How did 100,000,000 women disappear?

http://www.thestar.com/Insight/article/645832

by yread • 17 years ago

24 37 17 years ago

tjic2• 17 years ago

The most important bit is hidden several paragraphs in:

Anderson asked villagers about selective abortions and found them open about the fact that they use ultrasound to determine the baby's gender and help them decide whether or not to keep it.

I'm pro-life. I realize that not everyone is. I think that everyone, though, can be concerned that large segments of humanity are testing unborn children for "undesirable" traits and aborting them. We're facing a demographic timebomb.

Societies with more men than women are violent, and start wars.

mynameishere• 17 years ago

The people in developing countries are going to feel mighty stupid when they realize that as modernity increases the value of women increases.

GiraffeNecktie2• 17 years ago

I've heard that in China the situation is changing. Women are relatively scarce, so the groom's family often has to pony up a substantial "bride price" (reverse dowry?). This is helping to balance out the "value" of boys and girls.

huherto• 17 years ago

So in 20 years is going to be a surplus of women?

telegraph• 17 years ago

I'm having trouble finding the source (it was in the NYTimes a few months ago), but China has also undertaken a pretty sizable PR campaign encouraging people to have daughters to try and address the ridiculously skewed gender ratios, especially in rural areas (sometimes as high as 2:1 for males).

perneto• 17 years ago

It's worth noting that the practice of the groom's family paying the bride's family is nothing new in China - at least according to my flatmates from Hong Kong. The rationale is that the parents invested time and money into their daughter's upbringing, but since she's leaving their family to join the groom's, she won't be supporting them in their old years. There's still no pension system in HK - there's one in mainland China though.

ahoyhere• 17 years ago

I don't want to start a war with you. But in the interest of calm, reasoned discussion...

Can't we agree that the most important bit is actually after the first part of the article, where it states that:

* Once she and Ray broke down the numbers by age group, they found that the majority of excess female deaths came later in life: 66 per cent in India, 55 per cent in China and 83 per cent in sub-Saharan Africa.*

They are dying after childbirth, after toddlerhood, because of unequal access to food, medical care and other social services. In China, not only have they tended to undervalue potential daughters, but women kill themselves at a higher rate than men. And in India, full-grown women are being tortured to death because their families have not paid the dowry.

That sounds a lot worse to me.

ars6• 17 years ago

It's interesting how the article implied all the things you write - but without actually saying any of them, since they are not supported by their own research.

The number of suicides and kitchen fires is in the 10s of thousands, but the number of missing is in the 10s of millions. That is less than a 1/10 of a percent.

Notice they did not once actually say how the vast majority died. My personal belief is they died in childbirth, since before modern medical care that is unfortunately a common thing (and in those counties that care is not available to either gender).

Of course that belies their argument about discrimination causing it. This is one of those articles where they go in with the conclusion they want: "discrimination" and then look for facts to support it.

Notice at the end how they ask:

"How often are men given mosquito nets to protect themselves from malaria, but not women? How many women die because they are not taken to the hospital when they are sick?"

They ask that, and thus imply it - but never actually show that it's actually the case.

It's a masterful job over all. Not too many people can write like that, implying so many things, and leaving such a picture in peoples minds, without ever actually saying any of those things.

swombat2• 17 years ago

Societies with more men than women are violent, and start wars.

True. Then again, higher numbers of women make a greater contribution to overpopulation. Decreasing the number of women might screw the next generation and sort out the one after that. That's probably an outrageous view, but so's your point.

tjic2• 17 years ago

> higher numbers of women make a greater contribution to overpopulation.

"Overpopulation" is a phrase used by folks who see humanity as a problem.

The more people we have, the more minds we have.

The resources of the solar system are infinite, in any sense that matters.

The more minds we have working on our problems, the better.

silencio• 17 years ago

I don't like the idea of abortions based on gender either, but changing societal beliefs of gender differences/inferiority/discrimination in the long term will be more helpful than the knee-jerk "no abortions!"/"no abortions by gender!" reaction. The latter just hurts the women that do need abortions for a medically necessary reason, whatever it happens to be. The former will be longer-term and may not be appealing to someone who is pro-life (uh, whatever that label is supposed to mean), but will also help with the far greater issues involving violence and death of adult women as mentioned in the article linked.

Tichy5• 17 years ago

Isn't it more concerning that people have to resort to abortion? I doubt anybody actually likes to do it. Therefore I doubt that morals will help much - there is probably an upper limit of the price that morals can induce on abortion. Just as there seems to be an upper limit to the deterrent to crime that the death penalty can provide.

biohacker42• 17 years ago

Contrary to what you might expect, Anderson says, dowry prices have not dropped off with improvements in education in India. Instead, they have gotten worse, with educated brides and their families willing to pay even more for high-quality grooms.

Wasn't there a story here from a couple of days ago, on how expensive it is for the groom's family to get a bride in China these days?

tokenadult• 17 years ago

China has bride-price, while India has dowry (payments in the other direction). It has been that way for a long time.

socratees• 17 years ago

Its very sad to see these kinds of things happening.

Confusion• 17 years ago

I find it appalling that they dare present this as news. This has been known for at least two decades. If they want to draw attention to it, they should at least be honest about their own failure to do so earlier and not try to pat themselves on the back for reporting it. Bah.

How did 100,000,000 women disappear?

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