Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

http://kotaku.com/5929067/gabe-newell-wants-to-support-linux-because-windows-8-is-a-catastrophe

by checoivan • 14 years ago

364 191 14 years ago

kotaku.com

lazugod• 14 years ago

It's a catastrophe for Valve if third party markets like Steam don't fit seamlessly into the future of Windows.

huggyface2• 14 years ago

And it's a catastrophe for users if third party markets like Steam don't fit seamlessly into the future of Windows.

barranger• 14 years ago

However steam will continue to work just like it does now on the desktop.

It's disingenuous for Gabe to talk about how much of a 'Catastrophe' Windows 8 is going to be or how touch screens are "Short-term" but leave out the fact that these fears stem from it's possible impact on Steam's bottom line

wtracy3• 14 years ago

Long-term, yes.

Short-term, if they can still get their games through Microsoft's own market, they won't care.

zanny5• 14 years ago

I feel gamers are much more bound to Steam than they are to the Windows platform. If a game works on Linux, they could care less if it is under Windows. Most of them only use their PC for gaming, web browsing, video watching, music playing, and document writing anyway, and Ubuntu does all of that as good or better than Windows anyway.

They will happily Wubi install Ubuntu over their Windows disk the day their steam library works on it if Steam pushes them to switch. Getting the library working and the graphics drivers up to par is the bigger problem.

trotsky3• 14 years ago

I'm all for linux support, but clearly he's more worried about a future with microsoft taking their digital delivery business, not usability.

ajross• 14 years ago

Or Apple, or Google, or Amazon. Steam is, really, just an app store. And that's becoming part of the platform in the modern world.

Frankly I think the sanest option here would be for MS to simply buy Valve and turn them into the "Windows App Store". But I can't imagine that happening given all the internal churn that would be required to eliminate all their existing online purchase junk.

arohner• 14 years ago

I'm pretty sure Valve wouldn't sell to MS for any amount of money.

Gabe is a billionaire, and left MS to do his own stuff. And Valve culture sounds incompatible w/ MS culture.

trotsky3• 14 years ago

The difference being only one of them owns the platform steam gets practically all of their revenue from.

robryan2• 14 years ago

I don't think they have too much to worry about. Will take a lot to get gamers to switch to a Microsoft app store. Granted Microsoft could probably eat away at the very casual end of gaming.

Vekz• 14 years ago

You are correct app stores are becoming standard OS components. I feel like Steam on linux is one step away from a SteamLinuxOS. Which opens up console ideas comprable to the Ouya Andriod powered console that was just buzzing on kickstarter.

beedogs• 14 years ago

Pretty much everything MS buys gets ruined, so I'd rather that didn't happen.

ArcticCelt2• 14 years ago

Valve is not a public company so there is no shareholders nor investors who can pressure Gabe to sell. There is also absolutely no insensitive to sell for him. Even if he gets tired of Valve he can simply start a new venture by using the insane cash-flow raining directly in his bank account.

ralfn6• 14 years ago

Why would MS pay 3 billion dollar for Valve, if they can just abuse their position and disallow Steam on Win8, and then just steal the market.

Which is exactly what they are doing, with the win8 store policy, metro sandbox, and pricing strategy for the x86/classic-desktop version.

djhworld• 14 years ago

It might be sane for Microsoft, but it would be an abysmal turn of events for Valve.

dclowd9901• 14 years ago

Can someone explain to me how the App Store model is a viable business model? It seems like, at some point, it just becomes a race to the bottom in terms of the cut of sales revenues, or an abusive oligopoly of stores that force burdening arbitrary rules and limitations down peoples' throats.

Isn't it really just a modern day record label?

chj• 14 years ago

Love the fact that he votes with feet.

megaman821• 14 years ago

I don't understand this sentiment. If you don't like Metro, launch the desktop and forget it even exists. For rarely launched apps, hit the Win key and start typing the name and for frequently used apps, pin to your taskbar. Steam still works exactly the same on Windows 8.

summerdown2• 14 years ago

Am I the only one who likes having a gorgeous desktop wallpaper, with icons arranged in clusters according to usability? Or to have overlapping windows?

