Why did Microsoft make Windows 8 hard to Power Off?

http://ux.stackexchange.com/questions/25687/why-did-microsoft-make-windows-8-hard-to-power-off

by 1234 • 13 years ago

17 60 13 years ago

ux.stackexchange.com

http://ux.stackexchange.com/q/25687/4679

will_brown• 13 years ago

Windows 8 did to the start button what England did to William Wallace, quartered it and buried the parts in the 4 corners of the territory.

My solution add the following to the task bar and metro screen: 2 start orbs (blue orb = metro screen; green orb = Windows start screen), Restart and Shutdown

Screen shot of my Window 8 task bar: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6jnvIhOPJO7Y0NWQm56THVrbDA/...

Screen shot of my Metro screen: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6jnvIhOPJO7WVF1ZjBVOFc3MFU/...

Update: Even though I described the end of the start button so violently and added 2 start orbs to my own taskbar, I am not knocking MS choice to do away with the button.

12342• 13 years ago

That's nice! I use the same thing which i accidentaly push :( But since I got SSD-disks, we're up fast again! :)

pgsandstrom• 13 years ago

Maybe they, in contrast to their own FAQ, actually don't want users to turn their computers off. My parents always power off their laptop completely, because it feels natural to them to power off an electrical device when not using it. Then they complain about the long boot time.

This might not be the best solution since it causes confusion. But since so much is changing anyway, they might take the opportunity to change everything they don't like about how users interact with Windows.

lucb1e2• 13 years ago

> [They] actually don't want users to turn their computers off. My parents always power off their laptop completely, because it feels natural to them to power off an electrical device when not using it. Then they complain about the long boot time.

That made the most sense of the entire thread. Much more than the SE answer also.

ladzoppelin• 13 years ago

I find it really easy to power off once you know where to look. I think they moved it so people without a mouse/keyboard could still turn off Windows easily. Call me crazy but I find Windows 8 to be really solid even on older equipment.

batiudrami• 13 years ago

I don't mind it, but I also find that (other than task manager), I barely interact with the new features. I turn it on, put my password in, click 'Desktop' and launch my apps.

The extra half second of hovering to bring up the charms menu to shut down does annoy me disproportionately more than it really should.

ygra4• 13 years ago

You don't need to hover in the corner, you can just throw your mouse in the corner and then move it down.

But agreed on not using the new features. I think the only Metro app I use regularly is checking the weather from the Start screen. Otherwise I spend almost all time on the Desktop and there it works just like a slimmer and faster Windows 7.

lucb1e2• 13 years ago

A slightly extended version of my comment on the accepted answer:

I disagree on almost everything. On mobile phones you don't have a >17" screen to place a power button in an often-used menu somewhere, and the power button is like 5cm away. On a desktop this is usually not the case. As you said, you need to power a device on in a physical way because software is not running, but when powering off you can use either software or hardware buttons. You've been using that mouse and keyboard the whole time that you were working with it, why turn back to other hardware to turn it off?

For tablets, and even laptops to an extent, Windows 8 makes a lot of sense. The power button is close, or you can close the lid. For desktop PCs, not so much.

Lastly, I think of my phone or mobile device as always-on because it needs to be always on. I don't turn my ears off when I'm not using them either. My 500 Watt pc does not always need to be on or sleeping (hibernate at most). Nor does my family's tablet; we always power it off entirely. Conserves a lot of battery power and lifespan.

stinos• 13 years ago

that last part where you make a coparision with your ears makes it sound like you consider a phone as some sort of extension of your body :] well, it's clearly about personal preference. I for instance have no desire to leave my phone always on, not only because it "Conserves a lot of battery power and lifespan" but also becasue sometimes I like to not being bothered at all.

RyanZAG• 13 years ago

you consider a phone as some sort of extension of your body

I'm not the OP, but I'd say I pretty much do! It's only going to get even worse with things like Google Glass. Can't wait.

Dylan168077• 13 years ago

>My 500 Watt pc does not always need to be on or sleeping (hibernate at most).

I question how much that will actually save you. A turned-off PC drains somewhere under a watt, and a PC in sleep mode also drains... somewhere under a watt. Sure, you might not want to spend the 20-50 watts it takes to keep a PC fully powered and idling, but sleep mode is very efficient.

For a tablet it makes sense, since those tend to use a 'sleep' mode that's more of a deep idle, where wifi and background processes are still powered.

acqq2• 13 years ago

You're wrong when you say "a PC in sleep mode also drains somewhere under a watt." Unless you consider as the only "desktop" to be Mac mini, you've never tried to measure the power consumption of the desktop yourself. Otherwise, you'd know that a lot of desktops take a lot of power when sleeping, on average 20 Watts, but even up to 80:

http://standby.lbl.gov/summary-table.html

The above table used 52 computers to make the statistics: the average was 21 Watts.

Do you have a desktop? Plug it in a power meter, you'd be surprised. My desktop draws more than 10 Watts when powered off. That's why I use the hard power switch on the back and prefer a notebook.

