Trying for twelve years to chase down and catch an antelope by foot [audio]

https://www.thisamericanlife.org/80/running-after-antelope

by mhb • 2 years ago

27 46 2 years ago

thisamericanlife.org

dboreham• 2 years ago

World's second fastest animal.

Mistletoe• 2 years ago

Haha I tried this once. Was very unsuccessful.

mtlynch• 2 years ago

Scott Carrier is one of my favorite This American Life contributors. His delivery is so unusual and captivating.

If you like this episode, you should check out the episode dedicated to Scott Carrier stories: "The Friendly Man."

https://www.thisamericanlife.org/181/the-friendly-man

cheriot• 2 years ago

Anyone have a tldr on the antelope chase?

anonu• 2 years ago

I did the boring thing and put the transcript in ChatGPT (but at least the summary makes me want to listen to the episode even more... Maybe there should be different summaries for different people to pick out the things that interest you):

The story about the antelope, featured in This American Life, follows Scott Carrier and his brother's attempt to prove a theory that humans evolved to be endurance runners, capable of outrunning animals like pronghorn antelope over long distances. Scott's brother, a biology student, hypothesizes that early humans could have run down big game without weapons by relying on their endurance rather than speed.

In the 1980s, they go to Wyoming to test this theory by attempting to chase down antelope in the desert. The idea is to exhaust the antelope by making them run in the heat for a long period. Despite their efforts, the antelope consistently outmaneuver and outrun them, blending into herds and splitting into different directions, making it impossible to follow just one.

Scott reflects on the challenges of the endeavor, the limitations of modern life, and the connection to a primitive way of living. Despite failing to catch an antelope, the story highlights the persistence of the human spirit and the desire to understand our ancient origins.

ptspts• 2 years ago

TL;DR TL;DR They have been failing so far: they haven't caught a single sntelope.

woleium• 2 years ago

But.. wouldn’t you mark your target with a dye pack? In the past i assume you'd spear your target then hunt it down?

bitbasher• 2 years ago

Not sure why, but I thought the podcast was "thisdeveloperslife.com" which made the title even more interesting as I had no idea why developers would be out chasing an antelope in the desert. Though, maybe it would explain what happened to the podcast.

mdorazio2• 2 years ago

For those who don’t want to sit through the listen, they’re never able to do it. From the interspersed stories, the “run an animal to exhaustion” theory only works if it’s 1) not an antelope (ex. A deer), 2) the runner is good at tracking, and 3) the runner is able to consistently track the same animal even through multiple herd merges.

iamthemonster• 2 years ago

Did they never mention the concept of wounding the animal with a trap or missile weapon first?

Of course it's unethical to test that theory but it's surely the first thing you'd think of doing if you actually wanted to catch an animal. Of course it would be devilishly difficult to hit an individual antelope with a missile weapon, but slinging 100 rocks at a herd over time is much less energy than chasing on foot.

mdorazio2• 2 years ago

Nope. The experiment is to see if it's possible to run down an animal completely unaided, then capture or kill it. It sounded like they want to duplicate a pre-tool use scenario but I'm personally in the same camp as you - seems a lot more likely that pre-tool hominids would have probably been pretty good at chucking rocks or pointy sticks.

rramadass5• 2 years ago

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41242321

chrisco2556• 2 years ago

Here's an 8 hour exhaustion hunt of a kudu, a species of antelope.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=826HMLoiE_o

FredPret2• 2 years ago

I know of one hunter-gatherer tribe that does this.

1. They start by learning how to track animals so well that they can identify an individual from among a herd's tracks. (in other words, crazy, crazy good)

2. Long before the hunt, they bury water in ostrich eggs under strategic trees

3. They then throw a rock at some antelope which then flee in panic.

4. Track the juciest individual (this is key - you have to chase the same animal for days on end)

5. Repeat rock throwing, individual tracking, and strategic water drinking until the animal's muscles stop working. Then you get it with an arrow.

m3kw9• 2 years ago

Why not just shoot it with an arrow or are they glutton for punishment?

