Windows 10 1803 Update Failure

http://sdbr.net/windows-10-update-failure/

by x0054 • 8 years ago

77 121 8 years ago

John_KZ• 8 years ago

I literally stopped using windows because of windows 10. I'm lucky enough that I don't need it for anything work-related. In the rare occasions I do need something to run in win10, I run it on my old air-gapped laptop running a vanilla windows 7 installed from it's original DVD. I wouldn't trust windows on network-connected hardware. Not anymore.

gwbas1c• 8 years ago

Like all good Windows developer, I do my work in a VM on a Mac!

gerardnll2• 8 years ago

I may be the only one with zero problems on Windows 10...

Sometimes I think the adjectives to describe some situations are too harsh.

sddfd4• 8 years ago

Also having no problems.

nanodeath• 8 years ago

Eh, I had a similar problem. I'm low on disk space on C:, but it was able to download the update to C: + E: (E: is a partition on the same drive). Partway through installing the update, it asks me to "insert" disk E, which obviously I can't. Had to roll back the whole update. Now I'm kinda glad I did.

sakopov• 8 years ago

I, too, rarely have major issues with Windows. However, I did come across the login issue in the article, which was fixed with a restart. When people shit all over WinOS I'd like to instead give Microsoft credit for creating an OS that works as good as it does on virtually endless amounts of hardware configurations.

sddfd4• 8 years ago

And mostly without any technical user intervention.

x00549• 8 years ago

@sakopov: "When people shit all over WinOS I'd like to instead give Microsoft credit for creating an OS that works as good as it does on virtually endless amounts of hardware configurations."

That might be true, but in this case the issue appears to be exclusively software related. If they didn't force system upgrades, honestly, I probably wouldn't care. It may very well be a Dell issue, but Microsoft is large enough and powerful enough to enforce some standards on their partners.

Zardoz844• 8 years ago

Windows 7 was working better that Windows 10. And GNU/Linux works better that Windows 10 on a bigger set of machines.

ocdtrekkie3• 8 years ago

It's stunning to me that Microsoft can do this but we tolerate excuses from other companies about why they can't guarantee all devices running their OS can get a given software update. Or that each manufacturer's update needs to be released separately.

That being said, as someone who repairs Windows for a living, I've seen a lot of major issues with Windows. They take a two steps forward, one step back approach to everything they do. QA has gone down the toilet of late, but most of the core product is actually better.

maltalex4• 8 years ago

Sometimes I think the adjectives to describe some situations are too harsh.

might be related to this:

I may be the only one with zero problems on Windows 10...

Try spending hours (if not days) trying to bring your computer back to life, going through every google result for a helpful string like "0x80070422".

Seriously, just try looking at the autocomplete for "Windows 10 update 0x".

I know it's insanely difficult to do what Microsoft does, and the fact that Windows even works at all on so many different computers is nothing short of a miracle. But after a few experiences with odd Windows errors on a machine that worked fine just a minute ago can make you use some strong adjectives.

gerardnll2• 8 years ago

I've had some problems a few years ago but now, I just see improvements, to the point of not having issues nowadays. Since Windows 7 the situation has much improved. Windows 8 was great for me too.

I got to say, I don't install bullshit, I know which webpages I visit, I have an antivirus, good quality hardware and I have installed the just amount of software I need. It's been a few years now since the last format. I just try to keep it clean and ordered, like any other thing.

nickjj3• 8 years ago

I have no problems here either. Other than the telemetry bs, I really couldn't be happier for using Windows as a primary Linux based dev box (WSL, Docker, etc.).

dabockster7• 8 years ago

In my experience, it usually boils down to whatever software ships with the drivers. I had a trackpad driver once that caused an extra 5-10 seconds boot time on an SSD under Windows 7. All because it had to load its own custom branded control panel in order for scrolling to work.

nickjj3• 8 years ago

I thought 17.09 allowed you to defer feature updates for 1 year. It's an advanced setting under the update manager. No fiddling around needed.

Is that not available on Home editions?

icegreentea2• 8 years ago

Doesnt look like it is (I'm on W10 Home 1709).

