If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

http://blogs.hbr.org/bregman/2012/10/if-youre-too-busy-to-meditate.html

by bcrawl • 14 years ago

356 216 14 years ago

blogs.hbr.org

The misconception about meditation is that it requires one to give up everything and sit silently. This is not true in its entirety as it depends on how one interprets the word "meditation".

The meditation does not necessarily require you to give up one thing for the sake of another. The goal of the meditation is to "be in awareness" and you can achieve this same goal by being alert and aware with any activity your find yourself doing at any given moment. For example...

You are washing dishes but you are not really washing dishes because your mind is wandering with thoughts on what you need to do tonight at the place you need to visit. By the time your dishes are done, you have already planned for your future as your mind kept you busy with the thoughts of the future while you forgot what you were doing in the present (which is, washing dishes, which you really didn't).

The meditation is to be-in-present with whatever activity you do and love to do. If you had washed your dishes with full alertness and awareness, you would have achieved the same goal of meditation.

Let's go even further with another example.

You love to play music as your passion (or dance, or paint, or fill in the blank activity here) but you don't get enough opportunity in the day to do what you love to do more with passion. When you dance or sing or play music or run or exercise, you get the opportunity during that activity to forget yourself in the act (the subject merges into the object) and you become one with the reality, or you transcend that favorite activity by merging your self into it. That moment of transcendence is meditation, and you should find more opportunities to be in that meditation, in those moments.

Now, I am not suggesting that the type of meditation mentioned at the source is wrong or ineffective. What I am suggesting however is that people don't need to get stuck with one type of explanation of meditation because ultimately you can achieve the same goal by shifting the focus a bit.

ambler03• 14 years ago

I think you're making a good point. A lot of people reserve the word "mindfulness" for the sort of meditations you're describing here and use "meditation" for something more specific. But they're just names and I don't worry about them too much.

This all also reminds me that there are people who view "true yoga" as a sort of 24/7 meditation of movement, where the person strives to be aware of and deliberate about their movements all the time.

jemfinch• 14 years ago

Sorry, this is hard for me to understand. You seem to be saying--and I apologize if I misinterpret you--that it is better to focus on dishwashing than to use otherwise idle mental time to plan one's future.

Is that really the case? What gains could one expect from focusing on dishwashing, only to take time away from some other activity to plan one's future?

sausax82• 14 years ago

Happiness ?

ambler03• 14 years ago

I don't have a link handy right this moment, but I understand that there is research indicating that the kind of multitasking you're describing is associated with a negative effect on mood, whereas acting mindfully is associated with an improved mood. Everyone is different, but I have also found this to be the case in my own life.

On a more practical note, I just find that I make more mistakes when I'm not paying attention to what I'm doing. And as for planning for the future, how much extra time would it really take if you saved it for after the dishes? A couple minutes?

All that said, I still listen to podcasts while doing chores...

zoul• 14 years ago

It’s better to let yourself to be swallowed whole by your current activity (be it just doing the dishes) than to continue in the endless chatter of your mind. Doing the dishes can be fun if you pay attention to the textures, temperatures, smells and sounds. You can plan your future later, giving it full attention again. That’s the idea.

webwanderings10• 14 years ago

> What gains could one expect from focusing

I don't want you to think that I am suggesting that you shift your "focus" from one activity to another, because that is ultimately is as same as a typical meditation routine. You are shifting your focus from whatever you were doing, to your focus on sitting idle and doing typical meditation.

That's not what I am suggesting with the dishwashing example. The meditation I am describing does not ask for you to focus .... instead, it asks for you to be "aware" and "be in present".

Here's the difference and here's what you can potentially gain:

When you are in the present washing dishes, you are training your mind to not be in the past and/or future. So now, if your mind is in present, than it does not matter if you are washing dishes or singing or dancing. The point is, that in present, you are closer to your true self and in present, you are more alert to the reality.

The mind constantly makes you wander either in the past or in the future and we generally don't and cannot stay in the present.

The example of doing your favorite activity (like running, exercising, singing, dancing etc) is important here because it is in these activities where you derive a whole lot of satisfaction and contentment for yourself. It has also been established that athletes usually find loosing themselves in their games at the moment of transcendence and we (the audience) have seen above-human or super natural acts come out of those moments (there is another subject of what audience derives out of watching such events, be that sports games, a movie, a concert etc, etc).

Hope you're following.

omarchowdhury• 14 years ago

The future never comes as planned.

crux2• 14 years ago

In my experience, the sort of effort you put in and the work that you do in planning in this multitasking, unfocused mode is not nearly as immediately urgent or productive as it feels at the time. If you are able to cultivate a degree of concentration and mindfulness, then when the time is appropriate you are able to consider whatever matter actually demands your consideration, and respond with sound judgment and openness.

EDIT: Perhaps more to the point, many of the useful decisions or notions that might have arisen from thinking about the future or the past while washing dishes tend in my experience to arise more or less of their own accord, in their own time. Much of the mind tends to think itself once you let it.

chc• 14 years ago

Let's phrase it another way: Is it good to make decisions about your future while 60% of your brainpower is focused on cleaning dishes?

You'll do both things more efficiently if you give them your all rather than having your attention constantly flit between them. Imagine if, while programming, you had to switch between projects every five minutes. You'd never get anything done! Yet we expect our brains to perform well under the same harsh circumstances.

Of course, if you don't care about what you're doing, it doesn't really hurt to let your mind wander. You'll probably do a sloppy job, but you don't care anyway. But the real payoff to concentrating on something like washing dishes is that your mind gets better at concentrating, so you'll instinctively do it when it really matters. It's like muscle training — you don't want to wait until you need to heft a couch to start doing it.

Florin_Andrei4• 14 years ago

Yes and no. It could be that there's a misunderstanding of what meditation is, or is good for.

Sometimes it's best to use your time to actually practice your football skills, go out on the field and play; or else spend that time planning the next game, doing strategy and stuff like that.

But other times it's best to go to the gym and lift weights. That may seem like a waste of time for a football player, but it actually makes him stronger, so he gets better results in the game - because he engaged in a seemingly unrelated activity. Strangely enough. ;)

Same with washing dishes. Sometimes you use that time to draw plans for the future, advance the theoretical side for the projects you're working on ("play actual football with your team mates in the field"). Other times it's best to use those moments to meditate ("lift weights at the gym"). Both are useful, and in fact it's best if you practice both, at different times.

cellularmitosis• 14 years ago

"What gains could one expect..."

one of the most difficult principles of zen to understand and follow is "no gaining mind". this is an extension of the notion that attachment is the root of all suffering.

jamesli• 14 years ago

Excellent point! Be-in-present is the essence of some sects of Zen, especially in Japanese Zen. Sweeping the yard is not only to clean the yard. It is a practice, a meditation, to sweep the distracted thought of one's brain. Same as arranging flowers, etc. In this sense, it is the same as any other everyday manual work, like washing dishes, walking, etc.

webwanderings10• 14 years ago

Yes, indeed. But when you add the phenomena of activity humans love to do and excel in, you can see that those transcendent moment occur when the mind is in here-now.

