Unpacking my knapsack: the privileges of a Hispanic male in tech

http://danilocampos.com/2013/02/unpacking-my-knapsack-the-privileges-of-a-hispanic-male-in-tech/

by danilocampos • 13 years ago

115 121 13 years ago

incision4• 13 years ago

Interesting way of looking at things.

Take away the stability, college-educated parent, examples of success, spare time and replace Caguas with Washington D.C. and we've had a similar experiences.

I've been known to expound to anyone who will listen about the amazing opportunity that I believe a career in tech presents for "climbing out".

I could certainly be wrong, but given my circumstances it's hard to imagine coming as far as I have doing anything else.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

How'd you get started on that climb out?

incision4• 13 years ago

Like you demonstrate, there were a number of privileges that laid the foundation, but the earliest pivotal point probably came when I was teenager somewhere around '93.

I started spending all my free time reading about computers (I didn't own one) at the public library, later extending that to used books and eventually saving up to buy a used IBM XT.

I managed to teach myself enough to impress the office folks at my landscaping job, gained some part time experience there, landed an internship and had my first "real" IT job by late '97.

alts• 13 years ago

I met Danilo (briefly) at a Grubwithus dinner a while back in the SF. It's strange to type, but I never suspected he was Latino based on appearance. I'm in a similar boat, where I pass as white. There have been a number of times in my (so far) short career where it's been made evidently clear that if I didn't pass as white, things would be very different for me.

I appreciate this post though. It's from a perspective I don't hear too often, and I've been slow to contribute my own. So, thanks.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

Hi again!

Wow, I forgot about that part. I've done that thought experiment a couple times myself, how it would affect things if I looked markedly different. It's always a little scary, honestly.

malandrew• 13 years ago

I'm in the same boat. Brazilian born to a Brazilian father and British mother. Lived in the US since 4 years of age. I also pass as a white American (but still have to deal with DHS and immigration bullshit because bureaucratic red tape has delayed my ability to apply for citizenship).

Like Danilo said, there is no replacement for having lived and grown up in the United States. I'm a native English speaker, but Portuguese was my first language. I'm fully fluent in Portuguese, but I wish I spoke at native fluency. However I would not trade my native English fluency for native Portuguese fluency. English is simply way too valuable.

ced• 13 years ago

There have been a number of times in my (so far) short career where it's been made evidently clear that if I didn't pass as white, things would be very different for me.

Can you expand on that?

Yoms3• 13 years ago

Please do expand.

I look very Hispanic, and have a marked accent. What have I been missing in life?

dcope• 13 years ago

I, too, would love to hear more details. I find it astounding that an industry that does not care about looks (tech) would have something that is evidently very prevalent.

rabialam• 13 years ago

Very interesting take, especially at the end in enumerating privileges. I had a similar experience with my own Mom's Macintosh SE being the gateway to my life in tech, and I don't know what I would done if she didn't introduce me to that at such a young age. I have been so lucky. Born in the States (even though mom's a foreigner which was a blessing in a lot of ways on account of the work ethic she tried to bestow upon me), college educated male with tech skills that were developed sort of circumstantially but very intensely at a very early age -- I feel so lucky, as if I "had a winning lottery ticket" for sure. And now, even as I am finally able to enjoy the the excitement and passion of a career that is exactly what I want to be doing -- I find myself so often feeling so incredibly anxious about why I am not doing more to help others gain access to my world. Frankly, I think that it's rare that (and sad that it's rare that) we have open discussions in the tech community about that word "privilege" where there isn't an INTENSE amount of denial, apathy, minimization, skepticism and disbelief (which, sadly, are some of the most common results of such privilege). For me, this post was a breath of fresh air that adequately expressed a lot of what I feel everyday -- I feel so lucky, but I feel so torn. Yes, I think I worked really hard to make good on my skills and develop them. No, I do not think that makes the world even remotely fair. Yes, I still feel like it is so unfair that in a lot of respects it is almost CERTAINLY a lottery. Yes, it continues to bother me that I feel sort of powerless about that divide, but yes, I would like to bridge that. Perhaps part of that is to start blogging as you have. I think that's what I like so much about this post: you are really leading by example in a way that is rare and yet quite needed. Good on you, and I look forward to reading more.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

> Frankly, I think that it's rare that (and sad that it's rare that) we have open discussions in the tech community about that word "privilege" where there isn't an INTENSE amount of denial, apathy, minimization, skepticism and disbelief (which, sadly, are some of the most common results of such privilege)

Thank you for your comment – I'm glad you appreciated it, and that you mentioned the hostility a lot of this conversation can breed.

