Show HN: A different kind of coloring book for kids (Android). Simple and clean.

by martinadamek • 14 years ago

94 61 14 years ago

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

This my new Android app. I really tried to make it simple, beautiful and not annoy the kids and their parents with ads. Though I am not sure what is the best strategy to add in-app purchasing and still be nice to users.

robinwarren• 14 years ago

congratulations, it looks very good.

re monetising. I assume you plan to bring out more things to colour? If so you could announce them being available when the app is first opened. Assuming that is most likely to be done by the adult it should avoid worrying people. Make anything which could lead to a purchase happening obvious and make the bright coloured attention grabbing button take the user (possibly the child) to the game.

unless there is a safer/better way to go about it. Good luck!

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

That is actually really good idea with the update. Thanks!

Splines• 14 years ago

My daughter is 3 and she enjoys the coloring apps on my iPhone. We have a few that I downloaded for free, one was on sale, one has IAP and one is ad-supported.

The ad-supported one shows ads in a separate "pick your color" UI and I'm happy with the design. It's a flood-fill app like yours and while the drawings aren't as good as yours it's functional enough.

The one[1] with IAP is a "color in the lines" style app with a lot of UI: Picking brushes, viewing past drawing and picking a drawing are pretty rich. I ended up springing for the IAP (probably the first time I've ever indulged in it; there's probably a marketing lesson in there somewhere). The app showcased a bunch of locked coloring books that my daughter kept asking me about, so I bought them so she had more to do in the app. One interesting thing was that they partitioned the app's IAP. You could buy one set of markers, or collections of books for a certain amount, or buy the entire IAP library for a marginally higher price. For the record, I found the IAP design to be ok. The price is a little higher than what I'm personally accustomed to, but not unreasonable. What does bother me about this app is that it continues to show me ads for other apps by this developer. Please don't do that.

Hope this feedback helps you decide how to design your IAP.

Let me also add that it's mind boggling how the iTunes UX designers decided that IAP descriptions should be truncated.

[1] http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/amazing-coloring-studio/id507...

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

Thank you for the feedback, I really appreciate it!

cncool• 14 years ago

Why no iOS?

mkl• 14 years ago

Seriously? He just launched, and there are good reasons to start with Android, especially if you don't already own a Mac.

mdda• 14 years ago

Moreover, going off the discussion on the KytePhone app yesterday, Android offers the chance of hardening your device more thoroughly against curious little fingers.

That, and the lower price-point (particularly if you by an off-contract phone, ~AndroidTouch, on ebay), is a clear win for developing kids stuff on Android.

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

It's coming ;-)

Peroni• 14 years ago

Father to a two year old boy who loves playing with my iDevices.

Firstly, can you tell me in simple terms what's 'different' about it? Amazing Coloring Studio by Linqsoft Ltd. for iOS appears to be very similar. I understand yours is Android but is that really a differentiator anymore?

As for handling kid proof in app purchases, the popular 'Elmo Calls' app for iOS has a fantastic system which is a barely visible slider on the top of the screen which gives access to the in-app purchase menu.

Good luck with it regardless, I'm always keen to see people build decent apps for kids.

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

I tried dozens of them on Android. They are so busy, terrible UIs, ugly pictures, ads... so that's where I want to fight - with a nice thing. Thanks a lot for tips on apps, I'll check them out.

tdtran• 14 years ago

just a little app for kids, but very polished and excellent execution. Free and no ads. It's refreshing to know someone is still doing stuff just for fun and share it

biafra2• 14 years ago

It looks really nice!

Since you seem not to use the menu for anything: You could disable the legacy menu button on ICS devices by setting the targetSDKVersion to 14 or higher. But do not forget to test your App on an ICS device. By setting the targetSDKVersion so high you tell ICS to disable certain legacy compatibility behaviour.

Partly documented here: http://developer.android.com/reference/android/os/Build.VERS...

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

I've already played with that, but it had bad side effect on something (I can't remember what exactly that was). I am going back to that in next updates.

veeti• 14 years ago

IIRC, building for 14 or above enables hardware acceleration for everything automatically: that can cause problems. Try disabling it manually in the manifest.

PuerkitoBio• 14 years ago

Awesome. I have tipitap Coloring, but the colors are a little difficult to select.Yours is very simple with large selectors (especially on a tablet!) and the drawings look very good. Congratulations! My kids will love this.

davidw3• 14 years ago

Looks well done, but it seems fairly similar to a lot of other apps in the same space: "look, ma, flood fill!". That, or the big, fat "pen" that's possibly even more difficult to do anything useful with for little fingers than a real pencil or crayon.

In other words... I'm still not convinced that tablets or phones are very good for "coloring" or "painting" for children. That's not really a knock on your app, which seems about as good as these things get, but more of a call to use the devices in a new and interesting way that lets kids be creative and makes the most of the features the devices have, rather than emulating (poorly) something that works ok in the real world.

monsterix2• 14 years ago

David, need your help with something. How can I reach you?

davidw3• 14 years ago

Clicking on my profile brings up a variety of sites and things, most of which have contact information. I am always happy to correspond with people!

aidos• 14 years ago

Definitely agree with this. My little girl is almost at this stage now and I'm not sure that tablets are the right way to go. This implementation looks really nice but I think that the real world version is sooooo much more expressive.

