Show HN: MTailor – Get measured by your iPhone's camera for a custom shirt

http://www.mtailor.com/

by mpenn • 12 years ago

70 81 12 years ago

mpenn28• 12 years ago

Miles Penn here, cofounder of MTailor. Feel free to post any questions -- happy to answer them!

How does the "measure with your iPhone" thing work? That seems to be the most error-prone part of the entire process, yet you claim very high accuracy? That would seem to imply that you can somehow get accurate measurements out of the camera?

mpenn28• 12 years ago

My cofounder and I spent over a year developing the measurement technology -- it's a ton of math / machine learning. The process is also easy to do (you don't need to stand as still as a statue or anything).

We also really stand behind that 20% number. We brought 4 professional tailors in and 35 people, and we were 20% more accurate than the professional tailors. If anyone wants, I can go into more detail on the calculations of us vs. tailors.

avtar2• 12 years ago

This isn't iPhone related but perhaps others will find the project interesting:

http://openfitlab.com

https://www.flickr.com/photos/kylemcdonald/9150428195/in/poo...

masukomi• 12 years ago

The thing that i'd most like to see in the web site is pictures of the shirt styles on people rather than just fabric swatches.

mpenn28• 12 years ago

Yes, the website is definitely a work in progress. Most of our efforts have been focused on improving the app, but totally understand!

mhb• 12 years ago

Where can I even see fabric swatches without downloading the app?

elviejo2• 12 years ago

just some dumb ideas:

for people outside the US, you might sell the measuring app?

I'd love to print my patterns and take them to my own tailor...

besides if you could provide advice in what is the best shirt for my body shape, neck length and face... that would be appreciated too.

mpenn28• 12 years ago

We have definitely thought about licensing outside the US. However, we should be able to figure out the logistics of shipping shirts internationally in the next few months, so we should be shipping worldwide soon!

When you say advice, do you mean for off-the-rack shirts, or shirts you would buy from us?

tony_landis• 12 years ago

Just curious how long delivery takes. I made a test order 7-10 days ago and am holding off going to norstroms.

mpenn28• 12 years ago

It takes ~2 weeks to make your shirt and another 1/2 week for delivery.

Just checked on your order, and it should be finished by the 6th and hopefully get to you by the 8th (may be the following Monday though).

lthornberry2• 12 years ago

This looks very cool - enough that I finally created an account to ask you a question. Can you tell me a bit about the production process for the shirts? Are they made in the US? If overseas, what kind of assurances do you have about working conditions, etc in the factory? If you can vouch for decent working conditions, it would be a big selling point for me (and, I think, for many others).

cpayne• 12 years ago

(In Australia) there's conflict between VERY cheap clothing vs "work conditions".

How much more would you pay? 10% 20%?

mpenn28• 12 years ago

I feel honored about your account creation :-).

Our shirts are made by hand by professional manufacturers in China. We work with them closely to ensure that every shirt meets our high standards and is what a customer would love.

Since we make higher end custom shirts which require skilled labor (custom vs. off-the-rack), we focus on quality rather than squeezing out every penny on the manufacturing side. I hope that helps.

The reason we can offer high end custom shirts for $69 is that we cut out the expensive measurement process -- a tailor normally spends at least 30 minutes with you for measuring, while we do it with software. We also have fewer returns (since we're more accurate) and we have fewer mistakes (software vs. writing by hand). Additionally, we sell direct to consumer, so there's no retailer markup on top of us.

danieltillett2• 12 years ago

Great idea. What is the best way to get in contact with you?

rwitten• 12 years ago

Miles and I are on HN or you can shoot us an email at support@mtailor.com - one of us will get to it there.

cdcarter2• 12 years ago

Just placed an order after loving the measuring experience, here are some thoughts and questions.

* I would have felt better if it had said something like "we believe you're a 38" chest with a 15" neck circumference" so that I could eyeball whether or not what you've done really worked.

* Definitely would love to see the fabrics on people! Shows how good your product looks.

* I would LOVE an option for a third collar button as well as for a pocket button. If I'm getting a bespoke shirt, I want it the way I like to wear a shirt!

* To order again, I'll need a statement on your work conditions.

mpenn28• 12 years ago

Thanks for placing an order, and thank you for the feedback!

We don't actually process your measurements in real time, which is why we couldn't say what your measurements are when you finish.

For fabric selection, we're working on nice photographs of real shirts made (just takes time and money) -- it's actually the #1 complaint we get.

We can definitely do a pocket button. We may be able to do a 3rd collar button. If you would like those options, please email support@mtailor.com, and we'll see what we can make for you.

What kind of statement would you like? As I stated previously, since we make higher end custom shirts which require skilled labor (custom vs. off-the-rack), we focus on quality rather than squeezing out every penny on the manufacturing side. Don't know if that's what you are looking for though.

timrogers• 12 years ago

I'd love to use this - guess it's not available outside the US? I'm in London.

mpenn28• 12 years ago

Sorry, not yet! We've had problems with VAT / taxes, so we're US only (and we'll ship some shirts to Canada as well).

l_perrin2• 12 years ago

Then, I'll definately get some more before I head back to France!

scoot• 12 years ago

Can you be more specific on what problems you've had?

