The Crisis in American Walking

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/walking/2012/04/why_don_t_americans_walk_more_the_crisis_of_pedestrianism_.single.html

by lysol • 14 years ago

118 130 14 years ago

slate.com

ojbyrne2• 14 years ago

Trying not to start a controversy or hijack this to an unrelated news story - but my first thought when the whole Trayvon Martin thing happened - the thing that alerts Neighborhood Watch types in bedroom communities isn't "walking while black," but just plain old "walking." It's suspicious.

Duff3• 14 years ago

Great point. The whole notion of the "gated community" is patently offensive and only possible by virtue of the automobile.

Walk through an old city. Even in the victorian era, where families were packed in single rooms with no running water, they were just a 5-10 minute walk from stately townhouses of the well-to-do.

Now, we feel the need to separate ourselves with berms and fences.

hammock2• 14 years ago

The upper classes separating themselves from everyone else isn't a modern invention...what do you think castles are?

daniel_solano• 14 years ago

Well, the ‘gated community’ as such may exist by virtue of the automobile, but the overall concept is much older and can apply even in high-density urban environments. What about a luxury apartment building that hires a doorman? It is the same thing in spirit as the gated community.

thejteam• 14 years ago

I've thought the same thing. I've never been stopped by anybody, but I've had local sheriff's deputies drive past me really slow and look really closely at me while I'm taking a walk through a nearby community during my lunch break. And I'm a pretty non-imposing white guy dressed in business attire. This wasn't even a gated community. Walking just isn't considered a "normal" activity in some areas, at least by people who aren't up to something.

noonespecial3• 14 years ago

I tried to take a walk in the suburban neighborhood where my parents live and was brought home in a police car. The neighbors called the police and reported someone suspicious walking through the neighborhood. Apparently, its just not done. I didn't have any ID on me so I was brought home in the cruiser so I could present my "papers" to the officer.

Its a terrible thing to think but I distinctly remember being grateful for the particulary large amount of light my skin happens to reflect that night.

mindrag• 14 years ago

It's not a terrible thing to think. You aren't thinking this because you're racist, but because we all know that in many communities, the cops will not give nonwhites the same benefit of the doubt that they extend to white people.

tallyho• 14 years ago

Nowhere in this country is a citizen required to carry or produce ID in public. Furthermore, officers need reasonable suspicion that you have committed, or are about to commit, a crime before you are required to identify yourself. You are never required to explain your actions.

hjhjhj• 14 years ago

I've been living in more car centric semi-rural area for the last two years and I have been stopped by the police 7 times.

I had a job where I walked to work .7 miles and people would ask me almost every day if I need a ride home.

Someone told me that the few remaining buses in the town should be eliminated because they only service the scum and losers of society.

I've had 4 cars attempt to hit me on my bicycle because they felt and yelled that I should be riding on the sidewalk.

simmons4• 14 years ago

You may be on to something. In some places, even walking downtown is suspicious. I'll never forget an experience I had in the 90's while working for a regional ISP in Alabama. I was spending the day at a town 60 miles away to work on our satellite POP, and decided to take a walk around the downtown to find some lunch. It just so happened that a sales guy from my office was also in town, and stopped on the main road and yelled "What happened to your car?!?!!" He was shocked that someone would choose to take a walk, and was telling people about the incident for weeks.

Of course, here in Colorado, it's not uncommon at all to find people walking or biking even way out in the suburbs. So I suppose attitudes vary greatly by region.

dredmorbius• 14 years ago

ObBradbury, "The Pedestrian". Written 61 years ago.

http://mikejmoran.typepad.com/files/pedestrian-by-bradbury-1...

marknutter3• 14 years ago

This is part of the reason my wife and I are moving closer to the city. I've been stuck in the suburbs my whole life and you have to drive literally everywhere. The thought of being able to stroll over to the local market is very appealing to me.

jerednel• 14 years ago

Funny. I'm at the point where I'd trade that convenience to have a proper yard. Or to not be startled by giant rats when I walk down an alley. Or not to have to wait for 4 trains to pass you by because they're too full in the winter. Or to not have to park 3 blocks away from my apartment and worry about whether or not it is a street cleaning day or somebody got a permit to block off the area I was parked at because I haven't driven in a day and a sign may have been posted that lets the city tow any car in their path.

The point is, there are advantages to living in an area that may not be as walkable...

But yes, the proximity is nice :)

enjo3• 14 years ago

You're just in the wrong spot:) I'm pimping Denver in this thread, but what the hell, I'm going to do it again!

I live in a house with a proper yard. It's not suburban big (1100 ft^2 house on a 4500 ft^2 lot), but it's really nice. I have a really cool grocery store 5 blocks away. I also have a small lake (that you can boat on) 6 blocks away in the other direction. I have a 40+ bars and restaurants within a mile of our house. Downtown is two miles down the hill, passing through one of the hottest neighborhoods in the city which adds a bunch more bars and restaurants to the mix. I routinely walk or bike to all of these places. My car is parked 90% of the time. We mainly use it for trips to Ikea or to the mountains.

