Wolvic, a new browser project picking up where Firefox Reality leaves off

https://www.igalia.com/2022/02/03/Introducing-Wolvic.html

by Vinnl • 4 years ago

180 71 4 years ago

jraph4• 4 years ago

It seems based on Gecko?

Mozilla invested a lot into R&D in XR in the late 2010s, and in late 2018 they released an experimental browser called Firefox Reality. It was a great entry into the XR field, helping establish what a browser in these devices really looks like, and figure out the unique challenges. Today we’re excited to take up this experiment and continue this work as a complete project.
[links to https://blog.mozilla.org/mozilla/update-on-firefox-reality/]

A Gecko-based browser would be refreshing!

Igalia really seems to do interesting stuff.

orra• 4 years ago

Igalia really seems to do interesting stuff.

A lot of which is WebKit based, so this is indeed an interesting twist.

jraph4• 4 years ago

Yes, they even say it in the post, which is a bit confusing since I was specifically looking for this.

eole666• 4 years ago

Well, I hope they'll contribute to Gecko to make it faster at rendering 3D with WebGL, or even help adding WebGPU support. Because for now, perfs aint good compared to chromium based browsers... Firefox is often way slower when using heavy 3D apps.

skywal_l2• 4 years ago

I didn't know that. Why would firefox be slower than say chrome when if you use WebGL, the work is being done by the GPU anyway?

jdashg2• 4 years ago

Feel free to file bugs! I do like fixing WebGL perf issues!

Yoric• 4 years ago

Oh, is that the case?

Last time I checked (which was admittedly 2-3 years ago), Chrome had considerable lag with VR whereas Firefox managed much better. Might depend on the GPU, of course.

bkardell4• 4 years ago

We do right?! Thanks.

fabrice_d2• 4 years ago

Can you confirm this is a Gecko based browser? I find the wording a bit ambiguous in the article. Thanks!

mauricioc• 4 years ago

Firefox Reality also supports Servo as a browser engine, so this might be even more exciting! https://github.com/MozillaReality/FirefoxReality#experimenta...

nicce• 4 years ago

Isnt Servo kinda dead project?

aloisdg• 4 years ago

There is, of course, Firefox. Brave has a lion as a mascot, there are Puma and Dolphin browsers, and many smaller and historical browsers and projects within the browser space are named after animals

But the wolf name is already taken and on a browser based on Firefox too https://librewolf.net/

Note that I am still mad that librewolf was not named Windwolf or Waterwolf instead.

jeroenhd• 4 years ago

I think Waterwolf would get confused with Waterfox. Only a matter of time before wind and earth also get claimed by Firefox forks, though. New ones seem to pop up every year or so.

ilyu• 4 years ago

Volvic is a brand of water then Wolvic is probably a mineral water wolf

TedDoesntTalk2• 4 years ago

The name is a little confusing, and makes it clear they are not native English speakers. It's not a bad name, but if someone says to me, "Hey, did you try Wolvic yet?" I'll spell it "Wolfic" or "Wolfik" or "Wolfick", definitely not "Wolvic". Confusing.

jraph4• 4 years ago

I would pronounce the 'v' in Wolvic like in "vision" and the in your words 'f' like in "elfic". Which would make it clear Wolvic is written with a v. Would I be wrong?

(not a native English speaker)

(we have a town called Volvic here, known for its water. Pronounced like in "vision". I would pronounce Wolvic the same way, except the first letter would be pronounced like in "well")

(the English pronunciation is not a gift)

TingPing• 4 years ago

It is clear to me as a native English speaker. We do have "wolves" already.

bialpio• 4 years ago

Also not a native speaker, I'd use the same pronunciation as you ("v" in "wolvic" is the same as in "elven", "f" in "wolfic"/"wolfish" is the same as in "elfic"/"elfish"). But the difference is quite subtle, I see it can be hard to tell apart in casual conversation when people pay less attention to enunciation.

darrenf• 4 years ago

Whereas to my UK eyes it's instantly reminiscent of Volvic[0] mineral water, which is definitely a V sound and doesn't read or sound strange at all (see also: pelvic, civic, Slavic). It wouldn't occur to me that there might be an F sound.

[0] https://www.volvic.co.uk/

jraph4• 4 years ago

Indeed, and wolves seems to be pronounced with a v both in the US and in the UK.

UK: /wʊlvz/ US: (wŏŏlvz)

https://www.wordreference.com/enfr/wolves

You did think of Volvic as well!

laurent123456• 4 years ago

Never great when a product name looks like a misspelling of another more well known product name.

kingcharles• 4 years ago

It instantly reminded me of "Wolven + Loaves". You know, the one with the hipster ampersand.