If you are into watching movies and when you watch an exceptionally good movie, you are most likely staying in present in that moment where the mind is not there to distract. It could be a great scene or it could be the whole movie, the experience one gets out of watching good movie, is as same as the experience one gets out of being-in-present. But obviously the moment passes leaving the taste in your mouth, but the point is ... that one can find and cultivate those moments further in life in other situations.

starpilot2• 14 years ago

Parent has read "Miracle of Mindfulness," by Thich Nhat Hanh. He explains,

> If we can't wash the dishes, the chances are we won't be able to drink our tea either. While drinking the cup of tea, we will only be thinking of other things, barely aware of the cup in our hands. Thus we are sucked away into the future - and we are incapable of actually living one minute of life.

webwanderings10• 14 years ago

Thank you, my example of washing dishes indeed came from Thich Nhat Hanh.

zafka• 14 years ago

I too have read several of Thich Nhat Hann's books. I don't even know how many times I have referenced the washing dishes story. I do feel that it has added value to my life. I wonder if a statistically significant number of folks here on HN have read his books.

aashay2• 14 years ago

> "you become one with the reality, or you transcend that favorite activity by merging your self into it. That moment of transcendence is meditation"

I think this is a really interesting takeaway. I'd like to propose another type of activity which I think most people probably wouldn't group together with meditation: video games.

If you're an avid gamer, you'll know where I'm coming from. Whether you're playing an MMO or an immersive story-based game, or even a competitive real-time strategy game, you're well-versed in the feeling of being hyper-focused and "becoming one" with the reality in front of you. I rarely find my thoughts wandering while playing a game because there simply isn't an opportunity to let my brain drift this way, especially if it's a multiplayer game (think StarCraft II, for example).

Video games are, at least for me, an activity that allows me to be in complete awareness and be in the moment, at that helps me relax. Any time I get ridiculed for playing video games as an adult, this is my default explanation.

webwanderings10• 14 years ago

That's it. You are in meditation when you're playing video games. I believe you should just find more of those same opportunities when you are not playing video games (because you can't really play video games 24x7).

vikas5678• 14 years ago

"Meditation in action" is usually supported by "sitting meditation" like the author in the link above suggests.

In my own practice, I've noticed that when I skip sitting meditations, my attempts at staying aware through out the daily activities is harder than usual.

zabar• 14 years ago

I completely agree with the point.

I've been playing guitar (blues improv) long before I started meditating, and I really noticed the similarities in the state of mind it put you in.

I've been an insomniac for a long time and meditating did help me a lot. Be it playing guitar, sitting or doing yoga.

tylee782• 14 years ago

The idea behind meditation is not that difficult to understand. However, it is watered down quite a bit, especially if you learn it in a New Age environment. If you go back to the old schools of meditation, the techniques are very clear and straight forward and can be applied in daily life. It is really helpful though to know some meditation principles:

http://theravadin.wordpress.com/2010/09/30/surfing-on-the-wa...

http://theravadin.wordpress.com/2010/11/03/anussati-sinking-...

agumonkey3• 14 years ago

I play a game that I call MIKADO where I do everything in the smoothest way trying to generate the smallest amount of sound (or any kind of wave). It comes from a blend of the child game, taichi, and drumming (drumming ask for fine perception of balance shifts and acceleration) and forces me to focus on everything at everytime. From the object of action, its surroundings, myself and my surrounding. Sound seems quite exponential in nature, to avoid noises you really need to be continuously slow, at any sudden movement you'll have a hint, unless you know a path were you can accelerate freely. I find it very relaxing, body and mind. The unawareness of accumulation of changes/accelerations are often the cause of anger, tireness, physical effort. By going smooth and slow, not slow actually, just at your own pace, things appear to cost far less and to give far more.

pestaa2• 14 years ago

Sounds fun and boy would I look silly doing that in the street. I'll call it walk fu.

Thanks for the great idea.

driverdan2• 14 years ago

This is exactly how I lift weights / exercise, with complete focus and mindfulness.

While working out it is all I think about. I put on headphones with fast, heavy music and focus on the exercise I'm doing at that moment. I don't think about email in my inbox, I don't think about the errands I need to run, I don't talk to the other people around me. I think about my muscles contracting. I think about the extra 5 lbs I just added to the bar. I think about my form. I think about my breathing.

It is meditation as much as sitting on a pillow with legs crossed and eyes closed.

mtts3• 14 years ago

Weight lifting could be mindfulness, but only if you don't "put on headphones with fast, heavy music". Those headphones are a distraction.

mck-4• 14 years ago

It's that feeling of being in the zone, completely forgetting about tomorrow's worries. But how does one raise awareness of being in the zone? It is that consciousness that I believe is paramount.

Training your consciousness by playing sports vs sitting in lotus is analogous to training your biceps by rowing vs biceps curls. The latter is more targeted, hence more effective.

When you do what you love and you completely emerge in it, yes, you do get in a state of bliss. But are you conscious of it? If not, which is mostly the case when you see a group of people play soccer in the park, then I don't think that is beneficial in the meditative sense. Your mind is still very much active.

The reason why the traditional way of meditation is so effective (and has therefore been used for millennia), is because it is quite hard to just sit still and do nothing. And really clear your mind of any thought whatsoever.

It is this mental challenge that will really train your consciousness and raise your awareness.

An easier way to get started is to combine the two methods, in the form of tai-chi. Get your exercise, while clearing your mind (and raise your awareness). It has helped me a great deal -- my life has been so much smoother after I trained Tai Chi for 4 intensive months in China.

If you're interested, I blogged about that experience a while back: http://kuomarc.wordpress.com/2012/03/28/tai-chi-in-pursuit-o...

papsosouid2• 14 years ago

>Training your consciousness by playing sports vs sitting in lotus is analogous to training your biceps by rowing vs biceps curls. The latter is more targeted, hence more effective.

Only if your goal is to make your biceps bigger. If your goal is to gain strength, isolation is less effective, as strength involves more than just one muscle, it also involves stabilizing muscles, tendons, ligaments, etc. Who says training your conciousness isn't similar?

webwanderings10• 14 years ago

Agree with your comment in general but on this ...

> But how does one raise awareness of being in the zone? It is that consciousness that I believe is paramount.

I believe first, we have to realize that people in general are not aware that they could be aware. What I mean by this is that at first, you have to realize that you can be better, or you can achieve better if you bring the rules, or guides, or signs, into your consciousness. For example, without being aware that your daily activities could be an activity towards self-improvement, you cannot really avail the opportunities to be conscious.

Secondly, and once you realize the above, you can further raise your consciousness level for the betterment of not only yourself, but for the humanity at large (starting from your immediate close-by people in your circle).

So all in all, with the combination as you suggest, people can become more conscious, more ethical, more compassionate....all because they are making an effort to staying in here-now.

Florin_Andrei4• 14 years ago

> The misconception about meditation is that it requires one to give up everything and sit silently. This is not true in its entirety as it depends on how one interprets the word "meditation".