Oh and my house, in an amazing neighborhood, was less than $300K two years ago:)

marknutter3• 14 years ago

I should have been a bit more specific: we're moving to an "inner suburb" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inner_suburb) which compared to the suburb I live in now is basically "the city" as far as we're concerned.

RyanMcGreal6• 14 years ago

I live close to the downtown core of my city and my daily commute is a 6 km (3.7 mile) round trip by foot. People seem to think this is exotic if not downright subversive, whereas they think nothing about sitting in a car for an hour a day and stopping off at the gym for a workout.

Note that I'm not in particularly good shape and a walk of this magnitude is not at all difficult. I arrive at work every day refreshed, alert and in a good mood, and I arrive home after work feeling the same way.

You couldn't pay me enough to take a job at which I was forced to drive, though I wouldn't mind cycling to work if the distance was too long to walk in a reasonable time.

Duff3• 14 years ago

I started doing the same thing last year, at least when the weather is pleasant. It's an amazingly liberating experience.

It makes you look forward to spring. I live in a place that typically has bad winters, so the prospect of breaking my neck on ice is not very appealing!

RyanMcGreal6• 14 years ago

I live in southern Ontario and commute on foot year-round. There's no weather that appropriate outerwear can't handle.

bosie• 14 years ago

use studded tires. mine last at least 3 seasons with daily commute. http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/studdedtires.asp

since i put the studded tires on, i have not slipped once. i haven't even come close to slipping to be honest. i pretty much rie as i would on clear, dry asphalt.

MatthewPhillips2• 14 years ago

Keep in mind that the number of U.S. cities where you would want to live within a couple of miles of downtown can be counted on with 1 hand.

jdminhbg• 14 years ago

That's a value judgment that millions and millions of people apparently disagree with.

_delirium3• 14 years ago

I can think of quite a few... San Francisco, Seattle, Portland, Chicago, New York, Boston, Dallas, Austin, Houston. Even Los Angeles and Atlanta have nice "new downtown" areas, though the traditional downtowns are sketchy (Wilshire and Midtown, respectively).

natesm• 14 years ago

That's also a list of US cities I'd want to live in at all, though.

Retric• 14 years ago

I don't live in Downtown DC, but by apartment complex is in a great area for walking. http://www.walkscore.com/apartments/details/801-15th-street-...

Within one block of my house is a park, a subway stop, a mid sized mall, a variety of restaurants etc. I find it's easier to walk to most places in the area than get in my car and then look for parking. Honestly, most of the high density parts of Arlington Virginia are vary walkable because it's both high density and mixed use.

misterbwong• 14 years ago

While I agree that most people walking would be generally better than not, I don't quite follow your reasoning.

According to this paper [1], mean comfortable walking speed for a male in his twenties is 253.3 cm/s (~5.67 mph). Assuming you are male and in your twenties, this means it takes you ~39 mins to work each way, not including stopping at intersections, etc. Contrast this to ~15 mins each way in a car.

This means the cost/benefit would go something like this:

Walking:

(+) 78 mins/day commuting + exercise

(+) Mood heightened

(-) Lesser exercise (walking vs 1 hr at the gym where, presumably, you'd do more than walk)

Driving/Gym:

(-) 90 mins/day communting + exercise

(-) Mood not heightened

(+) Better exercise

(+) More flexibility (want to go more than a couple miles for lunch? Sorry.)

My guess is that most people choose option 2 for the flexibility alone. This allows them to do their exercise when they want to. Whether or not they will is another story.

[1] http://ageing.oxfordjournals.org/content/26/1/15.full.pdf

RyanMcGreal6• 14 years ago

> this means it takes you ~39 mins to work each way

I'm not sure about your speed calculations - average adult walking speed is generally understood to be around 5-6 km/h (3-3.75 mph). I'm a male in my late 30s and I generally walk at a relatively brisk 7-8 km/h (4.3-5 mph).

As it happens, my walk home is about twice as long as my walk to work, since I pick up my son from school along the way. My walk to work takes about 20 minutes and the walk home takes around 45-50 (part of it at a child's brisk pace).

> This means the cost/benefit would go something like this:

You're missing some factors from your cost/benefit analysis.

* Walking to work means we only need 1 family car. That saves $10,000 a year in direct ownership costs, not including paying for parking.

* If I drove instead of walking, I would not use the time saved for exercise at a gym (know thyself), so I would simply miss that daily exercise. But if my commute just happens to constitute daily exercise, so be it.

* There are about a dozen restaurants within a 5-10 minute walk of my office, including some of the best places in the city. (However, I'm cheap and almost always pack a lunch anyway.)

* Downtown, not having a car confers more flexibility because I don't have to figure out where to park it.

* If I do need more transportation flexibility on a given day, I can always take my bike to work that day.

snowwrestler2• 14 years ago

253.3 cm/s is the maximum men's walking gait, which probably looks something like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2urNVmKnEaQ

For comfy gaits, the study reported 127.2 cm/s for women (2.8 mph) and 146.2 cm/s for men (3.2 mph). That matches my own experience walking and hiking.

