DNA from cigarette leads to Dakota Access arrest warrant 3 years later

https://kfgo.com/news/articles/2019/sep/06/dna-from-cigarette-leads-to-dakota-access-arrest-3-years-later/934803/

by anigbrowl • 7 years ago

112 72 7 years ago

draw_down• 7 years ago

I’m sure our intrepid freedom of speech crusaders will be along to decry this any moment now!

deogeo2• 7 years ago

I'll decry it - for the growing surveillance state that shows how difficult it's getting to anonymously protest, for the corporate-skewed use of police resources (I'm sure more serious crimes went under-investigated while they were busy doing DNA analysis on every piece of trash from the protest), and for the chilling effect of prosecuting on the mere basis of presence at a protest. There's always a chance protests will get out of hand, and few people would attend if merely being there resulted in being prosecuted for everything the protest as a whole did wrong.

I also cried "censorship!" when 8chan got kicked off Cloudflare, when Facebook banned white nationalism, and when a cartoonist was fired from a rural newspaper after criticizing agribusiness.

I hope this helps you to a less strawman-like view of free-speech crusaders.

fzeroracer• 7 years ago

The problem is that what garners the attention of said free-speech crusaders tends to be wildly unbalanced.

The issues of FB banning white nationalism and 8chan being kicked off of cloudflare incited a massive thread and attention here on HN. Then you have stories like this one with the government itself engaging in very selective measures in attempt to censure people and it doesn't gain nearly the same amount of attention as it should.

I've posted various similar stories here on HN and there is a very obvious slant towards what 'violations' of freedom of speech invoke a larger response here on HN or across the various tech communities.

dang3• 7 years ago

Please don't post ideological flamebait to HN.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

LMYahooTFY• 7 years ago

This response seems ridiculously low effort, and doesn't even try to conform to HN guidelines.

Can you elaborate any more on "free speech crusaders" and why whoever you think they are deserve only your disdain and dismissal?

I'm actually not clear on why it's relevant.

acollins1331• 7 years ago

I wonder if there will ever be enough of a political pushback on this stuff to change anything? I feel like people that care about privacy and not having a dystopian government are always going to be the minority. What needs to happen for normal people to start to care?

robotron• 7 years ago

It will have to occur to someone they care about or themselves. By then it will be too late.

kgwxd• 7 years ago

But that will only change the mindset of the person it directly affects, and only maybe. Somehow, it needs to become part of the system, by default, whether most people care about it or not. Once it's in place, any stray from that default needs to be met with instant backlash from within the system itself to keep it in position. It's a never ending fight.

anigbrowl8• 7 years ago

You could argue that the 'Green New Deal' touted by left-leaning members of Congress and some Presidential candidates is an (indirect) policy response vs the right's preferred approach of building more fossil fuel infrastructure.

RcouF1uZ4gsC• 7 years ago

A crime was committed , and DNA evidence is being used to solve the crime. How is this any different than using DNA evidence to solve other crimes?

Also, I find it interesting that a person who was there presumably out of respect for the environment, is polluting the environment by his smoking and littering.

kennywinker3• 7 years ago

I have three replies:

1. is civil disobedience a crime, or the duty of all engaged citizens?

2. dna proves he was present AT SOME POINT, at that location, but not that he did anything illegal. I suspect they don't actually need to win the case, they just want to chase this guy down to chill further protests.

3. while I don't like cigarette butts littered around either, the environmental impact of a cigarette and its filter is so far outweighed by the impact of the pipeline in question. To compare the two is ridiculous.

cjensen• 7 years ago

The whole point of civil disobedience is to intentionally commit a non-violent and non-destructive crime.

If there is no crime, in the US it's just a lawful protest as permitted by the First Amendment.

mistrial9• 7 years ago

.. because, the motivation to prosecute, and then the penalty for conviction, is not evenly applied across populations, nor proportional to the activity which is being called crime. Many future scenarios societally include escalated penalties, escalated prosecution and escalated statements by various parties to unequally apply the force of law, for political or other reasons, on human actors.