Everything I've heard about Metro suggests limited customisation of the desktop and apps that insist on being full-screen or some guaranteed fraction. All of this feels like evolution in reverse to me.

I've never used Windows 8, but the stories coming out make me never want to.

http://kotaku.com/5929067/gabe-newell-wants-to-support-linux...

Zr40• 14 years ago

Nothing is forcing you to use Metro. In fact, only apps that have an UI designed specifically for Metro will use the Metro environment. Everything else will run in windows outside of Metro, just like they do in Windows 7.

Only the new start screen (which replaces the start menu) will expose you to Metro. But in my experience with the Release Preview, this start screen is pleasant to use and still allows for keyboard search like in Windows 7 as well as keyboard navigation.

You can still use your desktop in precisely the same way you're doing right now. Nothing has changed there.

correctifier• 14 years ago

It is unfortunate that this kind of information has been spread so widely about Windows 8, but it's just not true.

The desktop is still there, icons are still there, overlapping windows are still there, the only thing gone is the start menu, replaced with the metro launch screen that can launch both desktop and metro apps.

There are still some issues with the two different environments, especially the difference in look and feel, but it still works well.

huggyface2• 14 years ago

I'm not sure of his reasoning, but he is not saying that Windows 8 is a catastrophe for users directly.

I think Windows 8 is a catastrophe for everyone in the PC space. I think we'll lose some of the top-tier PC/OEMs, who will exit the market. I think margins will be destroyed for a bunch of people.

Sounds more like all it is a problem for all of the many players in the Windows space. Now of course Microsoft can do what they want with their ball (subject to DOJ purview), but so can everyone else, including companies like Valve who have been a major influence in keeping the PC relevant for an entire market.

If Steam and 2,500 games were available on Linux, that would make a huge case for that platform in the home.

learc834• 14 years ago

What would cause OEMs to leave the market, other than mass migration by users because of a bad user experience?

zanny5• 14 years ago

They won't be able to just jump 2,500 DirectX and DirectSound titles off the Windows API onto Wine. Maybe if they spend a few million dollars working on bringing Wine up to date with DX11, and then they have to deal with all the development houses not switching off Visual Studio and DX12 in the coming years, because they won't want to make the jump off the M$ platform.

commandar6• 14 years ago

>If you don't like Metro, launch the desktop and forget it even exists.

Been using W8 on my desktop at work for about a month now. If only it were that easy.

The big problem is that W8 is insanely inconsistent. Trying to change system settings can result in having to navigate a byzantine maze guiding you through new Metro interfaces with old-school control panel applets interspersed throughout.

The Control Panel still exists, but there's also a Metro PC settings interface, and trying to search will give you some mix of the two. It's just a nightmare to navigate.

It's more that the entire user experience sucks than it has anything to do with any single application.

ch0wn2• 14 years ago

I got the same impression so far. Take the Metro Windows Update for example. It failed for for me repeatedly without giving any reason until I found the same functionality within the "classic" Control Center where I had to allow the system to reboot in order to install the updates. This is simply a horrible experience in every way.

EvanAnderson• 14 years ago

I haven't looked at the release previews yet but I can only imagine. The antique-looking Windows 3.1 font control panel persisted into Windows 2000, so I can't believe that we'll be rid of the trappings of more recent versions of Windows anytime soon.

ArcticCelt2• 14 years ago

I also installed the preview to see how it works and after many frustrating experiences I now found the perfect way to use Windows 8 on my laptop.

When it boots I immediately launch a remote session to my windows 7 desktop.

CamperBob22• 14 years ago

For rarely launched apps, hit the Win key and start typing the name

There should be an app for that. It could be called... oh, I don't know, how about COMMAND.COM?

drivebyacct24• 14 years ago

What are you talking about? This is how every person I've ever observed ever uses the Start Menu in Windows Vista or 7.

archangel_one• 14 years ago

Not many application executables in Windows are in your PATH, so cmd is not going to find them. Even for the ones that are, you have to type the name of the .exe which is not necessarily obvious; eg. Visual Studio -> devenv.exe.

