Fish oils don't slow mental decline

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21929363.800-fish-oils-dont-boost-brain-power.html

by tokenadult • 13 years ago

44 48 13 years ago

newscientist.com

ekm22• 13 years ago

Isn't this the same thing as "Meat does not make you muscular?"

There has to be a combination of diet and exercise.

jasallen4• 13 years ago

There is, however, a significant correlation between meat eating (or more specifically protein consumption) and muscularity. If you corrected for exercise in the right way you would still see this correlation (a naive approach would remove all effects of exercise and you would lose the correlation).

So if this study is taken at face value (and well, no, don't do that) there is no correlation even before correcting for other factors.

ekm22• 13 years ago

If you do not work out, the meat merely makes you fat.

enraged_camel• 13 years ago

>If you corrected for exercise in the right way you would still see this correlation (a naive approach would remove all effects of exercise and you would lose the correlation).

I'd like to see some citations for this.

timje1• 13 years ago

I see a similarity between this study and the recent crack baby myth debunking - it's not the crack, it's the poverty. Only in this case, they're suggesting that it's not the Omega-3: it's the affluent (and health conscious) vs the not-so-affluent.

jasallen4• 13 years ago

I hate when these researchers don't stick to the rationally implied conclusions. "We see no correlation" is the rationally implied conclusion of the research. "Maybe it's affluence" is not science, at that point the researcher became just-some-guy(gal?) throwin' out his theories.

wuliwong2• 13 years ago

I absolutely agree. I would also add that as scientists we have the ability to shape opinions because our statements tend to be taken as fact (whether or not we are speaking about our field of research). With this comes a responsibility to be honest and transparent, a responsibility which is shirked all too often. The idea that this study is somehow the end of the discussion and it is now "proven" that Omega-3 fats don't help curb memory loss is laughable.

Finster• 13 years ago

It's common when writing a scientific paper to write opinions like that. "We showed there is no correlation. Possible explanations for past correlation may be..." It's not just some guy throwing theories against a wall to see what sticks. It's someone who has studied this exact topic for many months or years.

wuliwong2• 13 years ago

Yea, I see your point. I think I'm more annoyed by the title which greatly overstates the implications of the study.

hackinthebochs2• 13 years ago

Exactly. Speculation from someone who is entrenched in the study of a subject is very valuable. Is it not speculation that leads to further investigation and eventually a scientific study? Educated guesses is just as much a part of science as doing an actual controlled study.

jasallen4• 13 years ago

Pundit and research scientist are different roles, however. Yes, his punditry may be more informed than most other's, but the lines would be kept cleaner if the punditry didn't come out when formally addressing the research. It's a fine topic for future research, but until that future project comes, I'd rather see it kept separate from the formal project conclusions.

codemonkeymike• 13 years ago

It's called confirmation bias

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

ignostic• 13 years ago

That's really stretching the meaning. It's more like "guessing" than it is "confirmation bias."

readme• 13 years ago

Here's another study that found DHA did slow mental decline

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20434961

arn2• 13 years ago

The study you cite is a better study too in that it's randomized controlled prospective study, whereas the one linked here seems to be an observational one. Observational ones are the ones where everyone says correlation doesn't imply causation.

hiraki9• 13 years ago

Full Text: http://www.researchgate.net/publication/43533989_Beneficial_...

arn2• 13 years ago

Measuring blood levels of Omega-3 seems a strange method. Presumably they correlated high blood levels with high intake?

mistercow• 13 years ago

Ugh, I wish New Scientist would just go away. No link to the original study, gross exaggeration of the study's findings and scope in the headline. And a mention that one study doesn't overturn the entire existing body of research would have been nice.

klt0825• 13 years ago

I would be interested to see what the blood levels of EPA/DHA were in the patients studied, the article isn't really helpful in that respect and it may be important.

hammock• 13 years ago

Follow the money. Who funded this study? Also, better summary here http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-and-supplements/news/20130925/...

GrinningFool• 13 years ago

What's interesting to me in that study summary is this:

"...between 65 and 80 years old who had normal thinking and memory at the start of the study... The women took tests on thinking and memory each year for an average of six years. Blood levels of omega-3s were taken at the start of the study.

Overall, the researchers found no changes in mental function based on the levels of omega-3s in the blood. "

Given that age range, isn't maintaining baseline a net positive effect?

com2kid9• 13 years ago

Fish Oil does however help with anxiety and depression!

A large mega-dose of DHA/EPA (~1600mg of DHA, 1200mg of EPA) is the difference between my being stuck at home, and my going out to a party and socializing.

Fish Oil is not a panacea, but, there is lots of evidence [1] in its favor.

[1]http://examine.com/supplements/Fish+Oil/

tocomment5• 13 years ago

That's a lot, where do you buy it?

Also all I brands I've seen are higher on EPA over DHA. (The one in front of my is 780mg EPA and only 260 DHA)

Does that still help you or do you need a certain ratio?

NARKOZ• 13 years ago

I buy off from Amazon, the reviews are helpful. "Nordic Naturals" is a good brand to check out.

ValentineC2• 13 years ago

Is that per serving? Some brands may have fudged their numbers to appear better, but the amount of EPA/DHA per softgel could be much lower.

ValentineC2• 13 years ago

I'm curious — do you take it all at once? How long does its effects last?

com2kid9• 13 years ago

Yup, all at once. Effects are 6-8 hours. Typically just 4 capsules.

Fish Oil is interesting in that at different dosages it acts differently. You have to basically mega-dose it to get the anti-anxiety and depression effects. (As always, YMMV)

krembo• 13 years ago

Taking 2800mg of fish oil and then parting while smelling like an aquarium. Tell me more about your success with women...

com2kid9• 13 years ago

Good brands are purified and do not have any smell. Buying stuff from reputable brands I've never had a whiff of anything.

AsymetricCom• 13 years ago

Great news, Fish oils are very expensive lately.

ffrryuu• 13 years ago

Yeah and medicine does not help final outcome, which is death.

matznerd• 13 years ago

DHA is "almost 50% weight of the neuronal membranes[1]" in the brain. If your body does not have enough of it from the diet, it has to be synthesized in the body. It is a lot more efficient to supplement it and a lack of it is known to create mental decline.

It is well established within the Nootropic community that nearly everyone should supplement it. I take Jarrow Max DHA 2-3 times per day (500 mg DHA and 72 EPA/per cap)

[1] http://medind.nic.in/icb/t05/i3/icbt05i3p239.pdf

Fish oils don't slow mental decline

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