Part of the problem, I think, is that it feels like an accusation to tell someone about their privileges. No one likes to be confronted, no one likes to feel like their hard work is being short-changed.

So I decided to try and turn the conversation around. Maybe it'll be better received.

11235813213• 13 years ago

You and the author are looking for the word advantage, not privilege. A person wih an advantage plays by the same rules as others, but does better. An advantage is not necessarily earned. Privilege means to not have to follow the same rules as others and that's not what happened here.

I'm irked that you've set yourself up to call this proof of privilege to discredit any disagreement. If you want there to be more discussion of the role that luck plays in our lives, you should not do that.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

Your word parsing isn't helping your case. According to AHED, privilege is defined as:

a special right, advantage, or immunity granted or available only to a particular person or group of people

Believe me. These advantages were not universally available. I got lucky.

WildUtah• 13 years ago

I'd like to upvote this even more. The deliberate blurring of the distinction between privilege and advantage reduces our ability as a society to improve things for both the abused and the disadvantaged.

Privilege is latin for private law. It's a special set of rules that can only be offered to a minority like guaranteeing admission spots to top universities to legacies.

Privilege does not describe things that could be offered to everyone but are not out of sheer nastiness. If the state U prohibits blue eyed people from enrolling, that isn't a privilege for everyone else. It's just nasty prejudice against blue-eyes. Nobody is getting special private-law treatment; a minority is just getting shafted.

Advantage could be any number of things, including privilege, but could just be parents that care more about you. Everyone could have that; nobody threatened your parents to make them less caring. Not everybody does have it, though, so it's an advantage.

anewguy999• 13 years ago

I don't like including values in "privilege" because it removes the normative force behind such values. While luck plays a role in success, especially great success, it is well within the reach of many people to get ahead by adopting the right values. Furthermore, adopting these values will make the world a better place and reduce the burden on public services.

I know that non-judgment is the default modern moral stance. But there ought to be a way that we can advertise and support the values of self-reliance and respect for others without sounding accusative. Yes, luck plays a part in success, but why are we so focused on that part and not the easily repeatable values that will help out most poor people who adopt them?

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

What you may be missing is that values must be taught.

And not everyone gets that tutelage. The values may be universal, but the opportunity to learn them is less so.

jerrya• 13 years ago

Hey, I don't know you at all, and I'm truly only pulling your chain, and maybe I am missing your natural humor but shortly before you write of the privilege of values, and how you knew Anthony was wrong in thieving candy, you were using "a pirated copy of Photoshop".

confluence15• 13 years ago

> luck plays a role in success

A role? A part? Are you serious?

> adopting these values will make the world a better place and reduce the burden on public services

That's such bullshit. "If only poor people would just work harder and save more - everything would be awesome". Reality check: poor people work long, hard hours for minimum wage with no hope of escape.

> luck plays a part in success

Delusion - it is strong with this one.

jordan0day• 13 years ago

While I can't disagree with much of this, you need to check your glibness at the door. Especially stupid sentences like "Delusion - it is strong with this one." The whole point of commenting should be part of an attempt to inform others. When you're acting like a jerk, no one's going to take you seriously, and no one's going to learn anything from you.

wpietri5• 13 years ago

There are all sorts of privileges that we should spread more widely. Good education. Supportive family. Great teachers. Solid role models. And yes, good values.

I didn't see a bit of accusation in the original post. Maybe you're hearing that because you brought it in with you?

andyl• 13 years ago

So many others just wallow in grievances - I'm grateful to read this piece. Inspires me make the best of gifts that come for free, and pass it on when I can.

pekk2• 13 years ago

So many other whats?

rey2• 13 years ago

I love how you articulate the privileges you've had in your life, which buoyed your career. It's a rare exercise and one that I encourage people to do. All too often, we take for granted these "invisible stepping-stones" that brought us to where we are now (I recently wrote about these invisible privileges for the Huffington Post: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rey-faustino/the-empathy-gap_b...).