Donito2• 14 years ago

The title should be: "Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe' [for steam]".

Steam is, from a user perspective, a video game marketplace on PC. In Win8, they will have to compete with the built-in windows marketplace, where most games will published directly. In other words, Win8 is a catastrophe for them as it's endangering their business.

Splines2• 14 years ago

Steam is already competing with very strong entrants (Amazon, Gamestop/Impulse, Gamersgate), and seems to be doing well. Microsoft hasn't exactly hit the ball out of the park with Xbox Games-on-Demand, I'm not sure how much they really have to worry here.

tikhonj• 14 years ago

The worst problem isn't competing with the Microsoft marketplace--it's not being able to compete. And that's exactly what Windows 8 Rt threatens. Microsoft has decided to emulate Apple and be evil on tablets.

landr0id• 14 years ago

> In Win8, they will have to compete with the built-in windows marketplace, where most games will published directly.

Has there been any talk from major publishers/developers that they're actually looking at the Windows 8 marketplace as a serious option? Steam seems to be very friendly towards developers/publishers in terms of pushing out updates, cert, advertising. Plus, Steam has pretty good support for customers. What will the Windows 8 marketplace offer or do better to provide the sort of incentive needed to attract big players?

ericd2• 14 years ago

I can tell you that it would be very hard for Microsoft to make me choose to use their app store over Steam without resorting to anti-competitive tactics. Steam, from a gamer's perspective, does almost everything right, and I have a huge number of games "stored" there. Then again, laziness might trump for most people.

SCdF• 14 years ago

I don't understand that perspective, and I honestly think there is a bit of a double standard going on here. People hate on Origin and 'meh' the rest of the competition, but are in love with Steam. I know people who will only buy games if they're on Steam, it's bizarre.

Your games are locked into steam, and they may never be removed from there. You own none of them. The only way to play them is to open Steam (presuming it's up / not horribly busy / you have an internet connection^) and be shown their market place. There is no way to 'export' your 'purchases'.

Contrast that with other sites where you buy the game and get to download an actual installer, which you can do whatever you like with.

Steam could do a lot better for users, but by locking people into their service they do a lot better for themselves.

^There is an offline mode, yes. Except you have to put it into offline mode while you still have an internet connection, which sucks (what if your internet goes down due to a power cut / accident / misconfiguration at the ISPs end?), and it's not supported by all games.

zanny5• 14 years ago

They seem to be targeting Ubuntu, and you can buy most proprietary Ubuntu games on the Ubuntu Software Center already.

Isn't that already the same kind of competition? If a game is on the software center it has no online DRM so I would absolutely get it there over Steam if it was for the same price.

jmcqk6• 14 years ago

I don't think most games can be published in the windows 8 app store. They have very strict guidelines about the types of apps that will be listed. Specifically, only metro-style, full screen apps that use a specific subset of the .NET framework. I don't know of any games right now that would fit that requirement, certainly not the types of games that make steam popular. Especially when you consider the most popular games are exclusive to steam.

macspoofing• 14 years ago

They can change that

Donito2• 14 years ago

According to msdn, it is possible to create marketplace apps using C++/DirectX which is pretty much what games need:

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/apps/br22958...

nas• 14 years ago

My gut feeling is they have more compelling reasons to port Steam to Linux. Look at the growth in the number of relatively powerful personal computing devices (smartphones, tablets, etc) that don't run Windows. It's also been suggested that Valve is looking at developing their own game console. It is reasonable to spend some effort making their system less tied to the Windows API.

recoiledsnake4• 14 years ago

I think the headline of the article is pretty misleading as he means that Windows 8 is a catastrophe for Steam because of the Windows 8 app store. Looks like everyone's upvoting the article because they seem to think that Gabe meant that Windows 8 will be a failure.