I managed to defer my update to 1709 by like... 5 months by hitting 'later' on the nag screen though.

x00549• 8 years ago

Not in Home addition. You can set your internet connection to metered and that will only give you critical security updates, if you are lucky. But MS can choose to ignore that setting any time they want to.

sddfd4• 8 years ago

I'm running two machines (a recent laptop and an older desktop with Windows 10). I've wiped both drives and did a fresh install of a recent Windows 10 vom USB Stick.

I haven't had any problems updating and even big updates are fast. This is in contrast to a Dell laptop I got for work and which regularily took 45min to update.

If you have problems with your Windows 10, get rid of the crapware that came with your PC and/or do a fresh install from a clean image from MS (not one of the OEM rescue partitions/disks).

I with MS would do something about all the preinstalled crapware, because it has gotten out of hand and is hurting the brand.

curiousgal• 8 years ago

What about the activation? Would Windows recognize the device automatically and not ask for a key?

bhhaskin• 8 years ago

Keys are stored in the firmware on the motherboard. Shouldn't be an issue.

sddfd4• 8 years ago

Yes, it did on the desktop. I did buy a professional licence for the laptop though (it came with home).

ocdtrekkie3• 8 years ago

8.1 and newer devices have the key in firmware, and PCs upgraded from older versions of Windows are recognized automatically by the activation servers. So in most cases if a PC has ever had Windows 10 on it before, you can just install without a product key and it will activate itself.

x00549• 8 years ago

Best I can tell the Dell image for XPS 9550 is just Windows 10 with minimal drivers. I think I'll try the fresh Microsoft Windows route, but I want to mirror the drive first, because I don't want to install windows all over again and set up all my apps if it doesn't work. What's a good alternative to something like Carbon Copy Cloner for Windows? I used to use Ghost, but that was a decade ago.

jacob0192• 8 years ago

Live boot linux and use dd

dabockster7• 8 years ago

Best I can tell the Dell image for XPS 9550 is just Windows 10 with minimal drivers.

I've worked in an IT shop before. Even if the image is just Windows 10 with included drivers, those drivers can include bundled programs and bloatware themselves. I used a Dell laptop in the past with Windows 8 that had a trackpad application which had to autostart and run in the background for the trackpad to work properly. No matter what, that program was guaranteed to be using at least 50MB of RAM. Upon upgrading to 8.1, I had a bunch of OS errors. Turns out, uninstalling and reinstalling the trackpad driver fixed the problem.

OEM drivers aren't just the drivers themselves, but often instead an entire suite of programs that bloat your system and interfere with Windows' ability to take care of itself.

ihattendorf• 8 years ago

DriveImage XML[1] always worked the few times I needed it, and you can create the image while booted in to windows.

[1] https://www.runtime.org/driveimage-xml.htm

NiveaGeForce• 8 years ago

There was no crapware on my Surface Pro (mostly MS Store apps), and I also experienced issues, like this.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Windows10/comments/8g73kb/is_it_how...

I still have the following issue, even though I never installed an insider build on this machine.

https://wccftech.com/windows-10-1803-rtm-candidate-bug/

kerng2• 8 years ago

Agreed. Following random internet articles to disable Windows Updates is not a good advise. That same user might in a future post complain that a security issues aren't fixed, even though updates were explicitly disabled... My personal experience is that I had no issues updating multiple machines. Advise: Don't follow and change random registry keys and other things based on Google searches - it might become a problem in the future.

x00549• 8 years ago

Well, Windows 10 1803 update is a problem NOW. I'll take future problems over current problems. Also, disabling update service is a perfectly legitimate way to stop the updates from coming in. You can always turn it back on and control the update process manually, when you are good and ready, and have your HD backed up. You can do so on your schedule, not when MS chooses to spring it on you.

LifeLiverTransp• 8 years ago

I hope microsoft is at least paying well to fight any software resistance. These people are one terminal away from installing free software and doing there own decisions - often with good reason. This has to be stopped!

Labrat uprising in cage seven! Labrat uprising in cage seven! All personal with syringes report immediatly!

nickjj3• 8 years ago

Yep.

I upgraded to 18.03 about an hour after it was live. It was a very fast and painless upgrade on a ~4 year old workstation (parted out by pieces). I was running 17.09 Pro edition prior to 18.03.

robocat5• 8 years ago

Seconded on the reinstall by downloading the latest Windows 10 installation onto a USB stick.

Wayyyy faster than trying to restore from factory image.