I also was an immigrant to the US, and it sounds like we have a similar immigration story. I wonder what it would be like to be born in a low-income community in the US where social mobility is difficult. Do you think you would be where you are now if you grew up in that kind of environment?

incision4• 13 years ago

>I wonder what it would be like to be born in a low-income community in the US where social mobility is difficult.

I fit that description.

In short, my personal, anecdotal experience says immigrants often place a greater value on education, recognize more viable options for success, are more supportive of each other and have less fear of stepping out of their comfort zone.

I saw no shortage of people hamstrung by each of those things growing up, particularly the de-valuing of education.

rey2• 13 years ago

Yes, immigrant communities historically have been known to be more collaborative and to have more upward social mobility because of that.

When I worked in East Palo Alto, which is a low-income community in the heart of Silicon Valley, I sometimes felt like it was like living and working in a bucket full of lobsters. Instead of being helped up out of the bucket, we'd get clawed down.

But slowly and surely, the work of community leaders, nonprofits and community organizers are changing this landscape and building up a new generation of kids who think differently.

superflit• 13 years ago

The main reason is: 'Immigrants' do not have 'welfare' support. Mostly are 'undocumented'.

Yes.. we can get at ER and school. but no stamps, disability or unemployment checks.

So we have to help each other and never rely on gov...

sootzoo• 13 years ago

That's a great read too. Is the paraphrasing of Peggy McIntosh intentional? Her "Unpacking the Invisible Knapsack" (http://ted.coe.wayne.edu/ele3600/mcintosh.html) is a classic in sociology and race studies literature, for anyone interested.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

Entirely intentional. When someone related the concept to me, I realized I was carrying around a knapsack of my own, filled with things unusual for a hispanic person of my background.

gtank• 13 years ago

That was probably the proximate quote, but interestingly this has been a fairly common metaphor. Catullus is the oldest use I'm aware of, but I have no doubt it is older.

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Catullus_22

GuiA• 13 years ago

Thanks for sharing.

You'll probably like this essay¹, which made it big on HN² a few weeks ago.

¹: http://whatever.scalzi.com/2012/07/23/a-self-made-man-looks-...

²: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4965041

cantastoria2• 13 years ago

That list doesn't really contain many privileges in the "unpacking the knapsack" sense, in that they aren't advantages you have just because of your race/class/gender. If anything it shows that these opportunities/advantages are available to those to who pursue them whether it be you or your parents or your country.

Perhaps you are underestimating the impact that hard work has had on your life and over-estimating the impact of "privileges" you list. Certainly, you were born into such favorable circumstances (although your parents/family seemed to have been very intentional in creating that for you) but you wouldn't be successful in tech without the hard work part. I wonder what motivates you to emphasize the former and not the latter?

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

> in that they aren't advantages you have just because of your race/class/gender.

Clearly not – they are advantages that are atypical to my race and starting class, but entirely typical to a great many of the people I've encountered in my work. That's what was interesting to me about the exploration.

> but you wouldn't be successful in tech without the hard work part.

I completely agree. I'll put it to you like this: I may have run in the race, and that was all my effort, but someone needed to first put me on plane for me to even compete.

cantastoria2• 13 years ago

I'll put it to you like this: I may have run in the race, and that was all my effort, but someone needed to first put me on plane for me to even compete.

Sure, but they worked hard to be able to put on that plane. That you recognized the opportunity and took it is a tribute to you and them. It sounds like you're the product of a lot of hard work (and maybe a little luck). Why minimize that by calling it privilege? It does a disservice to you and those who've helped you.

denzil_correa• 13 years ago

Thanks for sharing! I loved the way you sum up everything

    So I stand upon the shoulders of giants. Holding a 
    winning lottery ticket.

It made me realize the "giant shoulders" I stood on to make me reach where I am today. It is a humbling experience to put life in perspective.

zeteo• 13 years ago

>I saw breathtaking houses that gave me pole stars for what I could achieve in my life.

