Get Your Shit Together

by Red_Tarsius • 11 years ago

635 144 11 years ago

wehadfun• 11 years ago

Thanks for the reminder.

a2tech• 11 years ago

This site is great! My wife and I were just discussing how we needed to get a living will/will written down so our wishes are clearly understood in the case of an emergency.

thehoff2• 11 years ago

I ran across this site the other day as well as my wife and I were discussing that with a kid now we should get wills.

codeulike• 11 years ago

Great idea! One thing though - this is presumably USA specific but nowhere does it actually spell that out, which could be confusing/timewasting for any brits or aussies who want to get their shit together. E.g a UK will has completely different wording to a USA will.

tempodox2• 11 years ago

this is presumably USA specific but nowhere does it actually spell that out

We humans have a hard time remembering that anything we communicate has _a lot_ of implicit context. On the Internet, this becomes especially conspicuous because our communications quickly escape the realm where that implicit context is known & valid. Up to now, the way to deal with that seems to be EULAs written in Legalese.

rcarrigan87• 11 years ago

It's a morbid subject, but working in home health care I'm shocked by how many people are totally unprepared when it comes to end of life planning.

And it's not just relatively young people or unexpected deaths. Many senior citizens with decent sized estates are totally unprepared or just assume their family will figure it out.

You pass on a lot of additional stress and hardship to your loved ones by not being prepared.

I love the site title btw.

cortesoft2• 11 years ago

There was a great Planet Money episode on this topic: http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/03/05/286126451/livin...

brc2• 11 years ago

True. I had a relative pass a few years back from cancer. It wasn't sudden at all.

The relative worked in the financial services industry and had provided me advice about estate planning.

When it came to the estate things were not prepared at all. If fact it was a bit of a mess.

I guess it's the case of builders living in unfinished houses and that.

lfender6445• 11 years ago

Can you imagine being in a vegetative state and not having legal means to end your life or have someone pull the plug?

I need to get my shit together.

jh37• 11 years ago

I actually JUST completed my will on doyourownwill for free. Pdf and word doc. http://www.doyourownwill.com

iamthepieman4• 11 years ago

I didn't see this covered under the will section but do talk to important people in your life while you are making your will. Nothing in your will should be a surprise to those that are involved in your estate after you die.

If you are leaving a large asset (money, house, investments, a 500 foot yacht in the Bahamas you never told anyone about) then the person getting it should know before hand.

If you have kids you need to discuss what happens to them, who takes care of them etc. This is a careful balance of the burden you put on family and friends and the well being of you children with the balance favoring your kids.

The most important thing is that you have these discussions and then document them in a will. Do not just fill out an online form, have it notarized and filed in a safe deposit box to be unearthed when you meet your end, timely or otherwise.

The process of creating a will like this can be a catalyst to re-prioritize your life and what is important to you and your family.

But of course, it doesn't have to be. As this site mentions, get your shit together! It's better to have a boilerplate will squirreled away somewhere that no one but your lawyer knows about than none at all.

cafard• 11 years ago

When we made a will, the person who had advised us to do so said, "And don't put it in a safe-deposit box. It will greatly delay the availability if you die suddenly.

kansface• 11 years ago

Put one in the bank, too.

ersii• 11 years ago

  If you are leaving a large asset (money, house, investments, a 500 foot yacht in the Bahamas you never told anyone about) then the person getting it should know before hand.

Could you elaborate on why you should tell someone before hand that you're going to leave assets in their name? Is it just common courtesy/manners in your opinion? Or something else? I'm genuinely courageous.

smileysteve• 11 years ago

Some things create hassles, especially illiquid assets like a house or yacht if that person has no desire for them and no knowledge about selling them.

Also, family conflicts. If your brother's uncle's nephew gets the house instead of the son who expects it, but there's good reason (he was renting it already), family conflicts arise for not great reasons.

iamthepieman4• 11 years ago

as smileysteve said anything except for cash has it's own burdens and commitment associated with it.

If I left my house to my brother who travels all over the place and has a carefree life it might be more of a burden trying to maintain it, rent it out or sell it than its worth. It might not, but that's why I would talk to him before putting it in a will.

Also, having these kinds of conversations is good for everyone involved because it makes them think about the little details beforehand and not while they are in the middle of funeral plans and grieving.

It's called estate planning, not estate liquidation or estate lottery. You wouldn't make major plans regarding your family without talking to your spouse or business plans without talking to your partners.

