After 4 Years of Silence, a Call to Mom on Mother’s Day

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/10/opinion/mothers-day-estrangement-parents.html

by danso • 6 years ago

56 57 6 years ago

I had a relatively good relationship with my mother but in my 20's and 30's I had a bad habit of being too busy for her. Either working or playing I was off doing things and not returning her calls. I lost her about 18 months ago and now I beat myself up for it.

I'm posting this here because this site caters to a crowd of people who tend to be workaholics. I've read comments here from people saying their mothers came to see them but they were too busy working to spend any time with them. At the end of your time on this planet it won't be the code you wrote or the marketing materials you worked on that you will remember. It will be the family and friends you spent time with.

microtonal• 6 years ago

I lost her about 18 months ago and now I beat myself up for it.

I am sorry to hear that :(.

The thing with parents is that they were always there (maybe not always there for you, but I mean present in your world) since your birth. For a long time in my life I didn't even consider that there would be a time without my parents. Obviously, you know rationally. But it does not feel that way.

Both my parents have now passed 65 (which was traditionally the retirement age in my country, and therefore sort of a milestone) and I have recently really started pondering that statistically they will only live for another 13-18 years.

We have been abroad for 5 years, but the age of our parents has been one of the important reasons to move close to our families again. We now see my parents weekly again (which our 6yo daughter also thoroughly enjoys) and my father in law every 1-2 months (outside COVID-19 times, because he lives across the border).

I am very happy that we made this choice regardless of what happens, so far we have had 1.5 years of much more regular visits and doing things together.

umvi• 6 years ago

At the end of your time on this planet it won't be the code you wrote or the marketing materials you worked on that you will remember. It will be the family and friends you spent time with.

But that's exactly why I'm working so hard on my side projects. I want desperately to be free from my 9-5 so I can have my 40 hours per week back...

Kalium• 6 years ago

And you might get it!

At the same time, being free later won't give you back the time you don't have today. Neither my friends nor my parents will last forever.

A few things have driven that home for me recently. The world won't hold still while I try to change my life. And I have to work with that limitation, rather than race against it.

eanzenberg• 6 years ago

Please don’t work countless hours so you’ll get some free time later in life. Work hard for today for a vision you truly believe in.

Swizec• 6 years ago

There’s a good story about the jar and the sand out there.

Fill the jar with sand and it’s full. No room for rocks and gravel.

But fill the jar with rocks and it’s full, yet you can still pour the gravel. It goes into tiny holes between the rocks. The now even fuller jar still has room for the sand finding those tiny crevices between the gravel and the rocks.

The rocks are your family and your health. The gravel is your job and other pursuits. The sand is social media and netflix.

Now here’s the kicker: You can still go and pour a glass of beer in the jar. It saturates the sand and gravel and finds room.

Because there’s always time for a beer with friends.

quercus3• 6 years ago

I am a workaholic who also loves his mother and has tormented himself with guilt for not calling her enough. Now 42, I've sort of come to terms with that guilt and realized there's a reason I keep mom at a distance. Talking to her is like groundhog's day, the same conversation every time. I do not look back and wish I had been having that conversation once per day instead of once per month.

I'm pretty sure on my deathbed I'm going to be glad I spent so much time working, because that's what makes me happy. When I look back on my life now, my most cherished memories are of times spent on my computer enthralled by a challenging project. Most of my memories involving family involve feeling bored and/or trapped, even though I do love them and have a good relationship with them.

goatherders• 6 years ago

Do you ever stop to consider what those conversations mean to her? I'm 43 and only started calling my parents more than once every couple weeks in the last 2 years. They tell me the same stories but that doesnt matter; their happiness is rooted in us sharing time together. I imagine they tell the same stories because as they are older they have fewer new things to share and they dont want our conversations to end. So they repeat something we talked about the week before.

But hey, if your feelings about your time and what's important to you trump having perspective on how someone else feels...

mellow2020• 6 years ago

I talked a lot with my mother, and as a result we could talk about pretty much anything, including stupid prototypes ^^ I think if I had only talked to her once or twice a year, she wouldn't have become as much of a friend and confidant as she was. If either of us repeated themselves a lot, the other would simply call them out on it.