That's right. There are prayer or mantra techniques that could be practiced anywhere, any time. In the Indian culture, there are people who say their mantra (sometimes silently, with no external sound or movement of the tongue) when they go about their daily business. In Orthodox cultures in Eastern Europe, there are people saying the Prayer of the Heart, again, during their daily routine (often silently, without any external sign of the practice).

There are also techniques of focusing your mind on various psycho-physiological aspects (breathing, various "energy centers", etc), but those may be a little harder to do while engaged in your normal routine.

There are also ways of maintaining a meditation-like, or "prayerful", state of mind and feeling during normal activities. This may require some prior experience.

In any case, yes, meditation does not mandate sitting down either on a chair or cross-legged, with eyes closed. Some techniques may actually require that posture, but others don't. It depends.

dscrd• 14 years ago

"The misconception about meditation is that it requires one to give up everything and sit silently."

How I think it, giving up everything and sitting silently is a form of practice. You cannot be in-present with whatever activity you do if your mental muscle isn't toned for it.

ambler03• 14 years ago

I took a mindfulness meditation class a year or two ago and I thought this was a pretty nice introduction to some of the ideas.

For anyone interested in the science, I have found lots of good articles by subscribing to this mailing list: http://www.mindfulexperience.org/newsletter.php

The ideas have been around forever, but scientists have really taken to testing them in recent decades.

stephth• 14 years ago

Focus on your breath going in and out. Every time you have a thought or an urge, notice it and bring yourself back to your breath.

From what I've heard so far, meditation is based on focusing on your body in order to quiet your mind. Are there other schools/techniques?

vidarh• 14 years ago

There are two main forms of meditations, with a pretty much infinite number of variations: Concentration based meditation, and contemplative meditation. But it all bleeds together - contemplative practices require a certain level of concentration in order to be able to practice them.

Contemplative practices can range from meditation on a specific subject to general observation of your mind, thoughs, body, environment - this latter form is exemplified very well by mindfulness meditation (vipassana, from Theravada Buddhism, though when mindfulness meditation is taught in the West it is often pretty much cleansed of Buddhist material).

What the article describes sounds close to mindfulness meditation. In this case the goal is to quiet the mind, but not silence it or shut out external impression. The breath is used as an "anchor" that you return to in order to not let thoughts or feelings or observations drag you along, so that you can observe your thoughts in a detached manner, notice them, and move back to the breath.

Compare with some of the concentration practices which include focus on completely emptying your mind for extended periods of time.

Dove2• 14 years ago

Yes, the emptying of the mind is the style of oriental meditation. In contrast, there is an old tradition of Christian meditation which attempts to fill the mind completely with one concept.

For example, in the medieval Lectio Divina (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lectio_Divina), one takes a few words of scripture and repeats them and considers them and ponders them for many minutes. The Cloud of Unknowing recommends doing something similar with the concept of God, or with a simple word such as "love".

This is actually a pretty tough mental exercise to do for even just 20 minutes.

muraiki2• 14 years ago

When I was in college at the University of Pittsburgh, I took a fascinating class called "Mysticism: East and East" that compared the contemplative traditions of Yoga and Orthodox Christian hesychast prayer. As a practicing Buddhist at the time, it was an eye-opening class.

I don't really know how to present a concise summary of the class, but I did find this paper by my teacher which sets forth an overview: http://www.doiserbia.nb.rs/ft.aspx?id=0350-08610802171B

Now of course Orthodox hesychasm is about communion with a person, whereas eastern meditation is typically not (Pure Land schools of Buddhism are more in line with Judeo-Christian concepts of prayer, though). But I think that there is some common ground for dialogue, and perhaps this paper may be of interest to you or others who enjoyed the original article and are interested in other practices.

muraiki2• 14 years ago

I realize that I already replied to this once, but I wanted to make another response not directly related to my other one, and it seemed too lengthly to add as an edit. I apologize if this is frowned upon at HN.

In Soto Zen Buddhism, the point isn't necessarily to "quiet the mind," because that implies that the running rivers of thoughts somehow dry up and give rise to a silent stillness. This may be the goal of some forms of meditation, but it is not the interpretation of Zen.

Dogen Zenji preferred to use the term shikantaza, which means something like "nothing but to hit sit," or less literally, "just sitting." The understanding is that rejecting thoughts is the other side of the coin of embracing thoughts: both are rooted in attachment to the thought, identification of the thought with the illusion of self or ego.

The "purpose" of shikantaza, also known as zazen (sitting meditation), is to neither accept nor reject thoughts. Thus the mind isn't necessarily becoming "quiet," but rather the process of self-aggrandizement is discontinued.

It might seem like I'm nitpicking over your word choice, but Zen in particular is a school that is very focused on how language itself is rooted in the concept of "I" and our ego. You can contrast shikantaza to other forms of meditation that utilize a particular focus, such as an image, which is something that Zen would not generally endorse (for you would simply be displacing grasping at one thing with another thing).

Shikantaza is tied to "thusness," or being fully in the moment, which webwanderings above explains quite well.

hntester123• 14 years ago

http://www.google.com/search?q=meditation

Some interesting links there.

Also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meditation

Florin_Andrei4• 14 years ago

The techniques are so numerous!

There are many techniques that use pure visualization - all in your mind. There are mantra (or prayer) techniques, that require repeating a certain formula, either out loud or silently (in your mind). There are devotional techniques where the practitioner is worshiping an image or a symbol of a deity (the deity itself being a metaphor of some aspect of consciousness states). There are the dancing dervishes. Goes on and on.

dkokelley• 14 years ago

I think the author has an excellent point about training one's ability to resist urges. Urges are spontaneous. They don't necessarily fit with our work flow. In fact, they interrupt it. Maybe a good analogy is the Time Management Matrix by Eisenhower (and popularized in Steven Covey's '7 Habits' book). Urges almost always present themselves as urgent tasks, but they aren't always important.

I'm not sure I agree with the conclusion that meditation will make you more productive. The evidence presented reminds me of a scenario from The Office, where Michael defends Monday morning movies by claiming they are more productive the rest of the day. Of course the reason they are more productive is because they have to be in order to recover the time spent watching a movie!

Rather, I think people don't realize how much spare time there is that gets wasted. Tasks expand to fill the time allotted. It's possible that meditation can help you identify those wasteful activities (urges) and address them appropriately.

KirinDave21• 14 years ago

Wait. Wait wait wait.

> Research shows that an ability to resist urges will improve your relationships, increase your dependability, and raise your performance...

Great. Yes. Impulse control is key. Delayed gratification is part of how we define higher intelligence.

Meditation has what do with this, exactly?

> How [does meditation help]? By increasing your capacity to resist distracting urges.

This entire article is predicated by this leap of faith, which as far as I can see has little to no justification besides, "Of course it does!"

> Meditation teaches us to resist the urge of that counterproductive follow through.

One cannot just say things over and over to make them true.

Dove2• 14 years ago

I don't know, I thought he explained it pretty well: during meditation, you practice resisting urges.