Instead of having to go through Steam's distribution, games will have the option of going directly to the Windows 8 app store and get featured there, not to mention XBox Live coming to Windows.

Anyone know what Steam's cut for game devs is? Microsoft is charging between 20 to 30%, so Steam seems to be very worried about their revenue stream and thus supporting Linux as a hedge.

Of course the regular desktop Steam client will keep working, but not on Windows RT ARM devices. Also, doesn't the WinRT support full DirectX?

Ref. http://www.joystiq.com/2009/10/07/randy-pitchford-on-steam-v...

Says Pitchford, "It would be much better if Steam was its own business." If Valve spun off the content delivery system, it would also remove the perceived conflict of interest Pitchford takes umbrage with. "Steam helps us as customers, but it's also a money grab, and Valve is exploiting a lot of people in a way that's not totally fair," Pitchford says. "Valve is taking a larger share than it should for the service it's providing. It's exploiting a lot of small guys."

commandar6• 14 years ago

What are you basing this on? The quote in both the linked article and the AllThingsD piece indicates that he said "I think Windows 8 is a catastrophe for everyone in the PC space." He isn't just talking about Valve.

bcbrown• 14 years ago

A business catastrophe, not a usability or market catastrophe. "I think margins will be destroyed for a bunch of people."

malkia3• 14 years ago

"Microsoft is charging between 20 to 30%" - I think that's too much, it must be much less than that, but I don't know for sure.

recoiledsnake4• 14 years ago

Reference: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/windowsstore/archive/2012/07/20/maki...

Store fees are calculated on a per-transaction basis as well. These fees are based at 30% of the app price, until your app reaches $25,000 or equivalent of lifetime sales (aggregated across app sales and in-app purchases) when they change to 20% of the app price.

trotsky3• 14 years ago

To lure in would-be developers, Microsoft is establishing an attractive revenue-split model that trumps what Apple delivers to its App Store and Mac App Store software partners. The Microsoft split starts at 70-30, between developers and Microsoft, respectively. This is the same ratio Apple offers, but once an app has proven its success by garnering $25,000 in sales, the split shifts further in the developer’s favor to 80-20.

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2011/12/windows-8-store-intro...

Ralz3• 14 years ago

Also I am 90% sure that this only applies to metro apps, non metro apps will be featured in the store but users will be directed to a website (chosen by the application developer) to purchase/download the product from.

malkia3• 14 years ago

Sorry. You guys are right. I was thinking of Xbox/360, not PC.

alt_• 14 years ago

I would be more afraid of Xbox Live than the app store.

Buying is just a one time deal. Achievements and other social features of Xbox Live are constant and, if shared with the large Xbox network, will be very desirable for consumers.

mdanger• 14 years ago

Steam supports achievements and some social features, although those aren't 1:1 with Live's social features.

Splenivore• 14 years ago

Games for Windows Live was not warmly received. It’s unlikely that this will be a killer feature.

ralfn6• 14 years ago

They are not afraid of losing the competition, they are afraid of not being allowed to compete.

Steam cant be on Metro, and the x86/classic-desktop will likely end up, only in the high end of the market.

Just like Apple, the common win8 consumer device will be in the 200-600 dollar range .. running on ARM, and completely block any competition from selling content. The privileges of backwards compatibility and "side-loading" will be available only on 800+ dollar devices.

So, Steam on windows has no future.

james4k4• 14 years ago

Steam's cut is 30%. However, for that 30% you get to update your game whenever you want, and virtually as often as you want. By that I mean they don't impose any direct limits on how often you update, but the general rule is no more than once a week aside from hotfixes and the like. I'm not aware of any digital marketplace that gives you this much control, especially as video game updates will often be hundreds of megabytes in size. Contrast this with Microsoft's Xbox Live Arcade, which charges you $40k for each additional update after the first free update. [1]

Edit: It is worth nothing that if a user's game was activated with a retail key, Steam takes no cut. This means that you are effectively getting service for that user for free.

