Poland in the 80's Through the Lens of French/Swiss Photographer Bruno Barbey

by curtis • 8 years ago

210 106 8 years ago

trhway2• 8 years ago

political background at the time of the photos https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Poland_(1945%E2%80%...

That photo of Lenin with the "Solidarity" newspaper and a sign on the jacket - nice humor and is pretty telling that Poland definitely was rejecting the socialism as a foreign object :)

edit: thank you, corrected the link

jboxee• 8 years ago

You have a typo in your link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Poland_(1945%E2%80%...

conanthe3• 8 years ago

This is wrong. "Solidarnosc" was more socialist than the ruling party! This common misconception. If you read their manifesto, you can see they wanted even more socialism. That movement was only about taking over. In 1988 communists started capitalist reforms similar to China, but fall of the Soviet Union gave politicians coming from the Solidarnosc a chance. First thing they did was reversing the free market reforms and moving Poland to be a socialist utopia it is today and wasting huge potential.

trhway2• 8 years ago

This is wrong. "Solidarnosc" was more socialist than the ruling party!

yes, i know, and you're right in the sense that it is a bit more complicated than i originally said. The fall of real socialism in 198x in USSR was also associated with the part of society having that naive/romantic longing of "back to good socialism as it was originally envisioned by the great wise fuzzy warm grandpa Lenin" (never mind that Lenin was presiding over and directing the class- and political based genocide on the national scale as a natural part of his socialism) as opposed to supposedly incorrectly implemented real socialism of the time. So the Lenin explicitly embracing "Solidarity" artifacts on that photo is exactly the symbol of the same "back to and more of the good original socialism" and a rejection of that "wrong" real socialism.

The catch of course is there is only one socialism, and it is not the "good one" as that just doesn't exist...

mamon2• 8 years ago

Actually, it's more complicated than that. "Solidarność" was a big organization, with different factions. The some of the members, like Andrzej Gwiazda, Anna Walentynowicz, Kornel Morawiecki, were more right-leaning, patriotic, fighting for independence. And then there were people like Adam Michnik, Jacek Kuroń, Bronisław Geremek, who actually were communists by heart, in fact more dedicated to communist ideals than the ruling PZPR party.

badpun3• 8 years ago

I grew up in Poland back then. Looking back at those photos, what is amazing is the serenity due to lack of advertising on the streets and on people's clothes. The world's visuals didn't scream at you back then (except for the occasional propagandist poster or banner, but these were not everywhere like today's advertising is).

BTW later, when I was a young teenager in Poland's nineties, already under neoliberal capitalism, I dreamt of the commercials on TV being informative and helpful instead of the brainwashing puke they were (and still are). As an Amiga fanboy, I especially dreamt of a commercial campain that would convince people of Amiga's technical strengths :) Ah, the innocent years of youth.

Lio2• 8 years ago

As a fanboy of a different now defunct computer manufacturer from the same time period I also dreamed similarly about convincing people that my team was the right team.

It seems crazy to me now. Not because they weren't really good products for the time but because I was hitching myself to a commercial organisation with its own agenda on everything. Unless you're a share holder cheering on a commercial organisation, as I did, is silly.

If I could go back in time and speak to my younger self I'd point out that at least with FOSS you've as much right to the future of a project as anyone else. RMS really is correct on that.

yostrovs3• 8 years ago

I grew up in the USSR and I dreamt of Lenin because he was as ever present as advertising and Jesus put together in the US. Huge red billboards were everywhere, with quotes from or about Lenin and the party he created. When commercials appeared, they at least seemed lively and exciting.

agumonkey3• 8 years ago

What were the dreams about ? I don't know what it is to dream about a political figure

Krasnol4• 8 years ago

Hey, you missed the huge Polonez Ad on the wall there. The socialist Poland Mercedes!

jeklj• 8 years ago

Yes, that single ad.

0ld• 8 years ago

Technically, it is Fiat 125. Just with different body.

oblio3• 8 years ago

Well, I guess all this says is that when people aren't forced, that's what they want.

