The little things I learned from the Valley

http://www.gigpeppers.com/the-little-things-i-learned-from-the-valley-april-2013-edition/

by Cherian • 13 years ago

91 90 13 years ago

gigpeppers.com

zalew3• 13 years ago

> Startup employees don’t make as much cash as I thought it would be. And that shouldn’t be the perspective.

what should be the perspective then?

Cherian2• 13 years ago

Learning, wearing 10 hats, broad range of knowledge from tech, design, hiring, firing, hyper productiveness, fun all the way up to optimized way of buying coffee.

A startup experience will definetly accelerator your career. You are likely to be more valuable than you were x months/years before the startup.

zalew3• 13 years ago

for me it sounds like it's what you do when you start your own company, not when you get hired by one.

does it take applying the name 'startup' to any company to embrace all that awesomeness in contrast to being hired by a company that doesn't meet this definition? I'm asking seriously. taking into account that 90% of startups fail in one way or the other, how is exactly working in an unknown unsuccessful young company such a strong career booster?

michaelochurch15• 13 years ago

I'm in New York, and the Bay Area might be very different, but my startup experiences were devastating for my career.

In one case, after I resigned because I refused to commit perjury, the CEO (from a well-known, rich family) embarked on a months-long campaign to ruin my reputation.

You don't get a worse position than you were eligible for before you did the startup, but if you don't have the credibility that comes with a successful exit, you don't get anything better either, which means you're overqualified for the subordinate roles into which you'll be placed, and thus less likely to be successful.

I wish it were a better world, but the truth is that there is such a thing in programming as being too good at your job, and startups are a way to end up with that problem. Sure, you learn a lot, but being learned without credibility is worse than being the idiot everyone thinks you are, because you don't get in as much conflict if you don't know anything.

ttrreeww4• 13 years ago

Should make the same as non-startup employees. Eg: 150k+ in 2013 dollars.

Developer auction was giving out sub 100k quotes, I just ignored them.

dasil0032• 13 years ago

> Palo Alto/University Ave is no more the place to be. You have to be in San Franciso. Caltrain/BART rides are perceived too long.

Is this true? If so why is PA real estate still so sky high? I understand if your startup culture is based on youthful hipness, but that is orthogonal to the viability of a startup.

ethikal• 13 years ago

Shouldn't high costs be a deterrent to startups? How can a startup be "lean" if its employees need to pay most of their salary in rent?

doktrin2• 13 years ago

Well that's the employees decision. Rent is high just about everywhere from Oakland to San Jose. When taking into account transportation costs, paying a premium to be in San Francisco is often worth it from a cultural standpoint. I can't really speak to Oakland, but after having worked on the Peninsula I would unequivocally not want to live there.

ttrreeww4• 13 years ago

In a gold rush, the miner (employee) don't make the big bucks. It's the miner support (landlord, investor, founders) that make the huge bucks.

samstave• 13 years ago

PA has never been cheap...

BrianEatWorld• 13 years ago

I don't know what PA/University Ave used to be, but I wasn't impressed with it when I arrived in the Valley two years ago. I would say the community is what you make it.

Personally, I found a nice home amongst MeetUp groups and the local Techshop to the point I am far happier in San Jose than even PA. Its like all the nerding out with none of the pretension and rent is half as expensive. Then again, maybe things are different if you are trying to be a founder.

doktrin2• 13 years ago

Well, take it with a grain of salt obviously. There are still plenty of startups & established companies in and around PA, and the presence of Stanford pretty much ensures property prices will never be low.

lowglow2• 13 years ago

> Palo Alto/University Ave is no more the place to be. You have to be in San Franciso.

I agree. The culture, inspiration, community, and experience here is a bit unparalleled. I can just as easily lock myself away to build product as I can go out and get away from marinating in self induced frustrations.