You also get Steam Cloud, which allows you to store your users' configuration and saved game files to be accessed anywhere, their peer-to-peer networking API which provides NAT punching. Then there's matchmaking, stats/achievements, Steam Community (their social network), and several other "Steamworks" features. [2]

Edit: Microtransactions is another big one, also known as in-app purchases. The online brochure for Steamworks is worth a read if you're interested in any of this: http://www.steampowered.com/steamworks/index.php

I haven't read a lot about Windows 8's app store, especially concerning Xbox Live, but Steam still has a lot to offer to developers.

[1] http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2012/07/microsoft-comes-under-...

[2] https://partner.steamgames.com/documentation/api

Xuzz• 14 years ago

Apple's app stores, on both iOS and Mac, both host games and allow unlimited free updates to them.

recoiledsnake4• 14 years ago

>Steam's cut is 30%. However, for that 30% you get to update your game whenever you want, and virtually as often as you want. By that I mean they don't impose any direct limits on how often you update, but the general rule is no more than once a week aside from hotfixes and the like.

Is there any reference for that?

msh2• 14 years ago

The windows app store gives unlimited free updates. It's only xbla for Xbox where they charge for updates.

shock3naw2• 14 years ago

Wow. $40,000 to push an update. Microsoft should put this into practice themselves and refund customers whenever Windows needs a patch.

Ralz3• 14 years ago

Unless the video game developer is creating a game only for metro then the Windows Store will not cause any harm to Valve. Although it is possible to list a non metro application in the store (http://blogs.msdn.com/b/windowsstore/archive/2012/06/08/list...) users will not be able to purchase or directly download those applications from the store and MS does not take a cut of non metro apps.

You bring up a good point about the WinRT ARM devices. These devises are very closed off similar to the IPad, the only option for WinRT tablet users will be to go to the Windows Store but I don't think Valve even cares about this market too much ( I don't think you can download games directly to your iPhone from the steam app, can you?). Steam in my opinion is geared towards the PC desktop gamer not the (ARM) tablet* user, so Valve has nothing to worry about.

*x86 tablets will most likely be able to download steam.

prawks• 14 years ago

> Steam in my opinion is geared towards the PC desktop gamer not the (ARM) tablet* user, so Valve has nothing to worry about.

The problem is that the PC desktop-gamer market is shrinking, and may shrink further if a large population adopts WinRT tablets. I'm sure there are many edge-case customers out there that would rather pay <$500 for a PC in exchange for not having access to the few indie games they or their children purchased on Steam.

While most avid PC gamers will keep with the desktop model, this sort of fork in the road for PC buyers is in essence also a narrowing of accessibility for future generations of would-be PC gamers.

mtgx• 14 years ago

I'm pretty sure Microsoft will end up doing to Steam what Apple tried to do with Amazon, and not allow them to sell games anywhere but in their store in the future.

fsaintjacques2• 14 years ago

And I'm pretty sure the EU will come back again and say: "You remember the antitrust case with IE? You're doing it again."

petitmiam3• 14 years ago

and saying he thinks the future of interaction will be through computerized wristbands

How far off are computerised wristbands?

SkyMarshal• 14 years ago

Not far.

http://www.france24.com/en/20120723-minority-report-software...

Produce• 14 years ago

The year of the Linux desktop?

MartinCron4• 14 years ago

The year of the Linux desktop is next year. The same as it has always been.

farinasa2• 14 years ago

Many people say that they have this or that application that keeps them clinging to windows and for me it has always been games. If it weren't for games, I would never use windows on any of my personal machines again, let alone purchase it. Linux distros don't even sell their products yet somehow are better thought out than any version of windows.

viraptor• 14 years ago

But they do sell the software. Either directly as a managed solutions to big companies, or very indirectly implement something per request or to solve an internal need. Or even offering support or getting some features sponsored. You may not give them money, but there are people / companies that do.

farinasa2• 14 years ago

It makes sense for corporations to pay for support if it costs less than hiring a team of people to do it. If that is the strategy a company uses to make their products more accessible to me, I'm all for it.

ryanisinallofus• 14 years ago

Steam has little to worry about in regards to the Windows App Store. They just need to keep pushing platforms, keep securing great titles, and RELEASE ANOTHER DAMN HALF LIFE 2 EPISODE. Exclusively on Steam of course.