Don't take this as me guilt tripping you though. People are different, and I'm not saying it's your fault that your family made you feel trapped. But where you can, be generous and patient. We'll all get old and find out why old people repeat themselves so much, if we get lucky.

ascendantlogic2• 6 years ago

The number of times you say "I" and "me" in this sentence tells me all I need to know about you and your priorities. Maybe think about your mother more than once a month.

crimsonalucard10• 6 years ago

You know they say that if you go to prison the longer you stay... more and more people start abandoning you just because of time. I'm talking about over a period of 10-20 years. Eventually contact is lost because everyone moves on.

First your girlfriend stops visiting, then your wife, then your kids.

They say the one connection that stays constant are your parents. If you're in jail for 20 years your parents will love you till the day you die and that love never fades. No one will ever love you as much as your parents.

The connection is one way unfortunately. Children will never love their parents as much as their parents love them.

As bad as your relationship is with your parents. Once they're gone, you're pretty much alone.

soulofmischief2• 6 years ago

You obviously haven't met my mother. Every time I see my mom these days she's asking for money for drugs or is too busy wrapped in her phone to have a conversation.

And I know plenty other people whose love for their parents far outweighs the love their parents show in return. Mother's Day is always a slog for me as I internally sort my desire for respect and sense of humanitarian duty.

pupppet• 6 years ago

Oof that's harsh, sorry you got a dud.

tw04• 6 years ago

Indeed. There are absolutely parents who match his description but to say that's every parent is more than a bit of a stretch.

crimsonalucard10• 6 years ago

Of course there are exceptions. But the general rule stands.

I say the above from anecdotal experience from my parents and other parents I know, and from quotations I hear from people actually living in prison.

I guess drugs throw off all the priorities, because in the end the actual mechanism that triggers love is in itself a chemical/drug as well.

proximitysauce4• 6 years ago

As bad as your relationship is with your parents. Once they're gone, you're pretty much alone.

Absolutely untrue. If your parents are toxic and damaging, you should cut them from your life. Some people can't live healthy lives if they keep contact with their abusive parents.

crimsonalucard10• 6 years ago

I'm in total agreement with you. If your parents are toxic, dump them for sure. Not every parent is like my description, I'm just describing a generality that describes the majority.

Despite this, I truly believe the statement below:

If you don't have parents that will stick with you while you're still in prison for 30 years, then you don't have anyone on the face of this earth who will do this for you. You are alone.

throwaway9482• 6 years ago

“Once they’re gone you’re pretty much alone”

All this says is how you feel about your life, many of us out here have completely different situations, including myself

crimsonalucard10• 6 years ago

Maybe what you say is true. Tell me about your situation.

I know that when someones parents are toxic and abusive they need to be cut off.

However, for many parents when the situation is reversed they do not have a choice. The love is too great and the parents have to stick with the child until the very very end.

If you murdered someone, a good number of parents will never abandon you. They will give up everything to help you including their own lives.

Do you have a friend or someone other than your parents who will stick with you no matter what? Tell me about it.

lostgame• 6 years ago

Talk to your Mother before it’s too late. I lost mine last summer and today is heartbreaking. All of the times I could’ve spoken to her, or made a difference in her life, are flashing before my eyes today, and it’s a sad go. You don’t know what you’ve got until it’s gone.

proximitysauce4• 6 years ago

If you have a good relationship with your mother.

If she was/is abusive and you're not comfortable talking to her, feel absolutely no guilt today.

pivo• 6 years ago

My biological mother died yesterday. I didn’t know her as well as I would have liked to because I found her only three years ago, but I loved her, and now I wish I’d called her much more often than I actually did. I thought I’d have many years to get to know her but I was wrong.

Klinky3• 6 years ago

Pretty sure my mother has Borderline Personality Disorder, which causes a lot of strain when talking with her. A lot of projected anger and manipulation. There are very justifiable reasons to refrain from contact with your parents, so do not let a holiday endanger your mental well-being.

iscrewyou• 6 years ago

But also do your part for the long run. You don’t want to regret talking to your mother when she has passed. That’s also bad for a lot people’s mental health. It’s important to find that balance.

proximitysauce4• 6 years ago

You don't have to "do your part". Your part is living a healthy life. Take whatever steps necessary to make that happen, even if that means cutting contact with your parents.