Just because you won't be around doesn't mean you should treat it any differently. Anyone involved in your estate should be involved prior to your will going into effect whether they be executors, caregivers or recipients.

VLM3• 11 years ago

They might be confusing executor issues with beneficiary issues. The cost of maintaining an extra house, until it sells, can be kinda high in some areas, for example. And there are ways of handling this in the legal system, most of which involve the beneficiaries getting much less money (starting with asking a judge to assign an expensive lawyer as executor instead of whomever). And unfortunately some folks can't really keep their stuff together by themselves when you're alive under normal conditions, so dumping executorship on them is just going to totally mess them up, they can't run one household now temporarily they have two.

Someone who's totally clueless about 500 foot yachts is just going to get screwed over either as executor or inheritor... hope at least one of them is semi-clueful about yachts, hopefully ahead of time. There are bottom feeders who look thru the legal notices in the paper and will descend on the grieving victims with absolutely ridiculous offers to take the hassle away... for pennies on the dollar, if that. Oh that classic Ferrari in perfect condition, well, I can't really offer more than scrap steel price for that, and next thing you know some poor widow gets screwed out of $100K.

andrewbinstock• 11 years ago

We were strongly advised not to do this. It puts you in a difficult bind if you change your mind later on. Plus there is little value in most beneficiaries knowing beforehand.

Dewie3• 11 years ago

This is a careful balance of the burden you put on family and friends and the well being of you children with the balance favoring your kids.

If the balance "favours your kids", presumably meaning that the new caretakers feel overwhelmed by that responsibility, I guess they could refuse that responsibility. I guess having that wish be in your will might pressure them sufficiently to actually go through with that responsibility, but that kind of pressuring somehow doesn't feel right either.

ascotan• 11 years ago

Great site. This has given me the inspiration to finally get this done.

nsimpson• 11 years ago

One of the better pieces of financial advice I ever got from a mentor was: if you have a business or are self employed, get disability insurance.

I ended up enrolling in California's Disability Insurance Elective Coverage (DIEC) - http://www.edd.ca.gov/disability/self-employed.htm. I wonder if anyone else has gone this route?

courtewing• 11 years ago

This is great advice all around, but get a local lawyer involved to prepare your will. Even in US, there is not a single set of laws that apply to wills and power of attorney. It varies state by state. With a generic template pulled from the internet, you could just be doing a whole lot of work and ultimately be ending up with a document that has little legal basis.

Do your loved ones a favor - hire a lawyer to do it. It's not free, but they'll do the actual paperwork, and you'll get the comfort of knowing it's done right.

pzxc• 11 years ago

There are a few grammatical errors in these documents as well that do not inspire confidence.

Also, you better be damn sure that you can trust the person you give power of attorney to -- the document provided here assigns power of attorney immediately, not on incapacitation/death, and allows the person you designate to gift themselves up to $13,000 a year of your own property without your consent.

Considering the laws of the 50 states are sometimes very different, and these documents cover a wide range of legal topics, I think you'd have to be an idiot to use these documents without running them by a lawyer in your state, because they might not have the consequences you think they have.

Frankly I don't see why the HN crowd would upvote a site like this -- I'd bet it was ring votes that got it to the front page. Or maybe it was just the snarky domain, who knows.

www.uslegalforms.com has been around for a long time now, and they at least have state-specific documents. Use them if you're going to use anything without consulting a lawyer. But really, pay a lawyer, it's worth it.

I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice.

jrs235• 11 years ago

Good advice.

I think this got upvoted because it offers a monthly email nudge/reminder and hopefully the site/service will stay on top of future issues related to staying on top of keeping your stuff together.

But yeah, talk to a lawyer to ensure state specific issues are properly covered/handled.

jobu• 11 years ago

Frankly I don't see why the HN crowd would upvote a site like this -- I'd bet it was ring votes that got it to the front page. Or maybe it was just the snarky domain, who knows.

My guess is it struck a chord with people similar to myself - young family and minimal EOL planning. (although the snarky domain definitely helps)

For us, the biggest problem has been deciding who should take care of the kids if something happens to both myself and my spouse. The only members of our family that aren't shitty people or very flaky are elderly or have medical issues preventing them from caring for children. (And all of our close friends have kids and full lives of their own.) I would love to hear if anyone has suggestions for determining the least shitty choice in a situation like that.

thehoff2• 11 years ago

It's at least a checklist and covers stuff you should be thinking about but may not have thought of (even if not financial such as the Thoughts section).

