European Commission President Juncker tweets that a Brexit deal has been done

https://twitter.com/JunckerEU/status/1184764705384124416

by seapunk • 7 years ago

67 102 7 years ago

twitter.com

jandeboevrie• 7 years ago

Duplicate of https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21280334

akmarinov• 7 years ago

But this one has comments, the other one doesn't :(

rvz2• 7 years ago

The DUP doesn't support it, so this is not a fully agreed deal.

Between the EU and the UK it is a 'deal', but as far as the Democratic and Unionist Party (DUP) is still concerned, they still stand by their rejection of it [0] even after their announcement of the deal. Therefore, more negotiations are needed to satisfy both the DUP and the EU before holding a vote to MPs first.

[0] https://twitter.com/duponline/status/1184707245478678533

mytailorisrich3• 7 years ago

Or... the plan is to have a general election with Boris Johnson able to say "I have a deal agreed with the EU, now give me a clear majority and let's get on with it", and bye bye DUP.

pjc505• 7 years ago

His current majority is -41, I believe, due to sacking a lot of MPs. This strategy didn't work for Theresa May (indeed it created the DUP situation!) and it won't work for Johnson.

tonyedgecombe2• 7 years ago

My guess is it will be put to parliament, there will be an amendment added for a second referendum, he will complain about it but deep down be rather pleased to have it taken off his hands.

rndgermandude4• 7 years ago

Boris already lost the majority, even without the DUP defecting.

But (parts of) the opposition parties could actually vote for the deal, thinking it's better than no-deal or gambling on a second referendum.

pjc505• 7 years ago

Which parts? Can we name names? Are there really that many people willing to get kicked out of the Labour party at this late stage to support an obviously bad deal?

tonyedgecombe2• 7 years ago

I don't think that matters, right now he has someone to blame (the DUP), that's all he cares about.

kmetan• 7 years ago

There is no such title as "EU President".

seapunk• 7 years ago

Fixed

arethuza4• 7 years ago

Doesn't really matter unless it is also passed by the UK parliament - which looks unlikely at this time, which was also the fate of the last deal that Theresa May's government negotiated.

growlist9• 7 years ago

It does matter, because those that reject it will at some point have to justify themselves to the electorate in a General Election, of which currently the opposition are running scared.

Edit: and what's more to remind everyone - over and over and over again we were told 'This is the only deal!' by Barnier, Juncker, Varadkar and many many others, and the anti-Brexit crowd used this to bash Leave over the head again and again. Turns out it wasn't the only deal. Fancy that!

pjc505• 7 years ago

We can't have an election until the extension against no-deal is secured. If Johnson wanted an election he shouldn't have made the fuss about being determined to exit at the end of the month no matter what.

Traster• 7 years ago

This deal is going to fail because of the pro-brexit contingent of the conservative party. The DUP are against and it looks like the ERG are likely to follow suit once it becomes clear exactly what is agreed. So whilst you're right that they'll face a GE at some point, the people responsible for stopping the deal to leave the EU are likely going to be campaigning for a deal to leave the EU (and then continuing to vote against it if they get elected).

arethuza4• 7 years ago

Well, it might matter in that respect but as far as the short term it does look like we won't be leaving on the 31st.

Mind you - I'd happily accept this deal if there was a confirmatory referendum - so maybe some parties would agree with this deal on that basis.

[NB Even Dominic Cummings used to think a confirmatory referendum was a good idea].

mpweiher2• 7 years ago

Ahem...as far as I can tell, this is the solution the EU initially proposed wrt Northern Ireland. It was the UK that rejected that solution.

So "only deal" is always in the context of "respecting UK red lines". Many other deals were on offer, including Norway etc.

lkramer• 7 years ago

It was the only deal with the red lines May had declared. Johnson was willing to compromise, so a different deal could be struck.

A different deal could also be struck if the UK were willing to stay fully in the customs union or otherwise were willing to align themselves more to the EU.

pjc505• 7 years ago

And of course it's not the only deal - but notice that it moves none of the EU "red lines". Instead it puts a customs border between parts of the UK. Which was previously unthinkable on the UK side. And was certainly not in the Leave referendum prospectus.

Anyone who thinks this deal is good - better than remain - needs to articulate why a customs border in the UK is an improvement.

gpderetta3• 7 years ago

This is the only deal

That was true given the constraints imposed by UK. If UK was willing to change the "red lines" different deals were always possible. The whole UK backstop for example was actually requested by the UK, EU only wanted NI in. It seems that Boris backtracked from it (details are still not known) and a new deal was made.