On different laptops attempting to restore from factory image has failed, or taken more than overnight to get to current version.

So far I have had 100% success fixing Windows update issues by doing a clean install from the latest Microsoft ISO.

jimnotgym10• 8 years ago

I have to second this. Microsoft even has a tool to build the latest release onto a USB stick, which for me was the first time I have installed Windows and not had to wait for any updates at all.

I had a couple of PC's which were upgraded from earlier versions of Windows when it was free. Installing from USB sure did free up a lot of disk space!

Licensing headaches seem to have gone away too. I did one fresh install onto a different hard-drive and it just worked.

There seems to be one Windows 10 update which forces a reboot, and then it never happens again. If you build your USB today I donlt think you will suffer that.

Putting that aside this article misses one important point. Windows 10 is extremely backwardly compatible with earlier versions. At the day job we have a number of legacy apps, things built in VB6 for instance, and they worked first time on Windows 10. To be clear, we are talking about applications written around 20 years ago, which are still working on Windows 10. I don't run any Apple devices anymore but it certainly wasn't my experience that Apple cared about backwards compatibility back then.

RE: same old regedit etc. The enterprise admins I know seem extremely pleased to see these old faithfuls in place. Where Windows 10 has added a new way of doing something (like the new control panel), it is very heartening to find the familiar old version running alongside.

I think it is fair to say that enterprise loved XP, hated Vista, liked 7, hated 8 and tolerated 8.1. Enterprise seems very happy with Windows 10 so far.

tom_• 8 years ago

I installed Windows on my laptop last year from a presumably-unmolested ISO I got from MSDN - and it took it 10+ goes, at one attempt per week or two, to update to 1709.

pxeboot• 8 years ago

Windows Update is in need of a massive overhaul, but these 'feature updates' are actually an entire new OS that gets installed.

While it normally works great, when it doesn't, it's very difficult to fix in most cases, as seen here.

thanksgiving• 8 years ago

There is one weird trick to solve at least 20% of the angst again Windows update.

It forces them on you, sometimes in the most inopportune time.

Let users reboot when they want. I don't care if you show a bright red bar warning people to restart but goodness gracious don't reboot computers without positive consent!

Yes, there are more difficult problems like reducing the number of things that require a reboot to update (without sacrificing backward compatibility) but not rebooting the computer without consent is such an easy thing to do. Just be upfront and tell people to leave their computer connected to a power source and ask them to press a button when they're ready.

cjcampbell• 8 years ago

Agreed 100%. Always prompt before rebooting a logged in user or updating a freshly started machine. It boggles my mind that Microsoft can’t figure out how to use better UX to solve their update problem.

Start with notifications and offering to schedule an update. Don’t reboot automatically with an active user when the scheduled time rolls around. Display a prompt and allow the user options to schedule another reminder.

After a couple weeks (security updates only) add a “warning bar” along the top or side of the screen. Nothing drastic. Just visible enough to be a constant reminder to update. Eventually, replace the desktop background with a visible warning.

cl0ckt0wer• 8 years ago

It sounds like this user should spring for the USD$7/month LTSB Windows: https://www.howtogeek.com/273824/windows-10-without-the-cruf...

m-p-3• 8 years ago

I wish LTSC was a version normal, licensed users could get access to... I normally go with LTS versions when using Ubuntu, and ESR for Firefox. Being able to use that kind of version for Windows 10 right away would be great.

x00549• 8 years ago

That would be perfect! But I am not paying MS $7 a month so they can remove features. I like my kill updates solution for now. This really should be a default on business products like Dell 9550.

robocat5• 8 years ago

Windows 10 puts Microsoft's needs ahead of the users.

There is no easy way to avoid updates interrupting your work, always when you need to use your PC for an urgent work issue.

The home screen adverts, and preinstalled junkware are insulting.

It is impossible to interact with the OS for more than a few minutes without finding another bug you have never seen before.

On Friday I was using a test laptop. The start menu stopped working, so I do a restart, but Windows decides to do an update (ignoring the configured "don't update between 8am and 6pm" setting).

I can't believe they don't have a professional version with a yearly subscription. I want my tools to work, not interrupt me, or fail randomly.

booleandilemma• 8 years ago

We use an enterprise version of Windows at work and I had to remove pre-installed candy crush and twitter apps from it :)

jimnotgym10• 8 years ago

But you could have removed them from the whole domain using AD...