For instance, my wife and I need more videos of us and not just the kid. If something happened to me tomorrow I would love it if my wife could show him videos of me when he gets older.

I agree that maybe the site needs a disclaimer that getting a lawyer is better but for some isn't a generic form better than nothing? Not a lawyer either so not entirely sure about that.

aasarava• 11 years ago

RE ring votes: There are a suspicious number of one-sentence / add-no-value comments on this all posted about an hour ago.

Red_Tarsius2• 11 years ago

Frankly I don't see why the HN crowd would upvote a site like this -- I'd bet it was ring votes that got it to the front page. Or maybe it was just the snarky domain, who knows.

Or maybe it's because the site is a useful checklist of what we should do to prevent death from completely destroying our family.

I'm the original poster and I'm not affiliated with the author in any way. The core message is not "we offer 100% legalese-proof papers", the pdfs are described as templates. The core message is:

  Get your shit together now and breathe a huge sigh of relief.

dissentertainer• 11 years ago

Frankly I don't see why the HN crowd would upvote a site like this.

If you view this as an MVP of an open source repository for EOL information then it makes total sense that it got upvoted here. If we can keep our code dry, why can't we keep our lives dry?

the_watcher2• 11 years ago

HN voting rings are fairly tough to actually get working. I doubt this site used one. Also, a small number of upvotes from varying accounts (in terms of age, location, reputation, etc) can cause a post to hit the front page.

vermontdevil• 11 years ago

Exactly! My dad remarried and moved to Georgia. He didn't change the will at all thinking all are set.

When he passed away, I found out that the will is invalidated because that's how it works in Georgia's legal system. Luckily my dad's wife is a nice woman and worked with me to ensure the estate went through probate properly.

But always double check when your life's circumstances change (new residence, etc)

Spooky23• 11 years ago

Great advice.

Even with a will, in some places the probate process is very expensive and onerous. In many cases, it's a lot easier to use a simple trust mechanism vs. a will. 3 hours of attorney time now can avoid 50 hours + lots of calendar time later.

martin19752• 11 years ago

Did it through RocketLawyer myself, and they have attorneys to review it as well as to guarantee it's legal in the state you live in. I also did my living will through them, all legitimate.

VLM3• 11 years ago

"It varies state by state. With a generic template pulled from the internet, you could just be doing a whole lot of work"

You won't be doing a "whole lot of work", but anyway, what works really well is giving a lawyer professional paperwork from another state (or whatever) and telling him to fix it for your state's laws.

They handle this kind of "translation" all the time because of people who moved in from another state, they might be a bit confused if you moved in from the state of "the internet" but it'll be less confusing than walking in with a completely blank slate. At least they'll have to ask a lot fewer questions and explain a lot fewer things. Spending money to telling a lawyer "i donno" can be very expensive compared to how cheap it is to tell him something like "I want the inheritance to work something similar to Wisconsin law"

Think by analogy of doing desktop support for a guy who can't articulate anything clearer than "the internet is broken on the hard drive", its gonna cost him a lot. But if the guy walked in with professional documentation of his specific problem, its gonna be a lot cheaper.

marincounty• 11 years ago

If you have a big estate see a lawyer.

If you don't, or cash strapped now, you can get by with Nolo press. If you can understand ROR, and programming, after reading their two books on wills and trusts, I think you can set up a trust and will, and skip the lawyer.

On the will get two signatures from people not in the will, and it does not need to be notarized in California. If you want to exclude a child out of a estate you must explicitly state that in the will.(Some kids got a lot of cash early on. Explain to them you love them. Make sure they are doing well, if you exclude them.) I recently did a will for a friend. Her daughter took all the family money when her father died--leaving her mother with nothing. The ironic part is her daughter is a multimillionaire in LA, with a successful business. She took advantatage of a bad situation, and a angry dying man. So yes, I didn't feel it was immoral to exclude her from the will of that friend.

realdlee• 11 years ago

There are plenty of bad lawyers out there, so if you're going to hire one, please do the legwork (get referrals, speak to multiple candidates) to find a good, trusted one.

matrix• 11 years ago

If anyone needs convincing to use this site, read the About Us page. It's a big credit to Chanel Reynolds that she was able to drawn on a tragic experience to help others.

jawns• 11 years ago

I'm the sole income earner for our household (my wife is at home with our wee ones). I've found that it's a lot easier to plan for my own disability/death than for hers.

For instance, I get relatively straightforward short-term and long-term disability insurance through my company. Should I become disabled, I get a percentage of my salary. But because my wife does not work, we've struggled to find a straightforward way to get (reasonably priced) disability insurance for her.

