Virginia Police Caught Assaulting Teens, Video Deletion Fails

http://revolution-news.com/virginia-police-caught-assaulting-teens-video-deletion-fails/

by guiambros • 11 years ago

63 67 11 years ago

guiambros4• 11 years ago

The scary part is:

“The Virginia Beach Police Department immediately began investigating this incident based on the officer’s self-reported Use of Force Report and video captured from the officer’s TASER camera submitted the night of the incident. The department was previously unaware of the citizens recorded video until TODAY” [1]. (note the 'incident' happened in January).

Police brutality will only stop when all officers are forced to wear head-mounted camera, 24x7. No dash-cam, taser-cam; Google Glass-like-cam, recording everything they say or do.

In the meantime, the only solution is for citizens to do what the young woman rightly did: try to record - and hope evidence is not tempered with.

[1] https://www.facebook.com/VirginiaBeachPD

rmxt• 11 years ago

Note: I believe that calling it a "TASER camera" is simply using the name brand of the device. It's not a camera literally mounted on a electrical weapon, but rather a body mounted camera made by the company TASER. Say what you will about uninformed writers repeating catch phrases verbatim without understanding their meaning, or fat public contracts consistently going to the same vendors. Frankly, I'd rather have the body mounted cameras made by a company that doesn't also make weapons... seems like all too cozy a situation between the methods of force (weapons) and the tools used to keep that force in check (body mounted cameras and video storage and retrieval systems).

guiambros4• 11 years ago

Indeed: https://www.taser.com/products/on-officer-video

It seems pretty good, in fact. Very much in line with what was suggested above.

higherpurpose• 11 years ago

I hope the smartphone industry will eventually go on a trend of making the cameras with bigger and bigger zoom capabilities. That should make it much easier (and safer) for other people to film from a distance what's going on - even from their own homes, at high quality.

angersock2• 11 years ago

Asking cops to become full-time streaming surveillance cameras is also not the right answer. Surveillance state++.

There's got to be some reasonable legal restriction to be placed on officers that prevents their use of unnecessary force.

patcon2• 11 years ago

Respectfully disagree. I'm personally entirely comfortable with the authorized force-wielding parties in my society also being localized units of high surveillance. This does not greatly affect my privacy, but rather my moments where I am least concerned with privacy (ie. the interactions of maximum likeliness for me to get legally injured or have my longterm rights revoked)

Udik• 11 years ago

According to the article, three kids are stopped by the police over a broken license plate light, then one of them, apparently without any reason, is pepper sprayed twice and tasered four times, and finally they're arrested (one of them will be in jail till July), not before the cops have tried to delete the recordings of the whole scene from one of the boys' phone.

Well, the first comment to the story (via Facebook) reads: "It's unbelievable that people actually justify these kids behavior!! I guess maybe it's because my parents raised me to respect police officers. They knew that camera was on them and they added fuel to the fire because of it. Just get out of the car, no taser, no spray...".

The comment has 100 likes so far. What the hell is going on in the USA?

paintrayne• 11 years ago

These are not the most sympathetic victims so people shit on them. Welcome to the USA. It's a real shame because the escalation of force there was entirely unnecessary. Some comments even sarcastically ask, what should the police have done with the kid who refused to get out? Just leave?

Obviously not. But the kid wasn't going anywhere and they could have waited for a legal guardian or negotiated further before escalating with the use of force. Not to mention the gratuitous use of TASER when the kid was attempting to comply.

Unfortunately, my ultimate take away is that people who object to police abuse are in the minority. If someone is perceived as a punk or criminal, it is open season. Democracy at its finest.

I'd really like to hear from a European counterpart how they think this scenario would have gone down across the pond. Not like this, I am sure.

What good are cameras and recordings if the citizens are OK with what they see?

oh_sigh15• 11 years ago

Does the officer need to wait for a legal guardian if the person is 17?

fit2rule5• 11 years ago

I'd really like to hear from a European counterpart how they think this scenario would have gone down across the pond. Not like this, I am sure.

In Germany I'm quite sure the police would have waited politely and patiently until the parents arrived.

(Well, I'm also pretty sure they wouldn't have stopped and attempted violent arrest of someone for having a broken light above their license plate...)

shaneofalltrad• 11 years ago

Seems like this is the issue in the US. Police are no longer tactful and use the same techniques that might make sense on someone drugged out or of a threat or danger to someone or the officer. They need to be retrained in civil duties, and respect of more typical citizens or non-violent situations. I personally have had a few instances growing up back in the 90's (Southern California), as a white and this is not a racist thing (most of the times), it is a power thing that has been a problem for years. Many people are scared of cops and that's because some don't respect us. I believe that these two teens are legitimately scared of what will happen to them away from the camera, and based on the officers excessive use of force, their instincts where correct.

mixmax2• 11 years ago

In Denmark it would be a major disaster, people would get fired, hearings would be held, and media discussion would ensue.

