, dinner, then work again on my startup, then some games for the icing on the days cake.

nostrademons• 18 years ago

9 hours. It seems to correlate with the intellectual demands of whatever I'm working on at the time. If I'm learning a new technology or working on a thorny design issue, it can be as much as 11 hours a night. If I'm cranking out code for something I know how to do in my sleep (no pun intended), as little as 8.

I also noticed a big correlation when I was doing math competitions in high school. 9 hours or more of sleep and I could usually get a perfect score without too much trouble. 6 hours or less tended to cut my score in half.

For that reason, I try to avoid shortchanging sleep. I figure something important's going on upstairs, and I don't know exactly what it is but if it's missing, it costs more in productivity than it gains in time.

I've read that the amount of sleep people require varies a lot from person-to-person...I know some people can get by 3-4 hours a night, but I always feel like shit if I try that. Can't concentrate, wake up with an upset stomach, can't sit down to work. If I have 4 hours of sleep the next day is essentially wasted for me, I might as well have just pulled an all-nighter and gone to bed early the next day.

jdavid3• 18 years ago

6-7 hours.

i find the trick is to sleep, whenever you are tired, take naps, and don't try to fight it. don't use alarm clocks, and don't lie in bed. you should either be asleep or awake, but don't lie in bed trying to decide. i also found that having a bedroom face east, does wonders for your biological clock and keeping it really regular.

sammyo• 18 years ago

I think it also varies by events. An exciting project that's nearing crunch time can get me running on just a few hours, the eyes snap open at 6:15 and life is fun (or...) til 2am. But don't try to keep running at that pace more than a few weeks if that long.

bfioca• 18 years ago

I used to brag about how little sleep I've gotten, but lately I've seen that as much more of a short-coming. I've been able to measure my productivity on weeks where I've had good nights' sleep and weeks where I haven't, and even though I maybe work more with less sleep, I accomplish much less.

asmosoinio• 18 years ago

About 8-9 hours. I strive to sleep enough, and have noticed that trying to cut on sleeping does not work for me. I can sleep even longer, especially if I don't have any interesting/urgent tasks to accomplish.

izak30• 18 years ago

6hrs - 7A

Something that got engrained in me, is that you tell yourself what time you are going to wake up, and then you make it standard, 7 days a week. Your body will adjust quickly and you will be tired when you need to be tired. Also sleep in 90 minute cycles, so I go to bed around 1A every night. if you still feel really tired during the day, take a nap < 20mins.

azsromej• 18 years ago

I typically get 6-7 a night. If I'm going to be tired it's usually during the day; inevitably, even without much sleep (or coffee), I really wake up around 11pm

pg• 18 years ago

7-8 hrs

edw5194• 18 years ago

7-8 hours. Never used an alarm clock in my life. Wake up with the sun.

Here's a dirty little secret than runs counter to most of the advice in this thread.

(% of diet that's fresh fruit & vegetable) is inversely related to (hours of sleep needed)

There's some logic to this, too. Fresh fruit requires much less energy to digest --> less sleep needed. Try it for yourself. Eat no processed or cooked food for 3 weeks and see if your sleep requirements change. It usually works for me, until I drive by "Five Guys" and then I can't resist - back to 8 hours.

yters• 18 years ago

I think exercise also helps reduce my sleep. That, and how excited I am about life.

krschultz• 18 years ago

I agree with you:

1) Five Guys IS awesome 2) Eating healthier does make up for lack of sleep. So does exercise. 3) There are a lot of things that will make you more productive than sleeping less. If you really think you need 3 more hours of awake time a day comparing 5 hours of sleep to 8 hours of sleep, something is wrong with your life.

I'm in college, double majoring computer science and mechanical engineering, play a sport in college, have a summer internship and a winter part time job, and a girlfriend, there are many nights when I just can not sleep 5 hours and get it all done when deadlines are coming up, much less 8. There are no places to cut. I ran that schedule for 6 months and ended up in the hospital, I had mono for several months and I was so burnt out I thought it was just sleep deprivation.

This semester I am much happier and healthier, I am getting more done, better grades, it is a whole different experiance. I changed a few things.