Casual, personal items used to determine identity and lead to prosecution years later, are of societal concern for a lot of reasons.

The character smear of the subject in the story, with a statement that implies one cigarette in the wilderness is on par with some invented hypocrisy, is typical of baiting-style political talk, and probably not appreciated among thinking people who are actually considering the issues and circumstances.

ridgeguy• 7 years ago

For me, it's odious because it's in the vein of:

"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." [1]

I think it's politically motivated abuse of process intended to curtail protest speech.

[1] attributed (attribution disputed) to Cardinal Richelieu: https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Cardinal_Richelieu

anigbrowl8• 7 years ago

If you want to prosecute people for trespass based on DNA alone, consider the fact that is a regular supply of DNA-keyed evidence available for free in the ashtrays of many bars, convenience-store trashcans, and so on. Indeed, if you get into a dispute with a vindictive neighbor it's probably not hard for them to get your DNA from your trash and use it to cause you a serious legal headache while you establish your alibi.

capableweb• 7 years ago

Seems to be missing an explanation on how they managed to figure out whoever smoked that cigarette was involved in the riot. Is there videos of that specific cigarette being thrown on the ground or something like that?

whoisjuan2• 7 years ago

Reaching that conclusion is pretty simple. At least simple and straight forward enough to charge someone. Probably not as simple to get an actual conviction.

I think this is what happened. They probably found several cigarette butts inside the perimeter of the vandalized private property, they ran DNA tests for all of them and one matched this guy's DNA. There are only a few possible reasons for his DNA to be inside that perimeter:

1) He was a contractor doing work for the Dakota Access Pipeline operator (probably already ruled out, otherwise he wouldn't have been charged).

2) Somebody took his butt from outside and put it inside the perimeter (very unlikely).

3) He actually smoked that cigarette and dropped the butt in that location while he was vandalizing it (most likely scenario from the prosecution point of view).

4) He trespassed the property at a different time and smoked and dropped the cigarette butt at that time. This is still an unlawful behavior but is probably better than all the other charges. (This is a possible scenario but it would be pretty hard for his defense to demonstrate this is what actually happened).

Again. This is enough for prosecutors to charge this guy but it doesn't mean at all that this is good evidence to get a conviction. In my humble opinion, a cigarette butt with your DNA is pretty weak evidence in this particular case.

paulsutter• 7 years ago

So you’re saying, no problem, all he needs to do is prove his innocence?

seanmcdirmid• 7 years ago

If he had an alibi for (3), then (4) would be plausible to show.

droithomme6• 7 years ago

This specific incident a bunch of people were around the equipment. Presidential Candidate Jill Stein was there and took a can of spray paint and painted the scoop of one of the bulldozers with an activist slogan. The incident is on film and was widely covered by the media. That was the vandalism. These bulldozer scoops have a rough life and any graffiti on them wears off within hours of their next use so the assertion that this was legitimate damage is questionable. It's known and documented on film exactly what happened there on that day. It's also known that only a tiny number of people engaged in bulldozer graffiti, the particular people who did were filmed, and their identities are known. The person named in the affidavit was not among any of the people who were seen painting the bulldozer scoop. Furthermore nothing observed there would be reasonably described by any rational person as "rioting", which is the charge being levied with this butt being the only evidence presented.

inflatableDodo• 7 years ago

2) Somebody took his butt from outside and put it inside the perimeter (very unlikely).

Only if you discount squirrels.

anigbrowl8• 7 years ago

That's why I posted it - using DNA to prove trespass seems wildly disproportional to the gravity of the offense, while being insufficient to prove participation in any more serious crime.

blt• 7 years ago

Daily reminder that police exist to protect the "property" of the ruling class.

m-p-3• 7 years ago

The police is there to protect the law and order, and the ruling class don't want the current order (them on top) to change.

