The prison inside: Japan's hikikomori lack relationships, not physical spaces

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/life/2019/06/01/lifestyle/prison-inside-japans-hikikomori-lack-relationships-not-physical-spaces/

by Ultramanoid • 7 years ago

90 54 7 years ago

japantimes.co.jp

kazinator3• 7 years ago

The term was coined by psychiatrist Tamaki Saito in the late 1990s

{Citation needed.}

This seems unlikely given that "hikikomoru" is a compound verb which means to stay inside.

If it's nice weather but someone stays at home all day, the hikikomoru verb is used for that; it (still) doesn't have automatic connotations of it being a way of life.

The "komoru" part has various meanings (according to EDICT): "shut oneself in (e.g. one's room); to be confined in; to seclude oneself; to hide away; to stay inside (one's shell)" as well as "to be heavy with (e.g. smoke); to be stuffy; to be dense", plus others.

wiggler00m• 7 years ago

The term was coined by psychiatrist Tamaki Saito in the late 1990s

I interpret the term (n. hikikomori) differently to the verb (hikikomoru) from which it is derived.

The term (hikikomori): individual instance of the social phenomenon of withdrawing from society and living in persistent isolation.

The verb (hikikomoru): used in reference to a specific (non-persistent) act of staying indoors, without necessarily carrying the broader sociological meaning. Edit: as another comment points out, just staying indoors for a weekend, etc.

Ultramanoid4• 7 years ago

The verb is used in normal daily conversation amongst us without the negative connotation ( as yet, given a general context ), as explained in a previous comment.

It's basically just staying home when you could do otherwise. A normal reply to "what did you do last Sunday ?", etc.

kazinator3• 7 years ago

from which it is derived.

"hikikomori" isn't a derivation, but a very basic inflection supported by all verbs, used all the time.

glandium• 7 years ago

According to https://medicalnote.jp/contents/150722-000005-CTDROY the term was coined as a translation for "Social withdrawal".

m0llusk• 7 years ago

It is the usage that makes it work. Their child is a shut away is pretty clear similar usage not uncommon in America.

kazinator3• 7 years ago

Is there a psychologist in America who is understood to have coined "shut in" or "shut away"?

AstralStorm2• 7 years ago

People in quite a few countries I've been to are more and more reluctant to try and form a relationship with a stranger, especially one who does not seem outgoing. No idea about the root cause of this general mistrust.

It's also easier to have substitute "network" relationships which are not complete.

Abd it shows we're geared towards living in relatively small communities whee everyone knows everyone, but new forced mobility breaks that, and so do long work hours. (I believe the optimum size is somewhere around 10k and average 30h workweek, more bursty.)

My personal solution to what almost happened to me was to fix the underlying problem with medication and start building from ground up. It took two lost years of my life (funny enough, during studies) and it's always a risk of relapse...

The solution is unfortunately to get really creative in finding actual humanity around. It's rare but happens.

It is actually quite hard for an adult to find an actual connection who isn't a spouse nowadays. You get to dig into weird social spaces like clubs (some are really niche too) and there are few guarantees. It's also for some reason harder for men because women still tend to build minimum social groups as a reflex ("coffee clatches" or rumour Mills)

A lot of it is extremely superficial too which can be annoying.

techsin101• 7 years ago

Just add to that. Humans have always lived in tribes. Tribes internally were mostly socialistic but between tribes it was free trade. You could say a man few thousand years ago was more certain of his future and less stressed about career then today. You knew your village goes to farm those lands, have neighbours who will feed you when you can't, gather for stories every evening, ... Life was physically hard but otherwise easy and simple

nradov• 7 years ago

You're romanticizing it. Very few primitive people had it easy. Life was hard and just staying alive was often complex. Especially when an epidemic came through, or your village was caught in the middle of a war.

closeparen• 7 years ago

In a bad harvest year you were going to starve, in a wartime defeat you were going to be killed or sold into slavery, and in an epidemic you were going to die.

Futures were far from certain with those existential threats on the horizon.

humanrebar6• 7 years ago

I guess that's true if you consider churches weird. Some are weird. Most are full of fairly normal people. Other than the desire to focus on growing as people. And, depending on your area, the theism.

But all the other desires and concerns you list are met by millions of people by going to church. And participating! Just like university, it's possible to go while essentially being disconnected from everyone.

And if the concern is the weirdness, most churches would be more than happy to let folks join in on activities and charitable work with no theological or financial commitments. I've never seen religious tests in churches other than to be a teacher of religion, which makes sense.

bilbo0s• 7 years ago

As someone who was raised in a pretty religious household, I have to say that churches can, indeed, be pretty weird. Churches are like clubs. Whole lot of different clubs out there, but you really do need to be careful that you don't end up in one that's, well, let's just use the word, "unhealthy". There's a lot of "unhealthy"-ness out there in the religious community today.

bigred100• 7 years ago

I have a bad opinion of churches as my abusive father was quite a fan of them, and would in fact diagnose my siblings as I as possessed by demons and use this as an excuse to slap the shit out of us, torment us until we cried, etc. None of his church friends gave a damn or lifted a finger to help us.

falcolas4• 7 years ago

Starting with the caveat of “not all churches”, but it is a very common trend.

