Apple and SpaceX link up to support Starlink satellite network on iPhones

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-01-29/apple-and-spacex-link-up-to-support-starlink-satellite-network-on-iphones

by mfiguiere • 1 year ago

234 189 1 year ago

bloomberg.com

Ancalagon• 1 year ago

Wow this might be the best update in years

pixxel• 1 year ago

Yes isn’t it wonderful. Coming to all ‘smart’ devices including dumb televisions. Bypassing networks has never been such wow.

batch12• 1 year ago

Doesn't that risk already exist with existing technology?

MR4D• 1 year ago

Seems the 2 biggest trends in phones are satellites and AI.

To me at least, everything else is just noise when a new phone comes out.

wkat42427• 1 year ago

Well AI is a trend in everything right now.

And sats for mobile aren't really a big thing. Qualcomm worked on it and killed it, Samsung did for a while and killed it, Bullitt had it and it was a fringe thing before they collapsed. Only Apple really stood by it. And it's really only their moat, they're still not selling subscriptions.

Starlink direct to cell is only available on a fraction of sats, even those launched now. They won't be able to launch a full direct to cell fleet until starship comes online due to the added size and weight of the sats.

As an android user I still don't have any replacement for my Garmin inreach which is really a pain because Garmin put the prices up considerably. I was hoping to be able to replace it by now. Also, Bullitt's service is kinda a no go for emergencies because it uses a geostationary network so it won't work from valleys with mountains to the south (in the Northern hemisphere that is). Starlink, globalstar (apple) and Iridium (qualcomm, until they killed the deal) don't have this issue being low earth orbit.

I guess the emergency service isn't the big selling point everyone thought it was and the capacity isn't there yet for much more than text messaging yet.

SOLAR_FIELDS• 1 year ago

I also cannot wait for Apple to improve the product because it should force Garmin to actually charge reasonable prices for their service. There is a yearly fee just to keep the subscription "active" and then you pay for service on a rolling month basis. The extortionate per-message fees are reminiscent of early SMS days in the States.

The product and service itself is pretty reliable though. I've taken my Inreach in all sorts of places and had only rare issues with it.

dillondoyle• 1 year ago

For backcountry I would love to have another option (and able to stream video and games lol). But I wouldn't drop the garmin for life saving reasons. I * might * if my garmin watch was able to use the garmin sos. Phone + very long lasting / hard to break watch might be enough for 90% of my nights out for me.

ofcrpls• 1 year ago

https://www.verizon.com/about/news/verizon-skylo-launch-dire...

The support is standards based and while they are all wetting their feet with a preferred partner, with minimal messaging support focused on emergency use cases, there is enough traction to flush out major use cases across all carriers, with out of the box enablement at the mobile platform layer integrated on supported newer devices with the requisite radio HW.

_fizz_buzz_• 1 year ago

Well AI is a trend in everything right now.

Seriously, I am fascinated by all the advanced in AI, but man, I don't need an AI assistant in my Adobe PDF reader.

JKCalhoun• 1 year ago

And it was the cameras for the first 10 years or so.

ulfw2• 1 year ago

Satellite limited to one country is useless for all of us living in the free world. AI on a phone is... well let's be honest Apple "Intelligence" is an utter gimmick.

Sadly there's been zero investment it seems in better user interfaces, settings screens have become a joke, cameras seem to have stagnated

Ginger-Pickles• 1 year ago

https://archive.ph/wqnqJ

wkat42427• 1 year ago

Latest iPhone update poised to work with upcoming service

Um well yeah the whole idea of starlink direct to cell is that it works with unmodified mobile phones so this isn't really a suprise.

What surprises me more is that apple is even working with starlink considering they have a competing service together with globalstar. Which is kinda their moat since all attempts on the Android side have failed (qualcomm had a deal with iridium and killed it within the year before it even launched, and bullitt (CAT/Motorola) which had a deal with Inmarsat went bankrupt. The sat part was spun off but without ongoing hardware releases this will be a dead end.

imoverclocked• 1 year ago

What surprises me more is that apple is even working with starlink considering they have a competing service together with globalstar

Apple also works with competing terrestrial cellular network companies.

wkat42427• 1 year ago

True but terrestrial networks are offering generic service directly to consumers. Apple's deal with globalstar is fully part of apple's offer. I don't think they even mention globalstar.