19ylram49• 7 years ago

Precisely!

newguy1234• 7 years ago

Police are there to protect the political ruling class and their power structure. Same with the military. This is why I am confused when people are "proud" to serve in the military. That's like being a slave used to build a railroad, which you will never use or benefit from.

dang3• 7 years ago

Maybe so, but please don't post unsubstantive comments to HN. Especially not ideological flamebait slogans.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

anigbrowl8• 7 years ago

That seems rather biased, Dan. While the 'daily reminder' bit is snarky dismissing it as mere flamebait or soganeering is unjustified and veers into trying to control the discussion. It's quite relevant considering the context.

nimbius• 7 years ago

This whole protest always seemed pretty dystopian to me. The fact that the government of North Dakota is still combing the scene for DNA leads to prosecute additional protestors 3 years later after having acquitted or probated nearly 400 of them seems to imply this is quite a witch hunt.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dakota_Access_Pipeline_protest...

In September 2016, construction workers bulldozed a section of land the tribe had identified as sacred ground and when protesters entered the area security workers used attack dogs which bit at least six of the protesters and one horse.
At least six protesters were treated for dog bites, and an estimated 30 were pepper-sprayed before the guards and their dogs left the scene in trucks.
In May 2017, internal TigerSwan documents leaked to The Intercept and other documents obtained through public records requests revealed a close collaboration between the pipeline company and local, state, and federal law enforcement as they carried out "military-style counterterrorism measures" to suppress the protesters.

jessehorne6• 7 years ago

https://theintercept.com/2018/12/30/tigerswan-infiltrator-da...

m0dest• 7 years ago

like something straight out of The East

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1869716/

markdown• 7 years ago

security workers used attack dogs which bit at least six of the protesters and one horse.

How many years did the security workers get in jail? In my country that would be quite a few for "intent to cause grievous bodily harm"

sieabahlpark2• 7 years ago

I can't remember wasn't this the same protest that after they left they left the entire place full of garbage?

boomboomsubban2• 7 years ago

It's very difficult to clean up after yourselves when you are forcibly evacuated.

sandworm101• 7 years ago

> The fact that the government of North Dakota is still combing the scene for DNA leads to prosecute additional protestors 3 years later

I doubt this DNA was combed from the scene three years later. This was a cigarette that was taken three years ago and has been in an evidence locker for years. Finally, today, an arrest is being made. We don't know whether it took three years to do the testing or whether they knew of the match years ago and only now decided to arrest. Three years is a common statute of limitations limit. They could have been working on this from day one and now, with a SOL looming, they have decided to move forwards.

Or maybe the DNA is the announced link and they had an identification by other means. Maybe by relying upon the cigarette they aren't announcing that they have been talking to witnesses/informers. The cigarette is enough to get the warrant, without the need to divulge the existence of informers just yet.

bb88• 7 years ago

But why bother with a DNA test for vandalism and protesting?

Especially if you haven't mandated DNA tests for Rape Kits and still have a backlog:

Rape, Murder, and Battery are one thing. Protesting and vandalism are quite another.

http://www.endthebacklog.org/north-dakota

jessehorne6• 7 years ago

I went to North Dakota when the camp was at its height. It was incredibly beautiful and inspiring.

droithomme6• 7 years ago

Brother, I was there with you as well. I saw no criminal activity by protestors (protectors). Everything was legal. No doubt there were some crimes here and there but certainly not rioting, terrorism, etc.

Those claiming now that everyone there committed federal crimes, I am here. Come arrest me. File your charges. I will ensure you are countersued for libel and false arrest. I will take you all down and as a lifelong successful engineer and entrepreneur I have the financial resources and legal advisors to ensure my rights. I committed no crime whatsoever. Bring it on, everyone making these claims. Bring it. I am here, waiting for all the internet basement accusers to make this real. Come now, let us grapple and let the courts determine the truth.

jessehorne6• 7 years ago

I think I had a cigarette butt or two in North Dakota at the time, too. Looks like they need to come get me as well. I'm still in good ole Des Moines, Iowa. :)

There was no illegal activity going on. Everyone told everyone else how sensitive things were. We were all on our toes. The true crimes were committed by the paid oil protectors, the cops, the companies making this project happen and the government.