Churches have a weird entry criteria - you have to believe in their god (which can be offensive when it’s phrased like “you are incapable of handling your own life, leave it to God”). And if you don’t, you’re silently and persistently pressured into making that conversion, with a healthy dose of pity for you and your sinful ways.

hrktb• 7 years ago

“But the reality is that most hikikomori are people who can’t get back into society after straying off the path at some point,” he says. “They have been forced into withdrawal. It isn’t that they’re shutting themselves away — it’s more like they’re being forced to shut themselves away.”

Articles need some narrative, and I get that it's also trying to put the spotlight on a different variant of a phenomenon.

But I feel it's going too strong on the opposite direction. There must be a sizeable number of Hikikomori who cut themselves willingly from traditional society because they feel there's nothing there for them. Others, like quoted, are forced into it.

I'm sure the reality of it is pretty mixed and varied, especially as the definition has been broaden to encompass people who don't get out of their homes out of pure necessity.

watwut• 7 years ago

Why is there such a fascination with hikikomori on this site?

mikekchar3• 7 years ago

Because Japan Times says, "Oh, it's been days since we published an article on hikihomori" and publish another one. People who read Japan Times, then post it all over the place (not just HN). It gets voted up on HN for 2 reasons I think. First, there are a lot of people who use social media (like HN) as a crutch for dealing with their own mental health issues. Because they spend a lot of time trying to learn how to become healthy, they are interested in a lot of things like this (and it's not just hikikomori -- it's depression, and schizophrenia, etc, etc). Just look at all posts about various drugs and diet relating to mental health on HN.

The other reason is because some people like to bash Japan (and increasingly Korea it seems to me). I don't really like the word "racist" here because it really doesn't fit, I think. It's more culturist. Some people really hate the culture and think it's wrong, so they promote stories that show it in a bad light. I would say equally prevalent are people who unduly love the culture and promote stories that show it in a good light. There are tons of overly optimistic stories about Japan on HN.

Japan Times makes money from this second category (people who unduly hate Japanese culture and people who unduly love Japanese culture) and so post a ridiculous amount of trashy articles about these kinds of things. If you really want to understand Japanese culture well, I would advise avoiding it as much as possible. They are only in it to whip up emotion as far as I can tell.

Ultramanoid4• 7 years ago

Some people really hate the culture and think it's wrong, so they promote stories that show it in a bad light.

I posted this story. I certainly don't hate my own home or culture. Rather I think one must have lived a very sheltered life in Japan not to have been affected by the hikikomori issue, by alcoholism, or both, which I'd argue are the two biggest problems today in Japanese society, bar none.

Japan Times criticism is valid, somewhat. It's certainly not top notch journalism, very few articles are these days. But I can't quite go and post a study of hikikomori in Japanese.

Not a single person I know in Japan has had no contact with, or not suffered themselves directly these issues. Any public conversation about them is good and necessary.

NeedMoreTea• 7 years ago

I don't know a huge amount about hikikomori other than what I've read here and in other media pieces about the topic. Plenty of those have pointed out that the phenomenon has been seen, and is becoming more common throughout the Western world. Just not attracting quite the same attention or a catchy name.

So I don't see it as Japan bashing just that it's more widely known and talked about in Japan. Not much different to early discussions of ADHD coming from the US. The Western cliche of an uber-nerd stuck in their parent's basement or their bedroom, but surrounded by technology seems to me the more offensive description of a similar result - yet not seen as US or UK bashing.

As for a specific HN angle, it seems reasonable to suppose that a phenomenon that has grown alongside technological growth, in a nation that for many years was at the forefront of that growth may be connected. In the same way my kids and friends are incredibly wary of making a simple phone call - almost taking any and every option in preference. Perhaps this is part of the "cost" of technology.

dmos62• 7 years ago

I'd speculate that there's a lot of people who can relate to it. It's easy to see the phenomenon as a hyperbole for the general self-alienation, hyper-individuality and social insecurity that is so common these days.

diveanon• 7 years ago

Because people are looking for a societal scapegoat that enables them to ignore their untreated depression and reinforce their victim mentality.

imtringued• 7 years ago

Maybe HN has an unexpectedly high hikikomori population? The type of person that can support himself financially without leaving the house is probably working remotely and a lot of remote work can be found in the tech sector.

faissaloo• 7 years ago

I feel like this has alot of parallels with the incel movement

AstralStorm2• 7 years ago

It's not a movement, but the social cause is probably the same...

ThePadawan• 7 years ago

I find it very disappointing that the definition of "incel" has now strayed incredibly from the actual literal abbreviation of "involuntary celibate", a rather clinical and descriptive term.

In my eyes, it now encompasses anti-feminist politics and overlaps a lot with "redpills". What happened?

falcolas4• 7 years ago

Some people started looking for a cause of their “involuntary celibacy”, and chose the easy route - it can’t be me, so it must be you. Once the blame has been assigned in such a way, hatred is one easy step further.

berrynice• 7 years ago

What happened was that the mainstream media learnt what 'incel' was.

_bxg1• 7 years ago

Feelings of failure and shame are common among hikikomori of all ages.

It sounds to me like Japan's hyper-competitive business culture has chewed these people up and spit them back out (even though for some this happened while still in school), and now an entire population segment has paralyzing depression. Maybe that aspect of the country's culture will be forced to change for the sake of the economy.

The prison inside: Japan's hikikomori lack relationships, not physical spaces

Related Stories