Someone• 14 years ago

Looking at figure 1, page 17, that 2.5 m/s is mean maximum speed, not comfortable speed. That's about 1.5 m/s. I think 2.5 m/s is high, even for mean top speed.

cowpewter3• 14 years ago

I live close (<2 miles) to work/downtown and could technically walk, except for about two blocks in the middle of the commute that I would not feel safe walking in the dark alone. (I am female, maybe a man wouldn't feel this way)

Sometimes I ride my bike, which feels safer, if for no other reason than those two blocks go by awfully fast and an assailant on foot could not easily catch up to me, but biking feels like a lot more work than walking. I have to gear up, and carry my bike down the stairs from my apartment, and bike three stories up the parking garage for our office once I get there (the building manager hates bicycles, and so you cannot take them up the stairs/elevator). I also feel like one of these days I'm going to be hit and killed in that garage. I feel that way even in my car (well, at least in my car I probably wouldn't die. On my bike? Maybe). The visibility around the corners is terrible and people seem to drive through that garage like maniacs.

Unfortunately, I have night owl tendencies and even if I didn't, I work for a startup and often need to work late nights, so I can't just arrange my schedule to know I can walk home before it's dark.

RyanMcGreal6• 14 years ago

You raise a very important issue: a community is not walkable if a person walking in public doesn't feel reasonably safe doing so.

I'm not specifically aware of gender-specific data related to walking (though now I'm going to see what's out there), but I've looked at the issue with respect to cycling and there's a strong correlation between the gender balance of cyclists in a city and the city's material commitment to being bikeable.

civilian2• 14 years ago

That sucks :( My former office (in Pioneer Square, Seattle) has a pretty large homeless & drug-dealing population, but I rarely don't feel safe. Even when I leave work at 1am on a friday night, I just dodge a few intersections that are especially bad and I get home safe. But I'm also a guy-- I know that some of my female coworkers didn't like it, to the extent that we'd sometimes walk them to the parking garage.

Have you considered getting mace?

moylan• 14 years ago

perhaps a folding bike? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brompton_Bicycle

not cheap but easily transportable indoors and out. you can store it by your desk in a bag. i see them all over dublin as it's cheaper ultimately to keep your bike by your side than lock them in a public place. and also been brought on public transport.

eugenejen• 14 years ago

wow. I have been walking since my childhood living in two different cities (Taipei and NYC). I really enjoy walking hours just to look at streets and scenes in different hours of days. I feel that I can perceive the environment while walking in much higher resolutions and bandwidth of information flowing into my brain than driving.

I was interviewed once in Mountain View in 2006 and I remembered walking on El Camino Real rd between Palo Alto and Sunnyvale on 100F July. I was the only one walking on the road and it is pain in ass to cross road since the traffic system is designed for cars. But I still remember vividly the scenes along El Camino Real between Palo Alto to Sunnyvale until now, even just one day in my life.

dasil0033• 14 years ago

Yeah El Camino sucks (and 100F to boot, that is probably less than once a year occurrence), but it's quite nice to walk through the neighborhoods. I used to commute 10 miles from Sunnyvale to downtown PA by bike (or maybe Caltrain if the weather was bad). The first time I rode all the way on El Camino, but within a few weeks I had pieced together a route that completely avoided El Camino. I felt pretty proud of myself when I figured out all the pieces through trial and error. A few months later Google Maps added bicycle directions and nailed my route almost perfectly.

reneherse• 14 years ago

El Camino is definitely a car oriented byway, where the pedestrian is a second class citizen. Through most of the towns it passes through on the Peninsula, it has what I can only describe as an automobile-scale commercial "strip" quality.

But for the most part the cities are much more pedestrian scale and walkable just a short distance away from this road. "Never judge a city by its El Camino Real"; it's usually one of the least pleasant parts...

danso• 14 years ago

In NYC, I think nothing of a 30min to 1-hour walk to get to dinner. In my hometown, where there are sidewalks connecting my house to the "downtown", I can barely walk 3 blocks without feeling weird. It's not just the practical distance, or how "safe" it is to conduct the walk... it's the strangeness of walking through something not as dense as NYC.

I've done far less formal exercise these days than I ever have at any point in my life, yet I'm still about the same weight. I owe it all to walking, including the four-story walkup.

SandersAK2• 14 years ago

I pretty much walk or bike everywhere in Brooklyn.

When I go home to Oregon, we're constantly in the car. "Getting a coffee" consists of getting in a car, driving for 5 minutes, grabbing a to-go cup at Starbucks and driving back home... I can't really do it anymore.

bitwize• 14 years ago

Must not be Portland, where driving makes you one of the untouchables, as distinguished from the Master Race astride their bicycles, kitted out in TRON gear.

kilowatt• 14 years ago

This is so true. Although I'm not sure it's entirely about density--I think part of it is just that you're so alone as a pedestrian. At least if you're walking around my hometown, you might be the only one on the sidewalks, barring neighborhood kids hopscotching around or whatever, for 2 miles, even though there are homes and businesses everywhere. The psychological effect of being such an outlier is really noticeable.

graeme• 14 years ago

I feel exactly the same way in the Plateau area of Montreal. I'm in Society when I go walking around, at any hour of the day or night.