They took a LOT of land from a lot of people, simply trying to get by. Even if you opposed it and refused any sort of financial compensation (which in fact several people tried to do) then the land was taken anyways.

aaronax2• 7 years ago

I lived in North Dakota during it's height and 30 years prior. It was a ridiculous protest driven by emotional overreaction to a normal construction proceeding (the Missouri had already been crossed near Williston by the same pipeline).

It had a disruptive negative impact on many of the surrounding communities. And the state was left with a huge mess to clean up after all the protestors left.

boomboomsubban2• 7 years ago

It had a disruptive negative impact on many of the surrounding communities

Given that it also nearly doubled the size of the county, it probably kept those dying towns afloat.

And the state was left with a huge mess to clean up after all the protestors left.

The state is also still spending tax money doing DNA tests to find a nonviolent protestor, not to mention the police bill rung up forcing all those protesters to leave.

anigbrowl8• 7 years ago

It's hard to believe that those pushing people off the land for trespass in forcible fashion would have decided to delay a day if they had pointed out the they needed time to clean up their campsite. Did you really think that argument through, or was it just a convenient way to express a negative opinion?

dbg314152• 7 years ago

My family has a cattle ranch near the protest site. What I saw was that the some of the protesters didn't really know the difference between a rancher's tractor, and pipeline equipment. Now... there is some overlap there with dump trucks, but there's no way a combine can build a pipeline (edit, a combine is a machine used for separating grain from the stalks). A number of ranchers had their equipment vandalized just for having a field near the protests (5-10 mile range). Incidents of people misbehaving were pretty well documented, and worse... these ranchers didn't often have vandalism insurance to make them whole again. I don't think it was quite all "Kumbaya" is all I'm getting at here. So while I was against the pipeline, I was more against people fucking up rancher's property. These guys have a hard enough life without some punk indiscriminately trying to pour sugar in the gas tank of everything they could find bigger than a riding lawnmower.

Anyway one of these has a clip of some of the protesters blocking access to a certain area. First hand, that was my experience trying to drive a pickup truck through one of the areas. These guys blocked the roads, came up to the truck, were incredibly aggressive... swearing and posturing right off the bat. My dad, who's an enrolled member of the tribe, tried to tell them he was just getting through... he's in his 70s, and these guys mistook him for a pipeline worker. Yeah... I mean, it was just surreal having someone who clearly didn't sound like they were from North Dakota yelling at my Dad, who has lived there his entire life, about how we were violating and trespassing on sacred lands and they had the right to stop us from using the road.

* Ranchers Impacted by the DAPL Protests Voice Their Concerns | The Mighty 790 KFGO || https://kfgo.com/podcasts/ag-news-leader/1694/ranchers-impac...

* N.D. Pipeline Protests Have Agitated Area Farmers - AgWeb || https://www.agweb.com/article/nd-pipeline-protests-have-agit...

* My old comments on HN on this subject || https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

zonidjan3• 7 years ago

Surprise! Large groups of people have bad apples!

segmondy• 7 years ago

"we only collect DNA for violent crimes" right!

we need to remember this as they push for facial recognition, gait recognition, voice recognition, etc.

sieabahlpark2• 7 years ago

They left quite a trash pile when they left at the expense of to the Dakota taxpayers

mattnewton• 7 years ago

It was mentioned elsewhere, but it is hard to pack up when you are fleeing attack dogs, carried off in cuffs, or being pepper sprayed.

Besides the fact that that isn’t one of the charges filed here, and the cost of cleaning up litter can’t possible compare to the amount of police work spent to hunt down this person.

zonidjan3• 7 years ago

Do you really believe that any police officer anywhere in the US actually cares enough about littering to do a full-on forensic investigation?

zonidjan3• 7 years ago

We don't live in a surveillance state! We have all these rights and everything to prove it!

aussieguy1234• 7 years ago

First it's these protesters in the US, next this will be used against Hong Kong protestors

sys_64738• 7 years ago

How do you prove the evidence wasn’t tampered with in the intervening years? Are we to trust the police evidence gathering and storage techniques for that long?

DNA from cigarette leads to Dakota Access arrest warrant 3 years later

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