MacBook charger teardown: The surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter (2015)

https://www.righto.com/2015/11/macbook-charger-teardown-surprising.html

by ViktorRay • 2 years ago

76 96 2 years ago

righto.com

java-man• 2 years ago

This article is from 2015.

Still, it's always fun to read Ken's blog.

epistasis2• 2 years ago

Classic article.

I recently got a 30W Anker USB-C charger that is as small as the really old iPhone chargers, less than an inch cube, and it charges my M1 MacBook at full speed. It's far less than a third of the size of this 90W charger.

I'd love to see a teardown of that, too.

bhouston2• 2 years ago

The trick is GAN technology:

https://www.promate.net/blogs/blog/what-is-gan-technology

Half of my company has done the same and mostly Anker too. I got the charger/battery combo, as it is amazing for travel.

hinkley4• 2 years ago

The internal organization is also an interesting point. They keep the AC and DC sides air gapped so that no shenanigans can happen in a dying PSU.

j454• 2 years ago

GaN is great for carrying weight and volume.

jmholla2• 2 years ago

as it is amazing for travel.

Do the Anker one's come with international plugs? I didn't see any indication on their product pages that they come with the adapters. Nor could I find them for sell.

duxup• 2 years ago

I can't tell from the article the dimensions of that charger they are tearing down, but the article is from 2015.

dvirsky• 2 years ago

How is it charging as fast as a charger 3 times more powerful?

Aissen• 2 years ago

I think only the M2 air (and M1 pro, depending on size) can use fast > 30W charge; it varies by model.

jwells892• 2 years ago

Been pretty happy with my GaN Anker brick, which is 150W and smaller than not only the 87W Apple brick, but also the 140W Apple brick and can charge up to 4 things instead of just one. It packs into my laptop bag nicely and makes it unnecessary to bring any other bricks.

semi-extrinsic• 2 years ago

I always bring just a ~5 year old 65W Dell USB-C charger. It can charge my Pixel from 0 to 100 in 90 minutes, and can take my M1 Pro from 40% to 80% in 60 minutes. It is rugged, and significantly smaller than the Apple power brick that came with the M1 Pro.

Don't think I've travelled with more than one charger since phones switched away from micro-USB.

duskwuff• 2 years ago

can charge up to 4 things instead of just one

Mind that a lot of chargers do weird power allocation things when multiple devices are connected. You probably aren't going to get all 150W to the laptop with four devices connected; depending on the charger and what port you're connected to, you may get much less.

kemayo• 2 years ago

Worth noting that Anker's 150W charger[1] isn't quite as fast as the 140W Apple charger, because the Anker will only deliver up to 100W to any single port (even if it's the only one being used) whereas the Apple can pump the full 140W out.

Of course, outside of fairly niche situations, this isn't going to make a practical difference to your life. :D

[1] https://www.anker.com/products/a2340

reaperman3• 2 years ago

it charges my M1 MacBook at full speed

MacBook Pro models are able to fast charge at 140W (M1 onwards). Even the original M1 MacBook Air can charge at 45W[0]. I don't think it's accurate to say that the 30W Anker charger can charge your "M1 MacBook" at "full speed".

0: https://www.reddit.com/r/macbook/comments/kdpxmm/psa_m1_macb...

hinkley4• 2 years ago

There are a few video games I can play with my m2 laptop plugged into my 80W monitor and the battery still charges. But it will drain on the 60W monitor if I get the wires switched around.

lxgr10• 2 years ago

On the other hand, not every MacBook is a MacBook Pro.

epistasis2• 2 years ago

Well what do you know, the M1 Air shipped with a 30W charger, despite at least one point of the charge cycle being able to handle 45W.

traceroute66• 2 years ago

Erm, comparing a 30W charger to a 90W charger is a bit like asking why your local UPS driver doesn't do a day's work in a VW Golf.

Wattage aside, I'm sure there's more to it than meets the eye. Afterall, Apple are not stupid, smaller charger means less plastic casing and less packaging means simpler manufacturing ... no doubt the Apple ones are the size they are for a reason.

pletnes• 2 years ago

Also people just like smaller chargers.

Source: have a HP laptop with a brick-size power brick.

lxgr10• 2 years ago

no doubt the Apple ones are the size they are for a reason.

That reason might well be "because it's slightly cheaper to build a larger charger and most people wouldn't be willing to pay more for a device that comes with a compact one in the box".

CharlesW• 2 years ago

Apple is now using GaN for chargers as well. Here's a teardown of Apple's 70W charger: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYfoRkzqAII

TMWNN2• 2 years ago

Like reaperman said, I don't know about "full speed". But for a year I used a 27W charger with my M1 MacBook Pro. It wasn't fast, but did the job (especially overnight).