It's also a USP for Apple in the mobile market right now.

CharlesW• 1 year ago

What surprises me more is that apple is even working with starlink considering they have a competing service together with globalstar.

Generally, Apple abhors single-supplier relationships. Having multiple suppliers reduces risk, improves their negotiation leverage, etc.

pxeboot• 1 year ago

Which is kinda their moat since all attempts on the Android side have failed

The latest Pixels have Satellite SOS [1].

[1] https://support.google.com/pixelphone/answer/15254448?hl=en

wkat42427• 1 year ago

Oh I see, I missed that, probably didn't make the news here as it's only in the US (so far at least). Sorry. Of course Apple's feature started out US-only too so I hope Google will expand their reach too.

cyberax2• 1 year ago

SpaceX will enable regular 4G and 5G, that should be accessible to any reasonable phone.

1oooqooq3• 1 year ago

promisses...

golergka• 1 year ago

Is Globalstar's network anywhere near Starlink in terms of bandwidth?

wkat42427• 1 year ago

No, but the Starlink direct to cell service is also nowhere near regular Starlink. At least until they get a lot more sats up with this capability.

Shank• 1 year ago

What surprises me more is that apple is even working with starlink considering they have a competing service together with globalstar

Apple hates being dependent on one company. They always use competing suppliers in their chain because it gives them more leverage. SpaceX vs Globalstar is a good strategy if one or the other has a problem or wants to negotiate something crazy.

In the past they’ve even sourced iPhone processors from both TSMC and Samsung (albeit mixed results).

teruakohatu• 1 year ago

I am pretty sure Apple could buy Globalstar without even noticing the cash, and Globalstar might be dead if it wasn’t for Apple (Apple owns 20% of Globalstar).

I don’t think Apple needs the financial leverage, I think they don’t want to put all their bets on a lame horse.

GeekyBear5• 1 year ago

What surprises me more is that apple is even working with starlink

Starlink is expected to offer greater bandwidth in the future, but Globalstar allowed Apple to start offering emergency SOS service with 2022 devices.

1oooqooq3• 1 year ago

i get instant alerts from starlink if i even smell anything that they think looks like torrent. so many false positives with wireguard and almost as useful of customer support as google.

karlgkk2• 1 year ago

Globalstar has substantially better coverage, but their constellation is in a much higher orbit. Starlink will be useful for actual internet access and lower cost emergency response messaging cost, but GS is going to be an important backup.

lxgr21• 1 year ago

I've always assumed that there would be at least some modifications required on the phone firmware side.

5G (at least the non-NTN ,non-IoT variants) is just too chatty to support cell sizes that big, is my suspicion. If you can get the phones to go into a special "texting only" mode (whether that's over IP using IMS, which also seems somewhat chatty, or something lower level and more efficient), that would probably help a lot, and I assume this is what Apple is doing in this firmware update.

wkat42427• 1 year ago

Yeah I always wondered about that too. How do you stop it from sending too much and cluttering the entire area (media access control is another issue because the satellite will 'see' a much wider area than the phone).

I imagine though that Starlink DTC will only be visible to phones in really remote areas, as it uses the same frequenties as terrestrial network it will be easily overwhelmed by traffic from nearby towers.

SanjayMehta• 1 year ago

I would not run out to upgrade for “AI,” but I would consider it for satellite.

CalChris• 1 year ago

iPhone 16 already has satellite SOS.

GeekyBear5• 1 year ago

Also, regular non-emergency texting (iMessage or SMS) has been enabled for customers in the US and Canada.

reaperducer4• 1 year ago

iPhone 16 already has satellite SOS.

And 15 and 14. I don't know about 13.