1) Made 8 hours of sleep a day my 1st priority. 2) Cut something out (the sport and the job), even if you think that there is nothing in your life that you can't cut out come hell or high water, if you look there is always something. How can I live without playing my sport? The reality is practice burnt me out so much it wasn't fun anymore. How can I live without money? Getting paid $15 an hour now but lowering my grades is not going to pay off when I work a real job, so I took out a loan. 3) Started eating better, I didn't realize it but when I was in high school I ran a schedule like that with home cooked meals, in college I ran a schedule like that from the dining hall, there was not enough nutrition to do it. When I made an effort to eat better I felt better, I started doing that at the end of the year before even changing my sleep patterns and it helped. 4) You are wasting time somewhere. There is no one in the world who is working 100% of the time. For me I realized I waste a lot of time reading news. About 2 hours a day reading newspapers, Digg, etc. But in reality most of the news I was reading was unimportant. I cut out Digg and cnn.com, most of the forums I read. Now I just read NYTimes, RealClearPolitics, Slashdot, and here. That can be done in 30 minutes a day and put 1.5 hours into my sleeping.

5) I changed jobs. I didn't realize this, but the job I had all last summer depressed me so much that going into the semester I was already burnt out. I quit that job, started a new one, and found myself happier and healthier. My old job I worked 9 hours a day, now I work 13, I am happier and more energized now because I actually enjoy what I am doing.

6) I used to drink caffeine inconsistantly on purpose, I wouldn't drink it until I had an all nighter and then I'd drink a bunch, it was like a hang over for a few days. Now I don't drink any, and I feel better. I also don't drink like I used to, the day you are hung over is destroyed, that 15 hours could be spread across the rest of the work week as 3 hours a day of sleep.

7) Go out and have fun, at some point you have to stop and take a break to refresh, if you grind all the time, you won't be productive. If you have events that are not work, work becomes part of your life not your entire life. That is a big distinction, because you work harder to get things done so that you can go out and have fun. If I just say I'm going to work all day, I am going to stretch out what I'm doing all day, even if it doesn't require it. How many people stretch out their project at work from 9-5 even if they could finish in 9-3, just because they are going to be there? You are wasting time.

DaniFong3• 18 years ago

I wish it were. I'm vegetarian; most of my diet is fresh, and I still need tons of sleep.

euccastro4• 18 years ago

Have you ever eaten meat? Did it have any effect on need for sleep?

asdflkj2• 18 years ago

Do you have a source for that? The logic seems backwards. Per calorie absorbed, it takes more effort to digest uncooked foods, not less. Some fresh foods, like lettuce, actually take more energy to digest than you get out of them.

edw5194• 18 years ago

http://www.amazon.com/Fit-Life-Harvey-Diamond/dp/1567315194/...

http://www.amazon.com/80-10-Diet/dp/1893831248/ref=pd_bbs_sr...

http://www.amazon.com/Eat-Live-Revolutionary-Formula-Sustain...

http://www.soilandhealth.org/02/0201hyglibcat/020121horne/02...

http://www.soilandhealth.org/02/0201hyglibcat/020125shelton....

http://www.soilandhealth.org/02/0201hyglibcat/020126shelton....

euccastro4• 18 years ago

Maybe you need to absorb less calories if your diet is mostly vegetable based? Also, some vegetables contain enzimes that help digestion.

I'm no doctor, but even if that particular logic is flawed, I do believe that a diet based on fruit and vegetables does reduce your need for sleep (or rather, that a diet based on processed foods does increase it.) My particular explanation is that such diet is just healthier, so your body has less to "repair", whatever that means.

Just like exercise: you'd think all exercise would increase your need for sleep, right? I find I'm actually more rested with less sleep when I do light exercise (which I admit isn't often enough.)

Eastern medicine is full of dubious explanations about why some therapies work. I don't believe most stuff I read about why Yoga, Shiatsu, acupuncture, etc. work, but I do believe they work. You can only attribute so much to placebo.

Bottom line: stop guessing what should work based on our incomplete knowledge of the very complex system our body is, and just try for yourself. Wake up with the sun, do light exercise, and eat more fruit, vegetables, and generally food that is less processed and more lightly cooked. It can't hurt!

xirium2• 18 years ago

If you're using an alarm clock then you're not getting enough sleep.

I've found that fruit as the first meal is effective for alertness and many diet problems.

A small amount of exercise also reduces sleep. Effectively, you get exercise time at no cost. However, you have to remember to do it before you get exhausted from coding.

rokhayakebe• 18 years ago

i get about 8. try taking power naps, those will boost your energy.

mrtron3• 18 years ago

About 8.5 is my ideal amount.

On the average day I sleep about 7.5. I can sleep unlimited amounts without any of the negative effects people mention, but if I sleep less than 7 it is really noticeable. I also can stay up several days pretty easily, but then I require a bunch of sleep to catch up, so it is pointless.

