After 36 years as a paid product, the Micro-Cap Circuit Simulator is now free

http://www.spectrum-soft.com/download/download.shtm

by lightlyused • 7 years ago

414 82 7 years ago

dang• 7 years ago

I pinched the title from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20495077 since it's more informative. If this is inaccurate, please let us know. (Submitted title was "Micro-Cap User Downloads – Now Free".)

macintux• 7 years ago

40 years isn’t bad for a small software shop. I hope Mr. Thompson is satisfied with how things turned out.

Anyone here use the software?

madengr3• 7 years ago

I used this in 1991 as an EE undergrad. I initially used it on my 8086, 4.77 MHz XT. It took several minutes to simulate a simple common emitter amp. I don’t remember if I had an 8087 FPU.

I then bought a 486DX, 50 MHz and the same simulation was finished before the mouse button lifted.

Fun times. Microcap was really cool at the time as it was the only GUI based SPICE, and the student version was under $50.

Nowadays I use LTSpice specifically since LT makes good switching regulators, and only develops those models for LTSpice. Otherwise I use Microwave Office.

MC still looks much more polished than LTSpice, at least the GUI. Schematic entry in LTSpice is still abysmal.

m0xte• 7 years ago

Yes also LTspice has some horrible clunk and bugs in it.

gowld• 7 years ago

How does this compare to modern circuit simulators?

https://www.tinkercad.com/ (Web)

http://www.virtualbreadboard.com/ (Windows)

madengr3• 7 years ago

It doesn’t. Those are not professional level simulators.

MC is a modern simulator, and professional level. I assume the guy is retiring. You are not going to be simulating large ICs, but it’s still plenty good for other stuff.

emmanueloga_3• 7 years ago

There's so pretty much seemingly unique proprietary software. A while ago I found this awesome logic minimizer called "logic Friday". [1] I don't think there's a free or open source version of a tool like this.

I have an idea that the "espresso" algorithm could be used to minimize not only electronic circuits but general boolean expressions for any programming language... I think it would do for a useful refactoring tool.

1: https://web.archive.org/web/20131022051516/http://www.sontra...

thaumasiotes2• 7 years ago

I have an idea that the "espresso" algorithm could be used to minimize not only electronic circuits but general boolean expressions for any programming language... I think it would do for a useful refactoring tool.

I think the goal for most boolean expressions in code is for the reader to be able to conceptually grasp what's being checked for, not for the expression to be as short as possible. Distributive properties can make an expression shorter while simultaneously making the concepts behind the expression much more obscure.

monocasa2• 7 years ago

It's useful in the compiler. For instance one optimization I haven't seen but would like to is going from

  if( value1 < 0 || value2 < 0 || value3 < 0 ) {

  temp = value1 | value2 | value3;
  if( temp < 0 ) {

Taking a sort of hardware, Boolean logic view makes this possible, as VHDL generally does this when synthesed.

emmanueloga_3• 7 years ago

Good point, although the idea would be you get to choose one for or the other. I think sometimes the simplified expression makes it easier to see the complement (else branch).

btw, I started to think about "boolean refactoring" when I saw J. Edwards' schematic tables video [1].

1: https://vimeo.com/140738254

Gracana• 7 years ago

I like Helmut Neemann's Digital: https://github.com/hneemann/Digital

It simulates logic, supports automated testing, simulates and analyses combinatorial and sequential logic, comes with a large library of components (generic stuff, specific 7400 logic, displays and memories, etc), it can output VHDL or Verilog, and it can export JEDEC files for GALs.

ngcc_hk2• 7 years ago

This seems more interesting as it is open sourced, support current hardware etc.

emmanueloga_3• 7 years ago

Looks great, I'll give it a try! Looks like it implements a different minimization algorithm [1].

1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quine%E2%80%93McCluskey_algori...

lloydatkinson• 7 years ago

+1 for Logic Friday.

I had fun with that, it is/was quite nice to use. I wonder what happened to it. The "sontrak.com" domain is bust now it seems.