So you don't even need the latest gear to do it.

colonial• 1 year ago

Smart move. As a Verizon/Android customer, I'm a little miffed that my carrier is going with ASTS's quasi-vaporware over the proven Starlink constellation - baking support into the OS avoids unhappy customers and loaded *'s next to features.

ivanjovanovic3• 1 year ago

I see you don't understand the technological advantage AST has in comparison with Starlink Direct-To-Cell connection. They are some years ahead in this game.

AST is already testing full broadband 5G technology fully integrated into the terrestrial networks without interference with Vodafone and AT&T and will get Verizon beta testing approval very soon.

What Starlink D2C currently has is a spotty text service with such a low signal strength that is useless for anything more. That is what they got approval for from FCC because any stronger signal is causing unacceptable interference with the current terrestrial networks and the terrestrial providers didn't agree to allow them more than that. It will take a year or two at least for Starlink to get to provide more than text and that is actually stated as well in the T-Mobile press release about this.

Other thing is difference in AST and Starlink architecture which makes Starlink not easy to properly integrate in the terrestrial networks since they have gNodeB modules on the satellite, where AST is integrating with the gNodeB modules on the ground.

There are many details that make AST leading in the game of direct-to-cell communication in comparison to other solutions. They just got 1B in cash from investors to expand and speed up deployment of their network, so calling them vaporware might not age well when in couple weeks they start releasing the testing results.

piltdownman4• 1 year ago

technological advantage AST has in comparison with Starlink Direct-To-Cell

Unverified and unverifiable to date. Unacceptable for an ex-SPAC which nearly got delisted from the exchanges when it dropped to $2 a share a few months back.

Other thing is difference in AST and Starlink architecture which makes Starlink not easy to properly integrate in the terrestrial networks since they have gNodeB modules on the satellite, where AST is integrating with the gNodeB modules on the ground.

Their bent-pipe architecture is going to have to do a LOT of heavy-lifting to mitigate the impacts of their anti-doppler mechanisms on top of the latency, SNR and jitter. Whole thing hinges on Bluebirds phased-array performance and their ability to handover cells at scale - presuming they've achieved a fraction of what they claim to have achieved using unmodified commercial handsets in real-world environments.

Schadenfreude at SpaceXs very understandable FCC interference issues is a bad look considering ASTS are wholly dependent on SpaceX to put their constellation into LEO!

There are many details that make AST leading in the game of direct-to-cell communication in comparison to other solutions.

A deSPAC with no major R&D heads of note, headed by an Auteur (Abel Avellan) whose only credence is partnerships with Rakuten/Vodafone leading to board seats.

ASTS have missed every single self-imposed roadmap delivery milestone, have had to hit up their ATM, previously lost 80% of their value from NAV, and are propped up pricewise by a small float and a rabid reddit-style fanbase as a holdover from the SPAC days. They've proven absolutely nothing so far, despite many lofty claims to the contrary, and Rakuten has already hit them up with a multi-million dollar fine for what was effectively non-delivery.

lxgr21• 1 year ago

any stronger signal is causing unacceptable interference with the current terrestrial networks

I actually never understood that argument. Why would it be harder to tolerate interference from an adjacent frequency base station hundreds of kilometers away than that of one one roof over?

Are Starlink's band pass filters really bad, or do terrestrial networks depend on geometric isolation (via topography or the horizon) to a larger extent than space-based transmission protocols?

lxgr21• 1 year ago

Competition is important. I do find it very impressive what Starlink has achieved so far, but it would make me very nervous if nobody else were even trying.

mg3• 1 year ago

Do I understand it correctly, that the satellite communicates with a ground station and the ground station communicates with the phones?

It's not that the phone communicates directly with the satellite, right?

murderfs• 1 year ago

No, that would be utterly pointless. It's LTE from the sky: https://www.starlink.com/business/direct-to-cell

invalidopcode• 1 year ago

Not pointless, that's the best use of Starlink with phones. Base station backhaul gets the benefits of not having to run fiber + space for a bigger antenna w/ better signal to noise ratio

kelseydh2• 1 year ago

It's curious how this hooks up to existing telecom networks. I always thought of Starlink as eventually bankrupting them.

mg3• 1 year ago

A phone has enough transmission power to communicate with a satellite?

