ARPANET dialogues - fictional chat logs

http://www.arpanetdialogues.net/

by rl1987 • 15 years ago

87 23 15 years ago

nbashaw• 15 years ago

For those who are unaware, Francis Fukuyama is the Hegelian who said at the end of the Cold War that we have reached the end of history. I think it's one of the most provocative and misunderstood statements of the past 20 years.

lubos• 15 years ago

who are these people? Marcel Broodthaers and Edward Said appeared incredibly smart in those chat logs. And Ronald Reagan? would it be politically incorrect to say that he sounded like a close-minded, conservative, ignorant prick? how this guy ever became a president? I wonder...

IvarTJ• 15 years ago

There are Wikipedia articles dedicated to them. Marcel was Belgian while Edward was Palestinian-American.

rbanffy3• 15 years ago

> how this guy ever became a president?

Democracy ensures a people gets the leader is deserves.

And, before you shoot me, remember I am from Brazil and we just had 8 years of Lula. Yes, we got what we deserved too ;-)

As far as Reagan is concerned, he was not the worse Americans did to themselves, by far. Could have been, but he got incredibly lucky.

protomyth2• 15 years ago

Compared to The Carter, Ford, Nixon sequence; Reagan was a lot better for America. At least they stopped writing those "Do we need a new form of government / Is the Presidency obsolete" editorials.

ditojim• 15 years ago

i think he came across as a patriot and presidential. after reading this, i am not surprised he went on to become president of our nation. and we are better off because of it.

protomyth2• 15 years ago

I am still wondering about some verification on identities. [edit: I guess zwischenzug found the hoax link]

Ronald Reagan was probably the last President who wrote long form letters often. There are several collections of his speeches and letters in various places. The writings tell a much different story than the media soundbites.

The speech that probably got him the Presidency was one he did for Barry Goldwater's Presidential campaign. The speech was called "A Time for Choosing" text: http://www.nationalcenter.org/ReaganChoosing1964.html

This was a refined version of the speech he had been giving for a number of years.

I dearly wished the Presidents after him wrote as much (from a historical record), but it seems like we will have to wait for someone with a blogger's mentality to win.

Tekahera• 15 years ago

If I'm not mistaken, this might very well be the first recorded instance of internet trolling!!

MARCEL BROODTHAERS It should be encouraged to be freely available.

RONALD REAGAN Marcel nothing is free you know.

MARCEL BROODTHAERS I know Ronald. I know. We have your great nation to thank for this.

RONALD REAGAN Yes Marcel I do believe you have much to thank this great nation for. Indeed.

RONALD REAGAN America is great nation.

RONALD REAGAN I can think of no other nation that has contributed as much to ideas of democracy and free enterprise as my own.

philfreo• 15 years ago

RONALD REAGAN Free. Well who pays for it in the end though.

stevenashley• 15 years ago

Some interesting dialog here.

MARCEL BROODTHAERS: Students I think could benefit from this greatly. Vast networks of students. Youth must be provided with the means to grasp this opportunity.

RONALD REAGAN: Sounds a bit out of control to me.

jeffb• 15 years ago

I think Ronald Reagan basically defines himself as a communist here. He says communism is "the suppression of liberty in the name of a common good." But shortly before that, he suggests he is against Jane Fonda's "liberty" in the name of the "liberty of millions of Americans" (the common good).

MARCEL BROODTHAERS: But I imagine you might not always appreciate her [Jane Fonda's] views Mr Reagan.

RONALD REAGAN: No I dont care much for Communist sympathizers to be frank.

MARCEL BROODTHAERS: But surely she is liberated in her freedom to do so.

RONALD REAGAN: If ones liberty threatens to undermine the liberty of millions of Americans then I must disagree Marcel.

<SNIP>

MARCEL BROODTHAERS: Thats a good point Edward. Can you even tell us what communism is Mr Reagan.

RONALD REAGAN: Its the suppression of liberty in the name of a common good.

zwischenzug• 15 years ago

Exactly what I noticed. It's the central philosophical problem with classical liberalism right there! Before I sent this to friends: is this an April fool?

edit:

http://jdeanicite.typepad.com/i_cite/2011/03/the-arpanet-dia...

Yeah, a hoax, though disingenuously justified as a "FLIP".

ladon862• 15 years ago

Is this real? Everyone sounds like an obvious caricature of themselves.

rbanffy3• 15 years ago

It's plausible. They were approaching a new technology they barely understood and knew they were being watched and recorded.

And, while on IRC, I most probably look like an obvious caricature of myself ;-)

hollerith• 15 years ago

No it is not plausible. It is extremely unlikely that this is anything other than a hoax.

_delirium• 15 years ago

The lack of any mention of these chats in any historical literature I can find is also suspicious. I could imagine the transcripts being lost until now, but if indeed Ronald Reagan, Edward Said, and Jane Fonda had an ARPANet chat in 1975, I would've expected to be able to find at least one person having mentioned it!

Additional reason: the supposed discoverers are media artists, and this project was presented at a new-media art festival, rather than, say, a history conference (and no mention of how the transcripts may have been unearthed, or from where). Feels very much like a media-art project.

ladon862• 15 years ago

Absolutely, and the script almost has a sort of story arc as they await the arrival of Jane Fonda. It feels play-like.

sunchild• 15 years ago

It reads like a terrible script from one of those "House on the Hill" type of movies. I keep waiting for the evil mastermind to introduce himself and explain why he's brought everyone together.

And, at the same time, it also sounds a whole lot like every chat and message board I've ever been in.

zokier• 15 years ago

I think it's fiction and attempts to be an art piece. It's presented at galleries, not in museums. Vol II mentions: "Featuring guest collaborator Khwezi Gule, a curator, artist and writer" (emphasis mine). Also all other people working on the site seem to be artists, not historians or techies.

Why they can't mention that somewhere on the page is beyond me.

rbanffy3• 15 years ago

I would love to see this with the background sound of running ASR-33s...

cj• 15 years ago

EDWARD SAID: How do you measure success?

RONALD REAGAN: I measure it in our prosperity and in our influence on the world stage.

Translation: Money and power.

richardfisher• 15 years ago

Definitely not genuine. Clicking on the symbol at the bottom right of the page leads to a disclaimer posted 3 April:

http://www.arpanetdialogues.net/disclaimer/

Interesting, all the same.

ARPANET dialogues - fictional chat logs

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