As much as I hate to admit it, AD is the killer feature that keeps MS king of the enterprise

Someone12342• 8 years ago

You sys-prepped a copy of Windows 10 enterprise to install them via AppX provisioning and then uninstalled them after the fact? Why..? I read this complaint a lot, and while valid for "Pro," it is a little odd for Enterprise since at that scale you are likely provisioning your app store apps anyway.

This sounds a little harsh, but the most likely cause of this issue is your SysAdmin not knowing how to manage Windows. If you don't provision the image at all, you'll wind up with a copy of Pro with a few more enterprise features. If you want to slim it down, you'll need to do so.

bsder2• 8 years ago

Windows 10 puts Microsoft's needs ahead of the users.

So stop using Windows.

It's really that simple. Until people stop buying Windows, this will never change.

robocat5• 8 years ago

I would love to stop using Windows , and I do boot to Linux.

However our business clients use Windows which means I need to test my work against IE, Edge, Windows 10 Mobile, and Windows touch screens.

Also our business would need to do a 100% rewrite of the core product (which depends on Windows).

A friend came crying to me because of Windows the other day. They can't afford a new laptop. I am the only person they can turn to for free.

My Dad depends on Windows for his work and he is too old to want to start his project from scratch on a new system.

My work, my friends, my tit-for-tat acquaintances, my family all depend on me helping them with Windows. Sometimes I can avoid it (give Mum an Android laptop; give a friend an old laptop with Linux). Mostly I can't.

Welcome to reality.

crispinb3• 8 years ago

It's really that simple. Until people stop buying Windows, this will never change

As simple as halting climate collapse by 'people' greatly reducing their car & electricity usage. Then lets stop war by 'people' refusing to fight or manufacture arms.

Much would be simple if there existed a decision-making unit we could label 'people'.

Tarean• 8 years ago

I like linux but windows has had much fewer technical issues for me.

Not having to wrangle bluetooth/printer/graphics card drivers for hours is nice. This admittedly has improved a ton on linux in recent years, though.

robocat5• 8 years ago

PS: trying to test Edge 17 today. 3 hours later I have found many critical bugs...

1. Edge in tablet mode, portrait, on low end tablet: you can't get to the far right hand side of your web page. Happens on major sites. (Scroll bar at bottom of <body> is missing right hand arrow - showing that it is an Edge bug).

2. Pressing keys trying to get screen shot: Goes into voice mode. You can't get into Settings to turn it off (Start | Settings doesn't work with touch).

3. Voice mode - cannot shut down laptop by swiping down.

4. So turned off using long press and got blue screen.

This is junk.

dabockster7• 8 years ago

My solution to the spyware is to "acquire" the Enterprise N edition and run WPD and Spybot AntiBeacon on it. It's pretty easy to find gray market keys if you know where to look.

The only reason this is a problem is because MSFT has a near monopoly in the consumer PC space.

exadeci• 8 years ago

The updates interrupt you work only if you have been pushing them back for too long which is a good thing when most users never want to update and then get infected.

Accept the updates when you are not doing anything critical and you won't have any problems with it.

maltalex4• 8 years ago

I've had a lot of issues with Windows update myself but the author's solution of "Murdering Windows Update" is not my cup of tea. I like my software patched.

So while I don't have a good solution for Windows Update issues, re-installs are a LOT less painful with choco[0]. I have one choco script for my home machine, one for work, one for the wife, and one for the parents. It makes things so much easier!

Edit: I am not affiliated with Choco in any way

[0] https://chocolatey.org/

amanzi• 8 years ago

I gave up on chocolatey after constant issues with permissions and never being sure which package to install for a particular app. Not sure if it has improved recently but it seemed like every app had multiple packages to choose from, and some features were only available in a paid plan.

beart• 8 years ago

Try scoop.sh

I've had much better luck with it than Choco.

Zardoz844• 8 years ago

I actually try to avoid to boot on Windows 10 on my dual boot computer (kubuntu 18.04 + windows 10) because the fucking updates of windows.

I got stuck with falling updates like 5 months . Every time that windows try to update, I lose like 2 hours. And only to see Windows failing to update and reverting it. And another issue is that Windows really hits hard my hard disk along like half hour, every time that I boots on Windows. I don't understand why does it. It's a shot experience, specially compar d against my Linux experience on the same computer, where everything just works out of the box, and I don't need to lost like half hour seeing how my hard drive is being smashed by the OS.