I was recently in Calgary, and felt alone amidst giant buildings. It was quite off-putting.

simonsarris• 14 years ago

This is actually one of the biggest reasons why I do not want to move. I love Nashua, New Hampshire because of how lovely it is to walk from the north end of town.

I walk to work every day in seven minutes[1]. The city maintains a large forested park that is a 5 minute walk from main street.

Every single weekend I walk to one of the fine cafes that exist on or around main street for breakfast. On workdays at lunch I have a wide array of restaurants, all within very reasonable walking distance. I purchase the fine beers I drink from the same building I work in[2].

Simply taking walks I can peruse downtown, or head north to the historic district and walk among the Victorian-era houses (I am living in one, built 1840, renting out the extra rooms to friends to make a kind of communal house), or I can go to the northern park and follow rail tracks through the woods, maybe swim in the Merrimack river (dangerous to amateurs but very fun), or go to Mine Falls by main street and stroll through the surprisingly deep woods in the heart of the little city.

I can go days without needing to use my car. I see walking as the norm in my life. My friends treat it as an eccentric novelty. I fear the day that I won't be able to walk to work anymore, and the simple walkable pleasures of my town are a big factor in not taking a job in SV.

Suburbs don't have to be horrible places, but as designed they seem very lacking.

[1] http://g.co/maps/8kvxg

[2] Warning, a lot of NH businesses have websites stuck in 1995! http://www.boomchugalug.com/

cncool• 14 years ago

"Simply taking walks I can peruse* downtown"

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

aaronblohowiak• 14 years ago

> to look over or through in a casual or cursory manner

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/peruse

enjo3• 14 years ago

It's a reason that I love living in Denver, Colorado. I live (affordably) about two miles from Downtown. There is a huge network of urban walking trails just a few short blocks form my house. I either bike or walk (or both thanks to the bike share) to work almost every day (or take public transit when it's really cold).

Since Denver is a very compact city at the core, I can get anywhere in the central city on foot. All the major sports stadiums and major cultural attractions are within a mile or two of each other. Most of the cities best bars and restaurants are clustered around the city center.

If you can live and work Downtown...it's just an amazing place to live. It's a major city that is extraordinarily approachable.

simmons4• 14 years ago

I'll second that -- I loved living in Downtown Denver, and still visit as much as I can. Funny, when I was reading about the seven-minute commute in Nashua, I thought "that sounds like the commute I had in Downtown Denver," then saw your comment.

I'm now living 6 miles out in Olde Town Arvada. It's actually a neat walkable area with coffee shops, brewpubs, etc., although there are no major tech employers within walking distance. (I work from home.)

davepeck• 14 years ago

A great start to what looks to be a promising series of articles.

My Walk Score means a lot to me [1]; if you're looking for a new place to live, Walk Score's apartment-finding service is the best tool I know [2]. The commute times feature is a particularly interesting bit of tech.

[1] Warning: I am irretrievably biased (see my profile.)

[2] http://www.walkscore.com/apartments

lutorm• 14 years ago

Awesome site! We're going to be moving soon, so this is exactly what I need.

hammock2• 14 years ago

Get your Walk Score: http://www.walkscore.com/score/times-square-nyc

dasil0033• 14 years ago

I'd like to see it with better UK support. My location near Clapham Junction in London scores an 93, but honestly that's a little low because this is the most insanely walkable place I can imagine. There are probably 300 shops within a quarter-mile radius, I'm two blocks from full on department stores, and there's even a Whole Foods three blocks away which is closer than I ever was to one living in Minneapolis, Santa Fe, and Mountain View (3 of the granolaiest places in America). Bus routes, I dunno, 30+? Rail links, no idea, but there are 18 platforms! Parks? 500 acres within walking distance.

J3L2404• 14 years ago

"Walkers Paradise" nice. But I knew that already. Actually everything is almost too close, two food markets and five pubs within 3 blocks, so I have to circle around to get more exercise.

jgw• 14 years ago

Sort of related - a funny observation that might amuse Americans about us wacky Canucks:

An awful lot of Canadians, myself included, avoid drive-through ATMs, and instead park and walk into the bank. And sometimes, when the bank's busy, we walk up to the the drive-through ATM.

I did this once when I was a co-op student in Starkville, MS, and got some really, really strange looks.

excuse-me3• 14 years ago

It's generally quicker to park and walk in than use the drive-though. (Except at Timmy's where nothing is quicker)

At In-and-out burger (the one reason good to live in Ca) there is generally a walk-up window by the drive-through so you can park and beat the queue.

If you feel this is un-america you could always leave the engine running while you wait.

flurdy• 14 years ago

Drive through ATMs? Never heard about that before. Suppose it makes sense in a drive centric area, but then I only use an ATM once or twice a year and I can walk to it if I need to.