Not that I'll have much say in it, my wife will veto tablets in favour of actual genuine finger painting in a heartbeat :)

ZeroGravitas3• 14 years ago

The fat pen is fairly useful in this app since when active it doesn't let you go outside the lines. However, you only seem to get to use it when the shape isn't divided up into sections.

I've used other apps (a branded Crayola one on Nintendo DS springs to mind) where it remembers where you put the stylus down and keeps you within the lines of that section until you lift it from the page. Worked quite well and I think it'd be a good fit for this app.

jvanderwal• 14 years ago

>>In other words... I'm still not convinced that tablets or phones are very good for "coloring" or "painting" for children.

My personal experience has shown they can be very beneficial. My little sister has Down Syndrome and never did well with regular book coloring. I downloaded an app that used tap-to-fill and what she learned from it has carried over to real life. She learned the lines are the edges for colors, different sections can be different colors, etc. I fully credit the app with teaching her that.

aidenn0• 14 years ago

In general they are worse than the actual paper and marker, but when you end up waiting somewhere and you left the kids coloring stuff in the car, apps like this are a life-saver.

That being said, my kids like the free-form doodle apps more than the coloring-book style ones.

shawnc• 14 years ago

My 3 year old has a marker and paper in her hand almost every minute of the day. She is constantly doodling and drawing pictures. I get at least 4 pictures a day from her, all with a story to tell.

When we're out and about, she loves having access to my iPhone when she's been already waiting 20 minutes and losing her patience. She immediately goes for the colouring and drawing apps, and continues doodling. And she knows how to click the home button and the power button to take a picture of the screen.

I don't see these as a replacement, but as a compliment. Don't think 'if I give this to my kid to use, they'll lose all ability to actually use a pencil'. It won't be the case.

biafra2• 14 years ago

A tip for other parents who let their kids use their Android phones or tablets. You can lock the Play Store so a pin is needed to do purchases. This also locks in-app purchases.

Older Android Markets did not have this options so I had to learn about this the hard (expensive) way.

duck• 14 years ago

Thanks for mentioning that... I didn't know they had changed that.

Deestan4• 14 years ago

Thank you! I did thorough research trying to find something like that in the Android Market, and didn't think to look again after the rebranding.

Hope they work on promoting that feature more. This could reduce the number of games whose core gameplay and general UI seems modeled around trying to trick kids into purchasing something.

ZeroGravitas3• 14 years ago

There's a free app called Famigo Sandbox which will provide your kid with their own launcher with a subset of apps you've approved for their use. As well as in-app purchases, it also prevents making phone calls, sending texts, mucking about with your settings etc. and blocks ads until you unlock with a swipe pattern to get back to the full phone.

It's quite handy. I assume they make money via recommending kid focused apps to their users.

http://www.famigo.com/sandbox/

shahidhussain• 14 years ago

Another option is Kyte (YC winter class grads):

I've used it quite a bit, really like the product. Smart guys too!

https://www.kytephone.com/

codypo• 14 years ago

Thanks for the shout out, it's always great to hear from a happy user!

You are correct on the business model; right now, it's promotional fees from developers plus device manufacturer licensing fees.

You are also correct that we focus on a different use case than Kyte. It seems to me they're more focused on location and telephony (very worthwhile, btw!), whereas we are all about making it for kids to find and play great apps.

nomd• 14 years ago

Looks very polished and easy too use. Gotta test it on my nephew :)

Did you create the images yourself?

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

I did all the graphics, programming, etc. My wife (she is children book illustrator) created the animals set and will create more. Others are licensed from other profesional illustrators from stock sites.

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

Thanks for all the feedback guys! App like this should never replace real thing! My wife is children book illustrator (and created the first set with animals) and she draws with our son on paper a lot. This app can help you in certains situations, where you need to entertain your kid for a while and phone is the thing you always have. I am also getting mixed feedback about buy buttons, so I will experiment tonight and will bring better solution which will be even less annoying. If you have good examples or suggestions, I'll be happy to see them!

Thanks again.

Deestan4• 14 years ago

> I am also getting mixed feedback about buy buttons

Personally, I prefer approach where there is a free version with ads, and a non-free version with no ads and no buy buttons.

Alternatively, some apps simply have the full version ad-free and buy-button-free, and you can optionally buy a "support the developers" version from the store. If the "support-app" is installed, the full version simply adds a "thank you!" on the launch screen.

I don't know how well these approaches do in sales statistics, but I personally go for products like those if given a choice, and I always pay for them if I use them. If nothing else, it's more straightforward and honest.

It is very frustrating to have a fun or useful app which is only provided as a free version and constantly annoys me with buy buttons and ads. I want to just pay - sometimes a lot - for the product instead of watching ads and being nagged to buy Koynz(TM).

ansgri• 14 years ago

What ads in children's app?!