As a non-EU company, you are under no obligation to collect VAT & import duties on shipments to the EU. These will often be collected by shipping agent on behalf of the recipient's tax authority, otherwise it is up to the individual to declare their liability.

To claim this as a reason not to trade internationally is a disservice to your potential customers and to your shareholders, and frankly reads as "we have no idea what we're doing, so we're not going to do it, just in case".

If you're really not sure, pay for some basic tax and legal advice who will tell you there's nothing to worry about. Meanwhile, you're loosing potential revenue and future referrals. (Assuming reasonable standards of product quality...)

bornabox• 12 years ago

Give us an update, when you start shipping internationally. I'm definitelty interested enough to have bought a shirt to try - if available.

elviejo2• 12 years ago

this looks pretty cool

l_perrin2• 12 years ago

I've just received mine and I was surprised how perfect the fit was.

Of course, it should be expected considering the measurement process and everything, but when you receive a box from someone you have never met and the shirt inside happens to be made exactly for you, it still feels special :)

artfuldodger• 12 years ago

I'll admit, I was one of the most skeptical people trying it out. I thought that there's no way an app would be able to properly measure me by simply twirling once. I went through the process because it was super quick and I liked how I could customize my shirt the way I liked it. Words cannot express my astonishment when I received the package in the mail. The shirt fit so nicely and the quality was incredible. I wore it that same night, and then again the next day. Def worth trying out, especially if you dislike shopping like I do.

nick_riviera• 12 years ago

Strangely enough I get the same from £1.75 T-shirts off Amazon and they fit better and last 4 years longer than the expensive Gieves and Hawkes (tailored) shirts I had a few years ago...

I think this is all YMMV territory and subject to mystique like wine tasting, watches (jewellery class watches) and crazy expensive HiFi products.

mpenn28• 12 years ago

We have definitely found that more expensive doesn't mean a better fit. Because every person is shaped differently, what fits great for me will almost certainly not fit as well on someone else. And being more expensive doesn't solve that problem.

We use over 14 dimensions for each of our shirts, so that every person who orders from us has a great fit.

If you can find off-the-rack shirts you love at a lower cost, I think that's an awesome option. However, I can say personally I've never found anything off-the-rack I like as much as my custom stuff (both pre-MTailor and now while doing MTailor), because it fits better, especially in my shoulders, waist and the length of the shirt.

rahimnathwani5• 12 years ago

T-shirts are generally stretchy, so they don't need to be custom-made to your body size.

From personal experience: I can buy ready-to-wear shirts, but the armholes are slightly larger than necessary, and there's always excess fabric around the waste, which means it bunches up when tucked in. Some places have choices of regular/slim/extra-slim, but even extra-slim is a bit baggy for me.

When I wear a well-fitting shirt (either custom-made, or one where I've used my sewing machine to take in the sides), the shirt doesn't look better. _I_ look better.

ajiang• 12 years ago

As someone who loves getting tailored shirts, the MTailor process was unreal. A couple minutes in front of an app, and a few weeks later I got a shirt that fits really nicely. This is a startup I really want to succeed, because if they do, I never have to go shopping at a brick and mortar again - just order online and everything will be tailored to my fit.

cpks4• 12 years ago

Where are the shirts made? Are you planning to go into pants, suits, jackets, etc.?

As a business decision, the $69 price-point seems a bit high. That sets it at elite, rather than mass-market. The problem with elite is outside of SFO and NYC, you'll get a lot less viral word-of-mouth growth. In most of the world, elites do talk to each other, but they talk to non-elites a lot more, and when they do talk to elites, the topic is usually not clothing.

To give a concrete example: I am C-level. As such, I could afford it, but most people I know would not be able to. The only people I could mention it to would be VP-level or C-level, most of whom are colleagues rather than friends. This would limit word-of-mouth from someone like me to perhaps 2-3 people tops, rather than 20-30 (so in practice, 0 rather than 2-3, since it would come up in conversation for perhaps 10% of the people I know). At $69, I also won't buy it on a whim. At a price point competitive with Eddie Bauer, or even Men's Warehouse, I would, just to see how well it worked. If it worked well, I'd switch to it. If I did buy it, at $69, I also expect quality. I wouldn't buy a second one until I see how long the first one lasts. That means repeat business won't come until you probably run out of runway.

Custom-tailored pants, in India or Africa, cost $10 for the fabric and $3 for the labor (and are fantastic). Even with a generous mark-up, you ought to be able to have a slow but inexpensive process that competes with middle class mass-market goods (not Walmart and Target, but certainly EB and Men's Warehouse).

mpenn28• 12 years ago

The shirts are made to our stringent quality controls in China. We're definitely planning to expand into other types of clothing. And since we take all your measurements, you'll only have to get measured once!

We get what you're saying about virality. We wanted to make shirts of a quality that we were proud of and after getting many samples we decided that we could make very high-quality shirts for $69. We hope that we'll be able to bring the price down with time.

