Poll: Is my own car worth it?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=634767

by speek • 17 years ago

12 39 17 years ago

news.ycombinator.com

mcav• 17 years ago

Borrowing someone else's car would save you the most money. (It has problems of its own, as others have pointed out.)

That said, choosing between buying older and newer is a tradeoff between risk versus cost. The older a car, the more likely it will need repair sooner. But since you've ruled out the most recent model years, most of the cars you're looking at (ca. 2002) will have already gone through the biggest depreciation.

If you want your own car, I'd aim for a used newer car (ca. 2002, for instance). Another factor to consider: whether or not you plan to have this car long-term, or if this is just to get you by until you can afford a better one.

spkthed• 17 years ago

Borrowing someone else's car is probably more hassle than it's worth. You'll have to deal with insurance, maintenance and there's problems, you risk that relationship.

You assume that older cars are cheap and newer ones aren't. Get something reliable (good engine, good transmission) that's ugly or damaged in some non-functional way. I've had friends that have driven $500 cars all their lives and had them work. The secret is finding something that nobody else wants for non-functional reasons.

vaksel5• 17 years ago

Do not borrow someone else's car, unless of course you plan to owe that person for the rest of your life. + it opens you up to huge problems if you get into an accident.

Here is what you do, buy a reliable older car(something like a Honda Civic, Honda Accord, Acura Integra, Toyota Camry), Spend at most 4-5K. Drive that for the summer, then at the end of the summer you can sell it for the same amount.

Hell, if you spend the time to find a deal, you can probably even make money on the transaction when you sell it. Since you'll be buying a reliable, popular car, you'll have no problem making a quick sale at the end of the summer, when everyone is buying cars for the start of the school year.

nazgulnarsil2• 17 years ago

um...why not just buy insurance on the car?

RiderOfGiraffes2• 17 years ago

In the UK you cannot legally insure someone else's car, you have to have them extend their insurance to cover you.

vaksel5• 17 years ago

I'm pretty sure that you can't insure a car that you don't own.

huhtenberg• 17 years ago

In Canada if you drive someone else's car, it is automatically covered by your own insurance. Some conditions apply, but in its core is like this.

brc2• 17 years ago

Even if you can insure the car, if you do destroy it in an accident, there may be a lifelong feeling of distrust towards you from the other person. This would depend on your relationship with the person, but nobody ever wins from an insurance payout. It's generally less than what you can replace the car for, it does damage to somebody's insurance rating, it's just not fun all round.

Buy your own car and know that you don't owe anyone anything.

benatkin• 17 years ago

I can tell you know what you're talking about, since you included Honda Civic but left out Toyota Corolla. (The Corolla is a pretty good car, but it doesn't belong in this set.)

randomwalker• 17 years ago

I must have missed something, why does it not belong?

RobGR• 17 years ago

I second this.

Someone mentioned the Toyota Corolla should not be included in the list, which I don't agree with (depending on the price and condition of the vehicle, of course). One option to look at it is a Chevy Prizm, which is a re-branded copy of the Corolla made in Fremont. They are usually cheaper used than the version with the Toyota emblem.

Try to get one for under 5,000 dollars, with less than 100,000 miles, from 2002 or newer. My preference is for manual transmission, believing that they have lower maintance over the long term, but that might not be yours.

Do not expect to sell the car at a profit at the end of the summer or any other time. The value will decline.

Depending on the nature of the car and friend you are dealing with now, consider simply buying that car. If you like the car, and your friend is going to be gone a while, ask them if you can just buy that car from them, and they can get a new car when they get back.

davidw• 17 years ago

Older car, for sure!

During high school, a friend and I bought a car together to go to bike races with. The car was as old as we were (1975), and cost us 500$, plus several hundred dollars in needed repairs. It ran fine for the 2 years we used it.

The last time I was in the states, I borrowed my parents' '87 camry (which I had owned previously). Great car - it was pushing 200K miles a few years ago when my dad got into a minor accident that had the unfortunate side effect of ruining the seal on the trunk, making it useless for hauling his camera gear around in rainy Oregon. It was still running great after all those years and miles, though. You could probably pick up a car like that for less than $2000, no problem and drive it well beyond just one summer.

Now, with a family, I'd consider getting something nicer, but before having a kid, there's no way anyone would dissuade me from getting an older car that runs well.

moe• 17 years ago

In HN spirit you shouldn't buy or borrow a car. You should build one.

Raphael• 17 years ago

I'll donate a potato battery for the cause.

vaksel5• 17 years ago

I can throw in a hood and some seats.

Angostura• 17 years ago

See which one your mother prefers. You know it'll save arguments.

Personally, I have better things to do with cash than spend it on a flash car, so buy a robust older model of car with a reputation for reliability. Learn enough to do simple servicing yourself. Purchase breakdown cover.

bayareaguy• 17 years ago

If you only care about your own personal transportation and the weather and roads are good in your area you could consider a motorcycle. A used motorcycle shouldn't cost you much. They are very fuel efficient, easy to park and great at getting past traffic.

icefox• 17 years ago

Or even cheaper, a moped

cellis• 17 years ago

umm...dude...60 miles on a moped?

vaksel5• 17 years ago

30 miles on a bike in traffic is not really a good idea. + chances are he doesn't know how to ride, or doesn't want to become an organ donor

menloparkbum2• 17 years ago

Motorcycles aren't as helpful for avoiding traffic outside of California. You can't split lanes anywhere else.

sp332• 17 years ago

I'm not sure what you mean - is it illegal or something? Motorcycles split lanes all the time here in NH.