I'm assuming that many of you who are either self-employed or are in a household in which one person is not currently working have faced similar challenges. Anybody have any recommendations about how to overcome them?

chadaustin• 11 years ago

There is a spreadsheet included with this book [1] that helps you figure out how much life insurance to get your non-working spouse. We signed up for private term life - it was substantially less expensive than my employer's optional term life plan. Plus it's decoupled from whatever job you happen to hold at the time!

[1] http://www.amazon.com/The-Ultimate-Financial-Plan-Balancing/...

iamthepieman4• 11 years ago

Get the minimum insurance you will need to take care of your kids and pay any debts that would be hard or impossible to pay if your wife were to become disabled.

Anytime you buy insurance you have to be ready to do some math. If you make enough to cover a caregiver (often covered or partially covered under health insurance) for your wife and have a strategy for taking care of your kids then you may not even need it.

I'm fortunate enough to live close to both my parents and my wife's parents. Because of this and because we have decent savings we decided against disability and life insurance for her. We are in the process of getting better life insurance for myself but are keeping it as low as possible to cover our debts and living expenses until the children are old enough to go to work in the coal mines.

__z8• 11 years ago

Create an account on ssa.gov to estimate your Social Security Disability benefits and Social Security Survivors benefits. Mine are plenty enough for me to live comfortably on but I have a very, very modest lifestyle without any debt.

If fact you should create an account on ssa.gov and irs.gov no matter what so nobody else does it for you if your identity is stolen.

jscheel• 11 years ago

Heading to Egypt with my wife for two weeks while our 2 year old daughter stays at home. Definitely something we've been trying to get together, and I really appreciate someone doing the leg work.

denzquix• 11 years ago

Memento mori, motherfucker.

tempodox2• 11 years ago

I love this idea. It's highly practical, of good use and deals with life as it is.

teddypop• 11 years ago

I think there are several out there, the best one I've found for simple will and living wills (and free, no monthly charge bs) is http://www.doyourownwill.com It also has good general advice and a legal forms section..and was fast. pdf and doc. made it easy for us.

trimble-alum• 11 years ago

Prepaid funerals are way cheaper and far less burdensome on family and friends.

golemotron• 11 years ago

What they don't mention:

* Document -all- of your bank accounts, assets and debts.

* Don't die without a will. If you do and you appoint an executor, you are giving them a very dirty job.

* Think twice about offshore accounts. They are a nightmare for executors.

mct2• 11 years ago

Don't die without a will. If you do and you appoint an executor, you are giving them a very dirty job

This is one of the reasons I've been putting off completing a will :-( Is there a good option for going about this without naming an executor?

zo1• 11 years ago

Certain countries require you by law to appoint an executor to your estate. If you don't, the state steps in and does it for you. Hardly the sort of thing you'd want, especially if you want it done properly.

You can appoint lawyers to be executors to your estate, mind you. They take a fee from the total bucket, and make sure everything is done according to your will.

Also, as far as I'm aware, appointing them the executor of your estate doesn't mean you give them the money. You entrust them with resolving all the issues with your estate, it's a bit different.

__z8• 11 years ago

I doubt these documents would be worth anything without getting notarized. Among other problems. Getting something notarized runs from free-around $2 so it's hilarious they expect you to track down two impartial witnesses but don't even mention a notary public.

If you are familiar with the current pending Supreme Court case DeBoer v. Snyder (which for the Supreme Court was combined with 3 other cases) you'd know in many cases you can't just appoint any guardian for your children upon your death. Basically the facts are: a lesbian couple has 4 children - 2 adopted by one woman and 2 adopted by the other. All children have been raised together as brothers and sisters by both women. No children we ever being raised by only one parent. They found out that they couldn't guarantee that the other parent would keep all 4 children in the event of the death of one parent. Under Michigan law, in their case, the courts would be free to appoint guardianship of the deceased's two children to whomever they choose no matter the paperwork the couple drafted beforehand.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/25/us/one-couples-unanticipat...

Their close call with the truck that day in 2011 led them to a lawyer, Dana Nessel, who advised them that she could draw up guardianship papers, but that they would be nearly worthless legally. She urged them instead to file a federal lawsuit challenging the adoption law in Michigan.

tomjen32• 11 years ago

Unless you are in the complete bonies you can track down to impartial witness very quickly - your neighbors, or if you know them well their neighbors, etc.

wglb• 11 years ago

Bonies? Not sure where that is. Perhaps you meant boonies?

tptacek• 11 years ago

The authors doubt that too, which is why "getting documents notarized" is in the checklist.