The sleeping unlimited amounts is really quite great for long flights or bus rides - I can just sleep for 20 straight hours.

VinzO6• 18 years ago

woah, impressive. I wish I could sleep that long in the plane. So if you don't use an alarm clock you sleep for about 20 hours?!?! Even if you aren't specially tired?

Shooter• 18 years ago

I can. Of course, I have several sleep disorders (sleep apnea, DSPS, etc.)

mrtron3• 18 years ago

Absolutely. If I don't use an alarm clock I sleep a really long time.

I was at my brother's place for the holidays, arrived well rested, and nobody woke me up the next day and I didn't have an alarm. I slept about 15 hours until the baby crying woke me.

jaaron• 18 years ago

6 hours on average. Lately, I've been staying up to 2-3 am and waking up between 8-9 am. I'd like to shift that an hour earlier, but it's been hard to break the habit. I never napped before, and generally don't like to, but I'm finding now that it helps if I take a short 30 minute nap at some point of the day.

And I work from home, which makes this schedule possible. I tend to take about an hour after waking up to get started working and then stop work from around 6:00 pm to 10:30 pm to be with my wife and daughter. Then back to work when everyone goes to sleep. So that's 8-9 hours during the day and another 4 hours or so at night.

Before I got married I would sometimes go on really long working binges of like 16 - 20 hours or longer and then take a day or so off. Honestly, I prefer working in spurts like that.

gibsonf1• 18 years ago

Averaging 5.5 hours right now (with the help of 3 cups of Earl Grey and 2 hard-core commute bike rides each day up beyond category climbs). But this little sleep is not recommended except during a definite deadline after which one can recover. My average without pressure is 6.5 to 7 hours, Studies seem to show that 7 hours is a good healthy amount of sleep.

akkartik• 18 years ago

Also cited at http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=97829

sethg• 18 years ago

As the father of three young children who finally are all usually sleeping through the night, I am all too familiar with the difference between four, six, and seven hours of sleep.

I haven't tried anything fancy like polyphasic sleep, but I can say that simply "reducing sleeping hours" is not going to make you "able to do more everyday". It's going to make you spend more time staring at your monitor going "uuuhhhh".

oPerrin• 18 years ago

I seem to be an outlier. I need about 10 hours but can easily enjoy 12.

Hexstream• 18 years ago

Well, outlier or not, you're not alone! I'm exactly like you on this aspect.

bluelu• 18 years ago

And so am I :-)

koolmoe• 18 years ago

I usually sleep about 7.5 hours. I don't know any hacks for sleeping less.

The best hack I know for getting more done in the same amount of time is to exercise intensely for 45 minutes to an hour every other day. It's best for me when my muscles reach exhaustion during the workout. I need about 30 minutes to an hour to recover, but my mind feels sharper and my enthusiasm is much greater for the rest of the day and the following day. I try to go first thing in the morning.

There's obvious health benefits, but I think the biggest benefit for me is psychological/emotional.

Thanks for the question! I think it may have inspired me to increase my waning dedication to exercise.

lst• 18 years ago

There is no general rule here:

I know persons who need at least 8 hours of sleep, and I know others who are more fortunate and only need about 4-5 hours.

It depends mostly on how sane you are in general (last not least: how your infancy has been: very, very important!).

VinzO6• 18 years ago

Can you explain on how you think your infancy will influence your sleeping hours? You mean if you are used to sleep much or not in your infancy?

prakash• 18 years ago

someone needs more sleep:-). The question you are asking is how do you get more done, how do you be more productive?

Take care of the usual suspects -- diet, exercise, sleep. Everyone needs different hours of sleep, so don't use that as a metric. The hours you are awake, make sure you are highly focused.

The other things that helps me is eating a light dinner (sometimes mostly soup) taken 3-5 hours before I hit the bed.

In addition, here are some excellent articles that should get you started.

1. Be an early riser: Steve Pavlina -- http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2005/05/how-to-become-an-ea...

2. Take care of your health (diet & exercise), here's Gerry Weinberg's* notes on health: -- http://www.developerdotstar.com/printable/mag/articles/weinb...

3. The Programmers’ Stone talks about meditation, diet and sleep -- http://the-programmers-stone.com/about/what-to-do-per-indivi...

* -- as a side note I highly recommend Gerry's book on technical leadership & secrets of consulting

good luck!

ldambra• 18 years ago

Let your body regulate your sleep, it's his job, just trust him and let it go and you'll be surprised at how much good he is at it. No expert can beat your body in this field.