TMWNN2• 2 years ago

I recently got a 30W Anker USB-C charger

After getting the M1 I'm typing this on I asked if a MagSafe 1-MagSafe 3 adapter existed. <https://np.reddit.com/r/applehelp/comments/10duooq/i_want_a_...> I felt foolish when I realized that being able to charge from USB-C meant that I could use any old charger and a USB-C cable for the times when I'm away from the stock Apple charger that came with the computer. Bonus: No more dealing with the Apple cable to the MagSafe 1 plug that inevitably lost its sheathing and exposed wires within a year.

fmajid3• 2 years ago

ChargerLab does a lot of charger teardowns. Not sure which 30W Anker you were referring to, but here is one:

https://www.chargerlab.com/teardown-of-anker-30w-usb-c-gan-5...

bhouston2• 2 years ago

Has Apple adopted GAN technology in its chargers yet? I’ve moved over to a GAN that is much smaller/lighter than Apples huge blocks.

minimaxir• 2 years ago

Yes, starting with the M2 Airs last year: https://9to5mac.com/2023/06/15/look-inside-apple-new-70w-gan...

Not as small/cheap as other GAN chargers, though.

eatbitseveryday• 2 years ago

Title needs (2015)

jqpabc123• 2 years ago

1959

Transistor oscillation and rectifying converter power supply system U.S. patent 3,040,271 is filed by Joseph E. Murphy and Francis J. Starzec, from General Motors Company.

cwoolfe• 2 years ago

Am I slowly damaging my 2020 M1 MacBook by charging it with a cheap 5V 1A USB-A to USB-C charger at night? What's the actual risk here?

surfpel• 2 years ago

Do a search for “cheap charger bricked phone”

klodolph• 2 years ago

The actual risk is that a cheap charger fails in an unsafe way, and exposes users to unsafe voltages. You need, internally, the right creepage and clearance distances, and you need to use the correct parts in certain places with the correct failure modes (e.g. must fail open or must fail closed). Some cheap chargers are not built to the same safety standards. You won’t notice anything unless they fail in an unsafe way. Unlikely, but possible.

jxcl• 2 years ago

You won’t notice anything unless they fail in an unsafe way. Unlikely, but possible.

Which, in the worst case, will start a fire that will burn down your house. It's not worth the risk of using cheap chargers; buy from a reputable brand

robocat• 2 years ago

You won’t notice anything unless they fail in an unsafe way. Unlikely, but possible.

Cheap chargers skimp on safety. Entirely possible they fail unsafely.

I once bought a cheap no-name Android charger and it literally exploded after a year of use. Hot metal droplet landed on phone screen which was a cute reminder for a while (until later the screen cracked through where the droplet was).

That tingly feeling has been found by me on plenty of different device power supplies. That is high voltage getting passed to the low voltage side - a sign of bad design. The last two devices I remember were (1) a multi-USB charger which tingled but seemed to work okay and (2) cheap speakers for a PC where the voltage hum was causing serious problems with other devices connected to the PC (and hard to diagnose cause).

I'm amazed how many unsafe electrical devices we own: the safety standards are not working in my experience. And I think New Zealand has stronger standards than the US.

AzzyHN• 2 years ago

If anything, the opposite. Most fast charging devices (any that advertises a 0-50% charge rate) end up throttling charge as it gets closer to 100% because filling up all cells super quickly can actually damage the battery.

That's also why many laptops (such as Macbooks) come with an "intelligent" charging feature that will limit charging to 80%, only charging up that last 20% when it thinks you'll need it

lxgr10• 2 years ago

On the other hand, ultra-low-power charging might effectively cause alternating between charging and discharging (e.g. when the Macbook wakes up to do things via "power nap" in the background, which on Apple Silicon devices can't be prevented and which might use more than 5W).

amelius2• 2 years ago

Read until the end:

The ironic thing about the Apple Macbook charger is that despite its complexity and attention to detail, it's not a reliable charger.

harkinian7• 2 years ago

Not surprising that a complex charger is unreliable. And with iPhones using Lightning, it's even worse.

samatman• 2 years ago

Why would Lightning make any difference here? The charge side of the cable is, and has always been, USB, the charger doesn't know the difference.

ryanisnan• 2 years ago

Who are you saying that for?

The Macbook charger is an impressive piece of engineering, even if it's not as reliable as you'd hope. On the other hand, cheap no-name chargers cut corners and often have safety issues, making them risky, both to you and your computer.

