A $999 monitor stand is everything wrong with Apple today

Whats truly odd is that it doesn’t matter whether the stand alone is worth so much — why didn’t they just add the price they wanted into the monitor itself, where price variability is less sensitive? Did they really want $5k pricetag that badly?

Instead they’ve created this ridiculous and unnecessary situation. It’s done as if they don’t actually want you to buy the stand.., but I don’t know what the alternative is? Is the mount significantly higher margins?

Terretta• 7 years ago

Can you link to this “same type of stand”, please? It needs to have:

- floating counterbalanced vertical positioning for a screen of this weight.

- 90 degree rotation

Apple first released this kind of mechanism with the Pixar lamp iMac, to float its screen above the hemisphere base; I haven’t seen it for any consumer or prosumer monitor since.

kmlx2• 7 years ago

maybe i'm misunderstanding something, but the following stand [0] appears to be identical to the apple one:

- Tilt and lift

- Switch from portrait to landscape with bi-directional pivoting

- 45-degree swivel

(Bi-directional pivoting, tilt adjustment +30° to -5°, swivel adjustment ±45°, 100 mm vertical lift range)

[0] https://www.dell.com/en-uk/shop/dell-optiplex-7760-all-in-on...

jotm• 7 years ago

Wait, I thought people on Reddit were joking about the 1k price tag

kbumsik2• 7 years ago

The 1k stand is a real thing. The audiences in the keynote booed when they showed the price tag.

MikusR• 7 years ago

The booing was especially funny because a large part of audience are Apple employees, put there to clap after every word.

envolt• 7 years ago

I had the same thought.

bubblewrap• 7 years ago

I was very tempted to buy a MacBook Pro last year. If the keyboards would actually work, it would have been pretty much perfect except for the price. I have no experience with the touch bar, but it didn't look so bad in the store.

I hope they can fix the keyboard issues...

(Just to make a counterpoint to the "everything Apple does sucks" tone of the article)

frou_dh• 7 years ago

Is the monitor actually in the same category as existing "reference" monitors that cost 5 figures?

If the answer to that is yes, then the fundamental mistake is presenting the monitor at a show watched by consumers. Because that's just a recipe for bafflement and mismatched expectations.

guidedlight• 7 years ago

Well the actual presentation justified the cost saying it was far cheaper than other reference monitors.

Unfortunately for Apple that didn’t make a good heading.

bruceb• 7 years ago

Does 99% of the population know what a reference monitor is and that they can be $30K. No.

If you asked most people today what they remember about the presentation, its the $999 stand.

gridlockd2• 7 years ago

Is the monitor actually in the same category as existing "reference" monitors that cost 5 figures?

Does the back of that Apple thing look anything like this?

https://assets.fatllama.com/images/large/sony-oled-17-trimas...

No? Then it's not in the same category.

TazeTSchnitzel• 7 years ago

It is very expensive. But it's based on the tried-and-tested Apple pricing approach: as high as the target customer will jump. I assume Apple is trying to milk large business customers for all they're worth, it is the “pro” market after all. The $800 saving by going for the VESA mount is peanuts compared to the overall cost of a fully-configured Mac Pro setup.

keithnoizu3• 7 years ago

The end-benefit aspect of consumer price sensitivity.

samdung• 7 years ago

I have a question.

Is the $999 stand a media deflection strategy for a rather mundane WWDC or something else? https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2019/06/highlights-from-wwdc-...

0xADEADBEE• 7 years ago

I'm not typically one for conspiracy theories but this thread got tanked at the weekend [0] and I'm not seeing much in the news about the actual story [1]. I'll certainly be watching the company I pay a premium for privacy for with great interest.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20054289

[1] https://9to5mac.com/2019/05/25/apple-itunes-lawsuit/

gutnor4• 7 years ago

That's the other way around really. The WWDC was quite good, software wise (as it should).

All you hear about is outrage about the stand of a pro-monitor outside the budget range of even the most enthousiast consumer. That's how you know it was a good WWDC.

threeseed5• 7 years ago

You can't possibly be serious. It is WWDC i.e. a developer's conference after all. And amongst developers and power users it was by far the best ever.