I would think the electromagnetic waves the phone sends are going out in a sphere, right? Then the loss on the way to the satellite must be gigantic.

teekert• 1 year ago

If the earth could be covered by only star link ground stations what would be the use of all the satelites?

mg3• 1 year ago

The stations would not have to be connected via data cables.

jbverschoor• 1 year ago

So no global xPhone/grok soon

Cumpiler69• 1 year ago

DogePhone?

noname120• 1 year ago

With do they have to partner up with T-Mobile if the iPhones will directly communicate with Starlink satellites? Wouldn't piggybacking off the Wi-Fi call technology be enough and less friction for customers?

I don't think it would be unreasonable to require customers to have a really cheap mobile plan with no internet if they want to do calls outside of iMessager/WhatsApp/Messenger/etc.

ryao2• 1 year ago

My understanding is that the starlink satellites will use T-Mobile’s spectrum to communicate with the cellphones, which requires a partnership.

withinboredom4• 1 year ago

Doesn’t 5G from space cause all kinds of issues with other things? Even if they share terrestrial spectrum, it will be broadcast from the sky.

This seems like a stupid idea on so many levels.

ignoramous• 1 year ago

Starlink probably takesover from the Core [0], while T-Mobile provides Radio Access Network.

[0] https://5g.systemsapproach.org/core.html

lxgr21• 1 year ago

Are you suggesting that the satellites should be using Wi-Fi spectrum?

That would not be possible, as neither access points nor clients are licensed to use nearly enough transmission power to bridge the distances required (and if they were, the spectrum would become usable for terrestrial uses).

GeekyBear5• 1 year ago

The Google/Starlink emergency SOS partnership in the contiguous US 48 States doesn't require that you to be a T-Mobile customer.

Access will be available "regardless of your carrier plan"

https://www.pcmag.com/news/googles-pixel-9-phones-get-their-...

kjsingh• 1 year ago

Come on Apple, don't taint yourself with Musk's junk!

theodric• 1 year ago

Those companies represent the collective effort of thousands of talented people creating novel products. I'm happy to support the engineers. I'd barely be online here without Starlink!

Not everyone cares about the political drama associated with companies that some dude has an ownership stake in.

inemesitaffia6• 1 year ago

T-Mobile is the partner

_1tem• 1 year ago

What does this actually mean in practice? Internet service everywhere even when out of range of a cell tower? Does it work indoors?

grishka• 1 year ago

Definitely not everywhere. Starlink cares a lot about national borders, neutralizing the one major advantage it has over most other internet access technologies. This just begs me to say "you had one job".

lupusreal• 1 year ago

Starlink disregards national borders when the US government gives them the greenlight for that, not otherwise. That's why it works in Iran. SpaceX / Starlink are an American company with personnel and property on the ground, they cannot simply defy their host government and do whatever they want, causing diplomatic incidents where they please. That's not realistic.

nroets2• 1 year ago

If you're resident in a country where StarLink is legal (like Mozambique), you can procure the service and then roam in a country where it's illegal like South Africa. I don't think that will ever change.

StarLink's definition of "resident" and "roaming" might change a little bit over time.

StarLink has been quite good in surrounding the countries where they stand to make a lot of money (like South Africa) with "friendly" countries. So, due to roaming, South Africa is losing out on a lot of tax revenue (VAT) and other economic benefits. Speculation is that they will give in.

zild3d• 1 year ago

Starlink cares a lot about national borders

Isn't is moreso that _laws_ care a lot about national borders? And Starlink has to care about laws to operate?

lxgr21• 1 year ago

"you had one job"

Violating international treaties and national law of almost all countries and potentially getting their assets seized, or worst case serving as a casus belli (economic or kinetic) in case the US does not enforce claims of other nations against them?

spwa4• 1 year ago

It seems right now, assuming you're in the test (is anyone that is not working for Apple?), an emergency button (no voice, no text, no nothing, other than the fact that you pressed the button and a location, not sure how accurate) (I guess maybe it's as featured as the Google feature)

MAYBE in the future text messaging service. Text only.