The about page has this in the copyright though:

*Espresso and misII are copyright © 1988-1993, Regents of the University of California.

coldpie• 7 years ago

There's so pretty much seemingly unique proprietary software.

Indeed. Something to consider when choosing a license and distribution model for your own projects, including web-based software. Your life is finite, but the life of your software may not be.

dan1234• 7 years ago

You should take a look at Z Notation, which is a formal specification language based around mathematics & set theory.

I hated working in it and have done my best to forget everything about it.

oakwhiz• 7 years ago

I've used Logic Friday once to make a wired remote controller device that operated on 74-logic. I haven't really seen any tools that offer more user-friendly ergonomics for that type of problem, except maybe a curve-fitting tool called Eureqa which used to be open-source and went closed-source. Or perhaps Wolfram Mathematica could be used to spit out a few solutions, again closed-source.

monoideism4• 7 years ago

I'd love to try it out, but I'm not downloading an executable from an `http` URL.

Edit: I hope the downvotes are because it supports `https` (just not by default, thanks to progman32 for correcting me) and not because you think that not wanting to download an executable over an open connection is an unreasonable thing.

dmitrygr• 7 years ago

Ok. Don't.

Looking a gift horse in the mouth?

monoideism4• 7 years ago

You would download an executable over an unencrypted connection? Whether it's free or not?

progman32• 7 years ago

Site supports https.

onion2k• 7 years ago

How is downloading a executable over https safer? It mitigates man-in-the-middle attacks that could modify the compressed artefact on the fly, but that's possibly the least likely attack on a download imaginable. It's far more likely that an attacker would try to replace the file on the server (that way they can also change and documentation around the file, like the reported MD5/SHA hash you might use to check the file is correct). Why would you happily download that over https?

If you're security conscious enough to not download random executables over http then you really should be aware that it's 99% as dangerous to download them over any link.

blincoln• 7 years ago

On most networks, anyone else on the same subnet as your IP can hijack your connection using ARP spoofing and send you whatever they want if you're connecting over Http instead of HTTPS. That's usually a lot easier to pull off than compromising the server and replacing the content there.

beobab• 7 years ago

You could spin up a virtual machine and try it out on there.

ngcc_hk2• 7 years ago

Open source possible?

fizixer• 7 years ago

ngspice

nrclark• 7 years ago

This is very exciting! Especially the SPICE model library. Microcap's libraries have lots of SPICE models that I haven't seen anywhere else. Being able to grab them will be awesome, even if I wind up using them with LTSPICE.

willis936• 7 years ago

I’m not familiar with microcap, but I am familiar with LTSpice. If they’re both free SPICE GUIs, surely microcap must be better than LTSpice. I can’t imagine any interface worse than LTSpice.

cushychicken• 7 years ago

LTSpice for OS X is a special kind of frustrating.

madengr3• 7 years ago

More than just GUIs, rather SPICE compatible simulators. LTSpice has macro models for most LT parts, that would not be compatible with MC. Likewise MC probably has models that are not compatible with LTSpice.

Now I wish LTSpice would take MC GUI and features, and implement it with their simulator. They should have bought it.

peter_retief3• 7 years ago

I have never heard of this, is it appropriate to ask if anyone could describe it in one sentence?

scaryclam• 7 years ago

It's software for simulating circuits.

peter_retief3• 7 years ago

At the moment I use Linux (Didn't see any Linux ports?) with ngSpice, I haven't found ngSpice that useful though

commandlinefan• 7 years ago

Thank you for asking - I was a little afraid to ask as well.

therealdrag0• 7 years ago

See the "Product Info" section: http://www.spectrum-soft.com/demo.shtm

And there's a Feature Tour with screenshots: http://www.spectrum-soft.com/demo/schemati.shtm

garganzol• 7 years ago

The website says that the company was closed.

Does anyone have an insight on why Spectrum Software is now closed?