I'd rather have billboards than oppression, but maybe that's just me.

badpun3• 8 years ago

You think people want advertising? I’d say companies want advertisting, and people cannot do anything to stop it. There are some exceptions though, like cities banning outdoor advertising in historic city centres, the reason being that they’re intrusive and ugly, thus making the location less attractive for tourists. It’s a shame that a mere ugliness is not enough, it has to be linked with a financial loss - but it’s a step in the right direction IMO.

brbrodude• 8 years ago

Why cant one dislike both?

Bayart• 8 years ago

I remember ads you could find in computing/science magazines back in the 80s and early 90s in France, and they were all about technical specs and performance for certain use-cases. Pretty cool stuff. Now it's just colour puke and buzz-words.

vram225• 8 years ago

Now it's just colour puke and buzz-words.

Well said. The rot started some years earlier. See BYTE and other contemporary computer mags going downhill or shutting down, after a great run of many years, for example. Those computer mags used to have pages and pages of code listings, and text explaining the code (even though they still had ads for products, you could either ignore them, or read them as I often did, to learn about new tech, and some of the products were even good and interesting). Same thing happened with National Geographic magazine, sadly. My dad had a lifelong subscription to NatGeo gifted to him by a mentor who he lived with in the States, a friend of his father, while doing college there. We used to get the issues in India each month (when not stolen by the postal staff, which happened sometimes). As I grew up, I noticed the mag getting thinner, less pages for articles and photos, and more for ads.

agumonkey3• 8 years ago

I'm also shocked at the spirit on people's face. The ~lack of most modern things was replaced by other ways to enjoy places and times.

pjf• 8 years ago

...a lens biased towards countryside, and that would require captions to better understand the meaning of photos, IMHO.

dreta3• 8 years ago

there's no bias, the photos represent the general state of the whole country

praptak2• 8 years ago

No they don't. Source: growing up in said country during that era. There weren't that many horses then, even in the countryside.

And they did have tractors. Plowing with a horse was a curiosity even in the eighties.

iagooar2• 8 years ago

What are you talking about and why are you lying?

jetrink• 8 years ago

The following site has short captions for many of the photos:

https://pro.magnumphotos.com/Catalogue/Bruno-Barbey/1981/POL...

V-28• 8 years ago

It's better than nothing, but please note that a lot of these are unfortunately inaccurate.

Eg. even sizeable cities such as Wrocław are referred to as "towns"... Poznań is supposedly located in the Silesia region... Sopot is referred to alternately by its Polish and German name (Zopott), and the German name is given as the primary one for Frombork (misspelled "Fronbork"), while the Motława river is named "Mottlau" exclusively for some reason, etc.

akavel• 8 years ago

Arrrgh, a photo from Kraków showing the Main Square with the Mariacki church is labeled "The Wawel Castle". It's like showing a photo of the Notre Dame cathedral in Paris and labeling it "The Eiffel Tower". It's hard to me to even imagine how the labeling process went here... must have been done at least in a big hurry and with blissful ignorance of the subject.

Markoff4• 8 years ago

is there difference in polish language between town and city? i would think they distinguish only between towns and villages, cities basically don't exist and town it's their language equivalent

aquarin• 8 years ago

Another photographer. Poland (and some former socialist courtiers) in the 70's - 80's http://chrisniedenthal.com/en

AstralStorm3• 8 years ago

Yeah Niedenthal's pictures are not as one sided as these...

d3ckard• 8 years ago

Highly recommend those. Photos linked in OP are cool and true, but very... selected. They show what was already sort of archaic even for Poles. Niedenthal is way more representative and famous - he was Lech Walesa's presidential photographer later on if I remember correctly.

bobthechef• 8 years ago

Maybe post them on Hacker News?

wwosik• 8 years ago

Just a note - while photos are true, they should not be taken as the representative or a generalization of how average life looked like. Photos from an Indian reservation or city ghettos will show how the life in the US looks like for certain people, but not as all people in the US live. Obviously, a photographer will concentrate on more exotic topics from his perspective.