I'll admit that falls rather short of a doubleblindrandomlyassignedcontrolgrouplargesamplesizepeerreviewed study, but it does seem to be common sense that practicing something would make you better at it.

KirinDave21• 14 years ago

"during meditation, you practice resisting urges."

Saying this does not make it true thought. Is that actually what people do during meditation? The only experience I have with meditation is sitting in seiza position after 2 hours of Ki Aikido, slowly feeling my muscles cramp, listening to someone hit a drum periodically, and not feeling anything good at all.

Eventually I just learned to devote that time to reviewing things I had learned that day. I found this self-reflective practice far more refreshing and pleasant than any search for metaphorical emptiness.

acgourley• 14 years ago

You're right he doesn't back up the claim, but that's just because it's so well accepted by people who study this he didn't even think he had to.

KirinDave21• 14 years ago

I'd like to actually see some evidence that Meditation helps people sustain that state of mind. Because I hear people trot it out a lot but I've never seen it backed up by hard data.

I think meditation may have benefits, but the idea that it helps you "build up willpower" has always been one I thought we could actually measure, and yet I've never seen a good study of it.

adorton• 14 years ago

Meditation is the focused practice of resisting distraction.

Have you ever tried sitting still for 15-30 minutes, doing nothing but breathing? Distractions come easily in this state. Sometimes it's your thoughts. Other times, it's very hard to resist the urge to get up and start moving. In order to successfully meditate, you need to deal with a wide variety of distractions and other obstacles.

KirinDave21• 14 years ago

> Meditation is the focused practice of resisting distraction.

Are we defining it this way? Because this does not jive with my experience of meditation, focusing, or resisting distraction.

> Have you ever tried sitting still for 15-30 minutes, doing nothing but breathing?

Yes. As a matter of fact, meditation was part of a martial arts practice I participated in for 2 years. In all that time I tried very hard to do this, but never found much value in it. Eventually I settled on quietly and methodically reflecting on the day, which is something that seemed to have a lot more value than chasing a vague notion of emptiness.

And honestly I'm not convinced this is _any different_ from the "benefits" of meditation.

mikeash2• 14 years ago

How do you know that resisting distraction while meditating makes it easier for you to resist urges otherwise? Maybe we actually have a finite store of urge-resistance to go through each day, and spending it on meditation actually makes things worse.

I'm not saying that's true, but I think GP's point is that we should really have some kind of evidence that meditation helps with this, rather than simply assuming that it helps because it makes you practice it.

notJim2• 14 years ago

> Meditation is the focused practice of resisting distraction.

So is actually practicing resisting distraction in vivo, except that it's directly applicable. You're argument is exactly the “of course it does!” argument that your parent was referring to.

Without studies, we don't actually know whether the skills in resisting distraction during meditation actually transfer to other situations.

To quote your parent:

One cannot just say things over and over to make them true.

bennesvig4• 14 years ago

Willpower is a muscle. By wanting to do things, but focusing on meditation, you're building up your willpower muscle.

dchest• 14 years ago

This is an analogy, it may be true or false.

Download speed is a muscle. By downloading more files you're building up your download speed.

Fishkins• 14 years ago

There's definitely evidence that meditation alters your brain in positive ways [1]. The phrase "impulse control" isn't used in the list of benefits, but they list improvements in traits I'd associate with impulse control, e.g. increased self-awareness and reduced anxiety.

[1] http://www.familyhealthguide.co.uk/mindfulness-meditation-le...

KirinDave21• 14 years ago

Sounds like similar benefits to exercising.

eof• 14 years ago

Article is not wrong about this. It is hard to measure what meditation is doing on a subjective level, which is very specific and easy to talk about amongst people who have spent even an hour meditating.

The key here, which for you might be a leap of faith, is that when one tries to simply focus on their breath (or the dishes), completely without our permission thoughts continue to pop into our head. The 'natural' thing to do is follow these thoughts; and there is a will of resistance to go back to your breath again and again. It is hard to do, and get easier with practice.

Anyone who has spent say, >3 hours of their life meditating will recognize it as a fact that meditation strengthens your will.

KirinDave21• 14 years ago

> Anyone who has spent say, >3 hours of their life meditating will recognize it as a fact that meditation strengthens your will.

Do you realize how unsupportable this line of thought is? Do I even need to go into this?

How do you know meditation does not actually make this worse? If "willpower" is finite and predicated on physical endurance (as studies suggest), then perhaps sitting here trying to hold your mind "empty" is actually making you less capable of carrying on with the rest of your day!

Why wouldn't 8 hours of sleep, famously known for its ability to inspire ideas, be even more effective?

kstenerud• 14 years ago

I've spent many hours of my life meditating. Looking back now, they were pretty much a waste of time.

My strength of will comes from adversity, not passivity.

hollerith4• 14 years ago

>Anyone who has spent say, >3 hours of their life meditating will recognize it as a fact that meditation strengthens your will.

I've spent hundreds of hours meditating over the last 40 years, and it is far from apparent to me that it strengthened my will.

codegeek• 14 years ago

"Meditation has what do with this, exactly?"

I think you are taking an extreme position on this issue. Meditation may not have everything to do with this but it does play a significant part. In my experience, meditation helps you analyze, hold and channel your thought process better. If your thought process is better, you have better control over your impulses.

KirinDave21• 14 years ago

It's "extreme" to ask for evidence on something testable now. :(

lobo_tuerto2• 14 years ago

Maybe this can shed some light on your question:

http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2011/meditation-0505.html

zeroonetwothree• 14 years ago

Exactly. There are so many things where a large number of people have claimed that "if you try it, then it will work", while later research found it to be nothing but the placebo effect. This includes acupuncture, chiropractic, etc.

baddox• 14 years ago

Meditation is resisting your urges. So it's practice for resisting your urges, which makes you better at resisting your urges when it actually matters (like while working). Why not just practice resisting your urges while working and avoid the extra time required for dedicated meditation?

jdc• 14 years ago

Right, I'm pretty sold on meditation having benefits, but this "practice resisting" mechanism seems like a flippant guess. Then there's the "willpower is a finite resource" studies argue that the opposite effect is more likely for people merely restraining themselves.

wpietri2• 14 years ago

It is dickish of you to suggest that the repetition is to cover up a falsehood. You can question without being hostile.

tryitnow• 14 years ago

What about comparative effectiveness? For example, if we did an experiment where we started subjects on the following regimes, which would have the greatest effects on impulse control: 1) Learning to program (assuming the subject is not already a coder 2) meditation 3) aerobic exercise

Then we would have to figure out ways to measure "impulse control."

Such a study would have a lot more credibility than the author's contention that "I control impulses while meditating; therefore, meditation makes me more productive."

One controls impulses during a wide variety of activities; the burden is on the pro-meditation crowd to provide evidence that meditation is an especially valuable form of practicing impulse control.

pyre• 14 years ago

I'm curious why you seem to be indirectly asserting that learning to program and/or aerobic exercise will have some effect on impulse control.

demigod• 14 years ago

When I meditate concentrating on my breath,my mind interferes with my breathing and it becomes uncomfortable if I dont relax

I believe this acts as some negative feedback for the control freak self inside me. Every time I exert unnecessary control it becomes uncomfortable.