P.S. The man behind the company, Andy Thompson, seems to be an excessively humble person. He left a lot of details in the mist. However, all these details are priceless to us mere humans. Memoirs? A blog? 39 years in business is not a small feat.

rubidium• 7 years ago

Perhaps his humility is the most important lesson to learn, esp. in the dominant culture of tech today.

CoolGuySteve• 7 years ago

And maybe the true payments were the friends he made along the way...

There needs to be a name for this kind of dead end aphorism thinking.

znpy2• 7 years ago

After 39 years the authors might have just retired.

Maybe their customer base was too small and their reference market too saturated to convince anyone to buy it.

anonymou2• 7 years ago

free as in free beer

znpy2• 7 years ago

It seems to be working with Wine under GNU/Linux.

I'll try it better when I get home.

modo_mario• 7 years ago

Any chance of it becoming FOSS?

lsiebert• 7 years ago

I really hope someone mirrors this on github or something, because there is no guarantee that a website for a closed company will be around for any length of time.

I lost some important records because yahoo shut down it's group archive last year (and banned the archive team from saving stuff wtf), and it's been on my mind lately.

betamaxthetape• 7 years ago

We (ArchiveTeam) are still trying to archive portions of Yahoo Groups (our methods have changed a bit since Yahoo turned off the web archive in December, but the data isn't deleted until Jan 31).

What's the name of the group?

crtasm• 7 years ago

If you're a member of the group (or can join it now) it's only a few clicks to make a request for the data. Doesn't get absolutely everything but all the emails/posts should be included.

https://www.theverge.com/2019/11/4/20917500/yahoo-group-data...

scrumper3• 7 years ago

Is this good for analog stuff, at least as effective as LTSpice?

I've been using the latter on a Mac for simulating vacuum tube (UK: valve) circuits with some success and a very large amount of frustration. I would love something a little less actively user-hostile...

compumike2• 7 years ago

What makes LTSpice seem so "actively user-hostile" to you?

(Founder of https://www.circuitlab.com/ (YC W13), an analog circuit simulator that many universities have now started using.)

scrumper3• 7 years ago

I didn't grow up with it, so coming at it from a perspective of someone who's gotten used to modern software, it's remarkably hard to learn.

The interface is weird. Placement of components isn't so bad but when you want to do stuff like move them or rotate, you fall into this strange mode system that's unlike any other software I've ever used.

Including models is done by writing arcane text commands on the diagram. And also by setting parameters in a hidden window on the component diagram itself.

Models != visual components.

Sometimes I have to set the model designator for a component in the UI twice before it'll "take". That's hostile!

Finickity pin alignment on custom/3rd party components sometimes leads to open circuits when they look closed.

The parameter/settings windows are cryptic.

The wire drawing tool is really nice though.

It's obviously better than writing a setlist in TextEdit but I've found the learning curve very steep, with all the underlying complexity of Spice exposed. The fairly prehistoric interface paradigm that means that any muscle memory and expectations from using any other graphical software just don't help. In fact, they hurt.

I tried your thing when I was looking for circuit design software. I liked it. It didn't have any vacuum tube models at the time (not that I blame you, it's niche) and so I couldn't use it for what I needed.

unlinked_dll2• 7 years ago

Does your tool support custom key commands and macros (also can I use it out of a browser)?

Last time I played with it that was what got me to leave. A drag and drop wysiwyg is wholly inappropriate for serious work. Also the search feature doesn’t work well, it stalled looking for “op amp”

And by “serious” work I mean a small circuit with two dozen elements.

forgotpwd162• 7 years ago

Free as in beer. It will have been ever better if it had been released as free software.

extra__tofu• 7 years ago

Wow, used this extensively in my undergrad. Always used the free version. I remember occasionally running into the "too many nodes" error. Thanks to the creator for releasing the full version for free. I'm sure many EE undergrads will be grateful.

After 36 years as a paid product, the Micro-Cap Circuit Simulator is now free

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