Given the above quote from the conclusion section, after a lengthy Why you shouldn't get a cheap charger section, my takeaway is that the author still endorses the Macbook charger.

fckgw• 2 years ago

The author goes on to state that the problems are with their cables, which for many Apple users is well known. The plastic coating they used that was engineered to be be more supple and "bendable" than other cables was prone to deterioration and breaking down, causing fraying and exposed wires. Apple has since moved on to braided cables since then.

The actual bricks themselves have been pretty reliable.

amelius2• 2 years ago

FTA:

Macbook chargers also fail due to internal problems. The photos above and below show burn marks inside a failed Apple charger from my collection.

harkinian7• 2 years ago

I have several well-functioning 1st-party chargers with perfectly intact cables, and sometimes it won't charge. Or it will, but the light doesn't turn on for some reason. Fixes itself when I replug it. Been this way since '06.

ProfessorLayton• 2 years ago

Anyone know what's going on with the ground pin on apple chargers? Why add it if they don't include the 3-prong extension cord in any of their Macbooks (in the U.S. at least)?

harkinian7• 2 years ago

[deleted]

vanchor3• 2 years ago

It's not necessary to have the ground and there probably isn't enough cost savings to remove it. They've used the same design for years and just disconnecting the ground wouldn't make any sense because then the grounded cable would be pointless.

astrange5• 2 years ago

It's made that way so that if you travel you can replace the wall side with the local connector. Some of them are always grounded.

Though, that's not really more convenient than carrying a power adapter around, so they didn't have to do it that way.

RandallBrown• 2 years ago

Because you can get a cable that does have a ground and attach it to the charger by removing the "duck head".

harkinian7• 2 years ago

Huh, my MacBook bought directly from Apple did come with a 3-prong cord, but I've seen plenty that didn't. I specifically remember having one, replacing it with a random 2-prong cord to fit into cramped outlets in high school, and my cautious friend saying "that's jank."

Ungrounded connection sometimes causes tingling, a common enough problem that this Amazon 3-prong head even mentions it in the title: https://www.amazon.com/Grounded-Duckhead-Apple-Mac-Adapter/d...

Aloisius• 2 years ago

They use the same power adapter in other countries where ground is required.

They also do sell a US 3-prong extension cord.

astrange5• 2 years ago

So you can use it as a bottle opener. (Try it, it works.)

Player6225• 2 years ago

This reminds me of the article comparing the computing power of the Apollo 11 Guidance Computer vs USB-C Chargers

https://forrestheller.com/Apollo-11-Computer-vs-USB-C-charge...

j454• 2 years ago

Delivering cleaner electricity helps devices last much longer.

I often wonder why I buy a third party charger for an expensive phone

astrange5• 2 years ago

Not the case as far as I know, but RF interference can mess with touchscreens and other cables or WiFi, and of course it can catch fire and kill you.

theshrike792• 2 years ago

I used to be That Guy who bought cheap chargers because they were cheap.

Then I noticed that my Ginuwine Aapel Charger made in Caulifloweria made my phone's touch screen literally buzz when I touched it.

Never used a cheap charger since. Why break a 500€ plus device by saving 20€ on a charger?

j454• 2 years ago

I ran computers on a pdu and they lasted forever, the traditional transistors that blew on identical motherboards not using pdu/cleaned power is enough data for me

rhplus• 2 years ago

One unexpected component is a tiny circuit board with a microcontroller... roughly as powerful as the processor inside the original Macintosh

That's a great little factoid that I'm going to use at every opportunity.

fmajid3• 2 years ago

Every USB-C cable rated at more than 60W has to have “e-marker” chips on both ends that are also probably more powerful than an original Mac.

kuharich• 2 years ago

Past comments: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10628212

owenversteeg3• 2 years ago

Absolutely classic: A long article about the beautiful engineering and perfection behind the charger, and then -

"The ironic thing about the Apple Macbook charger is that despite its complexity and attention to detail, it's not a reliable charger."

That's the funny thing about engineering. I have built a lot of things and have used a lot of tools across the entire spectrum from shitty garbage cast out of pot metal (think Harbor Freight, Aliexpress etc) to five-figure Serious Tools for Serious People (cranes, large format cutters, thrusters, advanced measuring equipment etc.) From that experience I can say confidently: It is impossible to know for sure if something is reliable until you actually use it for an extended period of time.