Note: Text messaging currently actually works on some Samsung phones on T-mobile, if you request to join the beta.

https://www.pcmag.com/news/t-mobile-begins-cellular-starlink...

Emergency SOS over Starlink works on recent pixel phones, which appears to provide text chat with emergency services:

https://support.google.com/pixelphone/answer/15254448?hl=en

Oarch• 1 year ago

Very soon all my memes will come directly from the edge of space and I think that's nice

hshshshshsh• 1 year ago

Edge of space is a meme.

1oooqooq3• 1 year ago

you mean scamer sms about extending your car warranty will come from space... because that's all this deal is about.

hu3• 1 year ago

and it's going to be summarized by AI to sound more legit.

duxup2• 1 year ago

It’s amazing, some day I get a dozen or more calls from:

- IRS - FBI - Some tax collecting / assistance group

You’d think the first two know where I live enough to come and collect…

newsclues3• 1 year ago

Data Centres in Space, with space based AI creating and sharing memes would be nice.

lxgr21• 1 year ago

Or we can just keep them on Earth and use the delta-v for something more useful.

ftyhbhyjnjk• 1 year ago

"Go Fuck Yourself" wins against the biggest monopoly.

gigatexal2• 1 year ago

Why Apple is getting into bed with Elon is beyond me. As a customer with tens of thousands spent at Apple and stocks to boot I don’t like this.

pjerem• 1 year ago

Same situation, I'm actually thinking about not buying Apple anymore.

inemesitaffia6• 1 year ago

T-Mobile is the partner.

inemesitaffia6• 1 year ago

You want to go Android where Google is a shareholder of Starlink and also supports this on Samsung phones?

Anyway T-Mobile is the partner here, not SpaceX

GeekyBear5• 1 year ago

Google and Starlink are direct partners.

Under the partnership, SpaceX will locate Starlink ground stations within Google’s data centre properties.

https://theincmagazine.com/google-cloud-has-signed-a-deal-wi...

newsclues3• 1 year ago

Because normal people don't hate or care about Elon.

TDS should not be tolerated in polite society.

true_religion4• 1 year ago

This is hardly TDS. Elon made his own 'gestures' then went to an AfD rally to clarify his position with a bullhorn in case some didn't hear the dog whistle.

hahamrfunnyguy• 1 year ago

I lost almost all respect for Elon Musk when he started calling a rescue diver "pedo guy". Up until this point, I was enthusiastic about his company's accomplishments in aerospace and electric vehicles.

Now I would love to see him fulfill his dream of being a Martian pioneer - as long as he doesn't return to earth. In my view, he is an embarrassment to the tech community and the United States. His childish and petty behavior has no place in a civil society.

bix6• 1 year ago

I’m a normal person and I’m disgusted by Elon’s actions. The salute was bad enough but the puns on X really sent me.

Nazism should not be tolerated in polite society.

crowcroft• 1 year ago

What satellite internet provider should people use instead?

inemesitaffia6• 1 year ago

Globalstar or Iridium which are SpaceX partners

true_religion4• 1 year ago

They were planning this for months, if not years.

amazingamazing2• 1 year ago

Why not? It's adding more functionality. Even if Apple used Globalstar, they're a partner of SpaceX and thus still "in bed" with Elon. Even if they didn't use satellite stuff at all, Apple's current CEO donated to Trump's inauguration, along with... you guessed it, Elon.

Cthulhu_• 1 year ago

Elon or SpaceX? It's important to separate the person and their actions and the company. I wouldn't be surprised / hope that long term Musk leaves or is ousted from SpaceX entirely.

mort96• 1 year ago

Elon. He's the front man and CEO of the company. Just like Tim is for Apple.

ladyanita22• 1 year ago

I do like it

lxgr21• 1 year ago

Given that this uses standards and protocols iPhones largely already support and are licensed for, not supporting it would seem more like active blocking at some point.

