Southwest Airlines now available on Google Flights

https://viewfromthewing.com/game-changer-southwest-airlines-now-available-on-google-flights/

by kk6mrp • 2 years ago

128 107 2 years ago

22c2• 2 years ago

I didn't know they weren't listed on flight aggregator services and I almost certainly did not consider Southwest when flying to FL for this very reason.

Seems to me that Southwest are learning the hard way that not being competitive and transparent with consumers about their pricing is bad for business.

lotsofpulp4• 2 years ago

I’ve always had them at the bottom of my list because I like to pick my seat in advance.

I also used to think Google flight search would show the lowest prices, but I recently saved a few hundred dollars by buying on Expedia. Same everything, just cheaper than even the airline’s website.

toomuchtodo• 2 years ago

I fly them exclusively in the US because of two free checked bags, no change fees, and anytime I have had a life event that required them extend non corporate grace (held the plane while trying to get to someone dying and I would’ve missed the door by a few minutes), they have been patient and humane. I’ll fly them until I die or they go out of business. Some brand value and corporate values are real.

lxgr6• 2 years ago

I suspect that the commission that Google presumably gets for each referral played a much larger role than a desire to not be transparent. Google Flights is not just a search engine – they get paid by the airlines, as far as I know!

As far as Southwest being listed on OTAs is concerned: I'm pretty sure they always have been, or I wouldn't have bought a ticket with them a while ago. They're just apparently not on all of them.

rockostrich• 2 years ago

AFAIK they aren't on any OTAs. I just checked Expedia and Booking for a route that I know they have inventory on (PHL to DEN).

catapart8• 2 years ago

I don't know how you would have come to that conclusion, after reading the article? It says pretty plainly that the new government regulations, which force airlines to show all "additional" charges alongside the ticket price, means that Southwest's bundled price will now SHOW as cheaper, rather than showing as a larger base price (but less without the added additional 'baggage check' fees, or whatever) than other airlines.

Basically, they took a principled stand to not show their prices in place where it would LOOK worse (without being worse) and they have stuck to it. The world changed to be more in alignment with their price honesty; they didn't cave to showing their prices unfairly in an effort to be more "competitive" or "transparent".

mushufasa• 2 years ago

As someone who's often flown southwest exactly for that reason, now I'm a little worried the "secret is out..." though they've had enough issues over the last few years that I should probably be happy they'll just get more business generally.

lotsofpulp4• 2 years ago

Google flights has long shown the total price including taxes and bag fees if you specify number of carry on and checkin bags.

I would bet it was just a negotiation of travel agent commission paid to Google.

lxgr6• 2 years ago

they took a principled stand to not show their prices in place where it would LOOK worse (without being worse)

I bet they weren't too unhappy about not paying an agent/referral fee to these "price comparison sites" (that are really often travel agents themselves, or are at least getting a commission from those or the airline directly).

For related reasons, Easyjet or Ryanair (I forgot which one) was not available for booking through the regular GDSes for the longest time, which made them unavailable for booking through traditional travel agents not directly integrating with their proprietary inventory system. I bet that was as much about not wanting to pay the incumbents' fees as much as it was about being "modern API forward".

toast0• 2 years ago

It certainly appears as a principled stance now, but they opted out of OTAs back when any ticket on any airline got you two checked bags.

They didn't want to be easily compared back then on a level playing field. So it's a bit surprising that they want to be easily compared now, but the industry is also different.

Most likely if there was a principle, it was that they didn't want to pay Sabre to be in it, especially since Sabre was part of American Airlines until 2000.

ApolloFortyNine2• 2 years ago

Google flights has had the no checked bags allowed icon for years. And still shows it, I was originally afraid the government decided every ticket price has to include a checked bag, as that what your comment sounded like.

So not too sure what's changed.

22c2• 2 years ago

I'm aware of plenty of airlines who are not transparent with their fees and are often advertised as much cheaper than some of my preferred airlines.

I don't trust the price I'm quoted until I get to checkout, but if I don't even SEE them in my list of flights to compare, they're not likely to be a consideration.

A lot of flight aggregators also support filtering in/out airlines and I often do this with those who are sneaky about their fees.

hn_throwaway_99• 2 years ago

Seems to me that Southwest are learning the hard way that not being competitive and transparent with consumers about their pricing is bad for business.

As the other comments said, that's highly doubtful. Also, you have to balance that against the fact that for many people (myself included) Southwest was always the first site I checked, specifically because they "trained" me to know I always had to go to their site, and that for many destinations they were by far the best option for me due to price and flight times, even given their "cattle call" seating.

impish9208• 2 years ago

I noticed this the other day when I saw SWA flights listed in the Chase Travel portal. Previously, you could only book directly from them.

mfkp• 2 years ago

The article mentioned that they have a special deal worked out specifically with Chase, so that would have been there previously.

