Rally Against Surveillance today in San Francisco

http://1984day.com/san-francisco/

by ndesaulniers • 13 years ago

125 36 13 years ago

1984day.com

rayiner4• 13 years ago

Hope it attracts more than the shamefully pathetic 400 that turned up to the last one.

Yeah, it's disappointing when Germany has bigger turnout over PRISM than we do in the US. But we do have twice as many people RSVP'd this time. But there will always be hope, wherever you are, until you yourself abandon it.

mtgx• 13 years ago

It's possible some apathy towards this issue and a feeling that this is no immediate threat to them, because US hasn't really been under dangerous regimes before, are at play here, but I also think people like to be led and organized. I think organizations like ACLU and EFF should do a lot more grassroots organizing of the protests, and get people to say "Yes, I'm coming to the protest tomorrow".

Reading about the protest on a website won't guarantee many will go (and most will not). People need to be contacted by these civil liberties organizations and asked to come.

rayiner4• 13 years ago

Yes, people do need to be led. Civil libertarians have proven completely unable to lead in the last decade. Certainly, a bunch of people who think you can do it all on the internet won't be able to lead.

If you want to impact political change, you need to do it the way other groups do. I have teenagers coming to my door asking if I know about Jesus. Where are the young people going door to door to spread knowledge about NSA spying?

WalterSear4• 13 years ago

Who hung about all of 25 minutes, so people who were even slightly caught in traffic missed the whole thing. And with no online information of where they were marching to.

The hour I spent trying to figure out what was going on,there were people showing up constantly, looking lost, fiddling with their phones and then wandering off, just like I eventually did.

Very frustrating, and why I'm not there today.

bendoernberg3• 13 years ago

So there was a shortfall in planning at the last event, and thus you've decided not to participate in the future? Wouldn't the proper solution be to contact the organizers and identify the problem, or to help organize yourself so that things would run more efficiently?

bendoernberg3• 13 years ago

What do you hope to accomplish with this comment? Why are you blaming the 400 people who showed up as "shamefully pathetic", instead of focusing your anger on those who did not show up? How do you think it feels to spend your free time working hard to organize event, only to have someone mock you for turning out a "shamefully pathetic 400"? Do you know how difficult it is to get people to show up for a protest, largely because of attitudes like yours?

zmanian2• 13 years ago

We are also going to live stream. Link around 11. Speakers at 12:45

ndesaulniers4• 13 years ago

Link?

w1ntermute• 13 years ago

It's not 11 yet.

dhughes• 13 years ago

Live stream a protest against video surveillance?

Pro_bity• 13 years ago

I 100% agree with with the sentiment behind this rally, but I often feel that rallies like this in San Francisco are preaching to the choir. They make the participants and observers feel better, but do little to effect real change.

northwest2• 13 years ago

Again, it's not about either-or - unless one activity prevents you from participating in another activity.

We need to take all bullets we can get and fire them in parallel (online and in meatspace).

They make the participants and observers feel better

To some extent, this is good b/c it helps everybody to understand they're not "the only one around here who...".

gtaylor• 13 years ago

You're right, maybe they shouldn't do anything at all and just accept the status quo.

Comments like this just boil my blood. Get off your tail, stop being apathetic, be a part of the solution.

clicks• 13 years ago

Rayiner: your comment is marked as dead, I think because you used the word circle.... Perhaps try re-posting without it.

Edit: actually here, I did it for you:

False dichotomy.

Rallies in San Francisco are just excuses for like minded people to have a merry old time. It's a politically irrelevant city, because it has no votes in play. Want to have some actual impact, some actual chance to change hearts and minds, go protest in Utah, where you can connect the cause to the site, or DC, or heck Iowa, where you can take advantage of their natural libertarian streak and there are votes to be swayed.

ndesaulniers4• 13 years ago

I disagree. The tide is turning in Congress. Since a majority of the media is incompetent, rallies are one way for the people to raise awareness. Maybe you have an idea for how we can help raise awareness?

WalterSear4• 13 years ago

What makes you think the tide is turning?

DannyBee• 13 years ago

Hold a rally in a city other than SF.

Seriously, the world outside of SF (including politicians/DC) view SF as a place of crazies, willing to protest any stupid old thing.

Sad, but true.

anigbrowl• 13 years ago

You could also try putting out more advance notice. This is the first I've heard of it, and since it was scheduled for 2 hours ago I'm assuming it's already over.

gnosis2• 13 years ago

It is hoped that this rally will inspire others, and make more people aware of the issue and the opposition the people have to living in a surveillance state.

The effects of protests might not be immediately obvious, and perhaps might never be publicly acknowledged. However, they can have a serious impact.

Here's one important example:

"Many people don't know it, but Nixon was considering using nuclear weapons in Vietnam. At that time, Nixon was also repeatedly saying that he didn't care what the American people thought about Vietnam, and that he was going to escalate the war anyway. However, according to a biography by a well-known historian, when Nixon saw hundreds of thousands of protesters on TV, he dropped his secret plan of nuking Vietnam."[1]

[1] http://www.opednews.com/Diary/Why-Nixon-Didn-t-Nuke-Viet-by-...

weisser• 13 years ago

I wish I had found out about this before today (I would have returned to Boston for it). I'm sure many people are in the same boat.

WalterSear4• 13 years ago

The organizers of this local group don't inspire any confidence.

bendoernberg3• 13 years ago

Please let us know when you've scheduled a date for your well-planned, confidence-inspiring protest.

jivatmanx2• 13 years ago

I think it would be more effective to begin organizing a primary challenge to Nancy Pelosi. Residents of San Francisco have the unique ability to send a message to the minority leader, and therefore, the entire democratic party.

The leverage, or political return on effort, for challenging a house party leader is far greater than for any other elected official. (Senate leaders have far more constituents)

northwest2• 13 years ago

Good idea, provided you're not saying it's an either-or.

rayiner4• 13 years ago

Yes! Put your money where your mouth is and raise money to oust Pelosi. The tech community is the "moneyed interests" here. They should be able to at least give her a big scare.

ihsw• 13 years ago

The tech industry has been complicit in this, and I think how the Democrat party resonates with them can be summarized as such:

What you can control cannot hurt you.

I think this explains why those in the tech industry either stand firmly and resolutely with the government (and firmly belonging to the Democrat party), or their political allegiance follows along Libertarian lines because such statements instill a strong sense of anxiety and trepidation.

pstuart• 13 years ago

Dianne Feinstein chairs the Intelligence Committee and is complicit with all of these shenanigans. She's worse.

It's not clear how to beat the Dem machine in California (I'm a disgruntled liberal).

jivatmanx2• 13 years ago

If she were a senator from Rhode Island, I'd recommend this. But the population of California is 38 Million.

The population per congressman averages 700,000

Not to mention that, horrifyingly, she's not up for election until 2018, while congressman are elected every 2 years.

But yes, her repeated use of the word "Homeland" is disturbing.

gnosis2• 13 years ago

Unfortunately, it's a much more systemic problem than can be solved by ousting a politician here or there.

I encourage everyone who cares about this to get politically involved at a level beyond merely voting for congress critters now and then.

There's a lot that you can do, from joining and supporting organizations like the EFF and the ACLU to getting involved in local politics, which is usually the level that can be most affected by relatively small numbers of individuals.

zmanian2• 13 years ago

Live Stream: http://youtu.be/vbMf9sc1NL0

Rally Against Surveillance today in San Francisco

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