BTW, is that a feature of an old film, but all those photos look very very grim to me :) Even the ones where people joke and laugh.

aasasd4• 8 years ago

Contrast on the photos is cranked up and there are a lot of shadows (I think that's all natural for film, but dunno if also adjusted manually). Plus the photographer picked shots that look still, even frozen―more so when the objects have volume thanks to the contrast. Makes for an eerie and menacing mood.

koonsolo• 8 years ago

A Belgian photographer once showed that he can create any picture he wants, using the same environment. Well worth the 3 minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmbsXussxUc.

It has English subtitles ;)

keiferski• 8 years ago

I highly highly recommend seeing the film Cold War, which is set in 1950’s-60’s Europe. The cinematography is near-perfect and the set design really takes you back to communist-era Poland and Paris.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8ImvkXgGVWw

aasasd4• 8 years ago

It seems to me that the photos are selected towards the more exotic to a Western photographer or viewer. You could also have shots of urban life barely distinguishable from that of 80s' NY―but that wouldn't be as interesting to viewers, would it?

It's hard and possibly erroneous to judge from this temporal distance, but the more I look through cultural artifacts (and what memories I have), the more I feel that the spirit of the time was similar in many aspects across the US, Europe and the USSR (and maybe SE Asia too). Probably because the economy became progressively more global, and because there was a steady trickle of Western culture into even the USSR proper, since the 60s.

viraptor2• 8 years ago

towards the more exotic to a Western photographer or viewer

I'd go with "distinctly Polish" in many cases. The folklore clothing, wood art, ceramic heater/oven, trabant, polonez, priests, village houses, etc. are not just exotic. For me they're very much pictures that identify the set as 100% Poland. There are some exotic things in PL that would be less relatable.

I think the photographer did an awesome job with the selection.

aasasd4• 8 years ago

It might've indeed been photographer's intent, though I have to wonder if it's true in the case of the photos of urban environment―which look quite jarring juxtaposed to traditional elements.

It's notable how the USSR never really dumped traditional folk culture: folk tales were featured extensively in children's books, and folklore-based art was prominent. (This might've had something to do with how the government had to raise everyone's support and morale during wartime, afaik even dropping the intense opposition to religion.)

And, from what I know, mainland and especially Central European countries tend to hold tighter to their traditional culture compared to both the US and Russia (the latter having wandered around in search of its identity all through the past three centuries).

oblio3• 8 years ago

For me they're very much pictures that identify the set as 100% Poland.

I'm not Polish, but those scenes could very well qualify as being from my country (Romania). There's more similarities between countries in Eastern Europe than we'd like to admit :)

Markoff4• 8 years ago

how is trabant distinctly polish? more like DDR or whole eastern block, but not sure what's polish specific about Trabant

yostrovs3• 8 years ago

You're clueless and think you can judge this matter, while you ignore the fact that millions ran from Poland, East Germany, USSR,etc, risking torture and death, and ran only in one direction. And to you "the spirit of the time" was the same on both sides of the Iron Curtain.

fiblye• 8 years ago

Having grown up near Amish country in the US, these pictures make Poland look like home. Fashion is different from the people I grew up around, but it certainly doesn't look like the "communist nightmare" that I was always warned that it was--it looks like it could've been right near me.

iagooar2• 8 years ago

Sorry, this has little to do with what Poland looked like in the 80s.

Being born and having lived there for the first few years of my life, these pictures looks as exotic and strange to me as pictures from Yemen or Kazakhstan.

I'm not saying they're not real, but these pictures are clearly selected to be as far from what an average Western person considers to be "normal".

I guess it's like going to the US, only focusing on the Amish and extrapolating their way of life to the whole country.

xHopen• 8 years ago

WHile I understand you, you miss the “Through the lens” , Is his personal view, not the real life. That is exactly what photography should be , art.