As an iPhone user, I really don’t need more instances of Apple telling me what I’m allowed to do at a software level, and on top of that Apple has had no problem allowing network connectivity to networks under all kinds of interesting ownership.

scyzoryk_xyz• 1 year ago

I don’t think it’s as simple as just Elon. These are enormous companies solving large problems with the objective of delivering value at highest possible profit margin to customers.

It’s just business

tchock232• 1 year ago

Will there be a way to disable this?

gruez• 1 year ago

Doesn't it use regular cellular frequencies? You might be able to "disable this" by using manual network selection, but if they use the same mcc mnc as tmobile (their partner), it'll be impossible to distinguish.

zitterbewegung• 1 year ago

Don’t use T-Mobile for now.

giancarlostoro2• 1 year ago

Its only intended for emergencies...

https://support.apple.com/en-us/101573

So by all means, if you rather not be able to text someone that you're in the middle of nowhere in danger with otherwise no signal, I don't see why you would disable that. Like its literally for SOS use.

lxgr21• 1 year ago

That's a different service (Apple's own, Globalstar-based one) than the one TFA and this discussion are about (i.e. Starlink/SpaceX + T-Mobile USA).

lxgr21• 1 year ago

Probably (I've read that there will be a switch in the carrier settings for T-Mobile USA), but also why would you want to?

In the end, the Starlink satellites will be just another set of cell towers, just with a slightly unusual velocity and altitude. You already can't e.g. disable using T-Mobile base stations leased by a particular land or infrastructure owner.

pavon• 1 year ago

Users in the program have a new toggle switch in their iPhone cellular data settings to manage the satellite feature.

giancarlostoro2• 1 year ago

So T-Mobile is partnering with Starlink to let people send SMS. This is insanely impressive, you could be in the middle of nowhere, and send an emergency text that otherwise would have gone nowhere.

stogot• 1 year ago

Is it still only line of site emergencies? Or is it that they solved the line of site issue?

voxic11• 1 year ago

It works indoors and under tree cover if that is what you are asking.

“Among other results, the satellites have been able to communicate with multiple models of unmodified Samsung, Apple, and Google devices using (T-Mobile’s) PCS G Block spectrum, including in urban and rural areas, indoors and outdoors, and in clear sky and under tree cover”

https://www.pcmag.com/news/spacex-cellular-starlink-system-w...

alp1n3_eth• 1 year ago

Garmin's smartwatch line and SOS communicators now have a massive target on their back. Now that the satellite availability issues are going to be solved, they just need to push battery life further for the watches and they'll be golden.

There will be no point other than simplicity / physical buttons to get a Garmin watch over an Apple watch if you have an iPhone pretty soon.

Garmin w/ eink screen, not great app, bad Apple compatibility = $300, latest AW series 10 = $380

lxgr21• 1 year ago

If you don’t care at all about battery life and, as you say, have an iPhone (the majority of smartphone users globally doesn’t, I believe).

bn-usd-mistake• 1 year ago

Garmin still has training readiness, training status, training plans, suggested event-based workouts and much longer battery life which makes them work better for endurance (hobby) athletes.

On the other hand, Garmin UX is horrible and the watch faces are utterly ugly

(saying as former Apple Watch owner and now Garmin FR 965)

jajko• 1 year ago

Popularity of Garmins go way beyond what you try for some reason reduce it to.

These are serious sport and adventure watches, apple doesnt really have a comparable product for many folks, ie for me or my wife (who has apple+garmin mix). I personally also prefer wearing round watches than blocky mini phone. Latest garmins, any garmins, with oled displays look much cooler.

wslh• 1 year ago

I wonder why nobody mentioned its military uses, such as operating autonomous vehicles.

Apple and SpaceX link up to support Starlink satellite network on iPhones

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