Now I needs me a McWolven.

bkardell4• 4 years ago

Interesting observation. Fwiw, I am definitely very much a native english speaker (in fact, I don't speak any other (non-programming) language very well), and I proposed the name. As the post says at the end - it doesn't hurt that the domains are available if you don't use a "real" world. I guess we'll see if this happens.

nkurz• 4 years ago

Apologies if it's not the type of feedback you are looking for, but I strongly agree with the OP. I find the name so confusing that I have trouble even thinking about it. Quite possibly the problem is me, but if you are trying to reach an American audience, consider doing further audience testing before investing too heavily in the name.

thevagrant• 4 years ago

Wolvic sounds more natural to me than your other suggestions. If someone verbally told me about the project, my first guess would be to spell it as Wolvic.

I can see possibly someone non native spelling it as Wulvic or Woolvic (if they heard the name in a conversation). I'm sure some may misspell it with an f also but if the project grows, it won't matter.

bagacrap• 4 years ago

How did "wolf" get turned into "wolvic"? That section at the end just seems to take it for granted that permutation is totally normal.

Vinnl2• 4 years ago

I'd imagine the same way "wolf" gets turned into "wolves"?

freediver2• 4 years ago

Looks like they are jumping on the whole "Meta" train, with enough expertise to make a dent.

I would be astonished though, if people used a web browser in virtual reality to do serious work.

bkardell4• 4 years ago

I get this take... You might find my post on this topic interesting https://bkardell.com/blog/wolvic.html

astlouis44• 4 years ago

Very excited to see this, my ongoing prediction is that the metaverse will be WebXR based. No 30% cut from walled gardens, and sites can evolve from static, 2D flat experiences to immersive ones. Of course, apps will work day one on any headset in a platform-agnostic manner. And for the spark, just wait until the Apple headset ships with WebXR and WebGPU supported by default....

Also, my team are currently working on bringing Unreal Engine to WebXR.

mlajtos4• 4 years ago

Fantastic piece of history about TBL and Ian Ritchie.

When APK of Wolvic for Quest 2?

Edit — found it: https://github.com/Igalia/wolvic/releases/download/0.9.3/Wol...

mycall• 4 years ago

This reminds me of Virtual Desktop on Value.

Vinnl2• 4 years ago

Very compelling post, thanks for sharing!

andybak• 4 years ago

A VR browser is however very useful eitherfor browsing 3d content or having access to content that is useful for other VR apps. Especially for standalone headsets where you can't just switch to your pc desktop.

voakbasda• 4 years ago

I continue to be astonished (and dismayed) that people use a browser on the desktop to do serious work. Really, the browser provides a horrible user experience, no matter where you use it.

I miss native apps and the engineering that went into them, as compared to the slapdashery of web apps.

freediver2• 4 years ago

Serious work can be as little as searching for something and reading content. No reason why a web browser can not do this - in fact it was built for this purpose.

ghotli2• 4 years ago

I've used passthru on the Quest 2 with a browser window hanging in my living room. There absolutely is an allure to having a tv as big as my wall playing a youtube video while I'm folding a mountain of laundry. Working, serious work it's a bit of a stretch at this moment yeah

I haven't used immersed yet, but the whole "I can see my environment and my hands and type on a keyboard I can see with N floating windows" thing is neat and will only get nicer as the resolution improves

moron4hire3• 4 years ago

I build a WebXR app at work. It's a virtual environment for taking foreign language classes. You travel around the world and talk about what you see in-language.

mlajtos4• 4 years ago

react-xr?

flakiness2• 4 years ago

"As of today, Igalia has secured partial funding over the next two years"

Wondering who is funding the project, or does this mean they use their own money to fund this? That sounds more brave than Brave imo. Good luck!

stanlarroque2• 4 years ago

We are going to integrate this in our Lynx R-1 headset! Great to have something else than just chromium in this space.

ghotli2• 4 years ago

I hadn't heard of these headsets. Is public developer documentation available?

stanlarroque2• 4 years ago

By March we will release our OpenXR SDK. Our website for now is https://lynx-r.com

josephcsible• 4 years ago

I'm always in favor of new browsers that are FOSS and don't use Blink!

binarynate• 4 years ago

This is really interesting. Last night I was looking at FireFox Reality's repo and was pleasantly surprised to see [some newer commits][1]. Now today I see that Wolvic is [a fork of FireFox Reality][2] and that the commits were contributed from that project. I'm happy to see a private company fund new work on this front.

[1] https://github.com/MozillaReality/FirefoxReality/commits/mai...

[2] https://github.com/Igalia/wolvic

lostmsu2• 4 years ago

Has anyone actually tried FF Reality/Wolvic and can comment on the text quality in XR?

d3nj4l• 4 years ago

I use FFR on my Oculus Quest 2. IME, text quality is more constrained by the res of the device, and I personally find it painful to read on my Quest - whether in FFR or Immersed - for extended periods. Others don't seem to have the issue, and people on HN have posted about working full-time in VR, so YMMV.

lostmsu2• 4 years ago

The question is about font rendering. Do they rasterize text into a texture, then draw the texture on a 3D plane in VR introducing artifacts at the second step, or do they rasterize text directly in 3D space using the view matrices?

Wolvic, a new browser project picking up where Firefox Reality leaves off

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