Geez Louise. I sure hope you will use all your advantages in life for better purposes than acquiring a fancy mansion. There are so many difficult, but worthwhile problems out there.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

Poorly stated, I agree. I meant only to contrast that with the squalor of where I might have grown up instead.

mahmud2• 13 years ago

Isn't that, like, the "American Dream"? Don't tell people how to spend their time and money.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

He's right, though, buying McMansions is dumb.

dfamorato• 13 years ago

It is a nice perspective to see that other people also live "The American Dream".

I am brazilian, born and raised in Brazil, but had the privilege of coming here twice (Disney) when I was a teenager. This was when I decided to eventually move to US at my first opportunity (20 years old).

It was for sure, the best decision of my life since the opportunities and lifestyle that I have here in US are simply just short of impossible back in Brazil. 7 Years in US gave me the opportunity to really grow professionally and personally.

I think my story is the similar to Danilo's…. Great parents, great support and education when growing up but ultimately, after age 17, "you are by yourself", which also includes paying for you college education if you want one.

For enabling me to get amazing education with scholarships and free content made available by US Colleges and Universities, also to accepting me as one of your own, THANK YOU AMERICA !

jtreminio• 13 years ago

> I know with certainty that having access to America – the mainland, the honest-to-god US of A – was the most crucial part of my privilege.

Simply being an American, even if from a non-state, was your biggest advantage and privilege.

I was an illegal immigrant living in Texas until I turned 19 or so, when Nicaraguans were granted amnesty. Since then, my quality of life has only gone up and up.

ivzar• 13 years ago

For more on the effect of hereditary privilege, read Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell.

mxuribe• 13 years ago

Big kudos for this post, and to you danilocampos!

Yoms3• 13 years ago

I think your post lays out a clear case that it comes down to parenting, hard work, and access to the USA. And as an American (Puerto Rican) you had access to the only one ordinary people can't control.

But I feel your article gets derailed with too many anecdotal stories. Some rub me the wrong way, but maybe I'm just reading it wrong...

I was also born in Puerto Rico and grew up in Caguas (Bairoa). But that wasn't a bad thing...

I have a horrible accent (which seems will never disappear) and would probably not pass the Texas State Trooper test. But that has not impacted my career...

My family was religious, but the first person I met who believed the world was only a few thousand years old was in Florida. I find it irritating that you would insinuate Puerto Ricans don't believe in Science...

I don't think being or not being Hispanic has anything to do with it. There are plenty of people, minorities or not, stuck in crappy areas. With good parenting, they can at least ensure their kids have a chance at hard work. It's what helped you, and what helped me. I was also the first person in my family with a six figure salary.

We should chat though, boricuas in tech has to be a very small group ;).

Jayschwa6• 13 years ago

vladsanchez 3 hours ago | link [dead]

Same boat, Boricua in tech, same traits. Read the article the right way, and liked the anecdotes. Take care.

ebf2• 13 years ago

I wonder if the same commentators who disagree with the author's usage of "privilege," also believe Silicon Valley is a meritocracy.

gfosco• 13 years ago

It's amazing how far back, and how complicated a chain of events can be that lead to a specific outcome. Similarly, I look back in awe at the luck and good fortune I've had.

I owe my entire life-path of technology to my grandfather on my fathers side. He was an electrical engineer, far ahead of his time, and when he was done playing with something he sent it to us. I was privileged to receive a TI-99 at age 5, a C64 at age 6, and an 8088 after that. I was hooked from the start, and computers have been the single most important constant in my life ever since.

enneff• 13 years ago

I, too, owe my technological career to my father's father, who was an engineer. He died recently and I wrote about it here:

https://plus.google.com/106356964679457436995/posts/dcPPziC1...

confluence15• 13 years ago

You know what I always find so hilarious. How people always seem to qualify luck - even when they show us how lucky they have actually been.

I continuously hear statements like "it's partly luck", or "luck is obviously a component of it", or "luck is clearly a factor", or "luck plays a role" [1] - all attempting to downplay the enormous magnitude random chance has on our daily lives. Hell, they might even put numbers on it like "it's probably 50% luck", or "90% luck". Nobody seems willing to go all they way to and just come out and say "Yeah - I got really lucky and that's about all there is to the story".