Steam is pretty great and it's not easy to replicate. See "Google Play."

devth3• 14 years ago

I could write Steam in Lisp in about 10 minutes

freehunter2• 14 years ago

The value of an application is more than the sum of its lines of code.

ShellfishMeme2• 14 years ago

> RELEASE ANOTHER DAMN HALF LIFE 2 EPISODE

Probably not going to happen before they release their new gaming console. They need a good launch title and you know how long it takes them to build a game.

trobertson• 14 years ago

They have stated, publicly and clearly, that they are not working on a game console.

ilaksh2• 14 years ago

I use Linux. I am on Ubuntu right now. I just wish I could figure out how to get the Radeon/whatever graphics drivers right on this Lenovo Ideapad. I gave up.

I am rooting for Linux, WebGL, and other stuff. Whatever can help take down Windows is great. If Windows can actually take down Windows, even better.

MartinCron4• 14 years ago

I just wish I could figure out how to get the Radeon/whatever graphics drivers right on this Lenovo Ideapad. I gave up

The fact that things like this are still an issue makes me think that it will take more than just Steam to make desktop Linux more than a tiny niche in the gaming market.

estebank• 14 years ago

Au contraire, having Steam available might be just enough to push for better driver support from nVidia and AMD.

reedlaw• 14 years ago

With Steam on Linux there will be more pressure for GPU vendors to clean up their drivers mess.

jlgreco4• 14 years ago

The radeon driver is open source. It should just work, assuming it can work. (Maybe it doesn't support your card currently?)

If you are talking about fglrx then I forsee nothing but pain for you. I doubt even Valve's encouragement can improve that situation.

ilaksh2• 14 years ago

Its working now! I finally figured out what the issue was, thanks!

Problem was that awhile back I think that Chrome wouldn't run WebGL and I thought it was a driver issue, so I installed the fglrx crap, which not only didn't make Chrome run WebGL but it completely screwed me, and I never properly removed it until now.

JVIDEL• 14 years ago

It makes sense: with Linux support Valve could run roll Steam with a barebones distro creating their own OS (SteamOS?) to run on top of the rumored SteamBox, with better control of resources and no need to pay licenses to MSFT.

sbierwagen• 14 years ago

Blogspam.

Original post is https://allthingsd.com/20120725/valves-gabe-newell-on-the-fu...

c0nfused• 14 years ago

It seems like sbierwagen's linked article makes this a bit clearer than the op.

I think that the fear he has of Windows 8 is not that Valve will have competition or that steam will lose market share. it already is fighting similar offerings from a few different angles. He seems concerned that windows 8 represents a step back from the open platform model of windows. That it signals an attempt from Microsoft to build their own walled garden to counteract Apple's. This would inevitably be bad for third parties who make their living in the Microsoft ecosystem.

Linux then solves the problem because the platform is open. Not in terms of cost but of access

sakopov2• 14 years ago

Back in my more involved gaming days, Steam was a catastrophe for PC gaming. Other than picking up a game at a good price and automatically getting game patches from Steam, there was really nothing great about it. They had virtually no support. Your best bet was the forums. Throttled downloads were really fun too. Especially when you download a 5-gig game pack and have to sit there and resume your download every 5 minutes. Constant startup issues. I was patiently waiting for Battlefield 3 and was delighted to find out that EA decided to ditch Steam for this release, however their own Origin platform wasn't much better. Honestly, If i had to pick between slightly higher prices at the stores and Steam - i'd pick the stores. With app stores rolling in all over different platforms i'm afraid to say there is going to be very little room for Steam and this is probably a good thing. I'd rather see a good remake of Counter Strike and Half Life from Valve, than a new gaming platform.

nitrogen• 14 years ago

Throttled game updates? For as long as I've had my present Internet connection, I download updates from Steam with a median speed of 6 MB/s.

petitmiam3• 14 years ago

I've never had an issue with throttled downloads. Doesn't your ISP have a Steam mirror?