Meditating long enough may show me that the mind will wander in its own ways regardless of what I maybe doing at the moment, and its best for me to let it wander on its own ways and focus on what I am doing. Thus helping me understand that all the thoughts about ego, and judgements is just come process on the sidelines, and different from the core of me, the core that is focused on what I am doing.

This is the impression I have of where meditation is taking me.

yresnob• 14 years ago

Read Pragmatic thinking and Learning for good explanation as well.. Meditation improves focus... this is not based on reports or data but from my own experience. That is always the best proof for me.. trying it myself.

ricvg2• 14 years ago

I highly recommend to take a 10 days retreat in a Vipassana[1] meditation center. I know that 10 days is a lot to ask but in my opinion is well worth the effort.

I've been there twice in the past three years. I thought that I understood everything the first time. Boy, was I wrong.

[1] http://www.dhamma.org/

konstruktor• 14 years ago

If those rules don't creep you out, then I don't know what does: http://www.dhamma.org/en/code.shtml No talking, no outside contact, no other forms of practice. This is not a healthy environment unless you know very well what to expect and are sure you really, really want this. It sounds very cultish to me, even though I do know somebody who goes on Vipassana retreats regularly and seems to benefit a lot. Those retreats are for laypersons, including beginners, but the rules are similar to the most intense meditation periods of monastic buddhist life. Compare that to western zen: There's a small zen temple in my town that will not allow people on 3 day retreats unless they have meditated for a while and know what to expect.

ricvg2• 14 years ago

hehe... yeah they do look like that at first.

Personally I find that the reasoning behind these rules is very practical. You see, the course is all about understanding what sensations are and the effects that they have in our psyche. So one of the goals is to limit as much as possible all sources of sensations so that you can easily focus on a few and see how the mind reacts to them.

pavedwalden• 14 years ago

Cults have rules like that to cut you out of your old life, but in this case I think it's a legitimate desire to eliminate ALL distraction. I did one of their retreats many years ago and concluded that the changes in my internal life that could only happen in such an environment.

For example, after a few days my internal monologue petered out and for the first time I realized that a good portion of my mental activity was normally devoted to thinking about things I was going to say later on. Once I was out of the habit of talking all the time, I stopped cooking up little quips and observations about everything and really felt an expansion of non-verbal thinking.

So, although I had my doubts about the place going in, I left feeling that 10 days of intense internal focus was the only possible way to reach the insights I'd had, and that I was glad I'd done it. The months afterwards (while I kept up the practice, before I got "too busy"), were the most contented of my life.

Alex3917• 14 years ago

I've done one of these retreats, it's not a cult, and there are good reasons for those rules being in place. Philosophically I'm much more of a pragmatic dharma person, but if I decide to continue with my practice then I'll do a bunch more Goenka retreats before trying other stuff. If nothing else they're free, and you actually get really good results. I certainly don't agree with all of those rules in my everyday life, but on the retreat itself they are a huge part of the experience.

If you want to know more about the Goenka approach, there are a couple of really good podcasts from Buddhist Geeks:

http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2007/07/bg-028-entrepregurus-an...

http://www.buddhistgeeks.com/2007/07/bg-029-mass-producing-m...

I think they're pretty much dead on in their analysis.

patrickdavey• 14 years ago

Vipassana is an _extremely_ powerful technique.. and not without its dangers - especially if you're not used to meditation. Check out http://livingvipassana.blogspot.com for a first hand account of a manic-depressive (bipolar) episode following it.

While no one knows the triggers to these things I would _not_ recommend just jumping in because you thought it'd be cool! Read up, do your research, and do lots of smaller practice before trying.

That'd be my recommendation anyway ;)

dschiptsov• 14 years ago

Oh, come on. Meditation is not the way to "exercise willpower muscle" (running is the way to do so).

Meditation is the way to learn that your flow of thoughts is not you, it is mere side-effect, a smoke from an engine, a screen-saver, or just idle-running.

Yes, the practice of meditation is beneficial for will-power and self-control, but it is not the goal.) Goal is realization that what you think you are, is just a running total of all previous conditioning, and the ''real you'' could be "seen" is in an instant between two thoughts.

Any good ''eastern'' teacher will tell you that.

crux2• 14 years ago

I'd think any good "eastern" teacher would be sure to emphasize both the cultivation of wholesome mental qualities and the realization of not-self in meditation, depending on the audience and the context.

7rurl2• 14 years ago

That's awfully dogmatic of you. Why can't people have different goals for meditating?

Speaking of running... same thing... people can run for different reasons. Certainly long distance running is great if your goal is to increase your willpower, but its also great if your goals is to increase your physical endurance or if your goals is simply to be able to run really far.

Agathos• 14 years ago

Running? Really?

In my experience, my mind is quite calm when doing hard physical work such as running. So if I wanted to practice resisting distracting thoughts, I would have to begin with almost anything besides physical exercise.

Florin_Andrei4• 14 years ago

Meditation is to your mind what hacking is to a computer. You're trying to make it do things it would not otherwise do.

(hacking in the sense accepted here on HN, not in the mainstream sense)

natex• 14 years ago

I'm seeing quite an interest here for the principles and techniques of meditation. Here's a link for some talks given by a wonderful teacher, on mindfulness/meditation and other topics.

http://www.audiodharma.org/

tylee782• 14 years ago

Happens to me all the time. I am working on a piece of code in the afternoon, and can't move forward or looking to identify a bug or optimizing some algorithm - wasting hours. After a meditation session I walk back to the computer screen, take a seat, and my hand clicks around the tabs, my fingers scroll around, my eye catches one obscure line of code which is EXACTLY where the problem sits. I had this happen so many times, it's a given by now. The article (and I am sure all who do meditate) shares the same kind of experience.

thirdtruck• 14 years ago

I can second this. I can't begin to count the number of times that spending five minutes walking and with my mind on anything but a given problem has lead to the recognition of a major time-saving change in plans.

Think of it as pulling off of the highway for a minute to check your map instead of trying to unfold it in front of your steering wheel.

ricknew• 14 years ago

This excerpt from Shunryu Suzuki might add another approach to the conversation.

http://www.kingstonkendo.org/mistakesinpractice.pdf (PDF)

rohun_ati• 14 years ago

There was a study done by Sarah Lazar at Harvard Med a while back. They concluded that meditation can not only prevent age related cognitive decline, but it can actually physically reshape our brains, thickening our cortical structures. There's a TED video online, and the actual study is available online if anyone is interested (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16272874)

gavanwoolery• 14 years ago

I meditate while walking my dogs or taking a shower. Unless you are trying to achieve the title of Zen Grandmaster (which you probably are not) there is no need to sit still while doing so.

mtts3• 14 years ago

Dunno. I've found purposefully sitting still is much more effective than walking dogs or taking a shower, during which your mind may calm down, but may very well not as well.

kylebrown3• 14 years ago

I think you are on to something here, but there is a difference between doing something relaxing and "meditating". I'm most relaxed while sitting on the pot and I get my best insights while taking a shower, but during neither of those am I meditating (in the zen sense).