The just world fallacy is a very, very strong illusion.

Life's a crapshoot. It's all luck.

[1] http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5174488

Jayschwa6• 13 years ago

Are you suggesting that outcomes are purely the result of random chance, and that an individual's values and behavior have no bearing?

confluence15• 13 years ago

Where you do think your values and behaviours came from in the first place?

Your values/behaviours are given to you via both your genes and your environment - which are effectively random. If your parents were prone to addictive behaviour in an environment that provides addictive substances - you will probably do the same.

This reminds me of thing I've always found highly curious about how the religious think.

They can't seem to understand that their choice in religion is relatively arbitrary and geographically dependent. Born in America you're Christian. Born in Pakistan now you're Muslim. Born in India now you're Hindu. Born in Israel now you're Jewish.

The fact that people can't seem to understand that the reason they believe in X god instead of Y is merely a question of a few hundred miles.

Life is particularly arbitrary. For example: I'm an atheist because of my environment (middle-class male, western country, studies science and technology, with access to freedom of speech). This is irrelevant as to whether atheism is actually the right option (which I believe it is - but then of course I would :) - the key fact to understand here is how the environment determined it.

Finally, physics eliminates the case for free will. So yes - you do what you do because you were set up to do it.

We're all just biological machines.

blackman• 13 years ago

This is one of the discussed problems of philosophy and it gets a bit complicated when you start on quantum physics and relativity.

Some info.

http://philosophy.stackexchange.com/questions/1210/in-which-...

stdbrouw• 13 years ago

Luck are unexpected good things that happen to you and that you didn't work for. It has little to do with randomness in a physical sense and thus philosophical discussions about determinism aren't really relevant in this context.

carlob• 13 years ago

Still our brain is, for all practical purposes, a classical machine. No quantum effects are observed at the neuron level. So we can't use indeterminism to save free will.

derleth• 13 years ago

> Yeah - I got really lucky and that's about all there is to the story

Meditate on what a philosophy like this, universally held, would do to morality.

Personally, I think it would improve it.

orangethirty4• 13 years ago

I live in the same town you were born. Conditions are still hard. Unemployment is through the roof. The few programming jobs available pay around $10/hr. And they are mostly doing maintenance on old C#/Visual Basic systems.But that's better than what most of the population gets. Minimum wage is the norm. People make around 12K per year, and have to deal with very high costs of living. Plus the shitty infrastructure.

I had it rough, too. Grew up in a barrio. Where most of my childhood friends are either dead, in jail, or crackheads. Few ever managed to make it into college (I did not). I'm the only one who has actually made something out of himself. But not without a lot of hardships. Not long ago (less than 5 years ago) I was completely broke, no transportation, no job, nothing. But somehow I kept moving forward. Throwing punches whenever I could. Like you, I was lucky. My parents got me a computer ( a C64) early on. No one else in a radius of 5 sq. miles had a computer. It was the best thing to ever happen to me. It gave something for me to hold on to when all my friends were busy learning how to sell drugs. It kept me safe at home when drive-by-shootings started to happen. It also helped me not get a young lady pregnant (which was the norm).

Nowdays, I am an accomplished engineer, marketing consultant, and entrepreneur. I work remotely, with a great team, building a very tough system (that has me writing code like crazy in different languages). Also help great people build their businesses into powerhouses. Best of all, I get to build my own businesses, which I find extremely fun (to the point of even doing some as a hobby). Who knows what would have happened to me had I not discovered my love for code? I know that I would not be able to say how proud I am of reading about a fellow puertorican who has made it. Good luck, and let me know if you ever visit. I know a place who makes great frituras.

danilocampos17• 13 years ago

Wow, what a story. Thank you for sharing it. I always had some notion of the depressing realities I'd have faced if I stuck around on the island – but your testimony takes it to a new level.

It's amazing. Education really is the silver bullet. And computers are the most revolutionary education tool ever devised. Way to climb out of a tough spot, my fellow boricua.

intended2• 13 years ago

Education is a good bullet, but its part of an arsenal.