Lio2• 8 years ago

People often complain that a photographer has objectified a particular subject whilst forgetting that cameras objectify everything that they capture regardless of the intention of the photographer.

What makes photography interesting is that a photo tells you everything and nothing about a subject.

Nothing shown in any photograph is real because you're looking at an impression of reality at a single moment in time.

yakshaving_jgt4• 8 years ago

In that photo with the wicker-basket love seats on the beach — which I'm guessing is Sopot — we still have those. Also ul Mariacka looks no different.

I'm guessing you're from somewhere prosperous? I mean even today, yes Sopot and Warsaw are just masses of Porsches and pretty women, but that isn't the case in some less well-off areas.

AstralStorm3• 8 years ago

Hmm, masses of concrete and falling apart houses are still in most cities, even today. Even some bigger towns.

LaGrange3• 8 years ago

In that photo with the wicker-basket love seats on the beach — which I'm guessing is Sopot — we still have those.

Amish also still exist. The issue is, this portrays a country that was by then very diverse, through a very specific perspective, that, through a rather suspicious coincidence, happens to match western stereotypes about the country, instead of challenging it.

Doesn't change the fact those are good photos, but while there might be true in their literal content, as a whole they provide a false narrative.

bobx11• 8 years ago

I love how poland embraces their history. Those beach baskets in Sopot are just typical of here and my wife’s grandparents have pictures in the same basket chairs that are out there today (kinda).

Many farm pictures can be seen with a 1 hour drive from Sopot today. There are some really remote places where people have horses, yet they have near gigabit LTE service. Borzestowo for example.

Coming from America where we have no single ancestor except “freedom” it’s hard to imagine why people would want to hang out there like that. However, it’s just part of the culture. We are lucky to be part of it.

aplc0r• 8 years ago

Is there a reason why the seats are facing away from the water?

romanovcode• 8 years ago

Thank you.

I've been in Poland only in 2000's but while watching these photos I could not believe that this is what Poland looked in 80s. Looks like some kind of village in middle of nowhere in 60's. The pictures were clearly selected to portray it as somewhat poor and non-western. The question is tho: Why?

oblio3• 8 years ago

It's exotic and therefore interesting.

It also makes people better off feel better about themselves. "You finish that plate right now, kids in Africa/India/wherever would give anything to have your food!"

pornel• 8 years ago

There's no conspiracy. Poland has really changed that rapidly during the '90s.

Krasnol4• 8 years ago

Well, considering that the rural areas of Poland looked like that and seeing horse carts delivering coal in Katowice was nothing unusual back then I'm not entirely sure if it is so wrong considering how much of Poland is/was rural. Even though I must admit I miss this "modern socialist" architecture that was there in the bigger cities for sure.

MichaelMoser123• 8 years ago

I recall that the women of Warsaw were all clothed in style at the time, despite all the problem with the economy. How did they all manage?

V-28• 8 years ago

Typically DIY and/or family in the West (or possibly Western charities).

Also trade trips to some other socialist countries that would happen to be better off at the moment. Depending on when exactly, it could be Czech Republic, Hungary, Yugoslavia etc.

paganel• 8 years ago

I'm a kid of the '80s from fellow Socialist country Romania and this photo: https://i.imgur.com/LFWANdK.jpg could have as well been shot in my country back then.

Also, the image of the old Polish peasant lady crying just outside Auschwitz is really, really powerful: https://i.imgur.com/uqTGzLO.jpg . Her headscarf (we call it "basma" here in Romania) is almost identical to what my both grandmas used to wear.

dougmwne2• 8 years ago

We are in the east of Poland and most of the farming scenes are still quite common. A lot of the clothing has hardly changed too for some older folks. It can be a real shock compared to the city.

ajuc2• 8 years ago

Meh, I'm from eastern Poland (lived in a small village near Lublin in 80s and 90s, spent every vacations in even smaller village near Włodawa in what I can only call Poland C).

I've rarely seen horses, and when I did they were a novelty, tractors were much more common.