Project Catalyst allows you to build Mac apps from your iOS code base with a checkbox and some minimal code. SwiftUI is a true game changer for app developers bringing Flutter style development. iPad OS with long overdue features like desktop Safari with download manager, USB drive support, 9ms pencil latency. iOS with Dark Mode, 2x app launch time, clever use of ML in Photos. Sign in with Apple is an extremely clever way to combat privacy. Apple Maps looked really strong.

I could keep going but mundane is not the way I would describe it.

spectramax3• 7 years ago

I also agree. This was one of the best WWDC’s in recent history. No matter what Apple does, it’s a lose-lose situation. HN was complaining for ages about how the 2014 Mac Pro sucked. Now that Apple has hit it out of the park, HN is still complaining about pricing. We’ve seen this since the introduction of iPhone. People said it sucked and it went ahead and changed the world. $499 for a phone!!!!! Are you kidding me?

It’s disappointing that HN continues to complain, often without basis. It’s a ritual. A positive comment has to, has to be combated with an opposing view even if it isn’t justified.

This Mac Pro is amazing in my view. Design, aesthetics, features, thermal design, engineering, EVERYTHING.

But, fuck Apple. The monitor didn’t have a 120hz refresh rate. I’m disappointed. Everyone is doing it, even Asus. How can Apple ignore our needs! For $5000!!!? Are you kidding me?

Sigh.

keldaris• 7 years ago

2x app launch time
Sign in with Apple is an extremely clever way to combat privacy

As someone who didn't watch the event and doesn't pay much attention to the Apple bubble, I can only hope you didn't mean to say what you said there.

gutnor4• 7 years ago

So much noise about the stand. This is the stand of a $5000 monitor, not just any stand.

Any random piece of plastic on a Porsche is more expensive than on a Ford. That shouldn't be the case in a perfect world, but we don't live in a perfect world.

People have complained for years that Apple is no pro enough. The Mac Pro and XDR display are so pro-level that the vast majority of the WWDC public was not the target demographic either.

Is it too expensive? Yes. Does that matter? No, it's only because it has an Apple badge that we hear about this at all, and people entitlement with Apple is just off the charts.

nextos2• 7 years ago

I'm happy that Apple is aiming at the pro market again. I wish their next step was to release more products for programmers, not just designers.

For example, big 2k 16:10 monitors have been wiped out from the market as manufacturers can't be bothered to produce panels in that aspect ratio, instead of 16:9. More vertical space makes such a difference.

I only know of two old 30 inch models from Dell and NEC that will be soon not possible to purchase. Apple, with their scale, could get custom orders.

Theodores2• 7 years ago

I am not sure that 2K 16:10 30" is the sweet spot for users. Five years ago before 4K worked properly then yes, but not now.

4K on 31" works great, plenty of vertical resolution for code plus the pixels are not too small. Anything larger and you will be getting neck ache peering up/down the screen. Or you would have to push the monitor further away than what a regular desk affords, adjusting font sizes accordingly, going into painful letter box territory.

I promise you won't look back if you go 4K on 31", there is no need for a dual monitor setup unless you are editing movies!

Dylan168078• 7 years ago

So you're saying we should look at it proportionally? Because that still makes it look terrible. Nobody else makes their stand cost 20% as much as the screen.

gutnor4• 7 years ago

I'm saying we should look at it from the people in that market perspective and the value it brings them or not. The fact that Apple is not including by default is significant. They expect the vast majority of their customer to no need the stand. The option to have a stand at all is probably only for very small shop, like youtube star, and for them they have to see it as buying a 6K monitor, which is probably still a good deal for them as it gives them an affordable alternative to a reference monitor.

In general, it is a specifically designed stand for a monitor targetted at a very small part of an already niche market. So yeah, it's expensive.

askafriend2• 7 years ago

This is a dumb article.

The only reason they even broke out the pricing like this is because the target audience is media production houses in Hollywood and other high budget environments where they already have their own rigs and mounts. It’s just a line item on an invoice. This monitor is competing against $25k+ reference displays. And the price is very competitive.

The only difference here is that no other company does large scale press events for products meant for such a niche professional audience.