__z8• 11 years ago

Must have missed it. I just opened the documents and read through them quickly and didn't see anything about a notary public.

bbanyc• 11 years ago

The law of wills can be peculiar. Under New York law a will MUST be signed by two witnesses to be valid (EPTL §3-2.1). A notarization won't cut it - a notary can be a witness just like anyone else but you still need a second witness.

On the other hand a trust can be either notarized or witnessed (EPTL §7-1.17) and a power of attorney must be notarized (General Obligations Law §5-1501B, which also requires a typeface "no less than twelve point in size").

mct2• 11 years ago

Regarding a living will, one I've seen that I really like is Five Wishes (https://www.agingwithdignity.org/five-wishes.php). I have one filled out that I've been procrastinating giving to friends and doctors, which is a mandatory step for having it be an effective document. Thank you to GYST for reminding me I need to take care of this.

pjungwir• 11 years ago

I'm using this book by Nolo and it's great! Covers the basics plus a lot more and comes with a computer program to generate the documents for you:

http://www.amazon.com/Quicken-WillMaker-Plus-2015-Software/d...

Nolo is a well-known established company, like LegalZoom for books, and I've also used their stuff for business setup and contracts.

supercanuck• 11 years ago

Maybe not the place, but where do people buy their cheap term life insurance?

martin19752• 11 years ago

AAA...west coast life.. your work place... etc. Cheap is also very relative - depending on the face amount, you may have to submit to a health examination...

mootothemax• 11 years ago

My father died in extremely unexpected circumstances, and as much as a will would've been handy (understatement of the year), there are other bits that save heartache and frustrated compromise.

For example:

- do you want to be buried or cremated? And where? Any thoughts on coffin design?

- do you want a church service or something else? What songs, how big, as many details as possible.

It's morbid stuff, but by writing it down informally somewhere, you lift the burden from your loved ones having to make unknown "it's what he would have wanted" guesses.

vtbassmatt2• 11 years ago

Absolutely +1 to this. My dad also died extremely unexpectedly, and while nothing about the process was easy, having his last wishes known to us was a relief. He and my mom had each prepared a "farewell letter" to the family. My dad's was characteristically brief, poignant, and hilarious - which itself served to make the situation a tiny bit brighter as we could almost imagine him there with us one last time.

And in other news, I still owe him a trip into the Great Smoky Mountains to scatter his ashes.

pandler• 11 years ago

The one thing I know about my mother's death (won't happen until after she's reached 100 according to her) is that she has expressly forbidden us from having flowers at her funeral. Instead, she prefers we send her flowers while she's still alive so she can actually enjoy them.

She also wants her body to be burned in a viking longship out at sea. We'll see how that goes.

bradleyjg• 11 years ago

> you lift the burden from your loved ones having to make unknown "it's what he would have wanted" guesses.

To each his own, but consider that maybe that's not the right question. My paternal grandmother recently died, and my dad sat shiva for her (Jewish mourning ritual). It almost certainly would not have been what she wanted, she was a fierce atheist. But it was what my dad wanted, what comforted him, and he was the one around and mourning, not my grandmother.

Just something to consider.

Thimothy• 11 years ago

Curious. I never gave it a thought because I always assumed that the funeral is for the ones that keep on living, so it's on them to figure out which kind of mourning ritual would help them cope with the lose better.

To be fair, if I someone made me go through coffin designs for my own coffin, or any kind of arrangement, chances are it would end in a practical joke. I just don't give a damn.

stevewilhelm• 11 years ago

Another bit of advice, if you have prepared these basic documents, it is a good idea to review them periodically.

It is particularly important to review and revise these documents after life changing events: getting married, having children, or when parents or executor becomes elderly, incapacitated, or dies.

Symbiote• 11 years ago

And the step my parents forgot: when your eldest child turns 18, add them as an executor.

signaler• 11 years ago

Always loved this Twitter account. I use it now and then to remind my followers that my shit is not together https://twitter.com/ismyshittogethr

Also there is no silver bullet for the maze that is life other than all the usual methods that the old masters laid out, like meditation, compassion, empathy, and logos/love/balance

someear• 11 years ago

some other general advice from my experiences - make sure you handle the case where you go missing. I know I'm drilling down into a bunch of conditional situations (missing for how long? under what circumstances?), but the last thing you want is to do is leave loved ones in situation where they can't get anything done.