7723• 8 years ago

The photo with the ship being pulled uphill. That still exists to date:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RDx-QLW2Tk

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elbl%C4%85g_Canal

vondro• 8 years ago

Nice photos. They represent personal view of the photographer, as every photo does in the end. One thing can be captured in many ways, showing different points of view or emotions. Enjoy one point of view from one specific place, one photo at a time.

AstralStorm3• 8 years ago

No picture of any newly built factory... (soon to be torn down or sold) or the concrete buildings that still make the cities ugly.

gadders• 8 years ago

I sent these pictures to a colleague in our Polish office, and he sent me a few before and after pics:

Before: https://i.imgur.com/18lEoGd.jpg

After: https://cdn.flixbus.de/2017-06/Gdansk-zwiedzanie.jpg

Before: https://pro.magnumphotos.com/image/PAR96165.html

After: http://www.psur.pl/ra/cmm_budynek_okm.jpg

http://navtur.pl/files/news/281.jpg

testrun• 8 years ago

Fantastic. The first before/after is incredible.

ido• 8 years ago

Feels like a lot of that stark difference in that first pair was due to particularly present weather in the modern one vs a cloudy/grey day in the old one.

contingencies• 8 years ago

Also there are trees now.

Markoff4• 8 years ago

it's mostly just light though in the first, raise gamma/brightness and make colors warmer and it will look pretty much same minus plants

thedaemon• 8 years ago

The boy's backpacks in the photo with them by the fisherman at the lake: they look like $500 backpacks. It's funny how some things have changed in price perspective.

aasasd4• 8 years ago

Eh, they were made from artificial leather with questionable feel, and, though the seams could be strong, the work was likely rather imprecise, so it's not quite the same thing.

‘Mass production’ goods from the 80s are now sold very cheaply second-hand, e.g. you can get these backpacks starting with $5, plenty for $15: https://www.avito.ru/rossiya?q=%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%8...

V-28• 8 years ago

Aside from the discussion on to what extent are these pictures actually representative of the overall conditions of the era, it's worth noting that the 1980s in Poland were particularly gloomy even by communist standards.

The system was clearly in the final phase of decline, and the crisis had struck hard.

The living standard had deteriorated considerably in comparison to the much more cheerful 1970s (when foreign credits helped to boost the consumption).

This shows in numerous statistics such as eg. alcohol or nicotine consumption, which peaked in the 1980s.

Jun8• 8 years ago

I’ve only been to Warsaw once, a couple of years ago, but has a strong mental image of ~80s Polish urban landscape formed from Kieslowski’s movies, esp. the Dekalog (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dekalog) Only the last photo in the set, of kids playing on an abandoned car in a grim apartment complex matched that image.

BTW, if you’ve never watched this series you absolutely should, esp, Dekalog 1 should be required watching for technical people, as an antidote to the hubris we sometimes feel in describing nature. Now that I have a son at that age, it strikes even closer!

jakubwaw• 8 years ago

I grew up in Hrubieszow (one of the eastern-most towns in Poland) in the late 90s and early naughties before emigrating. The photos are very much in line with the scenes I have observed growing up. It's such a contrast to compare my current environment to the one portrayed in the photos (and still lived by some of my extended family members).

If these parts stay unchanged, we will soon see places like (in Poland and elsewhere) as an oasis from the super-advanced reality most of the population lives within.

Going off other comments here and stories from my parents, the commercials and ads back then were thought to present a more modern, futuristic, "better" life that people worked hard to obtain. Soon, the commercials will present a simpler, older life that we dream of escaping to just for a moment. Interesting thought.

dariusjs• 8 years ago

It still looks like that today

Markoff4• 8 years ago

More like "poor rural Poland" but I guess it's not so catchy as claiming this is regular Poland in 80s where you could buy Coca Cola and watch American/French movies/TV shows. It's pretty sad to see someone pushing their agenda with such clickbait titles.

Poland in the 80's Through the Lens of French/Swiss Photographer Bruno Barbey

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