FredPret2• 2 years ago

I’m not clear on this.

Perhaps I’m wrong about the arrow in step 5 and they really don’t have arrows in the first place, killing the animal with a knife.

Or perhaps they can’t get close enough with their arrows on day 1. Some of these antelope are really large and aggressive - you wouldn’t want to wound one.

Loughla2• 2 years ago

Honestly. Hide in bush, shoot the animal with that arrow previously mentioned.

That seems much better?

anitil3• 2 years ago

I find it really interesting that this concept took hold so strongly in people's imaginations. I think because it's just on the border of plausibility and seems somehow to be hidden knowledge. It reminds me of Dan Luu's idea of 'Cocktail Party Ideas' [0]

Edit: Of course I appreciate someone putting the idea to the test!

[0] https://danluu.com/cocktail-ideas/

PhasmaFelis5• 2 years ago

If you're saying that this proves endurance hunting is a myth, you should know that there are real live people who practice it today, and you can find at least one of them on YouTube.

This comment discusses what some of those people do differently: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41241490

rramadass5• 2 years ago

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41242321

anitil3• 2 years ago

I'm not saying it's a myth, I'd say my position is -

1. It's plausible that some humans somewhere might have used it, however 2. It's unlikely any group of humans used this for a meaningful amount of their caloric intake

The point of my previous comment was that I find it interesting that it seems to have taken an oversized mindshare in people's beliefs around the evolution of humans. I'm interested in why that might be. I suspect because it has a slightly unexpected twist that while we're not fantastic at running, we are (allegedly) good at long-distance running.

rramadass5• 2 years ago

I never believed this "Humans are the best endurance hunters" story. It seemed just too pat with no data to back it up but just suppositions/rumours/stories to bolster it during retellings.

Humans have always hunted using the Stalk, Ambush, Injure and Track (with luck involved) process.

See The Persistent Myth of Persistence Hunting - https://undark.org/2019/10/03/persistent-myth-persistence-hu...

Wikipedia's Endurance running hypothesis entry points to criticisms under the "Academic Discourse" section - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endurance_running_hypothesis

chrisco2556• 2 years ago

How do you explain video evidence of it in modern times: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=826HMLoiE_o

inasio• 2 years ago

The tarahumara in northern Mexico are famous for running very long distances (men and women have won several ultramarathons, often running with handmade sandals), they are also known for hunting deer by running them to exhaustion (more for fun and tradition than anything else, they have access to rifles)

silverlake• 2 years ago

I was driving in Chicago late at night when this show first aired. I was so engrossed in the story I ended up in Wisconsin.

Loughla2• 2 years ago

I did that with S town. I missed a wedding. . . .

WatchDog• 2 years ago

I first became aware of persistence hunting, by seeing this BBC Earth documentary[0], in which three men track and hunt an Kudu for 8 hours.

[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=826HMLoiE_o

ungamedplayer• 2 years ago

The unsaid thing about endurance hunting is that you need to pick the right animal from the group and know how to persist hunt, aka keep prey away from water, have them run at the middle of the day, pace yourself, know the area and take shorter routes, know how to separate an animal from the herd.

Temperature of the area also plays a large part, perhaps the writer was doing this in a cooler area giving the animal an advantage.

I have not listened to the Audio, but most factors are not usually considered when people talk about any kind of persistence hunting.

I have hunted pigs, kangaroos and wild dogs and reindeer this way, without guns sometimes with dogs.

I am unable to do this in my older age, it's a younger man's game, it's good to see that people are still trying.

jancsika• 2 years ago

I am unable to do this in my older age, it's a younger man's game, it's good to see that people are still trying.

You're on a site called Hacker News.

Get 3 more old dudes, develop a whistling protocol, and box that reindeer in!

Trying for twelve years to chase down and catch an antelope by foot [audio]

Related Stories