I had a friend who committed suicide, but his body was never found and since there was no note, he was never officially declared dead. Even though that was years ago, his family still doesn't have access to his assets.

kendallpark• 11 years ago

How does disability insurance work for students?

I am going to be entering medical school. You typically get disability after you graduate, but if something happened in those four years, I could be a hundred thousand in debt with no viable career option as an MD.

__z8• 11 years ago

You would have to purchase private disability insurance or private life insurance. Almost every major insurance company offers it.

suelin• 11 years ago

Equally important to having legal documents is having conversations with your loved ones about your end-of-life preferences--there is a lot of nuance here and the legalese will not always speak for you the way you'd want it to (and won't necessarily cover things like how you want to be remembered, which photo of yourself is your favorite, what you would want to happen to your FB/twitter/Instagram/HN account, etc.).

I've been working for years in end-of-life planning and as others have said, a lot of these legal documents are state-by-state so be sure to talk to an attorney and your healthcare providers to make sure you're covered.

Apologies for self promotion, but we are building a modern end-of-life planning platform at https://myexitstrategy.co/ and our first offering will be an easy way to designate health care proxies -- everyone over age 18 should have one!

bigredtech• 11 years ago

There is a great startup based in New York doing this sort of thing called: Everplans. https://www.everplans.com/

They make it easy for you to get organized, find resources for handling the tougher scenarios of life and death.

*Not affiliated, just have met their team - all around good people.

dkhenry• 11 years ago

I can not agree with this advice. There are still a few area's where its worth it to have a trained professional, and their fee's are well worth it. I have a wife and three kids, I will not trust their future to some random page on the internet. I went to a reputable estate lawyer and I didn't just get some documents I started a relationship. That is what I am counting on. Every year I now have a professional that I go to not only review and update my documents, but to get advice for how laws change and what their inpact is to me.

Be responsible, don't cut corners.

hind3nburg• 11 years ago

If this sort of thing is interesting to you and you are a Christian and and a fan of Dave Ramsey like myself then you should check out his Legacy Journey class: https://www.daveramsey.com/legacy

We had already gotten our will done before we took it but I still found it to be packed with good information and it motivated us to get more organized.

stevejunior• 11 years ago

wat the fuk

breischl3• 11 years ago

I've lately been pondering how to handle the passwords piece of this. I use 1Password, which is convenient because I have a handy-dandy database of passwords, but makes it unrealistic that I'll write them all down on paper. So the problem becomes passing along that database and the master password for it. I also want to avoid giving that to anybody before I'm dead, for obvious reasons.

My best plan so far is to put the database on a hidden (but public) shared location, and use IfIDie.org to send the link to my inheritors. I would then physically meet with them and give them the password (but not the link). It's kind of awkward, and I don't love it, but seems like it could work even for my relatives of modest technical literacy.

I'd be really curious if anyone has a better approach for securely passing important data after you're dead.

jalons• 11 years ago

A safety deposit box with the password to the master database?

Sometimes low tech works.

breischl3• 11 years ago

I thought of that, but I don't like it for a few reasons:

1) It's cumbersome to update. I don't want to run to the bank, get the thumbdrive, update it, and take it back every time I change a password.

2) Everyone has to know that I have the box, know where it is, and know where to get the key.

3) The key could get lost or destroyed. For example, if someone slings an especially effective curse at me and I literally die in a (house) fire. You can keep the safe deposit key in a safe... but now you have to store the key for that safe, or the combination.

4) Even if they have the key, the bank still might not let my next-of-kin into the box. The bank keeps a list of who is allowed in and their signatures. You'll have to physically take every person who needs access down to the bank and add them. It's one more chore, particularly because my family lives in other states and rarely comes here to visit (we all go back to the parents' house instead). In theory a death certificate and some other documentation can overcome that, but it's going to be time consuming and annoying, during a time when they don't need one more damn thing. I'm also not sure how access is handled in case of incapacity but not death (ie, coma, sick in a foreign country, kidnapped, whatever).

VLM3• 11 years ago

Having been thru this stuff, financial/official orgs have policies for accepting a death certificate by fax or mail. If they know your social security number, there is no need to worry a death cert is the ultimate root password to any account. So don't worry about banks / brokerages /insurance etc. Once your SS # shows up on the SSDI list they don't argue much, and that only takes a day or two, or so it seemed.

Utility/subscription type services pretty much get a copy of the certificate and they go away, maybe with a final billing statement. Look out for scammers sending fake invoices to dead people listed in obituaries or legal notice section of the paper.