But about the only time I do pay with cash nowadays is a drive through KFC, perhaps they dont trust people to not drive off with their portable pin&chip terminals...

simmons4• 14 years ago

My bank's branch in my neighborhood only has a drive-through ATM... and a sign disallowing pedestrians from using it. (A lot of drive-through places have such signs... liability, insurance, etc.) It's annoying. Of course, pedestrians walk up to the drive-through ATM all the time, anyway.

(By the way, I lived in Starkville in my college years, and also had some strange looks as a pedestrian...)

HeyLaughingBoy2• 14 years ago

Around here, the only bank ATMs that are not drive through are at the banks that are inside grocery stores.

You usually can't walk up to a drive through. Although my wife has ridden horses to the McDonalds drive through window before...

mixmastamyk• 14 years ago

I live and telecommute in Los Angeles and belive it or not live in a walkable neighborhood. It's near the metro station which I use if I need to go somewhere en route, there are fantastic restaurants in walking distance, and the weather is usually perfect. I love this lifestyle, it's so much healthier than the one I remember in the suburbs.

So, it's close to infuriating when I encounter the "soccer" moms in their SUVs who won't walk a single block or the kook at work who would give me a hard time for walking half a mile (.8km) to lunch on a beautiful day. Though, after I pointed out my guns and his gut the smug comments declined.

dasil0033• 14 years ago

I had to do a double take after reading the last sentence as "After I pointed my gun at his gut...".

carguy1983• 14 years ago

Sounds like you live near the red or gold lines, I used to take those to work every day when I worked in Old Town Pasadena and lived in Hollywood (two very walkable areas also).

You're highlighting something a lot of people don't understand about LA - there are tons of walkable neighborhoods in LA, the problem is traveling from neighborhood to neighborhood takes forever and requires a car.

LA was originally a dozen different cities, all walkable, all connected by good public transport. It's very, very slowly returning to that ideal but light rail and subway are about 25 years behind where it could be.

With the accelerated transit programs/taxes (new light rail, new subways, new bus lines) currently underway, the gaining popularity of biking, and the increasing telecommuting, it'll get better. Eventually. :)

noodle• 14 years ago

I'm currently living in the middle of Atlanta. High walk score, but walking around isn't really pleasant, and biking is less so.

I'm originally from Charleston, SC. I went back there recently because of a family member in the hospital, and I realized how much I really love that city simply because walking around and biking is so nice. The weather is nice, the streets are nice, greenspace everywhere, and you can literally walk the width of the peninsula in 15 minutes.

I wish more cities were like that.

kia• 14 years ago

In US (not counting downtowns of large Cities like NY or SF) it is much harder to enjoy walking compared to most other places in the world.

First you just look weird here when you walk somewhere and you are the only person walking in the street. Drivers usually look at you like you are crazy (especially if you walk in the evening when it's getting dark).

The second and most annoying thing is that sidewalks here can end suddenly without a warning. You can walk somewhere enjoying the nice weather and the sidewalk ends suddenly! WTF? You have to turn back or continue walking using the side of the road looking even more weird.

And the most strange thing is that Americans use their cars to drive to places located within just a couple of thousand feet from their home. For a person from Europe THIS is really weird.

bunderbunder• 14 years ago

I used to live in a neighborhood without sidewalks. People would often stop their cars to ask me if I was OK and if I needed a ride somewhere when I was walking to the local convenience store. It was less than a mile away.

One of the many reasons why I will probably not be moving back to the suburbs if I can possibly avoid it. Most the others seem to center on walking, too: Not being able to walk to the grocery store; not being stuck in a situation where going out to the bar would be synonymous with drinking and driving, not spending my after-dinner strolls in a ditch. . .

saryant• 14 years ago

> And the most strange thing is that Americans use their cars to drive to places located within just a couple of thousand feet from their home. For a person from Europe THIS is really weird.

That's definitely true. When I lived in Strasbourg I thought nothing of walking 20 minutes to the hypermarche. I enjoyed it. Now, back in America, I live ~5 minutes from a major grocery store but I would never walk there.

Not only are there no sidewalks but I'd have to cross a major street and the intersection doesn't have pedestrian signals. It'd be suicide.

And this isn't Middle of Nowhere, USA. I live in the middle of San Antonio, TX. Five minutes from the Riverwalk. It's nuts but it's the way it is.

(Though the Texas heat may have something to do with not walking as well)

omegant• 14 years ago

It would be great if (new)cities where designed in small nucleus of 2 or 3 miles in diameter with homes around the business and commercial center, all surrounded by more or less green zones. This nucleus could be connected by subway or train. Obviously that is not going to work with old cities but here in Spain, Madrid has seen a huge grow this last decade (every thing is halted now but still you can see the town planing from the air) and the town planing has been non existent to disastrous (huge concrete islands surrounded by highways). Now you have all the inconvenience of vertical cities combined with the inconvenience of the suburbs...(No green zones, cant go walking anywhere...).

Obviously political and economical interest of the terrains to be built have priority over all this nonsense...

greedo• 14 years ago

As a kid (10-13) I was fascinated by birdwatching, and often got up early to go down to the estuaries near my house. I'd pack a lunch, my binoculars, and field guide. It was about a 4 mile walk, but to a kid, that's nothing.