There is also money out here. People are willing to travel and visit, there are a ton of venues for meetups, etc. I couldn't imagine a better place to be (at the moment) for both tech and life.

ucee0542• 13 years ago

How can it be "a bit" unparalleled? Is that like being "a little bit" pregnant?

lowglow2• 13 years ago

Is there a word/phrase for when you want to use a word, but it sounds cliche, so you try to underplay the use of that word by prepending some diminutive modifier?

josh2600• 13 years ago

There is no series A crunch, only too many seed rounds IMHO.

Very few companies need to raise more than $1M to reach profitability any more, so traction should be required before raising money, but if investors wait for traction, they'll miss the really big deals. This sets up a dynamic, particularly influenced by the JOBS act, where unsophisticated investors can flood the market with cheap capital.

When it comes time for a startup to raise money from serious investors, they won't touch it unless it looks like Midas. I'd argue that the Series A levels haven't really changed from year to year, but that we perceive it as a Crunch because of the ridiculously large number of seed rounds.

jaredsohn• 13 years ago

>I'd argue that the Series A levels haven't really changed from year to year

It doesn't take away from your point, but I believe there are actually an increasing number of Series A level investments happening.

We call the current situation a crunch because we're measuring the competitiveness of going from seed to Series A.

RKoutnik4• 13 years ago

Is it just me, or are big-ticket gambles no longer viable in today's Valley culture? The article mentions that "Ultra local services like Uber, Lyft, Instacart, ZeroCater, Chewse, etc. are raising more cash than world domination disruptive ideas." Add this to an underwhelming W13 Demo Day in terms of said WORLD DOMINATION and I'm starting to wonder if investors are losing their edge.

There's plenty of opportunity for truly revolutionary disruption in all sorts of sectors. I just don't hear about it. As someone with disruptive ideals (but outside the valley) am I just being paranoid or is there really a problem?

michaelochurch15• 13 years ago

I think the problem is that most of these VC-funded startups are seen as loaded to the hilt on one kind of risk (red-ocean grow-fast-or-die gambits) so they avoid all other kinds of innovation, which is why they are such uninspiring places if one looks at the actual work and culture. I know someone who's trying to run open allocation and his investors said "no", because they didn't want the added risk.

VCs are swinging for the fences more than ever, but that means they're loading up on one kind of risk (rapid execution risk) and have no space for any others.

At any rate, I think "world domination" is a pretty pathetic goal. Where are the companies that want to focus on excelling rather than simply "dominating" some market?

RKoutnik4• 13 years ago

So the issue is less risk-adversity and more focus on a certain "ideal" risk. Interesting.

As to "world domination," it's more a joking term for startups that are creating a new product that intends to replace what the market currently has [0]. Imagine a product designed to replace college as we know it. Incredibly risky? Absolutely. Crazy payoff (in cash and actual change)? Just as absolutely.

I just don't see these kinds of ideas anymore. Maybe we all forgot to remove our schlep blinders, maybe the community has been focusing elsewhere, maybe they exist and have been avoiding premature hype. Probably a mix of all three.

[0] Think Google/Heroku, not more mobile apps/anything social media

prostoalex• 13 years ago

Cleantech kinda collapsed on many large VCs, so to boost the returns to somewhere within the range expected by LPs, the capital is deployed into clearer monetization paths.

http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_22385874/kleiner-perk...

Cherian2• 13 years ago

This does not mean companies like “ Uber, Lyft, Instacart, ZeroCater, Chewse” are any way inferior. Maybe these markets are much more bigger than perceived. Maybe they have the capability to expand to other cities. Maybe the founders are very strong in their conviction.

This is an observation.

jaredhansen2• 13 years ago

How are Uber and Lyft not "world domination disruptive ideas"? The others I can see maybe, but completely revamping the automobile part of urban travel is a pretty big deal as far as I can tell.

rdouble6• 13 years ago

Are they "completely revamping the automobile part of urban travel?" Tesla and even ZipCar seem more world-dominate-y in that regard.

ttrreeww4• 13 years ago

I hope more startups move to Texas... housing cost are way too high in SV.

coolsunglasses3• 13 years ago

I, (and my next startup), are possibly moving to Austin soon.