When we're there, look at the "off power" of the set-top boxes. Horrible.

mparlane• 13 years ago

Press the power button on your machine. The same one you used to turn it on.

Dylan168077• 13 years ago

Okay, take a second to explain this to me. What exactly happens when I press the power button? On almost every laptop I have used the power button puts it to sleep. Are you saying this has changed in windows 8, and it will shut off instead?

Already__Taken• 13 years ago

You know you get set what the power button does in power options right?

I change all mine to hibernate and closing the screen to do nothing.

ygra4• 13 years ago

I think (not sure right now because I always set it to hibernate) it defaults to Sleep on laptops and Shut down on desktop computers.

UnoriginalGuy3• 13 years ago

If only it were that simple.

When I press the power button it does seemingly random things. Will it sleep? Will it shutdown? Will it hibernate? Will it do nothing?

Seems to vary on every PC I sit down at...

yareally3• 13 years ago

Even in Windows 7 it's kind of a pain if one is using shortcut keys.

shutdown – press the win key, then press the → key once and finally enter. (on xp it was win key + U twice)

restart – press the win key, then press the → key 2 times and finally R. (on xp it was win key + U then R)

However, at least locking is easy (hold win key and press L).

If one is not locking out, easier to just go to the start menu to shut down.

edit: mixed up locking and logout shortcuts. Also press → twice and not 3 times for restart, mea culpa.

reference link: http://productivity.ben61a.com/windows/windows-7-shortcut-ke...

hayksaakian• 13 years ago

I thought it was just windows right enter? Way easier than xp ( I worked in a computer lab)

yareally3• 13 years ago

I've seen reports of multiple methods to shut down on xp so that may work as well.

smnrchrds• 13 years ago

> restart – press the win key, then press the → key three times and finally R

You need to press → key twice. (I just accidentally restarted my computer trying this :-))

> However, at least logout is easy (hold win key and press L).

win+L locks the computer. To log off, you need to press the win key, then press the → key twice and finally L.

yareally3• 13 years ago

Thanks, I should have known log out versus lock. 4am here and not sure why am I still up.

Hopefully you didn't have anything important open that was not saved,

dangrossman4• 13 years ago

I have two machines running Windows 8: a 2-year-old laptop, and a Surface Pro tablet. I've never shut down either of them.

The laptop just gets closed when I'm not using it -- so it goes to sleep. If I leave it like that long enough it'll hibernate itself when the battery gets low.

The tablet I either press the power button on, or if I have the keyboard cover attached, just flip the cover shut which has the same effect. It goes to sleep and shuts itself down after 15?30? minutes of inactivity. Win8 on an SSD cold boots to a working desktop with network connection in 7 seconds flat.

Explicitly navigating to a software shutdown button just isn't part of a normal workflow on modern devices. The only time I think I'd use it would be to fix some kind of bug like a wonky driver. Desktops are going the way of the dodo -- my dinky little tablet can now drive a 2560x1440 monitor and run modern games. Adding one extra click to reach the old software shutdown button to keep the UX simple for what most people will be doing makes sense.

Heck, if you have a keyboard with the new Win8 shortcuts, it's the same amount of clicks as it was in WinVista and Win7. Charm button -> Power button -> Shut Down, versus Start Button -> Arrow next to the power icon -> Shut down.

nwh• 13 years ago

> Win8 on an SSD cold boots to a working desktop with network connection in 7 seconds flat.

Oddly enough, it's not booting. Clicking "Shut down" is hibernation in Windows 8.

ygra4• 13 years ago

It hibernates session 0 and the kernel, indeed. But that's a nitpicker's distinction. To the end user the result is the same, it just boots faster.

gordaco2• 13 years ago

> Desktops are going the way of the dodo

Frankly, I'm tired of reading this. Desktops are going to lower their market share, yes, but that's all. The desktop has quite a few advantages: modularity (i.e.: want a new graphics card or a bigger hard disk? No problem. Is some hardware failing? Just replace it, not the whole thing; it's much easier than on a laptop), compatibility with a LOT of software (including a whole world of office applications and games from a very wide range of time. Laptops also share this; tablets and phones, not so much), price (compare any PC with a laptop with the same specs, especially if you select each component instead of relying on a pre-made computer), etc.

dangrossman4• 13 years ago

You're going to be reading it for a long time, because it's true. The desktop is going extinct, and it's going extinct at a faster rate every month. Q4 desktop sales were 6.4% lower than Q4 2011. The advantages you mention are largely irrelevant outside specific professional niches, the only place desktops will stick around for a while.

The cheapest laptops are cheaper than the cheapest desktops in stores, and are cheap enough that it doesn't matter if you have to replace the whole thing if it's broken. Both laptops and tablets are compatible with the entire Windows legacy ecosystem. They're portable, they're what the workers and the managers making purchase decisions want to work on, and they cut the company's electric bill by more than half. Towers are going extinct.

masklinn• 13 years ago

> Explicitly navigating to a software shutdown button just isn't part of a normal workflow on modern devices.