One morning, a sheriff's deputy and his partner pulled up, told me to stop, and started asking me wth I was doing at 5am. They were amazed that I would get up that early to watch birds...

Nowadays my hometown is a lot more "trendy" and the estuary is surrounded by multi-million dollar homes. And I wouldn't expect that an unaccompanied minor would be greatly appreciated by the LE community, nor would a kid that age be as safe as I was.

backprojection5• 14 years ago

"Carlin Robinson, 12, walks from her grandmother's car to the school bus in Manchester, Ky. Her house can be seen in the background. A study published in 2010, investigating high obesity rates in the town found that residents used cars to minimize walking distance, to the detriment of their health."

Association != causation. While the picture this caption is from is indeed ridiculous (grandmother driving her daughter essentially to the end of her driveway for the school bus), the implication seems to be that Americans walking less somehow has a causative effect in skyrocketing obesity rates. This seems entirely wimpy and facile.

Here's an alternative: there exists an underlying metabolic disorder that develops in a large proportion of the population, in response to something new in our environment ( new compared to pre 1950's ). A major effect that this disorder has is to partition a large part of our calorie intake towards fat storage. Now we have less energy available for expenditure, and as a consequence we either eat more or behave more sedentarily. Sedentary behavior will be a compensatory effect, that will indeed associate with obesity ( as measured by observational studies, like the one mentioned).

A good candidate for such malady would be insulin resistance [1] (and more generally, metabolic syndrome); Gary Taubes makes a very compelling case [2] that this is indeed the case, and that the primary change(s) in our environment to cause these problems is our marked increase in sugar and refined carbohydrate consumption [3][4]. The same hypotheses also seem a good explanation for rising type II diabetes rates.

Now this is still a controversial topic [5], but my point this kind of explanation seems much stronger and more on-the-mark, than such flaccid ideas like 'americans are getting fat because they don't walk to school anymore'.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin_resistance [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Good_Calories,_Bad_Calories [3] http://journeytoforever.org/farm_library/Cleave/cleave_ch2.h... [4] http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2012/02/by-2606-us-die... [5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin_resistance#Causes

dhimes3• 14 years ago

Exactly. The organized sports for kids is insane in its breadth and depth. We used to play one, maybe two sports. Now normal kids are playing something most seasons. Not only are they playing, but they are going to special coaching sessions, camps, and so on. This is much more prevalent today than when I was a kid.

We had football practice twice a week (at 12 yo) with a game on Saturday.

She got a ride to the end of the driveway? Probably because she has a double-header soccer match that night. A soccer match at which some parents will get into a fistfight- but that's for another thread.

Goronmon3• 14 years ago

She got a ride to the end of the driveway? Probably because she has a double-header soccer match that night.

Someone athletic enough to play in a double-header soccer match wouldn't bat an eye at walking 100 feet down a driveway. As someone who played many sports in my earlier years, this line of reasoning seems completely off the mark.

BadCookie• 14 years ago

One striking thing to me, as someone who spends half my time in San Francisco and half elsewhere, is how much thinner San Franciscans are than most other Americans. Now, it could be because San Franciscans eat less sugar (perhaps because they are wealthier and eat better on the whole). But the Bay Area in general is pretty wealthy, and I think you still see a lot more large people on the peninsula than in SF. The peninsula is much more car dependent. I don't think it's a coincidence, but I can't prove it either.

Goronmon3• 14 years ago

Now this is still a controversial topic [5], but my point this kind of explanation seems much stronger and more on-the-mark, than such flaccid ideas like 'americans are getting fat because they don't walk to school anymore'.

I interpreted the article's point is that people avoid any form of physical activity at all cost. One example being driving a child to the end of a driveway instead of letting them walk. If physical activity is essential to maintaining one's health, it seems this sort of decision making would be detrimental to one's health.

I don't see why this is such an awful stance to take.

backprojection5• 14 years ago

It's not awful, it just seems off-the-mark. My point is that it seems avoiding physical activity at all costs is better viewed as a consequence of such a metabolic disorder, less so than a cause.

I completely agree that exercise is very important in maintaining health (exercise, especially weight-training is know to increase insulin sensitivity to some degree, for instance), I just think its role in weight-loss, for most people, is greatly exaggerated compared to fixing a diet which actively promotes fat storage (going beyond a caloric excess).

We've been telling overweight people to exercise more and eat less (esp. fat) for 40 years, it simply doesn't' seem to work [1].

[1] http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/01/magazine/tara-parker-pope-...

HeyLaughingBoy2• 14 years ago

ridiculous (grandmother driving her daughter essentially to the end of her driveway for the school bus)

I drive my son about half a mile to the school bus every morning. One of my neighbors drives their children from the house, down the driveway to the street to the same school bus.

Their driveway is just under half a mile long!

We're not encouraging laziness: the reason I (and I suspect the neighbor also) do it is because if we just let him walk, he'd screw around and not make it to the bus on time. Eleven year-olds do stuff like that.