I have seen countless absolute hack-job products made of pot metal last decades in a marine environment and I have seen a similarly endless number of beautifully engineered products made of top-tier materials fail catastrophically. Sometimes the shitty product will have two failures that miraculously cancel each other out, or it will rust to shit and keep working, or it will fall to pieces but can be easily epoxied back together to get another ten years out of it. That's the other side of the coin of perfection - repair. With the beautifully-engineered product made with quality materials? Nine times out of ten, fuhgeddaboudit. If you have a serious failure, you're fucked. There is no practical economic way to repair that Mac charger, or your fried fancy oscilloscope, or any advanced motor, or unibody, or virtually anything made of titanium, carbon fiber, et cetera. Give me the cheapest version of your object, however, and I can repair it using only crap from Walmart.

Don't get me wrong - give me infinite money and replacements and I will take your beautiful object every time, and in many cases today I have "infinite money" given the price of the product. An Apple Silicon Mac is cheap to replace and it is head-and-shoulders engineered above the rest; it is the pinnacle of all human engineering through history, in my opinion. If mine breaks I will just buy a new one. The problem is that as the world grows richer, this has gone from a luxury attitude to one more people can have each year, and the proportion of beautiful, perfectly engineered objects steadily rises. A hundred years ago no such objects existed. Thirty years ago, they were rare. Today, you can buy anything, from drills to cameras to new unibody cars that are beautiful and flawless and engineered to perfection and completely uneconomical to repair. There are exceptions, wear item parts, manufacturers with repair guides... but they are on the way out. Make no mistake, the moment anything can become a perfect sealed lifetime part, it will.

In the distant future, worlds ahead of endless energy and materials, long after the idea of popular repair dies, I only hope it will be reborn as a hobby; bored humans instructing bored robots to choose the inefficient path, to repair and not replace.

astrange5• 2 years ago

Do you actually repair power adapters? Sure I can see it for other things, but for high voltage home electronics it sounds dangerous. Like when you had to remember to discharge CRTs when opening an all in one computer case.

owenversteeg3• 2 years ago

Yeah, all the time. In fact, I'm repairing one right this minute. If anyone reading this is near the uws in nyc and has a ruef400 or similar pptc fuse handy I'll trade you for a beer! Email in profile :)

As far as dangerous home electronics repairs go, CRTs were pretty much the top of the list and they're all but gone now. Normal 110v work is rarely that dangerous even if you mess it up and most things aren't even 110v anymore - lots of consumer electronics just take a standard 5 or 12VDC or whatever. Besides, 90% of electronic repair is "find the burnt, hot or damaged component and replace it"; you're not exactly designing your own powerboard from scratch. Hell, there are hundreds of thousands of products on Amazon with hot 110V metal cases, which is pretty much the worst imaginable thing, and yet few people get injured by them - the reality is that whatever sin you possibly commit in your DIY repair has a tiny chance of causing any real world injury.

But more to my point, these days doing your own repairs are unusual, sixty years ago it was often included in the instruction manual. Even the cheap shitty stuff is less cheap and shitty than it once was; smaller, more efficient parts, SMD components, "sealed lifetime" bits, unrepairable materials etc.

RetroTechie2• 2 years ago

bored humans instructing bored robots to choose the inefficient path, to repair and not replace.

Repair is more efficient than replace! You're replacing something in either case. But in a repair, you replace less: only the part(s) that failed.

Reasons we don't (in many cases) are 3-fold:

1) Products are designed for 'easy'/efficient/cheap manufacturing, not to be easily repairable. "Repair-friendly" is often near the bottom on consumers' wishlist.

2) Manufacturers have become laser-focussed on that (successfully!), such that some devices literally cost pennies. Combined with

3) We value human time above machine/production time. So in most cases, the cost of [human time spent on repair] exceeds cost of [just buy replacement device].

Maybe "repair robots" will change that equation some day? Only if those are cheap & skillful enough.

owenversteeg3• 2 years ago

I tried to address this somewhat in my comment, but alas the world has been moving in the other direction and it's not just simple choice or value; it's that the new way is often far superior.

There is no practical economic way to repair that Mac charger, or your fried fancy oscilloscope, or any advanced motor, or unibody, or virtually anything made of titanium, carbon fiber, et cetera.

The issue lies in their superiority. The modern powerboard which filters and slices is far superior to its simple cousin. Titanium, carbon fiber, advanced composites permit the impossible. Elegant unibodies provide strength, cooling, simplicity. Sealed black boxes bring reliability, weight, strength. None of those things can be repaired economically. We are a rich world now, getting richer by the minute. The objects that surround us are sleek, powerful, reliable, perfect. I suspect nothing can stop this tide now. The march of time will forge ever more perfect objects and leave us useless in its wake.

MacBook charger teardown: The surprising complexity inside Apple's power adapter (2015)

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