A Zen Grandmaster can probably meditate while rollerblading through NYC and simultaneously debugging a kernel driver. For beginners, it helps to sit relatively still with eyes closed (or eyes focused on eg a candle, tree, waterfall etc. but not darting about), to chant or use beads to count breaths, etc.

vividmind• 14 years ago

I use fishing for the same purposes. Helps me concentrate on just that activity and get my mind off work-related stuff. Every time after a fishing trip I feel really rested, although might be tired a bit physically.

mtts3• 14 years ago

Maybe someone will do some research on this at some point, but yes, it seems fishing is indeed the western male's (it's usually western males that do fishing for leisure, no?) version of meditation. It's not about catching fish, surely.

ashutoshm• 14 years ago

"Many go fishing all their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after." ~ Henry David Thoreau

tehayj• 14 years ago

I'm into the basic practice of mindfulness since years. I read research papers about it every month and also train people in mindfulness skills. Here is the essence of what I learned. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sspY43lxqhE&list=UUh-TdJw...

up_and_up4• 14 years ago

In my opinion, Meditation and Mindfullness are not the same thing.

Meditation is a state, where the mind is completely silent, the breath slows waaaay down, the heartbeat slows waaaay down. Slowly ever so slowly, some bliss starts to bubble up from within. It is the climax of one pointed attention. Few people who say they "meditate" are reaching that point since it requires years of sincere effort. In Yoga, meditation is known as Dhyana, or the state resulting from the mind becoming one pointed for 100 seconds. Samadhi, which is considered a state of deep bliss is considered reached when the mind becomes completely still for 1000 seconds.

Mindfullness, is the act of being more aware during daily activities. Like watching actions and interactions. There is a gradual tendency to modify behavior to being more calm, collected and centered which helps to go deeper when attempting to meditate. The mind is still active during mindfullness, but it is being directed or corrected as needed throughout the day.

Meditation helps to develop deeper Mindfullness and vice versa. Meditation is like taking a shower, whereas Mindfullness is avoiding rolling in the mud and getting dirty. It is important to keep in mind that Meditation is literally a state where the mind is free from thought and that all the "meditation practices and techniques" are just different paths of reaching that same place.

prawks2• 14 years ago

If one were looking to get into Meditation, what is a good way of going about it? Preferably a DIY way if possible, but if a class is really the way to go that's okay.

When you say years of sincere effort, are you talking devoting a full-time job's worth of time, or just keeping a routine?

I've been interested in meditation for a while, but it seems whenever I try and dig around I get completely lost in literature and terms and fail to see a proper starting point. I'm not looking to go crazy, I like the idea of Mindfullness and having a better understanding of how to control the ebb and flow of your thoughts.

up_and_up4• 14 years ago

Thanks for the question. I started with DIY meditation. I got a couple of books, mainly the techniques were repeating some phrase, focusing on the breath etc. This was okay for me to start. But I have been working with a teacher for about 12 years, which really helped. There are lots of different types of meditation, some with religious or spiritual undertones and others that are completely outside all that. Find a style that you vibe with based on what you think/believe and run with that.

By "years of sincere effort" I mean practicing daily. 20-30 mins is probably enough to start. I would compare it to playing an instrument. Daily practice is pretty essential.

webwanderings10• 14 years ago

As part of my DYI, I would drop the guilt of not being able to go the traditional route. Being mindful, staying in here-now, is not easy either and it may not work for you well, but it is something one can try quiet easily at any given moment. When you walk, observe. When you eat, observe and only eat. Taste the food and only eat. So on and so forth. I believe this is the best DIY of meditation, though not everyone agrees that being mindfulness is meditation, but I tend to think that it IS meditation and not necessarily mindfulness, because the goal of being in here-now is to eliminate the distraction of past/future and not really to concentrate. However, on the other hand, the typical meditation techniques (of mantra or other types) would want you to concentrate on something.

wakoumel• 14 years ago

You cannot stop your thoughts, it's like trying to capture the wind by opening your jacket. The point of meditation that most miss is that it is an experiment rather than a quiet place you're trying to reach. You discover what your emotions are, what you think about, etc. There is no goal other than observation of your mind and to consistently bring your attention back to your breath. The reason you sit and don't move is only to start at the most basic thing you can do, but the point is not the sitting and becoming still, it is to learn how to carry your awareness with you where ever you go and no matter what you do. When you can do this, things change.

To get started I recommend finding a group and going a few times at first to understand good posture and breathing techniques. There is no right way to meditate so which group you join probably doesn't matter. I personally like the methods of Zen or Shambhala.

I have actually managed to meditate for 20-30 minutes first thing every morning for the last 26 days in a row, although over the years I've been practicing on and off. The trick I've found to do it everyday for nearly a month now has been to use some findings in behavioral economics.

The idea is this: come up with a challenge for a month and a small but immediate punishment for yourself if you don't meet it. For example, donating $50 to an organization you hate if you don't meditate when you knew you should've (obviously any real crises are exempt from any skipping). It is amazing how well this works. Suddenly I have 20 minutes at home to just sit down so the Westboro Church doesn't get any of my money.

But to more correctly answer your question, just keeping a routine is enough. We cannot all become monks, but if you can ever get to a place where 20-40 minutes is a daily routine, it will change your life. Feel free to message me if you have any specific questions on books to start with, etc.

kylebrown3• 14 years ago

On what to do physically, my recommendation is to use mediation beads (aka mala beads). 6-count breathing (6 on each inhale and exhale) and move one bead each breath. With the standard 108-beads, you start at the mala and it takes about 20 minutes to reach the end (you feel your fingers reach the mala again).

For the mental aspect, a good starting point is the audio session Alan Watts Teaches Mediation. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tYENNBA0cA

starpilot2• 14 years ago

I've read maybe a dozen books on vipassana meditation (the type usually posted to HN), zen, and mindfulness. The two best practical books on meditation I've read are:

1. The Miracle of Mindfulness, Thich Nhat Hanh

2. Mindfulness in Plain English, Bhante Gunaratana. This one is free online, though the paid copy is a bit more edited for clarity.

My primary guide is 1. It's concise and provides just the right amount of breathing exercises to help me focus while I "sit." 2 is more comprehensive but I've found it a bit too scattered, with too many tools to help with breathing that I go in circles attempting different ones. Most people I think employ a couple and ignore the rest. 1 is much better written and just a more cohesive book than 2 IMO, but they're both great books and either one alone works well as a guide to meditating.

prostoalex• 14 years ago

Mindfulness to Go: How to Meditate While You're On the Move is practical and written with Western reader in mind.

intended• 14 years ago

Brute force:

Allocate a certain room and time religiously where you will sit down every day. Reduce distractions to nil zealously.

Sit on the floor, cross your legs and close your eyes.

Now focus on taking deep slow breaths. Every time a thought comes, and you get focused on it, relax and let it go. Refocus on your breath.

Its more practice than technique.