Thinking about how much time and how you should sleep just brings an unnecessary cloud to your consciousness, wich is a limited and precious ressource. Keep the sky clear, focus on your objectives, be passionate about them and your body will just follow and gives you what you need. In return just listen to him and sleep when you feel tired. The quality of your sleep will be astounding.

pmjordan• 18 years ago

I need about 7 hours, my girlfriend needs 8-10, so we tend to compromise somewhere in the middle, with me continuing to read for a while after she's fallen asleep. I must not sleep much longer than 8 hours though, or I end up lethargic and unproductive and also unable to fall asleep the next night.

For me, the main sleep-related productivity boosters are making sure I can and do actually sleep, which took me years, (lying awake until 4am+ sucks big time) and making sure I'm ready to work at about 8-8:30 in the morning. 8:30 to 11:30 easily is my most productive time of day, probably 2-3 times as productive as other times.

I wouldn't bother trying to reduce sleep time. Optimise your awake time for happiness and productivity.

CoreyKossack• 18 years ago

I work crazy hours, but usually still manage to sleep 8 hours or so, minus when I'm really excited and can't sleep at all.

dhouston• 18 years ago

fyi: you're probably getting modded down because you add a signature to your posts (which people avoid, by convention, on news.yc)

sonink• 18 years ago

8.5

KirinDave• 18 years ago

6 hours on average. My dogs don't let me sleep in, my girlfriend doesn't let me sleep early, my job doesn't let me sleep during the day.

axod2• 18 years ago

What is it with all these ASK YC lifestyle questions? Are we trying to define success in terms of things like sleep/watches tv?

Ah most hackers get 6 hours of sleep! I should too then my startup will succeed.

Sorry, but seriously... A few are kind of interesting, but how many more of these questions are to come?

ALee• 18 years ago

productivity is important to any startup. since a startup is such a diff environment, it's nice to know how other ppl do it. lifestyle is as important as cool hacks, biz news, or debates about ARC.

pchristensen4• 18 years ago

It's fun to learn about the other people on the site. The more you get to know someone, the more context and more valuable each one of their comments is. It's like hearing from a friend rather than a URL.

euccastro4• 18 years ago

When art critics get together they talk about Form and Structure and Meaning. When artists get together they talk about where you can buy cheap turpentine. - Picasso

These days I was asking myself about how to clean my LCD screen and was hesitant if that was 'serious' enough to ask here. I was very relieved when I found someone else did.

You admit a few of these mundane questions are 'kind of interesting'. I guess all of them are interesting to some of us.

I see no specific problem with this. I'd let the usual voting mechanism take care of it.

axod2• 18 years ago

It just reminds me of the endless "Vote up if.." that plagues Reddit.

frankus• 18 years ago

I need about 9 hours, more if I've skimped lately and less if I haven't. I have an alarm set for 8AM but that's only because my work time is not entirely flexible. I'd probably wake up between 9 and 10 if I could set my own schedule. I could probably cut this down a little bit by improving my sleep quality (I often wake up at 4AM and can't get back to sleep), but I haven't really investigated that fully.

But to step back a level, there are probably other time sucks you could cut back on other than sleep. For me those things are surfing pr0n and the sort of unfocused yak shaving that could be avoided by just getting enough sleep.

Cutting back on sleep seems like denying yourself something pleasurable that your body needs anyway. It's like trying to not masturbate.

NoBSWebDesign• 18 years ago

2-5 hours a night, but I've only been doing that for the past 4 years.

My family members have seen sleep specialists, and according to them, the "people need 8 hours a night" argument is not true for everyone. Different people need different amounts. And if you actually read the research papers (it's been a couple years, so I'm not sure of links), scientists don't even know with 100% certainty what the purpose of sleep is.

However, that being said, there was a study done recently showing a correlation between getting less than 5 hours a night and heart problems later on in life. This has prompted me to start averaging closer to 5 hours than 2 hours lately.

DaniFong3• 18 years ago

If I wake up by eastern light: 6-7 hours. If I try to sleep through: 9-10 hours; sometimes more.