hs• 17 years ago

a very fuel efficient motorcycle (like 100 cc displacement) runs like 30 kilometers per liter, that's about 60 mile per gallon

the fuel tank volume for small motorcycle is like 4 liter, the bigger ones is like 10 liter, so the tank ranges from 1 - 3 gallons

so for 60 miles roundtrip expect to fill the tank every day or two (about 5 mins wasted at gas station)

but still it's much cheaper unless your hourly rate is 100+ dollars

it might be safer (paradoxically, riding a bike makes you feel unsafe, just like driving small car which in turn increases safety)

i use it to train my perception (more feedbacks from wind, noise, smell, sights)

but yeah, once you ride motorcycles, you'll never look back

i agree, consider motorcycle, if you turn out not liking it the risk is very low (like < $500 USD)

also, maintenance is super easy and cheap. just unscrew, dump dirty oil to recycle bin, screw back and fill 1 quart of motor oil. no filter required! total maintenance (tire, oil, lamp, gaskets, etc) is like $30 USD per year

catch23• 17 years ago

There are quite a few motorcycles over 600cc displacement that get better than 60mpg. Even their 1000cc displacement ones get 65mpg. The BMW F650GS has a 4.6 Gal capacity and gets 65/75mpg, that would get you around 300-350 miles on a single fill -- so you'd need to visit the gas station once every 5 days or so.

rue• 17 years ago

For those options, get the newer car; it will almost certainly be more environmentally friendly than an old one. If you do not care about such things, cars in need of body work will save you a decent amount -- just make sure there is no structural/mechanical damage.

What does "required to drive 30 miles" mean, though? The first thing to check, of course, is whether you could relocate closer (at least part of the time.) Do the math on the car cost, insurance, gas, other upkeep and see if it might be worth it to just shack up closer by instead.

The second thing, naturally, is mass transit: trains, buses? If the nearest station is a couple miles away, that is an easy bike ride (I think suggesting taking the bike 60mi/day would be a bit optimistic if you are not already cycling?)

drp• 17 years ago

Check out insurance auctions. If you can find a car that was totalled from hail damage or extensive scratches you can pick it up for cheap ($400-$1000) and still have a realiable vehicle for the summer. In college, I had a '96 Jetta with 80k miles and pockmarks on every panel that set me back $400.

safetytrick• 17 years ago

I bought a 94 civic for the exact same problem and I've had zero problems, find something old and reliable (I paid very little)

quellhorst• 17 years ago

Get a scooter or get a newer car. Most old cars are sold because they started to give their owners problems. I have had many used cars and found Japanese cars to be more reliable and better engineered and after owning them for several years I sold most for nearly what I paid for them.

asdf333• 17 years ago

here is another option. buy a newer used car for the price of a cheap older car.

how? At least until about 9 months ago, used hyundais of the post 2005 vintage were steals.

hyundais post 2005 are extremely reliable, yet people still feel it has the reputation of a 'unreliable car'. reality is out of sync w/ perception.

most people try for a reliable older car w/ a solid reputation. these cars have more miles on them and are, well, marked up b/c many people do this

part of the cheapness of hyundai elantras comes from the fact that resale values are absolute garbage for older models. w/ improving brand perception and reliability of the products itself, resale values for post 2005 cars will be much higher than ppl expect.

lower popularity means less chance of being stolen compared to an older vintage honda or toyota. i have had my older honda1993 stolen and had the police officer who took down the report brag to me about how he could've stolen my car w/ one hand tied behind his back too.

Finally, if you look at the depreciation schedule of an average car (resale value over its lifetime) the steepest drops happen between years 1-3. then it flattens out to about year 10 or so. so best place to buy is year 3 or so, and sell it around year 10-12. (actually cheapest is to run it into the ground)

My suggestion:

buy a 2005 model hyundai elantra w/ low mileage (old drivers are awesome), with one previous owner only. You can find dealers on craigslist.

I bagged on w/ 30K miles on it, which means I still have 20k miles of warranty left on this sucker for a bit over 7k out the door (you can do better in this current economy. got mine over a year ago).

peregrine• 17 years ago

Wow thanks for that! I had no idea such new cars where selling for so very very cheap. I was always looking for hondas or toyotas but wow this is a steal.

brc2• 17 years ago

You're contradicting yourself here. The reason they are cheap is because they have poor resale value. Therefore, you will also get poor resale on the vehicle. Once a brand is tarnished with a 'bad resale' value tag, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy, and one that would take decades to change.

By all means purchase a Hyundai, but don't expect to have an easy time selling it. Brand reputations aren't fixed in 12 months. All the while Hyundai are priced low with long warranties, the resale value will be low, because it's more logical to go and purchase a new one.

javert• 17 years ago

Borrowing someone else's car is going to save you a lot of time and hassle. And if they offered, it's probably not going to make that big of a difference to them. I would go that route.

mtrichardson• 17 years ago

From Ignite Portland 3, here's a presentation on practices for buying a car for under $1,000: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zve_dpFkX_E

b3b0p• 17 years ago

The problem with getting an older car cheaper is that there is a possibility that you will end up spending just as much on it as you would if you had spent more upfront on the newer model. There might be some immediate items that may need repair or replacement.

A higher mileage (~100,000) 2000ish Toyota, Honda, Acura that was well maintained is more than you need for 3 months and the sweet spot in my opinion. If it's nice enough you might even consider keeping it and putting another 100,000 miles on it before passing it along.

Poll: Is my own car worth it?

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