It's not part of the normal workflow on older ones either, mine anyway: I only ever shut down my desktop computer when it nags me after updates, or when I go on extended holidays and shut off all devices in the house.

> my dinky little tablet can now drive a 2560x1440 monitor and run modern games.

Good joke, that.

calciphus• 13 years ago

Sorry, have to disagree with your little potshot. I can run Starcraft II and Diablo3 on my Surface Pro. Not with everything maxed out, but a damn sight better than my 2011 Macbook Pro. It drives my 27" Dell display with no difficulty.

darklajid2• 13 years ago

1) Win + I

2) Click on shutdown button.

Alternative: Press power button on device.

I don't like the UI formerly known as Metro, but Windows 8 isn't thaaat bad and this bashing quickly got old.

mattmanser• 13 years ago

I've only had the opportunity to use the new UI on server 2012 for the last few months. Remoting in highlights the problems almost immediately.

In some ways it's great.

In other ways it's not just bad, it's really terrible. It deserves every bit of bashing it gets.

There have been so many regressions in the desktop UX it's incredibly frustrating.

laumars• 13 years ago

> I don't like the UI formerly known as Metro, but Windows 8 isn't thaaat bad and this bashing quickly got old.

It's easily the worst GUI shell on any popular OS. It's counter intuitive (very little of the OS is guessable), jarring between Metro and the classic desktop, and so poorly thought out that even IT professionals struggle to use it.

Given the excellent research facilities Microsoft have, their near-bottomless money pit and their massive market share for desktop / laptop installs, releasing such a substandard product is completely inexcusable.

So honestly, the apologists trying to forgive Microsoft quickly gets old.

darklajid2• 13 years ago

"Inexcusable"? "Apologists"? "Forgive"? Did you pick those words with consideration?

Obviously you seem to target me (as part of a group you don't agree with) here. Those words make no sense in this context?

I'm a Linux guy at home/at night, but work as a C# developer in a "We love Microsoft" (tm) company where everything MS is hyped. I'm not part of that though..

Windows 8 (or 2012) works for me _exactly_ as Windows 7 did (Windows 7 workflow for launching stuff? Hit 'Windows' key, start typing. Windows 8 workflow for launching stuff? Hit 'Windows' key (or Win+W or Win+F), start typing.

I certainly hate some of the design decisions, all of them related to Metro-only applications. Typing 'optional' (leading to 'Install optional updates', the ~sane~ version of Windows Update) annoys me. There are quite some cases like that, but really: That's minor.

The start menu was useless on every machine I've ever seen. It got cluttered quickly with a mixture of documents, programs, shortcuts to websites or crazy 'uninstall' tools, became a messy hierarchy after 15min of using a machine and don't get me started on the sorting or auto-hiding features previous versions of Windows 'improved' the situation with.

Worse, the _very specific_ complaint about ways to shut down the machine makes no sense at all (see my previous post. The change is that you have to add a 'i' key to the first press of the Windows button - yeah and the button to power down the machine is now on the right side of the screen).

I don't claim that Windows 8 is perfect or anything close to that, but it is not that bad. People just like to complain. A lot. KDE 4 is crap. Gnome 3 is crap. Unity is stupidity cast into UX. Ah - and OS X removes really, really vital things on every release, it seems. Right..

What I'm asking for is some perspective and some nuanced criticism. That isn't happening so far and your 'easily the worst GUI shell' is exactly that broad stroke that I consider flat out wrong. We can argue about details, specific issues, but the way you state it you're just appearing as angry and ranting. Using superlatives and general criticism serves no point.

On a slightly related side note: I have the feeling that IT professionals are the worst crowd to handle changes, actually. Where a user might accept a change and honestly give it a try, a more experienced so-called power-user might feel offended much more easily in my opinion.

ComputerGuru• 13 years ago

I couldn't find the menu to power off Windows. So I use my trusty old shortcut that has served me for decades:

winkey+r -> shutdown -s -t 0

(or shutdown -r -t 0 to reboot)

dschiptsov• 13 years ago

Because it boots in 5 minutes.))

12342• 13 years ago

Hehe - that might be it! :-)

ne0phyte2• 13 years ago

Click on the desktop, press Alt+F4. That's what I've been doing since Windows XP.

Bughunter101• 13 years ago

As the comments say: "What I find most interesting here...is no one thinks to hit the Power button to turn their PC off. You do the same with your TV, your phone, your blender, why is your PC the only one you turn on and off using two different ways!"

ne0phyte2• 13 years ago

My PC is under my table whereas my mouse and keyboard are at my fingertips.

dromidas• 13 years ago

How has nobody said "CTRL ALT DELETE" then "CLICK POWER BUTTON IN CORNER" yet? It's stupidly easy.

Shorel2• 13 years ago

If you dual boot with Linux, the Windows partition will not be writable when it's in hibernated state.

Why did Microsoft make Windows 8 hard to Power Off?

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