The aim is pretty simple - be able to witness your thoughts and let them go. Finally you reach no thought.

robertp• 14 years ago

Ive been working with a personal coach recently and at the start of each session we start with a guided 2-3 minutes of mediation practice. One way to do on your own is with mp3's and doing on your own. Really from my personal experience thats not expert driven at all, even doing 5 minutes a day before you day starts is a great way to start for weeks or months on end. Just those 5 minutes of calm and awareness can do a lot, it has for me.

krrrh• 14 years ago

I know it's not what you want to hear, but doing the 10 day Goenka vipassana course really makes a huge difference in getting established in the technique. I tried a few things, but didn't really click until doing it. To me sacrificing a 10 day vacation ended up being a lot more practical than slogging away by myself for years. Now I can miss practicing for a while but still get back to it in short order.

rsaarelm2• 14 years ago

Here's one interesting short guide: http://lesswrong.com/lw/5jj/meditation_insight_and_rationali...

sophacles• 14 years ago

Different people lear different ways of course, but for me what worked really well was reading about it, a lot, on the internet and trying out various things. At the same time I went to a local zen center that does mindful meditation. They have a short course on various techniques, and people who have been practicing for a long time - this is always good for me, I like to ask questions. The other nice thing about the zen center is that 2 days a week they had sitting meditation time. So you show up, and meditate in a big room with other people. Again, just personal preference, but being there, where the meditation was the focus, helped me not succumb to distraction (also, because I didn't want to be rude and be fidgety, noisy,or otherwise distracting to other poeple).

As for sincere effort, it isn't full time job style, but, it isn't "just" keeping a routine. It is keeping a routine, and actively trying to improve your meditation technique. Much like going golfing every week isn't the same as intentionally practicing your swing or putting with a coach every week.

justinhj• 14 years ago

I took a meditation class at a Buddhist temple. There wasn't any Buddhism taught in the class, only meditation techniques. The advantage in my case was that going to a class where I had to sit for an hour prevented me from procrastinating about practising meditation. That alone was worth it. After a few weeks I went from no meditation experience to being able to sit for 45 minutes at a time, and found many of the proclaimed benefits of meditation come right away.

idoruby3• 14 years ago

Meditation is best done in community. Just because you will have many questions while travelling in this new space. Goenka offers a free 10 day experience and a community of meditators. Absolutely not a cult. Give it a try.

Do this and you will no longer have doubts about meditation. You will like it or hate it but you will know what it is.

webwanderings10• 14 years ago

The mindfulness, which I called meditation below, is sort of a way to say that you - any average individual - can get on the path of blissfulness without waiting for, or waiting to start the path of meditation (of your example).

It really all boils down to each individual and their capacity of how they wish to learn.

Some people can easily start the meditation (of any type beginning with what the author describe in the source, of breathing exercises) to mantra meditation to anything else. However, if the above methods does not come easily to you, you can still meditate by being in here-now (what you describe as mindfulness).

The point is, that we don't have to be dogmatic about meditation and everyone can easily and equally get on the path of bliss and self-improvement in all walks of life.

For far too long, the traditional culture has sort of relegated the arts and artists to the lower pole of meaningful life. What is being suggested here is that either you can plainly observe the sun rising, or you can take pride in your singing or painting....all of these artistic self-expressions give you containment which leads to blissfulness...something an average meditator of various type would achieve by sitting idle or concentrating as their practice.

The more one stays in here-now, the more the mind sheds the distractions, the more there is bliss.

eightbitman• 14 years ago

You are incorrect, but my fees are pretty steep, and I accept cash only, so I can't explain it to you here.

zupreme• 14 years ago

This is simply incorrect. There are many different types of meditation with many different types of goals.

Some meditation disciplines involve slowing the breath down, while others involve speeding the breath up (research Breath of Fire). Some meditation disciplines involve quieting the mind and ignoring stimuli, while others involve opening the floodgates of sensation to more fully experience stimuli (research Vipassana).

The reality is that almost no single person can say what is and is not meditation because meditation comes in many different forms, in many different traditions, from many different sources.

Anyone who arrogates to him or herself the authority to say what is and is not meditation is regrettably mistaken.

up_and_up4• 14 years ago

Thanks for your comment. I agree that 'Meditation' means many things to many people. Thus, I started my comment above with "In my opinion" which makes the whole comment subjective to my experience. The definition I give above, refers to the Patanjali Yoga Sutra definition of Dhyana, which is essentially an extremely old technical document related to meditation and yoga.

Something to consider, is that there seems to be some confusion on this thread between meditative practices and meditative states etc. This would be like comparing the act of drinking a lot of alcohol with the drunkenness that results. There are many different types of alcohol and varying means of consuming it but that state that results from its consumption is somewhat common to most people.

In my comment above, I was referring to Meditation as a state of consciousness where the sense organs and mind become highly introverted. In that state the mind slows way down and comes to a stop.

Hari_Seldon• 14 years ago

I think that there is a tendency amongst us westerners to believe that meditation is about attaining something, Chögyam Trungpa described this as a type of "spiritual materialism". I've noticed this behaviour repeatedly, people feeling the need to quantify theirs and others progress or lack thereof.

If the writer of the TFA experiences 4 seconds of emptying his mind and a state of bliss, does it really matter that he didn't in your opinion use the correct terminology? or wasn't in the state long enough for this or that term to apply?

I enjoyed the article, it has inspired me to take up my own practise again, even 1 second of no thoughts and blissful awareness at the beginning of my day changes everything.

joelthelion• 14 years ago

>I think that there is a tendency amongst us westerners to believe that meditation is about attaining something

Of course there is. It's the only rational reason to do something: for present or future benefit. Otherwise you quit the realm of reason and enter the domain of religion.

ncarroll• 14 years ago

Hmm, if you are timing the experience in order to categorize it later, is your mind, maybe, not empty?

specialist• 14 years ago

> Meditation is a state, where the mind is completely silent

That wasn't my experience. I tried very hard to attain that "no thought" state. At best, I was able to let my thoughts flow without holding on to them.

I concluded that silent mind thing is an analogy. The opposite of "don't think of a pink elephant" causes you to think of a pink elephant. When you have "no thought" you just let the thought come and go without trying to process (consider, internalize, whatever) it.

But I haven't compared notes with others, gurus, whomever. YMMV.

up_and_up4• 14 years ago

"I concluded that silent mind thing is an analogy"

Thanks for the comment, I can definitely concur that stopping the mind is not easy.

When I started running, I would have told you that for me, running a 5 minute mile was probably impossible. After training a bit, I was able to achieve it consistently. But a key thing to keep in mind, is that I had a coach and other teammates to train with. This helped me believe I could reach goal and gave me the tools to do so.