So this article really it's helpful for me.

maltalex4• 8 years ago

against my Linux experience on the same computer, where everything just works out of the box

What machine do you use?

Zardoz844• 8 years ago

FX8370E + MSI motherboard + 16 GiB DDR3 + AMD RX580 + two hard disks. UEFI dual boot with grub.

Even the HDMI sound is working fine (on 17.XX was necessary to update the linux kernel, but on 18.04 works out of the box), and I can output sound at same time on the HDMI and the sound card (Windows can't do this!)

PD: And I have Kubuntu and Debian working without issues (and faster!) on other machines with other GPUs/CPUs from Nvidia and Intel.

jimnotgym10• 8 years ago

Reinstall Windows 10 from a USB stick (MS provide a tool to create them). You will jump straight to the latest build with no updates at all.

However I will agree, I dual boot Windows 10 and Ubuntu anad I know I will have to suffer updates if I boot Windows. On the other hand I am not too happy with Ubuntu's updates right now...

Zardoz844• 8 years ago

I control when I update my Kubuntu installation. And GNU/Linux updates are far less intrusive that Windows updates. Not enforces you to reboot the machine to apply it, and you can work at same time that you updates.

PD: This kind of fix, remember me to the times of Windows 95/98 when a full reinstall of Windows every few months was a good practice to keep the computer working nice. I don't have to do this on a Windows 7/8 or on a GNU/Linux. Why I need to do to this on Windows 10 ?

ta34636363636• 8 years ago

I got stuck with falling updates like 5 month

I've had a similar/same issue (although this is on Windows 7) with the Feb->Current monthly security rollups installing and rolling back ad nauseum. The reason I mention it is because dual-booting has been fingered as the cause in a few cases, whether or not that's grub or something else I'm not sure (no helpful error messages that I can find).

I'm personally about to drop the Windows partition completely, but if it's possible removing the dual-boot bit temporarily might help (although faffing around etc). Until the next time it happens! This happened a year or two back as well from memory.

epx• 8 years ago

Windows must die.

wcoenen• 8 years ago

I also had that problem with my password not working after the 1803 update (until I rebooted).

By using the password reveal button, I found out that windows was not letting me enter any digits. I tried both the numpad and the number row.

maltalex4• 8 years ago

I wonder whether it's the same issue I had, but with both numbers AND letters.

All I could enter were spaces until I rebooted.

nwrk• 8 years ago

2018 and MS is still heavy. Running Antergos (Arch Linux flavour) with ZFS and not looking back. Rolling updates, speedy. Everything just works.

Luckily forgot about the long hours spend on reinstalling and reinstalling Windows back then.

*Is there any form of compensation from MS for fixing computer after broken update ?

Productivity ? Go for Mac or Linux

tomxor2• 8 years ago

Frankly they are both super heavy these days, I'd pick mac over windows given the choice but i'd pick linux or a BSD over either of them for the lightweight factor and actually having control of my computer in the most basic way.

merinowool• 8 years ago

Microsoft has become very hostile. Recently I have upgraded my PC and that tripped the activation. For some reason I was unable to reactivate (I own full retail licence btw), after wasting time on Google I tried Microsoft support. For a couple of days and a number of consultants trying to force me to give them full access to my machine, asking to upload invoices for the new parts, treating me basically like a thief, they eventually generated me new license key. Now I am scared to upgrade anything in my PC again and then there is that update coming. How on earth it is possible to treat customers like this in 2018? Sadly I use some software that only works on Windows so I have no option, but now I have separate PC only to have those apps and on all other machines I installed Linux. Fuck you Microsoft!

iMerNibor• 8 years ago

Try the phone based activation next time, it's usually a lot more forgiving for activations + they have a free number in most countries

dabockster7• 8 years ago

Or just buy a gray market key for $10-15 so it's not a big wallet hit if it gets deactivated.

Like always, piracy is an access problem. And I need to be able to access my computer's functions without MS locking me out because I decided to overclock my thermal paste.

crispinb3• 8 years ago

What I want for Xmas is an OS usable for laptops. Windows? Dealt with by comments here. Mac? Only runs on a limited range of crippled hardware. Linux? Life's too short.