For me the surprising thing is that Boris actually managed to get a deal at all, as most just assumed he was stalling.

SirHound• 7 years ago

It's the same deal only the backstop is a permanent arrangement.

OscarCunningham9• 7 years ago

The idea that Labour don't want an election is absurd. They've been demanding one since last year. The only reason they're voting against one now is that Johnson would pull the UK out of the EU whilst Parliament was dissolved. They'll support an election as soon as possible if there's another extension.

ReptileMan2• 7 years ago

The thing is that now Boris Johnson delivered a deal so he can freely go with no exit if the parliament refuses it. Which he hints he really wants. Until the mess has gone trough courts 31st will be long gone if he decides to not seek extension.

benj1118• 7 years ago

No, parliament have the option to reject it.

wrnr• 7 years ago

It's a tragedy this divorce, our wife is leaving us and we get to keep the kids.

deca6cda37d02• 7 years ago

Wouldn’t the whole brexit thing be easier if there wasn’t a UK anymore and 4 individual countries. Scotland for sure and Northern Ireland I guess want to stay in the EU. England wants to leave. Wales I’m not sure about.

e2le• 7 years ago

Not everyone in England wants to leave either. Not everyone in Scotland wants to stay.

mcv2• 7 years ago

Politics is always a matter of compromise. Allow Scotland to stay while England leaves, and give everybody some time to move if they're unhappy with the direction of their country.

tom_mellior6• 7 years ago

If "everyone" were the threshold we apply, politics could never get anything done. Scotland voted 62% remain, that is a pretty strong mandate for remaining. Stronger than the 51.9% leave vote for the UK overall.

SmellyGeekBoy• 7 years ago

I'm not sure that Scotland and Northern Ireland would automatically be allowed to "stay" in the EU - wouldn't they need to reapply for membership as new entities?

mstade• 7 years ago

As far as I understand it they would have to reapply, but if I recall correctly back when the referendum on Scottish independence was a thing the EU said that they'd fast track their application, whatever that means.

Again, if I recall correctly.

mantap2• 7 years ago

Yes but it would be a mere formality as they are already part of the EU. Especially for NI which would be joining an existing EU state, not getting independence.

OscarCunningham9• 7 years ago

A neat solution would be for England and Wales to jointly declare independence, leaving a UK consisting of Scotland and Northern Ireland.

calpaterson2• 7 years ago

This is about as politically realistic as the alternative: for the EU to break into its constituent parts instead so that a simple ROI-UK deal could be arranged without involving trade policy with Hungary, Portugal, etc etc

arethuza4• 7 years ago

Some are, some aren't - I flew out to Spain recently and unexpectedly got fairly emotional at the prospect that it might be my last time through the "EU Citizen" channel.

I also see far more EU flags flying from peoples houses than Union Jacks - but then I am in Scotland!

Lio2• 7 years ago

This is not that simple. It wasn’t a first past the post election in any area. It was based on overall majority for the whole.

As it happens a majority of people in Wales voted for leave but that's not the same as "Wales voted leave".

The 38% who voted leave in Scotland count just the same as the 47% who voted remain in England.

If more people had voted remain in Scotland (38-62) or Northern Ireland (44-56) we wouldn’t be in this situation today.

(The same is obviously also true for people in England and Wales).

r721• 7 years ago

BBC story: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-50079385

Illniyar• 7 years ago

This didn't change much - https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-50079385

From with it looks like the backstop is still there.

Northern Ireland is going to have different Rules than the rest of the UK that align with EU regulations (it's unclear how much different but the issue was never one of degrees).

There is still going to be a customs check between Northern Ireland and the rest of the UK to determine if goods are heading out to the EU or only inside Northern Ireland.

HugoDaniel• 7 years ago

Will farage finally leave the EU with this deal ? It certainly feels like he is the one pushing the barrel on a race to the bottom. His mep salary most definetly makes him interested in that.

rvz2• 7 years ago

No he will not.

He stated that he would rather back an extension + General Election to go for a deal with the Brexit Party, than back Boris's deal due to the agreement mentioning a placement of an internal border between the UK and NI.

At this point, he would rather go for a no deal.

European Commission President Juncker tweets that a Brexit deal has been done

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