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

For now I have tried to solve it by removing all BUY buttons from the interface but one - on welcome screen, that buys you everything forever - which is effectively turning app into 'pro' version without ads, offers, just pure content. IAP is new to me, but from what I read it is the most effective way to monetize. Needs to be done nicely, though.

ja27• 14 years ago

It's frustrating because ads don't work well for the users and parents often hate in-app-purchases. Really the best way to monetize a kid's app is to charge for it up-front. But that makes it hard to market. You want to get free downloads to build momentum and fans but then you've got to feed your own family (which users never seem to understand). At least on iOS it's easy to schedule a "free for a day" sale to get attention. Amazon has "Test Drive", their in-browser free trial and NOOK has a separate APK upload for a free trial. (I haven't tried the NOOK free trial yet but I suspect that not many users know about it.)

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

Exactly. I hope that current model (get for free and pay once to get everything forever) will make happy both sides :-)

lotharbot• 14 years ago

I absolutely hate anything inside of a kids app that gives my kid the opportunity to buy, install, or even view anything I haven't vetted. Ads are especially bad.

I like the idea of a buy button that makes you prove you're an adult by typing xyz in a box, or some other trivial-for-an-adult task, before it launches the store. IIRC Zoodles' "Kid Mode" has a voice that says "ask an adult to help you with this" any time a kid tries to access a premium feature.

rodolphoarruda• 14 years ago

What would be the recommended age for kids to play with this? My daughter is 17 months old.

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

From experience with my son (now 4y old) I think it's about 2 years. But if parent will assist, kids learn quickly :-)

shimfish• 14 years ago

Have you done any usability testing with little kids? I'm intrigued to know if they'll be able to instinctively navigate through the options. Also, isn't using the hardware back button is going to end up with countless accidental app exits?

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

I tested mainly on my 4y old son and then asked few friends to test on their kids. No problems reported. Re HW button - I am thinking about design without it especially because I am going to build iOS version that doesn't have one.

razzaj• 14 years ago

I think this app (although nice looking) misses the point of coloring book exercises. I think that using a pen/cil to color is not only aimed at fostering kids' creative process but also developing their hand-eye coordination and improve on their focus. I dont really have the time to dig out the references for this right now.

An additional side effect of this app is that now coloring takes less time. A great feature of coloring books is their ability to "buy" you (the parent) 30-60 minutes of peace.

TheShihan• 14 years ago

I'm sure kids will like this but that doesn't mean thats something they should use. Sure some kids (someone mentioned a kid with down-syndrom) will benefit from such an app but I would prefer if my own kids would use real pencils/paper instead so they won't be limited by the application. Of course the results won't surely look as nice but I think it will benefit the creativity of kids to use the real world tools.

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

UPDATE: All BUY and RATE buttons were removed from all sets. Only all-in-one unlock is available in welcome screen and it enables everything forever. I want you and your kids to be happy. Enjoy! New version 1.0.2 should appear on Play Store in moments.

At this point I must say that Android is awesome in a way I am able to provide quick updates. Love it!

mistercow• 14 years ago

I don't understand what makes this a "different kind of coloring book". Because it has flood fill?

epaga• 14 years ago

I think because of the zoom feature...at least that's what caught my eye as relatively unique.

dclowd9901• 14 years ago

Just a tip on the "Buy" feature:

Kids will instinctively mash the button 40 times to buy something. You need a more complex stop.

Also, most of the fun of coloring books comes from discovering the weirdness that happens from the overlaying strokes. The strokes are too flat, and they don't "coat". You should add some brush "wetness" and add thickness with successive overlying strokes.

martinadamek14• 14 years ago

There is of course short time between taps which if exceeded, then the tap counts is reset. I'll think about another unlock, I'll just collect the feedback and decide. I've got some feedback on overlaying strokes, so I'll think about it for sure. Thanks for the tips!

rb2k_• 14 years ago

Isn't coloring supposed to train fine motor skills in children? Just using a 'tap and fill' functionality takes that completely away from them :(

diwaiyer• 14 years ago

Very clean UI. I like how you can still do the traditional strokes. The touch to paint can be fun for older kids. This is definitely different from the typical coloring apps.

One suggestion: You should seriously consider iOS if you haven't already. While the Android market desparately needs apps like this, your engagement will be through the roof on iOS since you've designed an app that caters to the tastes of a typical iOS user.

Monetization: I'd recommend pricing it at $1.99 & having a sale weekend during which you give it away for free. Check out this terrific write up for details. I think it was on HN. http://www.1312.ru/blog/Pocket-Lists-sales-13500-in-first-3-...

jonstjohn• 14 years ago

Nice job! Looks awesome! Will have to try it out with my little one. I haven't seen the other apps that people say are similar, and kind of surprised by some of the not-so-positive comments. As far as real coloring books vs apps - I really don't see the dichotomy. I think kids are going to grow up with a mix of both, fulfilling different needs/purposes. Kudos!

webjprgm• 14 years ago

Doesn't flood fill defeat the point of coloring books? The kids will never learn the hand-eye coordination necessary for drawing within the lines.

Show HN: A different kind of coloring book for kids (Android). Simple and clean.

Related Stories