He walks home from the bus because it doesn't matter if it takes him a few extra minutes to get home.

snowwrestler2• 14 years ago

I think you probably don't have a good sense of just how much energy walking and other continuous small movements burn. There have several studies that showed that even different amounts of fidgeting can result in significant differences in energy usage, which correlated closely with levels of obesity.

"Overweight people have a tendency to sit, while lean ones have trouble holding still and spend two hours more a day on their feet, pacing around and fidgeting, researchers are reporting in findings published today.

"The difference translates into about 350 calories a day, enough to produce a weight loss of 30 to 40 pounds in one year without trips to the gym - if only heavy people could act more restless, like thin ones."

....

"The director of the study, Dr. James Levine, an endocrinologist and nutritionist at the Mayo Clinic, said the findings offered hope to overweight people, suggesting that relatively simple and painless changes in their daily behavior, like making an effort to walk more and ride less, could help control weight."

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/28/health/28weight.html

I picked this one because it's the NY Times and Science, but there are numerous other sources available via Google.

backprojection5• 14 years ago

That's exactly what I'm talking about. Most of us eat plentifully. If your metabolism is up to shape, you'll spend the extra calories fidgeting. That's what a lean person is. In this paradigm, a fat person is one who partitions off calories towards fat, regardless of physical activity. He then has to match expenditure to what's left.

DanBC2• 14 years ago

Yes.

A number of studies have shown that overweight people can make a difference just by walking around their home a bit more, and doing things in a more active way. For example, instead of sitting down to watch TV they could stand and do some ironing while watching tv. And then, when standing and ironing they can bounce a bit. Many of these seemingly trivial actions build into more exercise and better weight loss.

yummyfajitas2• 14 years ago

...the implication seems to be that Americans walking less somehow has a causative effect in skyrocketing obesity rates. This seems entirely wimpy and facile.

The fact that exercise causes weight loss has been borne out by numerous controlled experiments. Something I found via a quick search: https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.duke.car...

Also, Taubes' insulin nonsense has been debunked. Lets move on.

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2011/08/carbohydrate-h...

As for your hypothetical environmental cause, it must be extremely selective. For example, consider mixed income American neighborhoods (e.g., Harlem, Jersey City). This alleged environmental cause seems to primarily affect the lower income people. How does that happen? Are the yuppies with gym memberships and hipsters with their organic vegan raw paleo diets somehow immune?

backprojection5• 14 years ago

> Are the yuppies with gym memberships and hipsters with their organic vegan raw paleo diets somehow immune?

Well, yes. As a paleo dieter, I can tell you I can't be eating more sugar than someone from the 1850s. My guess is that anyone conscious enough to be on a raw-vegan diet, doesn't either.

> This alleged environmental cause seems to primarily affect the lower income people.

My understanding is that refined carbohydrates and vegetable oils are cheap. Who was it that said that if you have $1.5 to spend on food, you're better off (calorically) buying potato chips than broccoli.

> Also, Taubes' insulin nonsense has been debunked. Lets move on.

I do suspect that it's simplistic. It's much better than the popular notion of calories-in/calories-out, though. That's why I said that it's controversial, but that it's the kind of thing, that's more on-the-mark than simply blaming sedentarity as a primary cause in obesity.

> The fact that exercise causes weight loss has been borne out by numerous controlled experiments. Something I found via a quick search: https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.duke.car....

OTOH, exercise makes you hungry. What's more interesting is whether exercise is effective long-term to cure obesity. I'd suspect not alone, but that it certainly helps.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1914974,00....

gamble3• 14 years ago

Not mentioned is the fact that something like 2/3 of traffic deaths in the US are pedestrians struck by vehicles. That's around 20,000 people per year.

Auto manufacturers are pretty good at protecting the people inside the car, but we're not so good at protecting pedestrians.

dschleef• 14 years ago

5 seconds of Googling indicates that you're making shit up:

http://www-fars.nhtsa.dot.gov/Main/index.aspx

The second half is, of course, completely correct.

(Edit: please read "making shit up" as "your source is inaccurate")

gamble3• 14 years ago

You're right. I did see the two-thirds figure quoted in an article elsewhere, but I'll take the NHTSA's word over theirs.

simonz05• 14 years ago

Growing up on the Norwegian country side. We walked or went by bike in the summer. In the winter we went by ski or "spark" [1]. I remember on Saturday's we were allowed to go to the closest grocery store for candy. This was 4 km away. The trip took me and my sister one hour each way. We were 6 and 8 years old by the time.

From the age of 9 I went by bike to school each day. I loved riding that bike — such a freedom. I never thought about those 14 km back and forth[2]. From and to school was just about getting there. After school involved more activities.

Currently I reside on one of the most bicycle friendly cities in the world. Approximately 40% use their bike to work in Copenhagen. I always use my bike when I can. During the summer we sometimes bike around the isle of Amager. It's 42 KM all the way around, but the trip takes you through so many different scenes of nature.

To me, getting around by foot or bike, is freedom. It's the only way I know. I can drive a traktor, but have never driven a car.