MKBHD said it best in his video. If Apple had said “This is a $6k monitor” and then during configuration time provided a stand-less option for $1k less, then we wouldn’t see any of these dumb articles.

This is everything that is wrong with journalism today.

manderley3• 7 years ago

People keep saying this: Is this monitor actually competitive with $25k+ reference monitors? Because the specs seem to indicate "no" to me, but I'm not a professional user so can't judge what's important.

Also, to be able to use your own mount you still need the $200 VESA mount.

askafriend2• 7 years ago

Yes it actually is competitive in many ways. Especially for it’s size.

Here are a few other reference displays in the market:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/professionalvideo/Ntt/HDR...

Keyframe4• 7 years ago

Close enough to be considered, yes. However, only tests will show since it's not in pro's hands yet.

threeseed5• 7 years ago

So you're not a professional user and you can't judge what's important. But your gut feeling is telling you that it isn't a good deal ?

I wonder what someone from Apple Product Marketing would think about comments like this when they would've spent the best part of 5 years working closely with potential customers in the product design and specifications.

Keyframe4• 7 years ago

What makes people think that if it's a "hollywood" production house (most of them aren't in Hollywood) that they are ready to buy a $1k monitor stand, no questions asked? It won't happen, unless they are a) stupid (they aren't) b) flush with cash (they aren't) c) for a client room (maybe).

What is interesting is that new monitor. Spec-wise it's not the same as a good Sony or even Flanders, but it's not that far off and it's not $35k+. Now, that's something that those studios would buy plus a stand - when you put it like that - 6-7k monitor that's 95% there of a 35k monitor.

totemizer• 7 years ago

In fact the actual point should be that those production houses will never buy this stand because they already have their stands. (this is what MKBHD said anyway).

And to be honest, if I had the money I would buy that stand, I always loved these move-around-stay-in-place gadgets.

Traster• 7 years ago

I really wish people would stop comparing this monitor to the $35k monitors. Yes, it's almost as good, maybe even 95% as good, but guess what? People are not paying $35k for the sake of it, that 5% is really bloody important. If it isn't important to you, you weren't going to buy the $35k monitor already. The reason they're so much more expensive is because they have features and specs that a small number of people find really important and will pay the premium for it. If we want to go down that line fine - but people can just as easily point to $2k displays that are 95% as good as the Apple one.

Vagantem• 7 years ago

Maybe Apple is taking a page from the fashion playbook - every runway show has 1x outrageous item to create buzz & PR. Like that wearable inflatable swimming pool..

gridlockd2• 7 years ago

This monitor is competing against $25k+ reference displays. And the price is very competitive.

No it isn't. That's just the framing. Yes, reference monitors are expensive. It's not a reference monitor. A reference monitor is a very specialized piece of equipment that fits into infrastructure that you may find at a broadcasting studio:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadcast_reference_monitor#Fe...

It's not necessarily the panel itself that makes them so pricey (though OLED vs. LCD does make a difference). Rather, it's the fact that they're niche products.

edit: link added for clarification

threeseed5• 7 years ago

Can you clarify what makes it not a reference monitor ?

Because a reference monitor is surely not defined based on it being niche or whether you find it in a studio or not.

Dylan168078• 7 years ago

If Apple had said “This is a $6k monitor” and then during configuration time provided a stand-less option for $1k less, then we wouldn’t see any of these dumb articles.

Yes we would! People aren't too dumb to do the math.

If they simply made it a $6k screen, always with the stand, then that's something that would change perception. It would mean slightly less excitement. Probably not much less. But critically, it wouldn't be insulting.

xtiansimon• 7 years ago

insulting

?? As in failing to recognize you as a person in some way?

There’s a lot to bemoan about Apple’s product positioning as ‘attainable luxury’. Yet, I find this position confusing and naive.

Word.

matsemann• 7 years ago

This is everything that is wrong with journalism today.

What? It's not manufactured hate by journalists. Minutes after the presentation Twitter, reddit etc buzzed with this. So they only report on what people are reacting to.