As a comparison: In 2012 (the latest year I could find data for) Danish police fired a total of 49 shots over the year.

gregsq2• 11 years ago

I'd really like to hear from a European counterpart how they think this scenario would have gone down across the pond. Not like this, I am sure.

I've been pulled over twice in the UK. The first time was a fair time back when I had a cheap old Saab. I was out very late near Hampstead Heath and I overtook a car, definitely exceeding the speed limit. As I did that I spotted a police panda ( car ) parked on the side, and I thought I was in for some kind of penalty. I went back to the speed limit and he caught me up. He kindly explained that my number plate wasn't to the most recent regulations and that I should have them replaced. I thanked him very much and was on my way. That's the nice end of town.

The other time I was visiting a friend who lived in the opposite side of the fence, near Brixton, an area known for trouble sometimes. I saw a police car behind me but was near his estate so pulled over and turned off the engine to call him to let him know I was downstairs and waiting. A sergeant knocked on my window and I was surrounded by four police. I explained that I was calling my friend, and the sergeant said that I should finish my call and I should wait. Took a few seconds, and then I hopped out if the car. They kept their distance. Apparently they thought my behaviour was suspicious because I'd pulled in and turned off my lights and engine. I explained to the police that within the past two days the law had changed so that it had become illegal to talk on a mobile phone while the engine is on. They said that they didn't know that, and we wished each other good night and my friend and I went to the pub.

Oh one more. My Peugeot 205 had an issue with the spare wheel being accessible to thieves. I walked up to my car and was shocked to see my spare wheel inside on the back seat. At first I thought a thief was playing tricks. It was a walking Bobbie who'd disturbed someone trying to make off with it apparently, and who had kindly broken into my car, put the wheel in and then locked it up for me.

Peel chose blue for the police so as to distinguish them from the red of the military, who were armed and not well trusted. Police were not armed for the same general reason, to be part of the community.

[edit punctuation]

jacquesm2• 11 years ago

People in Europe (Western Europe, unfortunately not all police forces are equal in this respect) are generally less afraid of being physically abused by the police which is why they'd have much less of a problem to do things like getting out of the car (a young person might feel safer in their car than out of it when confronting a police officer from a police force they do not trust).

guiambros4• 11 years ago

It's the same mindset of people who blame rape victims for using tight clothes. "She was asking for it".

oh_sigh15• 11 years ago

There's a difference between dressing how you want, and actively resisting a lawful order coming from a police officer. It's pretty offensive that you could even remotely compare this situation to rape.

fit2rule5• 11 years ago

What the hell is going on in the USA?

The people have been conditioned to accepting a totalitarian/authoritarian police state, whether they like it or not. Militaristic behavior is considered worthy of respect, and aggression from authorities is tolerated - because of the conditioning.

That conditioning consists of repeated propaganda about what happens to you when you don't obey - i.e. news reports, daily, about who got shot today. Who got brutalized today. Who got put away, today. All because they did not obey.

But the real question is, why do you expect more from the country that has 25% of the worlds imprisoned population within its borders? What conditioning have you accepted that makes you think things should be any different in the USA today? Because that is the other half of the dialetic materialist campaign that is conditioning us all into acceptance/denial.

eternalban• 11 years ago

They have a great game going here. Reminds me of `A Clockwork Orange` and the recruitment of thugs to the police.

At some level, imo, everyone is perfectly aware as to what is really going on, but repressing the awareness. They are not exactly being subtle, these days.

oh_sigh15• 11 years ago

Did you watch the video? The officer asks the person in the back to get out of the car. He refuses. Then the officer tries to pull him out of the car, he struggles and puts his hands up like he is going to punch the officer. The officer tries to get him multiple times out of the car, then the person gets pepper sprayed, and is still combative and resisting about 10 attempts to grab him and get him out of the car. Then he gets tased twice and gets pulled out of the car.

If an officer demands that you get out of your car, get out of your car. If an officer puts his hands on you to get you out of the car, DEFINITELY do not pull away, put your hands up to fight, and repeatedly try to get away from the officer.

ubernostrum• 11 years ago

Piece of advice: never assert a belief that you could potentially become a victim of later.

mikeash• 11 years ago

Similarly, for a police officer, do not escalate a situation to violence unless it's absolutely necessary.

One of the two people here is a paid professional in this field. I don't understand why people always heap criticism on the other guy and give the professional a pass.

oh_sigh15• 11 years ago

revolution-news doesn't seem like a particularly unbiased source. A lot of news stations have reported on it, why not link to them instead if we want to talk about this story?