[1] http://g.api.no/obscura/pub/978x1200r/04135/1326712053000_Sp... [2] http://g.co/maps/nck6s [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Porsche_Traktor_Diesel_Sup...

koji• 14 years ago

I consider similar things to this every time I'm in a parking lot. If you think about it, all parking lots are poorly designed. It is obvious that people will need to walk to and from their cars when in a parking lot. However, you rarely see appropriate walking corridors (sidewalks, marked lanes, etc) specifically for pedestrians. This is especially noticeable, and dangerous, in the narrow confines of underground parking garages.

The bias to favor the car is clearly evident. Who is the customer? The car or the driver?

minimax• 14 years ago

In Houston, where I grew up, older people (retirees) used to drive to their nearest indoor mall just after it opened for the day and walk laps around the inside the mall. They wanted to walk but they didn't want to do it in the heat. Some of those old guys, my grandfather included, could really move. I'm curious to know if that's still common.

minikomi• 14 years ago

I am addicted to walking. Tokyo is so perfect for exploring on foot. I've thought about organizing a hike-n-hack - where a group of similar enthusiasts take their laptops and walk for an hour or two, stop to hack in a cafe for an hour or two, walk again .. Check out a gallery .. Hack again.. Walk again.. This is pretty much what I do on my days off anyway so if you're keen and in the area let me know!

tsotha• 14 years ago

Part of it has to be just time. I used to walk a fair amount. A few miles a day. But as life became more busy there just wasn't time to walk to the grocery store any more - I go to the grocery store on the way back from somewhere else, because I just don't have an hour and a half to buy groceries any more.

As an aside, is anyone else annoyed by the appearance of the word "crisis" in the title of every damn news story? A crisis implies immediate danger. The lack of walking Americans is not a crisis. Global warming is not a crisis. Peak oil is not a crisis. These things are all problems, to be sure, but problems we have some time to deal with. Let's save the word for situations where it applies.

kephra• 14 years ago

I wonder, that no one gave a coders point of view to walking here.

I don't own a car for nearly 25 years. I'm a programmer for more than 35 years, and of course, I got a car with 18. But this first VW Golf told me a lesson, that driving a car and coding is incompatible. I crashed that car twice, after hacking through the night shift at a customer, driving home over fatigued. My second and last car was a BMW2002ti, it was fun, but hard to maintain. And I realized: I do not need a car!

Unlike other self employed, I do not need to carry heavy tools and equipment to serve my customer. And they pay for train and taxi cab, so I don't need a car to go to work. This was 25 years ago, when computer modems started to become brick size and cheap. Now I'm just 100ms away from my shop in Nashville, while sitting in Bremen Germany. A programmer does not need a car. No car could get me faster to work than the internet.

But a programmer needs a walk. Walking is like resting, for someone who sits in front of a computer while work. So I walk to buy my food, and I often just walk the imaginary dog. Walking to the lake, to my boat or to the boats house, just to relax, is one of my methods to attack difficult problems. My eyes can wander around, and legs move by them self, and my mind can drift around the problem, or even better about something completely different. I'll make a coffee, when I'm home, and often sit down immediately to code with much better productivity, than before the walk, when I was blocked. Walking is a way to get me into flow.

I'm currently living in the subs of a major German City. We have good public transport in Bremen, good bike lanes, and I'm faster to nearly anyplace in town, if I take the train, compared to car. But I also lived in the rural. Think about you have to carry your food, and your dogs food yourself over a distance of 5km/3miles, and suddenly a Pepsi becomes a luxury. Not owning a car for 25 years changed a lot of my life, not only when it comes to food, or when I comes to fitness. But most important when it comes to social life. Walking my neighborhood, to buy food, to relax, to talk with over the fence or in shop, is that part of my social life, where I can get contact with "normal" people. People who are not programmers, or belong to my peer group of friends from school, or to my yacht club.

I'm living in a cheap area, because I'm self employed, and reducing monthly cost, increases the runway. I'm not shy talking to a junky on the street. Well I have long hairs, beard and a hoodie also. The kids on the street greet me in the 'right' way to show respect. I helped people moving in, and often stay for a short barbecue or grill in neighbors gardens on my way home. Its important for a community that there is life outside the walls. That neighbors watch each other, especially in the cheaper areas. My ghetto is a good one. E.g. we have a new neighbor since January. An 82 year old lady from California, who came back to Germany because of health (insurance), and because she ran out of money. I saw her first when it was freezing cold, and she was standing there, in her plain white thin clothes in the supermarket. Half of the flats of my U-block here are rented out to Wohnungshilfe, a department of social welfare who have flats, for those who are in need, and can not find a flat on the normal market. Those could be people coming from jail, or in this case a bankrupt woman from California. It took less than 3 hours, to get her some warm clothes, a bed and warm blankets, and some furniture. I visit here regular, because our supermarket that is a mile away has no penut butter.

I own a small parcel in San Antioco, a Sardian island, and the people there have a special tradition called Passagiata. Every day after lunch, they walk the main street, up and down, again and again. Greet each other, talk a bit, drink a coffee or smoke a cigarette.

This kind of Mediterranean art of life is utterly lost in most modern cities. A suburb where people no longer walk, and talk, lost its soul and became a zombie of a town.

The Crisis in American Walking

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