If the article and reactions are dumb because Apple could have spun this as a $6k monitor, then that's Apple's fault.

mcv• 7 years ago

It's not the pricing itself that's wrong, but how Apple presents it. The way Apple presents it puts focus on the ridiculously expensive stand. Apple used to be the master at presenting these kind of new products, but they seem to have lost that edge.

firecall• 7 years ago

Look... I hear this argument a lot and I've used it myself.

But after a few days of considering it, I do think the general consensus is correct. The price is completely bonkers.

I haven't read the article BTW.

But it's not correct that production houses are so minted they don't care and just soak up the costs (I work in marketing, I work with these people). Margins can be thin and equipment costs matter.

A grand for a stand is mental and will be questioned on the PO when it goes past the CFO or the person signing the cheques.

This was a weird move by Apple and totally tone deaf for the market the audience at the event.

And the WWDC event is important. They should have known better... the fact they didn't predict the reaction to this speaks volumes. The multi millionaire and billionaire senior management are massively out of touch in some ways.

In other ways they got it right: They actually spoke to the people who wanted this Mac and they got it right.

But WWDC is their premier public international marketing stunt of the year. The grand for a stand is a bad look and just reinforces Apple as a brand for elitists when that is the last thing they need globally.

hackergary• 7 years ago

Well said! Pasting my comment from Facebook where this was reposted:

---

Idiots. The new monitor and stand isn't made for you. Not even you, clueless Engadget journalist. It's made for graphics, movie studio pros whose company pay $18000 currently for Reference monitors. Compared to that and the fact that this is 6k with that fancy nano coating, this thing is cheap.

And I'm not buying it, because I don't need it. If you don't understand the price, it's not for you either. Move along.

znpy3• 7 years ago

As Linus from LinusTechTips pointed out, if they had just bundled the whole thing for 6k with an option to buy the monitor alone for 5k (thus "saving" 1k) people would probably be less angry.

I don't really see the point of getting angry however: for once Apple is trying to charge 1k$ extra for a thing that you don't really need and that you can easily and happily live without.

Just use a compatible one that you can get for like $100 or less off Amazon.

manderley3• 7 years ago

If anything, the $200 VESA mount you absolutely need is more egregious.

keithnoizu3• 7 years ago

but having a non standardized mount is so revolutionary.

kbumsik2• 7 years ago

There's no compatible one unless you buy a $200 vesa mount though.

znpy3• 7 years ago

Unless a $50 compatible vesa mount is released too, you know?

aequitas2• 7 years ago

a thing that you don't really need

Don't underestimate how people feel about having a complete Apple-design desktop solution. Eg: people are also falling out about Apple selling a LG thunderbolt display as companion for their Macbook instead of a proper Apple-design display.

znpy3• 7 years ago

Will that display work the same when hooked to a different stand? Yes.

BTW I'm currently using a 15" macbook pro hooked to an old 24" 1920x1200 HP display (using DVI connection via a Thunderbolt docking station). I can't really complain, I am able to do whatever I need with this monitor.

Nexxxeh• 7 years ago

It doesn't come with a stand, and isn't VESA compatible without an additional $200 adapter, and it's all proprietary.

It's just such a ridiculous thing to nickle and dime, or in this case, hundreds and hundrends and hundreds of dollars.

It's not justifiable and just looks like continued contempt for the consumer.

There's no way the stand costs $800 more than their VESA adapter, which means they're taking the piss. Most monitors include a stand and many include VESA functionality for free.

Apple have produced a monitor that places an arguably otherwise unobtainable level of capability within reach of a budget conscious Apple fan who would actually save up and buy this. One for whom it's not a mindless line item purchase. For whom it's a once-in-three-years or even once-in-a-decade purchase. It is a prosumer price. Brilliant.

I can't justify one, but a couple of my photography buddies could. It'll sting them, and they'll have to skimp and save for a while, and it won't be at launch, but give it a year or so of saving hard...

Except it's pretty useless without either a stand or a mount. And instead of including a stand one for free like everyone else, the price is eye watering to anyone who actually cares about price.

And by doing so, they've made the monitor pricing look like bullshit because it's effectively unusable without overpriced proprietary bullshit.