My favorite sentence from the article: "the sensible young woman requests a sergeant be present to avoid her rights being further infringed."

nickysielicki• 11 years ago

"Smell" as probable cause needs to disappear.

As an extension of this, the existence of drug dogs is extremely irritating to me. It's been seen more than a few times that they're commonly trained to react to a cue rather than genuinely detecting illegal substance. Dogs aren't conscious, and they don't have a sense of morality. I have a huge problem with them being used by police and that their 'opinion', if you want to call it that, is respected in a court of law. A dog cannot testify in court. A dog doesn't realize it is lying. It's insulting to the legal system.

swift• 11 years ago

I agree with pretty much everything you said, but I do think it goes too far to say that dogs aren't conscious. The evidence I have for dog consciousness is about as good as the evidence I have for human consciousness, as far as I'm concerned.

patcon2• 11 years ago

Yeah, I was just thinking that there really should be a legal device that detects the chemicals, so the "strength" of the marijuana smell can be audited and it's not just a subjective way for an officer to justify gut assumptions in escalating

aric2• 11 years ago

One simple trained motion of an officer's hand and a dog will go into frantic, "there must be drugs in the car" mode. Probable cause is created. Several videos have caught cops triggering dogs.

Wars on drugs are abysmal entirely. Among many primary sources of havoc and waste on earth that such law creates, arguably the most reaching is its impetus to imbalance power and destroy individual rights and expectations of everyone. Mentality snowballs. A large portion of society is trained to accept increased authority and violation. They laugh at people who attempt to peacefully resist and exercise any remaining rights they have left in the face of 'deletion.'

def_illiterate• 11 years ago

The war on drugs is a jobs program. Period, end of story. It reduces the labor supply by keeping a large segment of society behind bars, and it provides employment in enforcement for a segment of the population who we really, really don't want unemployed (veterans and other folks who are too versed in the application of force to live a quiet civilian life.)

It's not good, but I'm not sure the alternative is better.

mixmax2• 11 years ago

I'm sorry to say, but looking from Europe America looks more and more like a policestate.

guard-of-terra• 11 years ago

I'm so not moving to the US ever now!

On one hand Paul Graham's "the only place to be is Bay Area" gig, on other hand is this and similar stories. One can find a lot of unsafe places without changing continents.

One more entry for my "rather kill myself than live there" list. Incidentally, the other one is where I currently reside.

plongeur5• 11 years ago

Then again ... if a cop tells you to leave the car and you then start to argue and to fight back instead of following the order.

What kind of reaction do you expect?

This would happen in any country.

DanBC• 11 years ago

Police do not routinely carry pepper spray and tasers in every country.

plongeur5• 11 years ago

So? What country are you referring to? In Germany f.x. they do carry pepper spray and tasers and a gun and in most other countries as well. What's your point?

jqm• 11 years ago

I see the big offense not in forcibly removing the kid from the car (the police are probably within their rights as far as that goes), but in attempting to delete evidence. That's the real crime for which someone should be fired and possibly prosecuted as well.

oh_sigh15• 11 years ago

Agreed. I'm interested in hearing how this plays out. I hope they can prove chain of custody of the phone and determine if the video was deleted at all, and if it was, if it was deleted when in the hands of an officer. Right now we just have it from the driver that the file was deleted. But this was the same driver that said "I wouldn't allow marijuana in my car", and the guy in the back seat ended up being busted for possession and intent to sell marijuana based off of that stop. I hope there is good evidence one way or the other if the file was deleted, and the officer is punished if it was in fact deleted while in an officers custody.

I'm leaning towards the fact that it was not deleted while in the officers custody, but I'd love to see the forensic evidence. My reasons:

1) The driver already was caught lying

2) It's convenient that the driver had the technical know how to get undeleted files off of her device

3) The officer was already recording the entire course of events on his body cam.

kw71• 11 years ago

This corner of Virginia is plagued by disgusting behavior of police and other officials. Neither you nor your family are safe if you happen to be in Virginia Beach, Chesapeake, Norfolk, or Portsmouth. The police departments and commonwealths attorneys in these jurisdictions have a disgusting perversion of the concept of 'equal protection of the laws,' they simply decide that some individuals deserve to be abused and the perpetrators of crimes against them shall be unsanctioned, free to roam the streets and able to possess firearms. Certain people in the community are free to commit crimes due to their political or social connections, and they are protected and permitted to hold government jobs within various agencies of these cities such as the police departments and school boards.

Virginia Police Caught Assaulting Teens, Video Deletion Fails

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