Not everyone can make of the tools the same house you have fashioned, which follows from people themselves being massively varied.

I suspect that many tools in your tool case would be used in a variety of manners for people who wanted to get out.

---

Side note - I've heard "education is the silver bullet for our problems" and seen it applied with very disappointing results.

On one hand it has definitely given several people a path to move up in life. But its also been terrible for the rest of the populace.

It ended up creating legions of people who are literate but not 'educated'. A curious situation where people can say they know about rationality without having to be rational.

It produces legions of people who can perform mental athletics like rote memorization, or mental calculus and other tricks, but about poor understanding of the logic of the underlying principles they apply.

The number of people who grow up to be like the two of you is few and far between.

orangethirty4• 13 years ago

Yes, education is the important factor. Though education != college. It goes farther than that. It is what we learn from our parents ever since the day we can think. Both of my parents are very strongly educated people, something that they passed on to me (and my brothers).

Computers are an amazing tool. That is why I'm always helping people learn to use and program them. I wish all programmers would do the same. It makes a huge difference.

Oh, and I'm not done climbing. :)

Thank you.

PS. Lets keep in touch. Email in profile.

Yoms3• 13 years ago

Great story. Even though I love the island, especially if/when you have kids, get out of there. It's sad that rather than advise an intelligent, motivated, hard working individual to stay and make the place better I'd advice them to get out, but I just don't see the problems getting better. There is something broken about the current culture in Puerto Rico. I'm glad I'm raising my kids on the mainland, they are learning the culture and language but in an environment where I don't have to look over my shoulder at all times. There are plenty of bad places here too, but it's much easier to get away from them here than there.

As much as it saddens me, I haven't met anyone who has left and hasn't found a better/safer opportunity here. We're lucky we don't need to worry about citizenship...

Mano y si necesitas ayuda me avisas, yo soy Cagueño también! 3 in one hn thread! Ship me some alcapurrias ;)

orangethirty4• 13 years ago

Thank you. I appreciate the offer. May you shoot me an email?

0xfaded• 13 years ago

tldr; Won the birth lottery, currently in Ukraine doing some soul searching, arrived at same conclusion that I want to give back but don't know how.

I can't deny I did well in birth lottery, and due to similar circumstances I wound up a programmer with an amazing job and even more amazing opportunities. That's not the point of this post however.

I am currently on holidays in Europe and am spending a month in Ukraine. I can't even begin to describe how the people I've met and the conversions I've had with them have changed me. To sum it up briefly, Ukraine is one of the most corrupt countries in the world. Kiev looks like a modern European capital, and there is obviously money around judging by the number of luxury SUVs on the road. Yet $400/month is considered a good wage, unless one has the appropriate connections. In short, European costs of living coupled with developing world wages.

The post's ending about somehow giving back is what resonated most to me. When I was a student I was fortunate enough to have free time and the money to explore my outside interests; fast forward 4 years and I have taught myself Japanese to fluency and have lived in the country on 3 separate occasions. I've met a student here that who I see a lot of my self in, she gets top grades and has an inexplicable interest in Japan. It is her dream to work there and she studies the language in her spare time. The only difference is that she works a full time job to pay for her studies (unrelated to Japanese) which are also full time. The reality is that she doesn't have the free time I did to learn Japanese, let alone the funds to visit independently. It kills me inside knowing that two weeks of my salary would give her a year of free time and the same opportunity I had to pursue my interest in Japan.

There are a lot of posts below about how education could be a silver bullet. I know what has affected my life most, however, was the ability to pursue my own interests.

Competencies in any area will open doors, maybe not doors as wide as those available to programmers, but doors to better places none the less. In her case Japanese language competency would make her eligible for the MEXT scholarships paid for by the Japanese government.

Honestly, I have debated offering to loan her a year's salary to be paid back if and when it is ever convenient for her. My conclusion is that the same could also be used to sponsor a child through to high school, and something else tells me its just not the right thing to do. Yet I arrive at the same internal conflict that you do, how to give back after winning the lottery.

For the record there are no romantic interests at stake here.

Unpacking my knapsack: the privileges of a Hispanic male in tech

Related Stories