And if you were to sum up what emotion "effectively unusable without overpriced proprietary bullshit" is going to make someone feel...

tdy_err• 7 years ago

I think it's a misrepresented discount. Like, most pros have VESA mounts already. So they discount the monitor... So you don't have to pay for it if you don't need it.

But the message about that reason is not there and therefore it sounds like nickel and diming.

Instead we should consider it as:

$6000 for the monitor with stand OR $5200 for the monitor with VESA mount

spectramax3• 7 years ago

Yep, this was poor marketing. Plain and simple.

threatofrain• 7 years ago

Perhaps poor but also perhaps deliberate to give an unrealistically (because most customers will buy the stand or the vesa mount) low price point.

millstone• 7 years ago

Yeah decorate it with $29 iPod socks then call us back.

The critique of Apple's "design over usefulness" is older than the Internet. I read this exact same article after the iMac dropped the floppy drive.

DevX101• 7 years ago

The rise of Apple computers latest era started with the ad campaign "I'm a Mac/I'm a PC" which made computing choices a cultural signal, mocking PC users as stodgy and out of touch corporate types. It worked.

The timing is right where a computer manufacturer with a solid build at a reasonable price could play this same strategy against Apple. I'm thinking an ad campaign which pokes fun at Apple at being over priced and pretentious, with out of touch super fans paying thousands for a basic laptop and accessories.

The cornerstone of the campaign could be this image:

https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5cf8133011e2051fb46d5...

Disclaimer: Writing this comment from a Macbook Pro.

layoutIfNeeded• 7 years ago

Jesus, that image is super cringey.

That being said, the problem is that even if another vendor could produce hardware that’s on par with Apple, but at a reasonable price, they would still lack the OS. Windows is still doing 1 hour updates on reboot, and is filled with telemetry spyware... Linux still requires a lot of hacking, often has audio and trackpad issues, etc.

Right now macOS is the only sensible operating system for creative pros. Period.

xorcist2• 7 years ago

Linux still requires a lot of hacking,

Sorry, somebody must call out these myths. A less than 20 year old Linux desktop is the most plug and play operating system there is. Stick with supported hardware and there aren't even any third party drivers to mess about it. It doesn't get any easier than that. And hardware support is a lot broader than with MacOS.

The reason more Macs are used with the creative industry is mostly cultural. The operating system isn't really a choice for a professional, you choose your tools and use whatever is required to run them. There are some exceptions with products such as Lightworks, but I get the impression that these are sold mostly as appliances.

It's different for us who do IT for IT's sake. It's more of a personal choice which desktops we want to run. It's absolutely possible to deploy on Linux and develop on a Mac as long as you don't touch anything close to the machine. You probably need to install things like Brew and keep things updated and reasonably secure, but it's not only possible but something many people find worthwhile.

tomglynch• 7 years ago

I just started a discussion here [1] about the "I'm a Mac, and I'm a PC" advertising campaign. I didn't know Microsoft ran a campaign as a response to it also.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20112800

sjustinas• 7 years ago

MSI is on it.

https://twitter.com/AustraliaMSI/status/1136188253785034752

thirdsun• 7 years ago

I get their point, but to be fair the pixel density of the MSI model isn't comparable at all. I'd take that 5k display in a 27" format though.

jpalomaki2• 7 years ago

On the actual monitor side you don’t seem to have much competition on this category. If you want large screen with high DPI, the only ”massmarket” option seems to be the couple of years old Dell 32” 8K display which sells for like $4k.

Seems to be all the 5k displays have been discontinued.

blablabla123• 7 years ago

Maybe it's also more to be seen as a reference, the LG models were also quite top notch. Probably better than making/advertising low end reference models.

For example it's great that they advertise USB-C so much. This will finally end the mass of mutually incompatible docking station solutions and create less electronics trash. By the way, there is are Dell display stands with USB-C charging, integrated Ethernet, USB-A ports etc and VESA mount. So the stand I got (DS1000) was 200 $ and the screen I got for 75 $...

sudhirj2• 7 years ago

Yes, the people who sit in $1,000 Aeron chairs with $10,000 workstations hooked up to $42,000 monitors and $5,000 speakers (each) in $100,000 - $1,000,000 studios working on movies and songs that make $100,000,000 to $1,000,000,000 each are going to be so pissed off about this atrocious pricing.

chosenbreed37• 7 years ago

I see what you did there ;-)

maaaats• 7 years ago

A lot of professionals not in those categories will probably also be interested in it. I think it's disingenuous to pretend it doesn't matter as only people buying $50k monitors are interested.