Klinky3• 6 years ago

I've been trying to find balance for decades. The other side also has to be capable of stability and balance, which has never been demonstrated as a priority for my mom. It feels as though she is incapable of it.

chance_state• 6 years ago

From the article:

My brother, nine years older than me, cut ties definitively and decisively. When I was 19 years old, he got married, leaving our mother and father behind. While my brother built a new family for himself, he remained close with me. His wife and in-laws welcomed me at every holiday table. I have never faulted my brother for his approach. Some parents commit unforgivable sins. We do not owe our affection to those who share our DNA but have not earned a place in our lives.

u801e• 6 years ago

The big lesson here is that how your treat your children will be how they end up treating you in your old age.

thisnewthrow• 6 years ago

I was in the same boat as you. A parent's bpd is hard to endure as a child and as I grew up I was always scared that I would inherit this trait. Thankfully I did not. I got to reconnect with my mom in a small way prior to her death and I feel good that I made that effort. I'm still pissed off about all those wasted years but I did what I could. Bpd is a horrible condition. For everyone involved .

NicoJuicy2• 6 years ago

Friends come and go, family is forever :)

filoleg3• 6 years ago

Depends on your definition of “family”, I guess, so I wouldn’t throw this around as a universal wisdom.

For a lot of people, their family is something that, indeed, is the closest relationship they will ever have. For others, their family is simply the environment and people they grew up with, and that doesn’t always mean it was pleasant or relevant as an adult. Those people just make “adoptive families” with closest friends, but that isn’t typically referred to as “families” of any kind. And i am not talking only about scenarios where the actual families were abusive or anything like that.

Here goes a personal example of the latter that, I believe, is pretty common. I grew up fine. My parents cared for me, provided for me as a kid. They weren’t “abusive” or anything like that. I really appreciated all the care, despite a lot of their failings as parents. I have zero hatred, anger, or any other ill feelings towards my family. We have always been on really good terms. Just mentioning that, so it is clear i am not making my point from an edge case position of someone who was abused by their actual family and now despises them.

But as i grew up, i realized that people in my family were just not pleasant or reasonable adults to be around (and no, i am not talking in terms of political opinions or some other typical stuff teenagers on reddit tend to whine about). I still visit them, i still spend time with them. But it is more of a sign of appreciation, gratitude, and respect, at this point. I do not enjoy spending prolonged periods of time with them, i cannot share my deepest secrets with them, i cannot hope for them to be understanding of a lot of things and decisions in my life, and i cannot get any good advice from them either. And mind you, i am not even in a situation where i need to “come out” to my parents (or anything like that), we are talking about much more insignificant things.

However, I do have a few extremely close friends who have persisted in my life for a really long time, and with them, I can absolutely share all those things and receive a useful advice. And they count on me to provide the same for them. Our relationship with each other is way more than the “respectful sign of appreciation” kind of a relationship i have with my actual family. But to me, those few extremely close friends are what i would count as the kind of people who are my family. And in that sense, they are there for me in all the ways that my actual family is not.

TL;DR: while your actual family can be what the family is supposed to be about, this is far from being always the case, and your few very close friends can fulfill that role for each other in ways that your actual family failed to.

NicoJuicy2• 6 years ago

The statement still remains.

It's not because they are not your favorite people that they aren't your family all of the sudden.

Your mom by birth is and stays your mom. They can be replaced, but there won't be another "mom" in the blood bound sense.

There can be less than optional cases concerning social issues, it doesn't mean it is not true.

If you break with a friend, as everyone here has done. It is a lot easier as there is no recurring encounters ( edge-cases here apply ofc)

TLDR: A lot of people seem to misinterpret social issues, while I meant the blood bound of my comment. The family ( in that sense) stays, the relation can go bad, ofc. As is the same with friends, but the family relation isn't disappearing.

Example: People are more intrigued to see their birth father/mother, which is perfectly possible they have never seen and have been replaced.

There is no factual social relation, but it was and is their parent/family.

Example 2: You are still going to visit your family although you don't have a deep relation with them anymore. That's perfectly fine and actually affirms my statement.

If one of your closest relationships suddenly has children and his priorities could change. It's perfectly possible that your relation will lessen over a 2-year period ( eg. His wife is always joining and you don't have deep conversations anymore, so you meet him less, ...).

Ps. If you want to challenge the statement.

Who else are you visiting outside of your family because of "respect" :) . Do you do something similar for a friend/acquaintance? :)

Or if you would have money problems. Would you stay at your parents or your friends place as last resort. Who would you ask first/feel most comfortable with asking? :) ( Edge-cases are possible ofc)

After 4 Years of Silence, a Call to Mom on Mother’s Day

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