WeWork Tells Employees Meat Is Permanently Off the Company Menu

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-13/wework-tells-employees-meat-is-permanently-off-the-company-menu

by everdev • 8 years ago

35 57 8 years ago

bloomberg.com

PHGamer• 8 years ago

hippies

rayiner• 8 years ago

Obligatory: "this is why Trump won."

mc322• 8 years ago

Well, I can sort of see if the founder is a vegetatian and has issues with meat consumption.... but at the same time it’s dictatorial and patronizing and, to many, off putting.

Not as offputting as let’s say an omnivore or meat eater insisting on others all eating meat centric dishes, but still very jarring.

It’s very cause oriented.

ggg99907• 8 years ago

When I see stuff like this I do get about a 500 millisecond urge to vote for Trump in 2020 just to give a big middle finger to people like this CEO. Then I realize the cost of that middle finger and it’s too expensive for my tastes.

PhasmaFelis5• 8 years ago

That's pretty much why we got Trump in the first place. A lot of disgruntled Bernie fans who decided they'd rather watch the world burn than accept the lesser of two evils.

toasterlovin4• 8 years ago

Meat vs. non-meat is not the right lens through which to judge the environmental impact of your diet. Cost per calorie is.

For instance, whole chickens provide about about 1200 calories/dollar, whereas leafy green vegetables all provide under 100 calories/dollar. That means there is a 12x difference in the amount of resources required per calorie provided. You can go on about the externalities of meat all you want, but a 12x difference almost certainly makes up for them.

So if you switch from eating lots of meat to eating lots of leafy green vegetables and berries, you probably aren't making much of a difference. The better heuristic to follow is to just pay attention to how much your food costs. Less money spent on food = lower environmental impact.

If you're interested, I go pretty deep down this rabbit hole here: http://www.thinkfundamental.org/why-kale-is-actually-terribl...

iamforreal2• 8 years ago

What? No. This ignores subsidies, markup, shelf space, and that you probably shouldn't be going for the cheapest calorie per dollar anyway. Following your argument, we should all just eat pure sugar and butter.

I read your site, and it's all just FUD. You mention in passing how you'd need to grow agriculture to feed animals anyway, and then completely ignore that fact through the rest of your writing. You don't cite any actual environmental numbers, pull some out of your ass, and then hand wave your way through your position.

inimino• 8 years ago

sugar and butter

GP is talking about environmental impact, not health.

toasterlovin4• 8 years ago

Look, calories per $ is a crude metric that I would not put forward as useful for food items which are within 2x of each other in terms of calories per $. But when you're talking about a 12x difference, I think you have to engage in serious denial to dismiss it.

You mention in passing how you'd need to grow agriculture to feed animals anyway, and then completely ignore that fact through the rest of your writing.

I'm not sure what you think I should have addressed about this, but I have had people try to claim that meat cannot possibly be easier on the environment than plants, since animals consume plants and there is energy loss in that process, so I'll assume that's your objection. And the answer is that animals are fed plants which provide a lot of calories per $. If you were to base your diet on those plants (grains, essentially), then, yes, it would be better for the environment than eating meat. But I was specifically pointing out that there are classes of plants (leafy greens and berries) which are worse for the environment than some meat (chicken). There are also classes of meat (red meat; 50-400 calories per $) that are worse than certain classes of plants (potatoes, grains, and nut & vegetable oils; 800-3000 calories per $).

dragonwriter• 8 years ago

Meat vs. non-meat is not the right lens through which to judge the environmental impact of your diet. Cost per calorie is.

Only if you pretend that the entire supply chain is an idealized free market without externalities, which is wrong in basically every possible way when it comes to food, everywhere in the world.

toasterlovin4• 8 years ago

Yeah, my whole point is that when you have an order of magnitude difference in cost per calorie between two food items, that allows for an order of magnitude difference in externalities/subsidies/whatever.

walrus013• 8 years ago

If you meausred just calories per dollar you'd have everyone eating out of a communal 20 kilogram bucket of pure lard.

legostormtroopr• 8 years ago

Sure, there are strong environmental and ethical reasons against eating meat.

But do we really want to applaud companies dictating what their employees do in their down time?

Keep in mind this policy covers travel expenses, so if you have to travel for work, you must eat the vegetarian option while traveling or you will pay out of pocket. Even if the only vegetarian option is fries, which is not uncommon.

iamforreal2• 8 years ago

They're not dictating what employees can do on their own time, only what they can use company resources for. You can always find a restaurant with good vegan/veg options, although its admittedly harder in europe.

ggg99907• 8 years ago

So you fly away from your family to spend the night closing a deal for your employer and after a long day of meetings you sit down and have to order tofu because the latest Richard Hendricks of the hour started dating a vegan. Fuck this whole idea and fuck WeWork.

kgwgk• 8 years ago

Would you be so understanding of this rule if it was the other way around? If you were only able to expense meals including meat, and vegetarian options were carefully excluded at WeWork events?

themarkn2• 8 years ago

I was a vegetarian for years and it fell apart when I spent 6 months as a music tour manager. When you are on the road you need to work with what's available. I support being vegetarian and even encouraging this among employees somehow, but maybe there's a way that's more considerate and practical.

TheCoelacanth2• 8 years ago

The purpose of expensing meals is to compensate employees for the greatly increased cost of eating that is imposed by travel taking them away from their normal food storage and preparation facilities. It shouldn't be regarded as using company resources to purchase food. It should be treated as a form of employee compensation.

hyperdunc• 8 years ago

There are also strong environmental and ethical reasons against eating soy and other mass-produced crops in lieu of meat.