So there's one for you.

ttrreeww4• 13 years ago

Thank you! I hope it's the start of a new trend. Google fiber is just the icing on the cake!

michaelochurch15• 13 years ago

What's your next startup?

michaelochurch15• 13 years ago

I'm starting to think the balance is going to shift to lower-COL areas. This is based on my experience having been on the hiring side.

It's not about salaries because those aren't the major issue. The COL difference is minor in comparison to the execution risks. In fact, the traditional reason why startups "had to be" in NYC, Boston, and San Francisco is job-market latency. Yes, you can find great engineers elsewhere, but for some ridiculous purple squirrel query (production experience in the 3 NoSQLs you use) that needs to be filled tomorrow, you need to be in the Valley or New York (due to Wall Street, there's a lot of technical talent, albeit expensive). If you're in Austin, you can find great people but probably not the guy who matches your purple squirrel query exactly.

That said, a place like NYC has the urban dating problem (too many alternatives, so people treat each other like shit). We'd write great offers to people only to have them picked off based on minutiae. We were ridiculously picky and rejected people for dumb reasons; only fair for them to be.

However, I feel like the grow-fast-or-die red-ocean nonsense is played-out and the next wave is going to be in the mid-growth (5-30%/year headcount growth, focus on technical excellence) space which doesn't need to be in the Valley or New York.

tocomment• 13 years ago

What are some promising low COL areas? (I like your thinking by the way)

ChuckMcM• 13 years ago

Palo Alto has always been a 'university town' with respect to Stanford's presence there. It benefitted from professors who were both teaching and entrepreneurs, or nurturing ideas that came out of their labs into full grown companies. Berkeley has a similar vibe for similar reasons.

Traditionally San Francisco has been an artistic and design hub but not an engineering focused environment. However, that is a great environment to create products which are distinguished primarily by their design.

It's surprising however how dysfunctional the whole San Francisco political scene remains. One would hope that the influx of young workers and the tax base they represent would encourage improvements in the management processes in order to capture long term economic growth. Its not clear that will happen though. It makes me wonder how durable a decision to base your company in SF will be.

GuiA• 13 years ago

> South Bay is getting more expensive. Rentals at $2500 for 2 bedrooms in Mountain View and Palo Alto. East PA and Fremont continue to be cheap.

Meanwhile, those of us living in the East Bay are somewhat happy with the price they're paying and the short length of their commute :)

ahmadss2• 13 years ago

any recs on family friendly cities/towns in the east bay for those looking to move out to bay area soon? my wife and i plan on working in SF proper. her firms SF office is located near embarcadero BART, and i'm still looking for a gig.

rdouble6• 13 years ago

Kensington, Alameda, Albany.

malyk2• 13 years ago

All of them?

I guess the big question is schools, which I know nothing about. But if you stay away from the worst parts of oakland than I think almost any east bay city would be pretty good.

My wife and I live in North Oakland and we think it's very nice. It's certainly not white yuppie suburbia, but it's also not dirty run down violent west oakland. If you want something more towards the former then you probably want to look in places like the berkeley or oakland hills, rockridge, peidmont, walnut creek, etc. Basically things along Rt 24.

moystard2• 13 years ago

My apologies if the answer is obvious, but why does he mention Mailbox?

rgbrenner• 13 years ago

The sentence is "HYPE is now a subject of discussion. MailBox as an example."

What is Mailbox (from wikipedia):

  Weeks before its launch, pre-registration prompted a wait 
  list of over 380,000. Mailbox was added to the iOS App Store 
  on Thursday, February 7, 2013; it became the second most 
  downloaded free app in the App Store that day

  In March 2013, Mailbox was acquired by Dropbox Inc.

So: they hyped up their app, and were able to exit less than a month after launch.

whiteshadow• 13 years ago

So, when he says that HYPE is subject of discussion, that means that other companies are looking at this factor as a winning factor? What is your reading on that?

moystard2• 13 years ago

Interesting, thank you.

coin• 13 years ago

Funky horizontal scrolling on an iPad, pretty much unreadable.

The little things I learned from the Valley

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