Sometimes I feel like I have very 'important' dreams that never resolve themselves. This keeps me in my bed for a long time.

cos2• 18 years ago

4-6 hrs + amphetamines for my ADD. on the weekends when I don't take my speed I can sleep for about 12 hours.

rms• 18 years ago

I'm curious if you started taking those as an adult or a child and if you wish it was one way or the other.

cos2• 18 years ago

adult. and I'm happy I waited. the effect on me now is indistinguishable from drinking coffee all day only it doesn't give me the shits. I'm at the maximum legal dosage at 90 milligrams a day of adderal.

tlrobinson2• 18 years ago

Recently... ~7 hours

Unfortunately those 6 hours have usually been 6AM to 1PM...

tlrobinson2• 18 years ago

And apparently I can't do simple math. Those 7 hours.

imsteve• 18 years ago

The less you exercise, the less your body needs to recover. So you can balance your health and sleep time depending on your goals.

goodgoblin• 18 years ago

6 hours usually - 7 if I'm lucky. Can't usually get to sleep before 1am - usually the kids are up by 7, I can sometimes stay in bed until 8. I wish I slept more actually - I really sometimes do feel like I am brain damaging myself. But I try and take a nap around 7pm usually - a half hour or hour while the kids go to bed - then I get up - watch TV and hang out with the missus, and get to work.

Neoryder• 18 years ago

I was able to manage 3-4 hours sleep to be able to continue learning outside of my 9-5! My first week of doing this resulted in a onversation with my manager telling me to shape up or ship out. I was okay afterwards. The human body is a wonderful thing , it seems to adjust to whatever you throw at it!

omakase2• 18 years ago

agreed. i was working co-op 9-6 then my startup 7-4am for 4 months. at first it was tough but once i adjusted no one at work noticed.

omakase2• 18 years ago

4-6 hours. every week or two i get a night of 7 or 8 to catch up. can't say its the healthiest thing but i'm still productive. the more annoying part is that my hours are slowly shifting around i've been going to sleep at 10am sleeping till 2pm these days and its my second time all the way around 24 hour clock in the last 3 months :(

Novash• 18 years ago

5.5 hours, out of necessity. I usually oversleep during the weekends. It is a poor compensation, but it is what I can do.

oditogre• 18 years ago

Varies by how long I've been awake. 5 - 6 hours on weeknights. 8 - 9 on weekends (but the entire 'day' - from time I woke up on Friday to time I wake up on Saturday, for instance - will be longer than 24hrs total). I can get by on 4 or 9, but usually less than 5 for 2 days in a row or more than 9 under any conditions and I feel like hell all day. When I have extended periods (more than 5 or 6 days) where I have no particular reason to get up at a certain time, I fall into a sleeping pattern essentially the same as the '28 hour day / 6 day week'. My sleeping habits have been about the same since puberty, and my mom's are about the same as mine (my dad sleeps about 9hrs a night).

apexauk• 18 years ago

i slept 12 hours out of 85 this week.. but then caught up just now so it's 25 out of 100 - or averaging 6 hours a night. i can't fit my sleep within a standard 24 hour period - in particular i find it hard sleeping twice within 18 hours. but on average i find i need to catch up to something fairly standard.

bootload• 18 years ago

"... By reducing sleeping hours I hope to be able to do more everyday. I know that some people need only 4h sleep and they are full of energy. I wish I could do so but I usually need 8.5 hours. I would like to know how many hours you guys sleep and if you have some tips to reduce sleep time. Do you think we are "born" with a needed amount of sleep or can we change it? ..."

Sleeping 4 hours a day and feeling refreshed! Fatigued more like it. I certainly don't believe it. I've had stretches of months with only 4 hours sleep per day. I functioned but only at a base level. I didn't feel refreshed staying up 76hrs at a time. [0] For me and (we are all individuals) I need a good 8Hrs. If I don't, I'm one sorry mess to work with. Communication is by grunt.

  With rest, bit of exercise, food I work far better and do tasks far better

You need sleep. If you don't get enough sleep there is enough studies [1] to suggest performance at a lot of levels is severely reduced. Sleep deprivation is also form of mental torture. I don't know why anyone would want to have less sleep and as a result do things worse than they can.

  Trying to avoid sleep is a symptom

What is the real problem? Are you trying to do more with the time you have? Is it a time management issue? Is it an issue of living far from your work and travelling? Do you have poor sleep hygiene? Do you work in a job that "demands" so much it requires you to miss something so basic as sleep?

  Is your boss torturing you?

Re-define the problem. Is it sleep you need to miss out on or is it something else?

[0] 3 days doesn't sound like much bit it is. An interesting experiment was to find ways to keep me awake. Funny but some Yoga & breathing worked a charm. Another thing is I learnt how cat-nap. Fall asleep, deep sleep at a moments notice. Day or night.

[1] BetterHealth, Victorian Gov, "Sleep deprivation" ~ http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/BHCV2/bhcarticles.nsf/pag...

Ask YC: How many hours do you sleep on average ?

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