Where it gets messier is non-financial institution online accounts, but they wouldn't be financially important or time critical. I remember ebay was fairly civil about the whole thing, although I don't remember what they did.

dbarlett2• 11 years ago

I have a password file encrypted with key that has been split into five shares using Shamir's Secret Sharing Scheme [1]. I printed out the shares, instructions, and file URL and hand delivered them to five trusted individuals in different states. Any three of the five can reassemble the key.

[1] http://point-at-infinity.org/ssss/

beat3• 11 years ago

I use Keeper to manage my passwords. I use randomly generated hard passwords for all but a few things, so I need it. What isn't random is the password to my laptop, to my phone, and to Keeper. My wife and daughter both know those passwords, just in case.

knicholes• 11 years ago

This makes me want a service that allows me to send letters to people upon my death/capture (or text messages or whatever) so if I don't unmark a flag after x days/months/years it sends out that information. Sort of like, "If you're watching this, I must be dead," or, "PS I Love You," kind of thing.

dbarlett2• 11 years ago

https://www.deadmansswitch.net/

SomewhatLikely• 11 years ago

Google has an inactive account manager that basically does this: https://www.google.com/settings/u/0/account/inactive

breischl3• 11 years ago

http://ifidie.org/

shockzzz• 11 years ago

I'm basically lost in life without a constant reminder of my impending doom.

hoprocker• 11 years ago

Vita brevis, amigo.

woodrowlevin• 11 years ago

   This a good site, and can help to guide you.  Probably even give you templates to store your info in, but what about sharing?
  Check out my company www.estateassist.com (Estate Assist) which is much more focused on being a Digital Safe Deposit box to protect and share financial and digital assets with trusted recipients.

thomasjudge• 11 years ago

Living wills and advance directives are a good starting point but they may not be enough. If one is potentially near end-of-life and is serious about DNR-type wishes, it behooves one to get something like a DNR bracelet and/or a POLST document posted on your fridge, so there are no misunderstandings with first responders. There have been a couple NYT articles about this recently. As others have echoed, get the information specific to your state.

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/04/29/the-right-pa...

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/17/health/the-trouble-with-ad...

taurath• 11 years ago

I'm not sure whether I'd consider it morbid and sad or helpful to constantly wear a bracelet reminding myself that I'm going to die and might at any point in time become hopelessly disabled.

Disruptive_Dave• 11 years ago

The buddhist in me (he's in there somewhere) tells me it could be quite liberating.

tgeek• 11 years ago

I've always wondered why this type of information hasn't been attached to a driver's license much like organ donorship is in many states. Seems like a prime system to keep such a thing organized and available.

galfarragem• 11 years ago

I like the content (idea) but I wonder if it was just me that didn't like the chosen words, there isn't any mention to the grieving process, making everything sound too cold and materialistic:

In 2009 my husband was killed in an accident. In the following hours, weeks, and months I was shocked by the number of things we had left disorganized or ignored.

lkrubner• 11 years ago

This is a subject where it is often difficult to break through to people. Everyone fears death, and most of us live with a kind of denial about the fact that we will die.

There are different tactics that can be used to try to get past the denial. Stating things bluntly is a worthwhile tactic. Merely mentioning facts is another possible tactic, but you run into the problem that people would prefer to screen out any information about such a painful topic.

This a subject where shock tactics can be justified, if they manage to get people to think about the fact that, yes, they will die someday.

lh7777• 11 years ago

Making a will is critical for everyone. Not having a will is frankly not an option, you know this.

I keep hearing this, but I don't believe it. No kids, no assets of any significance, and my state's intestacy laws are fine by me for what there is. Of course, I'll revisit when my situation changes but I just can't see why making and maintaining a will needs to be a high priority for me.

__z8• 11 years ago

My grandma didn't need a will.