FYI - the salesman in me has to say that if you have any doubts, you can try us risk-free because of our very generous return policy. We're happy to accept a return or remake your shirt for any reason (not just fit).

readme2• 12 years ago

"you'll only have to get measured once!"

Unless you get fat.

jsmthrowaway3• 12 years ago

You consider a $69 shirt elite? I've paid about that for every non t-shirt that I own. Hell, even my t-shirts are about half that, but that might be a function of my size.

Shit, my ex-wife would pay $150-$200 for what I'd consider to be a basic blouse without even flinching.

mpenn28• 12 years ago

I would just say here people have very different expectations for what a nice dress shirt should cost.

There's everything from $13 ones at Walmart to $70 - $90 ones at J. Crew and Brooks Brothers (MTailor price point) to $300 Armani shirts (and above).

Having spent a lot of time in in-person custom shirt shops, our $69 shirts are comparable in quality to shirts you would buy there for $125 and above.

cypherpnks4• 12 years ago

Most people on HN are in the elite.

I'd suggest trying any of the wealth calculator apps, and figuring out which percentile you're in. And please post here once you've done that. Or, go here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Household_income_in_the_United_...

Median household income in the US is $51,000. That's household income, not individual income. That's what a family of four gets. Take away taxes, and you're at 37k. Assume $1000 mortgage, and you're at $25k. Car insurance, gas, etc. brings you down to perhaps $20k. Four cell phones? $19k. Internet, property tax, utilities, etc? $17k. Food? $14k. Health care? Putting kids through school? Retirement savings? Once you add in all the bare necessities, you won't find many people spending $70 on shirts, let alone $150-$200.

To run with your numbers. A $200 basic blouse, times 40 items of clothing purchased per year by your ex, is $8000. Family of 4 brings that up to $32000. Perhaps $24000, if you consider kids clothing costs less, or perhaps more, if you consider it wears out quickly, so you buy a lot of it.

Typically, the biggest expenditures are housing, health care, car, food, and similar. Clothing is waaay down on the list.

mbesto• 12 years ago

I know plenty of people who are not c-level who easily spend $69+ on shirts. In fact, I would argue that most people on wall street are expected to pay $50+ on shirts. $250+ would be c-level IMHO.

Data point - Brooks Brothers does $750MM in revenue[1]

[1] http://www.insideview.com/directory/brooks-brothers-inc

cypherpnks4• 12 years ago

That is a true statement, about Wall St. Less true about C-level, until you hit pretty big companies. A typical C-level or VP-level earns between $200k and $500k, typically towards the lower-end of that (obviously, Fortune 500 would be millions for CEO -- I'm basing this on companies of ~100 employees).

I don't know typical Wall St. income, but the friends I have there are around $300k. You can cite Google and Apple employees too as spending $50+ on clothing. That's all the elite.

Median household income is $51k in the US. That's 1/3-1/6 of a single salary at Google (and most have working spouses as well). It's perhaps 1/6 of Wall St. That translates into many times that difference in disposable income.

I appreciate the appeal of making products for people similar to yourself, but if you think that makes for a good business plan, compare you $750MM in revenue to TJ Max with $18B in revenue, Gap at $13B, Ross at $10B, etc. If you look at relative prices, that's probably about 100x as many items of clothing sold.

trevyn3• 12 years ago

I'm curious, are you making custom patterns based on the video data, or just extracting standard measurements and then doing traditional shirtmaking?

Also, please add a solid black fabric! :)

mpenn28• 12 years ago

We are making custom patterns! We use over 14 measurements for each shirt -- everything from chest to shoulder slope.

Solid black has been a big request -- we ran out but are working on getting more :-).

trevyn3• 12 years ago

Very cool!

filmgirlcw• 12 years ago

Please consider a female version!

mpenn28• 12 years ago

Definitely in the pipeline! We had to start somewhere, but we plan to expand into every article of clothing for men and women.

rahimnathwani5• 12 years ago

I'm curious - do you source your fabric within mainland China mainland, or import it? I live in Beijing, and have found the selection and quality of fabrics at tailors in Beijing quite lacking (compared to Hong Kong tailor shops, or compared to ready-to-wear shirts from Charles Tyrwhitt).

mpenn28• 12 years ago

Mostly from mainland, but we only put fabrics on the app that I've felt personally thought were good enough.

Since you cannot feel our fabric, if you don't like a shirt from us, we'll remake the shirt with a different fabric or refund you (no questions asked, no hassle).

com2kid• 12 years ago

There are a lot of similar "custom men's dress shirts" services around now days (though good job on the cool tech!), but none of them offer fashionable men's long sleeve shirts, in styles such as those mass marketed by Rag and Bone.

As someone with insanely long arms, who already gladly pays $200 per shirt for off the rack, I'd gladly pay for a service that offered custom tailored men's fashion shirts.

Any thoughts of moving towards that market?

Show HN: MTailor – Get measured by your iPhone's camera for a custom shirt

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