The best ethical option is to eat organic foods grown/reared by yourself or someone close by, but that option doesn't scale so well in our current economy.

astura2• 8 years ago

First off, I think this is a bad business decision.

But

Even if the only vegetarian option is fries, which is not uncommon.

Is not true in my experience.

I'm a vegetarian and I only very rarely have problems finding something to eat at restaurants, and not fries, I don't even like fries. Though sometimes I have to ask for substitutions.

I admit, if you are not actually open to eating non-meat products you'd have issues.

1996• 8 years ago

Meat is too expensive!

Ramen it will be. And it will teach them startup spirit!

andyidsinga• 8 years ago

...and a new cohort of coworking spaces kickoff with the investor pitch " 'we're the wework of the coworking spaces with meat' industry"

ggg99907• 8 years ago

I would tell any company that tried to dictate the content of my expensed meals while traveling to go fuck themselves. Sadly I know that not everyone has the privilege of doing so

walrus013• 8 years ago

I want to know how they plan to enforce it. Let's say I'm traveling and eat at an airport restaurant in the departure area. The receipt says "burger". I say I ordered the tofurkey burger. How can they prove I didn't?

trentlott2• 8 years ago

Take a picture of the menu after you double check your receipt, I guess. Or don't order risky items.

I doubt any restaurant would list a veggie burger as "Burger". There'd be a "V" or something, to explain why it was $2 extra.

ggg99907• 8 years ago

This is how corporations are like autocratic governments. And the larger they get, the harder it is to get away from their spheres of influence (if you’re a software engineer in Seattle, by rejecting Amazon as an employer you wrote yourself out of 90% of the open hiring reqs in the city).

ggg99907• 8 years ago

Can’t see how a company can do this and then meaningfully claim to care about “diversity.” Also worth noting that this decision falls wholly on employees and not at all on customers — best to abuse the people who will find it much harder to quit you.

pndd90• 8 years ago

Good bye WeWork. Just another crazy idea by the environmentalists, right after feeding babies with orange juice instead of milk. Btw, human DNA contains 50% of proteins obtainable only from meat. Make your own conclusions.

PhasmaFelis5• 8 years ago

This is a dumb idea, but you're being just as ideological and silly as they are. It's quite possible for modern humans to be healthy without eating meat.

clay_the_ripper• 8 years ago

As a vegetarian, this is pretty dumb. I could see not serving meat at the company, but not allowing people to expense it? That’s just weird and feels overly dranconian. If they are so concerned with environmental impact, do their other company policies extend this level of control? (Require carbon neutral transport, environmentally friendly electronics? What about building materials? Furnishings?). I don’t think like they are going to convert anyone to vegan/vegetarian this way, and probably encourage the opposite.

walrus013• 8 years ago

I give it six months until they get sued by a Muslim employee. Culturally and religiously eating meat is pretty much required in Pakistan.

themarkn2• 8 years ago

The article seems to suggest that religious needs etc would be met.

mayankkaizen• 8 years ago

That is a weird comment.

I mean I am Indian and know plenty of Muslims. In fact some of them are my closest pals. I understand they eat meat regularly but I don't understand how eating meat regularly is required?

As a matter of fact, I have lived with 2 muslim guys for 4 years and I never felt like they feel the need to eat meat. All those years, they ate veg food (except when they visited their home).

PhasmaFelis5• 8 years ago

From TFA:

Individuals requiring "medical or religious" allowances are being referred to the company’s policy team to discuss options.

xor1• 8 years ago

"New research indicates that avoiding meat is one of the biggest things an individual can do to reduce their personal environmental impact"

Not nearly as much impact as not having kids.

guy_c• 8 years ago

A few more details from an article in the Guardian:

---

The Guardian US is based at one of the many offices run by WeWork in New York City. Currently on the event schedule is a TGIM with Capital One event that promises “mini doughnuts and bacon, bacon, bacon”. This is one of many events promising to serve meat at WeWorks across the world – even as the policy was being announced, at the Corrigan Station WeWork in Kansas City lunch is being provided from Monk’s Roast Beef as part of “food truck Friday”, for example.

When the Guardian spoke to WeWork about whether these events would be cancelled, a spokesperson said they would not, and clarified: “This policy only applies to events paid for by WeWork. Members and employees are welcome to bring in meat for meals, and members are welcome to serve meat at events they host … we are working with vendors to align our commitment for previously scheduled events, and meat will not be served at events hosted by WeWork moving forward.”

---

SamReidHughes2• 8 years ago

Not paying for people to buy meat is perfectly reasonable. It's your money and you can decide how you spend it. It's like not paying for birth control as part of a company health plan.

But having a company event, a "summer camp," with no meat food options might be incredibly fucked up.

fred_is_fred• 8 years ago

It's legal, but it is in fact not reasonable.

PhasmaFelis5• 8 years ago

It's like not paying for birth control as part of a company health plan.

That's not reasonable either.

I don't understand why so many people think that "not actually illegal" is the same thing as "perfectly acceptable."

SamReidHughes2• 8 years ago

Well, I'm not paying for your birth control and I'm not buying you any meat either. I don't see anything wrong with either, for the same reason.

jwilk• 8 years ago

More discussion here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17526695

detaro• 8 years ago

biggest discussion ended up here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17526695

WeWork Tells Employees Meat Is Permanently Off the Company Menu

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