Also, Counter-Strike: GO is being released on Aug 21. http://store.steampowered.com/app/1800/

sakopov2• 14 years ago

The last game i purchased from Steam was roughly a little over a year ago and up to that point any game downloads would take days. I'm not on any kind of uber-fast connection (10mb) and never had any issues with any issues streaming or downloading content from any other service.

P.S. I have heard of CS:GO which is nothing more than old CS:Source with improved environment. It isn't a bad game by any means, but it is lagging behind multiplayer shooters like CoD, Battlefield.

fpp• 14 years ago

After the Vista Candy shop its toy blocks now...

- haven't looked under the hood of W8 yet but if MS wants to limit me what I can install on my computer / take over boot / BIOS control this one will certainly find no home on any of my computers.

Call me old fashioned but if I go to a shop and buy a computer (or have it send to my place) I actually want to own it and not find a clause on line 432'678 of the license agreement that it's now completely legal that a Seattle Corp has pwned my computer.

notatoad• 14 years ago

None of those things are true. Microsoft will not limit what you can install, take over your bios, or control your boot. In fact, windows 8 is the first windows to play nice with Linux boot loaders. Windows RT (aka tablets) is the only space where bootloaders will be locked. Don't get me wrong, locking it down anywhere is a shitty thing to do, but spreading misinformation is also a shitty thing to do.

zanny5• 14 years ago

Secure Boot and signed kernels called. Microsoft is pushing OEMs to sell laptops in the next several years with forced secure boot for x86 platforms.

csense• 14 years ago

Most EULA's contain a clause that says "This EULA may be changed by us at any time without notice to you. Your continued use of the product after any such change constitutes acceptance of such terms."

Seems like, if you don't have a script polling their website hourly for EULA updates, they can insert terms like "By continuing use of our product, you agree that we now own your computer, your house, your bank accounts, your first-born son and your immortal soul." And you'll have no choice but to pay up.

I'm surprised I haven't seen more headlines about companies trying this kind of s*.

chousuke• 14 years ago

EULAs can contain arbitrary demands, but that doesn't mean they're enforceable. The particular statement "without notice" sounds like something that would simply be ignored in court.

drivebyacct24• 14 years ago

>haven't looked under the hood of W8 yet but if MS wants to limit me what I can install on my computer / take over boot / BIOS control this one will certainly find no home on any of my computers.

Thank god. I was afraid we'd get through this thread without the typical misinformed FUD about SecureBoot.

tcarey83• 14 years ago

I love this. Gabe rules.

valgaze• 14 years ago

"According to Newell, there's a guy in Kansas making virtual hats for $150,000 a year. $150,000 a year."

pbreit• 14 years ago

Has anyone been able to get Windows 8 to work on VirtualBox for Mac? I got it installed but can't figure out how to make it work. Running W8 in a VM really demonstrates how silly hiding the Start menu in the bottom-left pixel.

gnufied• 14 years ago

It is one thing porting Steam to Linux and quite another making actual games available on Linux. Take OSX for example,a platform where Steam has been available for awhile now. and yet around half of most played titles on Steam are not available on OSX. What is more - Dota2 valve's own game is not available.

flannell• 14 years ago

hmmmm, is the secret Valve tv/games console Linux based?

cs702• 14 years ago

Along with another HN submission ("Changing My Mind On Microsoft"[1]), Newell's comments are important in and of themselves because of what they represent: a tectonic shift in the business community's perception of Microsoft.

Business executives are now openly doubting the future relevance of the Windows platform!

[1] http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4295711

Gabe Newell Wants to Support Linux, Because Windows 8 is a 'Catastrophe'

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