2018 is sad, with no light on the visible horizon.

vbezhenar• 8 years ago

I've found that I avoided most of issues other people often encountering by reinstalling OS every few monthes. Usually after big updates. Might not work for everybody, I just like to configure OS from clean state. Works for anything from macOS to Linux.

jimnotgym10• 8 years ago

I suppose it is worth saying that this is not the same for enterprises as it is for single users. If you run a domain you can completely control your updates from WSUS (or a myriad of third party options). You can test the updates on a subset of users before letting them loose on your whole domain. MS are supporting a much wider range of hardware than Apple have to, and there will always be surprises. I can only think of two major update issues on my domain.

1) Conflict with a driver for an extremely specialized printer

2) A weird update about 4 years ago for W7 which seemed to forget to close the 'Windows is updating' screen. ctrl-al-del resumed normal service!

I believe some of the clunkier updates for Windows 10 (like the forced reboot) are actually part of a patch to improve the silent update feature! Install afresh from a USB as sddfd suggested and you wont have to suffer that patch.

0x0• 8 years ago

By the way, I've had those top menus that open to left happen when windows installs a touch/ink/stylus input device. There's a control panel setting somewhere for input devices like these, where there's a checkbox (that sometimes magically self-re-enables) for making menus appear to left for the purpose of accomodating on-screen hand-writing for right-handed writers. It's a bit weird that it ends up affecting the menus even when you stricly use a mouse to open them.

x00549• 8 years ago

Thank you! That was driving me crazy. It's in the "Other" tab of the "Tablet PC Settings" in Control Panel. One problem solved :)

LeoPanthera• 8 years ago

The author openly admits to jailbreaking their iPhone. These kinds of users tend to install many types of "tweaks" on their computers, and I would bet that this is the cause of the update failure.

exrook• 8 years ago

The author also admits to downloading a fresh restore image from Dell, which I would assume would create a fresh install of Windows without any "tweaks," and then still experiencing the same issue.

x00549• 8 years ago

You would bet and loose. I did do a clean install from a Dell recovery USB image, that's part 2 of the article. Also, I don't "openly admit" to jailbreaking my iPhone. I nonchalantly mention this :)

sengork• 8 years ago

One of my desktops keeps failing to update Windows 10 for 2 years now, the recent v1803 doesn't fix it either. Too ineffective to do a fresh install and just about tried everything out there to fix it. Complete waste of time.

On the other hand the desktop which always worked flawlessly now cannot even get past the initial installation boot screen from a freshly made v1803 DVD/USB (within 5sec of booting) likewise the update from inside Windows itself fails. Waiting to see if MS address this issue before I waste any more time trying to fix it myself.

mnm1• 8 years ago

Humorously written, but the situation is no different on OS X these days. I could not update to high Sierra and the new filesystem and after trying, it required a complete os x install which takes about six hours after starting using time machine. The only thing that's better on os x is that Apple finally seems to have stopped trying to push high Sierra on users, after even aggressively downloading it without permission. It's really rather depressing that the state of desktop operating system is thus. That includes all desktop Linux distros I've tried also unless one gets a lucky combination of hardware (aka Linux distros run like shit on Apple hardware if they even run at all).

Jerry2• 8 years ago

My dad, who still uses Windows, sent me this pic of his Windows upgrade trials and tribulations:

https://i.imgur.com/MwWenDA.png

He still hasn't been able to upgrade. I live hundreds of miles away and can't attempt to help him troubleshoot it in person.

imtringued• 8 years ago

Windows Updates are simply broken. If you're using windows then there is no way around reinstalling windows regularly. I've had update issues on vista, 7 and 10. I could fix some of them on vista but the time investment has always been higher than simply reinstalling windows.

wornohaulus• 8 years ago

Got my 1803 update installed on a 4.x years old Lenovo g50-45 AMD, low powered machine in an hour.. no issues at all.. machine restarted few times during the installation.. and it was done..

ThatHNGuy• 8 years ago

I've update my VirtualBox VM from Windows 7 to Win10 1703 then 1709 and 1803 without any problem, don't understand where the problem is.

locusm• 8 years ago

Windows 1803 is causing a lot of havoc for Google Drive users. It has hosed a lot of working configurations.

Windows 10 1803 Update Failure

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