I think you can probably get the analogy here.

ericmoritz• 14 years ago

Aw, I know the benefits. I hoped this would help me find a way to fit it in.

brianmcdonough2• 14 years ago

Hey Eric, at risk of sounding like I know a lot about this, there are two facets that make it hard to fit in. The benefits take days to appear and it's uncomfortable in the beginning. Like running, it's hard to start a practice of meditating, but if you do 1 minute, then 5 minutes, then work your way up to 20 minutes, there is a breaking point where you will do it because the benefits are clearly making your life richer. Colors appear more vibrant, sounds more clear, emotions more fully experienced. You will take more moments, like while stopped at a stoplight, to meditate because it allows joyful feelings rise to the top. Then, you won't ever think, "how can I fit it in," it will become part of you.

lloyddobbler• 14 years ago

If I'm too busy to medidate, why will I have time to read this article (presumably on meditation)?

qbit• 14 years ago

"And you will have experience that proves to you that the urge is only a suggestion. You are in control."

This is the most interesting part to me. Don't we always act on the urge that is strongest at the moment? If I decide to continue to meditate even though I have an urge to stop, doesn't that just mean that the urge to continue happened to be stronger than the urge to stop? Did I really get to choose which of those urges was strongest at that moment? Of course, this gets into questions of free will, which has been discussed on HN before. But when I meditate, it becomes very clear that I am definitely not in control of my thoughts, feelings, and urges. I see that I have multiple, competing urges at any given moment and that I don't control which urge emerges as the victor and compels me to act.

palderson• 14 years ago

For me, meditation is a way of separating myself from the issues I'm dealing with. The act of distancing my mind from the issue itself provides renewed vigor when returning to the problem.

ta12121• 14 years ago

There's nothing in this article that isn't said better elsewhere. I'd recommend the (free, online) Mindfulness in Plain English: http://www.urbandharma.org/udharma4/mpe.html (also available as a "real" book).

javajosh• 14 years ago

What the author calls "impulses" the Buddha called sankhara, or reactivity. The ones the OP is talking about are minor reactions.

These reactions do indeed impede our progress, as when our actions are driven by reaction we are not fully aware of what's going on around us. I first recognized the practical implications of this playing billiards - when I would strike a ball and miss, I would feel slightly dejected, and neglect to analyze what I just did to learn from it. When I would strike a ball and make it, I would feel slightly elated, and neglect to understand what I just did to learn from it.

My game got a lot better when I started playing the game, fascinated but detached from outcomes. There are a remarkable number of ways to strike a ball wrong - and it is interesting to consider why, having learned the game sufficiently, one would ever strike the ball wrong. Where does the variation creep in? Why, if I examine a table and decide to put the cue ball "just so", can I not do that? The answer, of course, is that there is countless non-verbal data that your body is sending you on each stroke - feedback from your bridge hand, the hand on the cue, even your stance and the feel of the felt all factor into this.

If you are attached to the outcome, all of this goes out the window. There is nervousness, fear, and excitement instead of systematic understanding.

brianmcdonough2• 14 years ago

Jonathan Haidt, the author of one of my favorite books, "The Happiness Hypothesis," points out–based on extensive research–that there are only three ways to change "automatic reactions" to circumstances like a flooded kitchen...meditation, cognitive therapy, and Prozac. Meditation is an inexpensive and natural alternative to the other two, it's been around for thousands of years and there are no negative side effects.

idoruby3• 14 years ago

I have been meditating for forty years. For thirty nine years I did transcendental meditation (TM)as taught by Maharishi Mahesh Yogi. I sat for 20 minutes twice a day without fail.

Last year I switched to Vipassana not because I was displeased with TM but just for a change and because the Goenka community seems to be very professional. I have been sitting in this new way one hour a day for a year now. I am not as regular because Vipassana requires more arrangement than TM. I am satisfied with my practice and can see a path to grow in this community for the rest of my life.

I am not sorry that I have spent so much time meditating. It changed my life. Before I began meditating I was aware of a certain pervasive incompleteness. I am a programmer and I love programming and I have been married for forty seven years and love my wife. But these satisfactions were not enough. My meditation practice did not materially change my life but it has given me a sense of centeredness. I am in a quiet way more fulfilled.

My experience was that TM was a very practical choice. I paid $75 to be initiated and found the TM community meet my needs for companionship on my path. Community is important to support a meditative practice. The actual practice is practical to do in our busy lives. If you are too busy to take two twenty minute periods each day for your personal readjustment then you are too busy and you need to readjust your life pattern. If you do not realize the imbalance in your life, probably meditation is not for you. Don't waste your time. Perhaps later.

YMMV, nowadays it cost $2k+ to learn TM. It is a good deal at this cost at least the benefits in my life exceed almost any amount of money. But without my experience I would never understand that. It is a chicken and egg problem.

OTOH, the TM community has changed and I am not sure I would be served by the Post Mahrishi community. In my case, as a long term meditator the difficulties with the community don't really affect me. Although I did consider the quality of the Goenka to support me in future.

So the choice of TM is a possibility for a newby. One caution, I knew many poeple who started TM and did not continue. So you are risking $2k+.

Vipassana is different. The technique requires more training and a greater daily investment. I sit for an hour a day. But Goenka suggests a minimum of two hours a day. And most practioners do at least one ten day retreat a year. I find this a bit much. But given that I am retired it is easily feasable. It merely a matter of commitment for me. A midlife married programmer will find this a greater challenge.

The introduction to Goenka's technique is charming. You do a ten day retreat at no cost to you. Their story is that adopting this practice is a serious matter. You learn the technique and then practice ten hours a day for ten days. For this learning period you live on the charity of others like a Budhist monk. Since this technique is a way of living that extends beyond just sitting, you need time to get into it.

I don't know how to tell which is most appropriate for you. I can just say it works for me. But I can say one thing for certain. Meditation is a practice that must be done everyday. Don't bother if you are not ready to commit to a regular practice. The benefits of meditation can not be explained. It is an experience and all that a teacher can do is give the experience and show you how to protect it. The rest is up to you.

I will say that meditation and psychotherapy are not mutually exclusive. For more than twelve years during the last forty I have been in therapy.

My final thought is that if you have a sense that your experience of life seems not quite complete, meditation can work to give you greater experience of connection.

kevTheDev• 14 years ago

I've been meditating pretty much every day for a few months now, and the thing that got me into it was getsomeheadspace.com

I've found it incredibly helpful - having a different guided meditation to do on the train every day makes the London commute, whilst not blissful, certainly better.

001sky• 14 years ago

(Yet) Another venue to for the competitive display of subtle nuances and arcane desiderata.

sandGorgon• 14 years ago

For casual meditation, all that has been pointed out here is fair and good.

But if you want to delve deep into meditation, then I seriously suggest that you look up MCTB - it talks about several of the dangers that lie in that path.

www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/dharma-wiki/-/wiki/Main/MCTB

edwinyzh• 14 years ago

Some of you pointed out it's not easy to control/stop the mind, yes, that's very true, especially for some people. To solve that, I suggest to read Ekhart Tolle's The Power Of Now, I think it's the modern book that explains the orignal Zen in a easy-to-understand way.

I used to think/worry/imagine too much about the future, and thus missed every actual moment I was living in, and it made me unhappy. I was living like that since I was very young and until I read the book The Power Of Now. So I highly recommend it.

If You're Too Busy to Meditate, Read This

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