I could see a lot of designers buying this screen at this price point, that normally have $1-2k screens. Then that $1k stand is atrocious.

badestrand• 7 years ago

But how many people are those? 1,000 worldwide? 10,000? I am sure it is a tiny fraction of the entire audience of maybe a fifty million people who hear about it. So they should do it in a separate event or direct market it to those studios, but the news didn't fit the audience.

spectramax3• 7 years ago

Because WWDC is a conduit for Apple to flex while the whole world is watching. WWDC is a major event, yes for developers but also for Apple in general to release new products and services.

muzani• 7 years ago

Maybe this exact situation is rare, but the point still stands. For some people the value of a top of the line monitor exceeds its price. Apple is expensive compared to the competition, but still relatively cheap for the monopoly they hold and the value it provides.

manderley3• 7 years ago

The people making things aren't necessarily the ones to profit from their commercial success. VFX studios seem to be squeezed very hard by big studios.

sudhirj2• 7 years ago

They just won't buy the stand. I'd assume most offices already have VESA stands like [1] built into the furniture, which is why Apple isn't even bundling a stand with the monitor. It would just be wasted.

[1] https://www.hermanmiller.com/products/accessories/technology...

iliaznk• 7 years ago

Let's wait and see their sales reports and then we'll see who's wrong.

clay_the_ripper• 7 years ago

If it seems expensive, it’s not for you.

Although I am disappointed that Apple hasn’t made a display for “the rest of us”. I’d love an Apple monitor instead of the LG ones but without all the stuff only high end video pros need. Maybe they’ll do one after everyone buys the 6k version already.

z3t4• 7 years ago

It's funny how monitor stands can cost more then the monitor itself, but it's relatively cheap if it can prevent back/neck pain.

csomar• 7 years ago

I don't think I'm going to buy one but here is a thing: Is it made of Aluminum or other expansive metal?

I bought a desk with Aluminum legs. The legs were empty from the inside. The desk was already expensive comparing to the standard model (It was custom made, I asked for the Alu legs). I asked the manufacturing guy why the legs were not full and he laughed. He said the price will be astronomical if they were full and that the metal is very expensive.

I forgot the price but it was definitively over $1,000. The non-Alu version was less than half.

So depending on the metal and heaviness of the stand, Apple might not be overcharging on this one.

michaelmrose• 7 years ago

Aluminum is 1.5 usd per lb.

D_Alex• 7 years ago

Is it made of Aluminum or other expansive metal?

There are few metals as cheap as aluminium, actually I cannot think of any except iron.

Bulk aluminium costs less than $1/pound.

Of course if the legs were not hollow, they might be rather heavy (even though aluminium is quite a light metal)

threeseed5• 7 years ago

The specs say that the stand weights 9.5 pounds (4.3 kg).

jpgvm• 7 years ago

Aluminium is actually rather cheap. Precision CNC machining on the other hand.. not so much. Especially when the design is intricate and tolerances are tight, that means a lot of machine time == a very high price point.

finchisko• 7 years ago

I wonder how many people complaining about the price of the stand, is even considering buying the monitor. My point is, why to complain about something I'm not going to buy anyway.

Stay_frostJebel• 7 years ago

The truth is... anyone who's complaining about the cost of the optional stand, can't afford to buy the monitor anyway.

I somehow don't think this monitor was designed for viewing and editing iMovie videos. Completely different market.

yoz-y• 7 years ago

There are tripods that cost way more than this, professional equipment has a markup, justified or not.

It's funny how so many people are complaining about something they were never going to buy anyways.

At some level it is Apple's fault, they were marketing the "Pro" line to general public for so long that somehow they have set an expectation which makes no sense.

A $999 monitor stand is everything wrong with Apple today

Related Stories