Should I be paid more?

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4946167

by myohan • 14 years ago

9 12 14 years ago

news.ycombinator.com

Ever since I started my career in software engineering, I have always wondered what exactly I should be paid, or in other words what is my worth? I know the answer depends on a lot of factors such as location, experience/knowledge, day-to-day responsibilities, supply and demand, company size, company profit, etc… But I wanted to give a brief background information about myself and wanted to get honest opinion from my peers at hacker news so I get a better sense of what I’m worth and hopefully this post will also help someone else who may be wondering the same thing. My title is Mid-Level software engineer with 2 years of experience. I have a CS and Fine Art degree. I work for a small private company (government contractor) in the Washington Metropolitan Area (Northern Virginia to be specific). I am currently the only and lead Software Engineer for two Java enterprise applications. I ship code about 5 to 7 times a year with about 200-320 development/test hours for each release. I lead and take part in every phase of software development lifecycle including customer support. I have managed to clear two Oracle Certifications in one year, and preparing to clear another in the near future. According to my yearly review I was told I was doing an excellent job and will be promoted to Sr. Software Engineer within a year at the pace I’m going. My company size is in the range of 20-30 people and yearly profit is about somewhere in the range of 5-10 million. I have lot of experience in Java and J2EE technologies, but I am also very familiar with PHP, ROR and somewhat familiar with C, but I can learn anything in a short period of time. Right now I make about 75K a year. Hope that is enough info to give you an idea of how much I should be paid? So the big question is ‘Should I get paid more?’ Thank you all!

nostrademons• 14 years ago

There's no right answer to "should you be paid more" - either you can get someone to pay you more or you can't, and the only way to find out is to go and ask for it. Your salary is whatever you can negotiate, no more or less.

A quick glance at GlassDoor's salary data is that $75K is pretty typical for someone with your experience, skillset, and location.

myohan4• 14 years ago

Not sure about GlassDoor but according to salary.com and payscale.com and a search on "Software Developer III" or "Software Developer IV" (titles that closely match my job description) the median salary for NoVa is believe it or not, around 100k. Even a search for "Software Developer II" comes up to be around 85K. I think the problem here is that I have few years of experience (2 years) but my job description matches more of SDIII or SDIV which is about 5-10 years of experience. But I don't trust the accuracy of these sites hence why I created this post so i can get answers from real people. I appreciate your input.

thejteam• 14 years ago

You mentioned that the company you work for is a government contractor. Is it a product company or a support services company? If it is the latter, then 1)the rate that the company can bill you out at is determined based on years of experience and not what you actually do and 2) the government is clamping down on companies rates and many are in a pay freeze right now. If it is a product company they have more latitude, although not as much as you would think.

100k for 7-10 years seems right for the area, especially if you are in the government contracting realm(contrary to popular belief, government contractors are paid well below market). A company that competed in the private sector could probably pay more. 85K for about 5 years seems a touch low for an average, but no incredibly so. 75k for 2 years is probably a touch above average, although not incredibly so.

btaitelb• 14 years ago

If you go out on your own and contract with that same company, chances are good that you could easily pull in $100/hr (I've heard numbers much higher than that, but am trying to be conservative here). Now, there's a higher risk for contracting, and you're on your own for paying taxes, but if you work from home and have a home office, you can claim lots of deductions. Still, assuming a 35% tax rate with no deductions, and spending only 75% of the year doing billable work, that's still a nice salary of $101k.

If you don't feel confident to go out on your own, or need stability and/or benefits, you can always start shopping around at other places (lots of companies are hiring for your skillsets in the DC area). This can be a good opportunity to practice your negotiation skills, and see how high of an offer you can get (tell them what your current salary is and that you know you're underpaid). Then you can either take the new job or go back to your current company and get them to match.

nanijoe• 14 years ago

Definitely ask for a raise. I think you are underpaid. A quick search for "Junior java developer" on indeed.com, indicates that you could easily be making $20k more than you presently do.

xauronx2• 14 years ago

The more important thing is that HE thinks that he's underpaid. It's clearly something that he's put quite a lot of thought into. I think that ultimately he's looking for a push, or some confidence boost, to approach his boss. So OP, my advice is this: look for a new job. You don't have to get a new job, but you can look. There's really no downside to it. Perhaps after a month you'll realize "damn, I can't find anything without taking a pay cut" and your problem is solved. OR, you'll find a company that loves and wants you for more money. Then you have ammunition (and confidence) to approach your boss.

myohan4• 14 years ago

Thanks for your input. Yes but are you implying that i tell my boss that another employer is willing to higher me for X amount? I feel a little uncomfortable taking that approach.

codegeek• 14 years ago

Before I try to answer the "should", I can tell you that you certainly "could". I have lived and worked in DC/NoVA area and there is definitely possibility to get more. But coming back to the point about "should", you need to ask yourself the following questions and assess your situation:

1. How critical is your position/situation at the current company ? Is it possible to have a frank discussion about salary with your manager and see where it goes ?

2. Have you tried looking outside just to get an idea of how much someone is willing to pay you ? With 2 years of experience, 75K is not a bad number necessarily but again I know a few 2 years experienced Java devs making more than that.

Bottomline is that it comes down to whatever you can negotiate. Pay attention to the word negotiate again. Thats what it really is all about. If you don't try hard, your employer will obviously not do charity even if they love you. So go out there, talk to current employer and look outside at the same time. You will know where you stand.

myohan4• 14 years ago

Thanks for your time an input. To answer your question, yes I believe my position is critical. I don't have any backups as of right now that are familiar with what I do, but that is not to say there aren't other employees that could potentially pick up when I leave but I believe the projects can be at huge risk if leave suddenly. I don't know if the managers are open to negotiation but I think it doesn't hurt to ask. To answer your second question, I haven't looked at other employers, but I have a lot of friends that work in the area and they say people in their company with similar responsibilities make a lot more than I do. But I will take your advise and try to negotiate and if that doesn't work out try looking into other places.

firebones• 14 years ago

There is a lot of other stuff to factor in.

First and foremost, are you happy and do you see a future for yourself there? If the company's primary focus is software, then defense is less of a concern than if software is adjunct to the core business. Do you drive profit, or are you a cost center?

Are there people there you can learn from? It sounds like the company is doing well ($166k to $500k profit per employee--profit, not revenue), but if you are 2 years in and already the biggest fish in the pond, then you may have a decision to make, possibly based on whether you can get any equity or not. The small size of the company is a plus, particularly if they are software focused.

If you have any ambition or dream to move to a commercial company, now is probably the time. While defense can provide a premium (especially in the NoVa market), it also tends to come with a bit of a stigma around process that can be hard to shake if you are immersed in it too long (both in terms of habits and perceptions those outside the industry can have). Take your experience and make the jump to an industry that suits your tastes. Loving what you do and sticking with it can yield better financial outcomes than can simply trying to optimize a situation that is "just a job".

If your current company is growing, and you are growing with it, and if you see some of the shared upside...then don't worry so much about base rate. Your skills and ambition will keep you a big fish in that pond and you should start to see the upside soon.

Should I be paid more?

Related Stories