My mom was on her checking account (because my mom took care of a lot of her finances) so my mom automatically got all of her money in the world - $900. The only other thing she owned was her house. Her will said it was to be sold and the money split between her children. Exactly zero of her children were interested in the house, selling the house, living in the house, or anything to do with the house. So the house was abandoned along with all the stuff in her house. My grandma knew that would happen (the house was literally falling apart - if code enforcement saw it then it would be condemned) but she made a will because she was "supposed" to.

bhartzer• 11 years ago

Definitely good advice. Need to get my will done, this has inspired me.

gavanwoolery• 11 years ago

My recommendation to anyone who does not want to leave their loved ones empty-handed is to get life insurance. Depends where you shop, but for about $10/month you can get $100k in life insurance - not a huge amount but probably enough to cover any debts you might have, cover the cost of your funeral, and more. For about $30/month (if you are ~30 years old and relatively healthy), you can get $500k in life insurance. The other good thing about setting this up is that your insurance agency will usually help you get your other items in order like your will, your trust, who will be your guardian(s) if you have children, etc. It might seem premature to get life insurance young, but I have had friends in their 20s and 30s who have died or had near-death experiences.

switch007• 11 years ago

It is a lot of work being an executor. Even more stressful if someone challenges the will. I was recently involved (as a beneficiary) in an estate where someone challenged the will, and I'm glad the solicitor was the executor and not me!

I know someone who is a beneficiary and an executor of an estate currently nearly £10,000 in debt countering a challenge of a will (as the beneficiary, not the executor, however).

aaron6952• 11 years ago

There is nothing more stupid than doing a will or getting life insurance. The other advice is worth thinking about.

There is no imaginary place in the sky where you can look down after your death and see people happy because you left them money or less stress.

Live life for the present and future. Not for the nothing.

Sure, game theory might throw a spanner in the works for the now and future-

- Your partner having a will / life insurance might be important, so you have to get one for quid quo pro.

- You might be stuck being stupid and it'll help you relax. Humans are weird.

- Stupid people might judge you or smart people might sham you (Since wills probably benefit society)

But this crutch we can get, that in death my kids and wife will be happy, a false safety valve, can be more destructive to your life than the reasons above.

vivekian2• 11 years ago

Really?

Making sure that the financial needs of your loved ones are met if you do depart in a sudden manner, is the most selfless thing you can do. It has nothing to do about making you feel happy, it has everything to do with being pragmatic so that they have one less thing to worry about.

aaron6952• 11 years ago

Not dying and living life is both selfish and (one hopes) better for your loved ones.

But that's hard. It means you have to be healthy. Reduce stress. Spend quality time with people.

Filling out a will is an easy escape.

Doing the best for yourself and loved ones is hard. The second half of the article touches on this.

cwp• 11 years ago

WTF? I can't believe this is the top comment.

I don't believe in life after death, but I do believe that the world will continue to exist after I die. And in that world, chances are good that my wife and kid will still be alive, but I will not be earning money to support them. Planning for that scenario is not stupid at all. It has nothing to do with how I or anyone else will feel, unless you count "hungry" as a feeling.

the_watcher2• 11 years ago

> There is nothing more stupid than doing a will or getting life insurance.

This is extraordinarily variable based on where you are in your life. If you have a lot of assets or a family that depends on your income, a will and life insurance can make sense. If you are like me, a single, 26 year old who has a decent job, some assets, but that's it, it's a waste of time and money.

akshatpradhan• 11 years ago

This needs to be turned into a WebApp. A place where you can edit, update, retrieve, and share these vital records.

beat3• 11 years ago

A little over a week ago, I had a Branch Vein Retinal Occlusion - basically, a stroke in my retina. I cannot read with my right eye now, and that may or may not heal. This makes me think, a lot.

First, it could have been an inch back in my head, and I might not be here to talk about it at all. Or I could be hospitalized for an extended time, or a vegetable, or permanently unable to work.

Second, there's about a one in six chance it will happen again. If that happens, I could lose my other eye, and my ability to read - thus ending my career. I'd also lose driving and any number of other things I enjoy.

Is my shit together? No. I just assume my assets go to my wife, and she can share out what she feels should be shared out with our now-adult children, friends, and my (distant) family.

benmanns• 11 years ago

What happens to your wife if instead of killing you, the stroke leaves you disabled, unable to work, and needing full-time care?

beat3• 11 years ago

I have long-term disability, and Social Security would kick in. Other than that...

renox• 11 years ago

A will? My father died recently and he did not make a will and it would have been quite useless, but we're a very simple family: no divorce, and none of us are poor.. So YMMV.

theRhino• 11 years ago

this is very good - sensible stuff, details will vary but this is a very useful start - everybody should do something along these lines, obviously tailored towards there own personal circumstances

ujjwal_wadhawan• 11 years ago

With so many passwords, my will shall be a book. I use Lastpass and will prefer to give the master password :)

The thing that bothers me are the auto renew settings on my subscriptions. One (any probably only) way to stop them is to cancel the cards they are on. For e.g: Dropbox/ Amazon s3 will charge me for my hosted data for eternity.

Get Your Shit Together

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