_huayra_• 2 years ago

Besides the 2 bags you get for free, the ability to rebook whenever you want and pay the difference / get a credit is so incredibly useful. I am not super well-versed on airline policies, but last time I looked, I think they were the only US airline that did this (at least for the economy class level of tickets).

One neat trick: you can rebook your exact same itinerary if you see it cheaper and get the difference as a credit (for the Wanna Get Away class fares; if you booked with the pricier ones, you'll get it back as a refund to your credit card).

brigade• 2 years ago

Spirit just dropped change fees entirely, and the other 6 biggest airlines have dropped change fees except for their basic economy equivalents (normal economy is changeable for free.) But for checked bags they all still really want you to pay $95 annually for their cobranded credit cards.

Now that Spirit dropped them, I wouldn’t be surprised if change fees get scrapped across the board soon given the upcoming requirement to advertise them upfront.

CSSer2• 2 years ago

This is going to sound like an ad, but I exclusively fly SW domestically. As noted, they used to look like a worse value but only because of the way competition handled fees. Couple this with the standard rewards program and I think SW is a steal. Did you know that SW is also the only domestic airline to have never filed bankruptcy? I’m glad to see the rest of the world being forced to compete more honestly. I’m sad to see that my convenient flights might get a little more crowded, but oh well!

aaomidi2• 2 years ago

They're the only airline I use during non-peak travel.

Peak travel time, they do shit the bed because of the same software that makes them so good.

Also, they have one of the lowest rates of baggage lost, despite having free baggage lol.

parl_match• 2 years ago

I just can't put up with the unassigned seating zoo, lack of premium class options, and other niceties.

vasco• 2 years ago

unassigned seating zoo

I never flew SW, can you or someone explain what the problem is with unassigned seats (what makes it a zoo)? I've used long distance trains and buses and it has been fine.

fshbbdssbbgdd• 2 years ago

I just pay for upgraded boarding ($30) which means that I have my pick of aisle/window seats before it gets crowded.

Lack of premium class seating is real, Southwest is not the airline for you if you require >17 inch seat width or >31 inch legroom.

mint2• 2 years ago

Interesting, I find it refreshingly egalitarian and not classist and extractive.

It really bothers me how other airlines treat seating as a way to further bleed customers of money and create tiers.

WaxProlix• 2 years ago

Might be the case in some parts of the US, but Delta and sometimes Alaska tend to be price competitive with SW, and the flying experience is leagues better (imo).

Are the rewards that much better than others?

hnburnsy7• 2 years ago

Best perk on SW is the companion pass. Some well timed credit card sign ups and a few flights and you can have a companion fly free with you for almost 2 years. Especially nice as SW flies to Hawaii.

wil421• 2 years ago

Except you have to deal with Southwest customers, no seating, and being charged for everything.

I’ll gladly take Delta over SW or Spirit but I’m at a huge hub. Delta is about as cheap as SW if I account for my Amex discounts.

hnburnsy7• 2 years ago

Balance that with no change fees, free bags, companion pass, and flight credits that do not expire.

When I travelled a lot, I would fly Southwest the first part of the year to earn the companion pass. Once earned I would fly Delta or United, who ever was cheaper.

As a consumer it is nice to have a choice and competition. Seems like the other large carriers raise fees and degrade the travel experience in tandem.

fragmede2• 2 years ago

What is the signal being derived never having declared bankruptcy? Doesn't that mean, comparatively, they're extracting more money from customers than the rest of the industry and spending less on things like maintenance? Both of those sound like bad things to me.

cbhl• 2 years ago

If you buy a plane ticket for the future, in a bankruptcy, you become an unsecured creditor of the airline.

That means the airline could have taken your money, spent it, and the bankruptcy court can say that they don't actually have to honor your ticket because it falls below the line of the things the airline has money to actually pay people back for. And then you have to go buy another ticket on another airline.

Beyond that, Southwest is known for loading and unloading their planes efficiently: https://www.npr.org/2015/06/28/418147961/the-man-who-saved-s...

JumpCrisscross6• 2 years ago

but only because of the way competition handled fees

Southwest treats all its customers the way the big three treat their most frequent fliers. I am loyal to Delta and also never pay baggage fees or change fees or have miles expire. The lounges are free, which means free food and drink from one airport to the other. I can get a human on the phone within 60s, have had a car help with gate-to-gate transfers when a delay (not my fault) caused a close call while I was flying with a pet and had them help when I needed to fly back from Mexico without my (stolen) passport. For those privileges, I spend five figures with them a year and quite a bit more on their branded credit card.

My mom flew Delta recently. Despite me booking her into a quite-nice set (albeit not front-cabin, my bad), she had an atrocious--almost condescending--experience all the way through. Surprise fees on check-in. No help at the gate. Expensive restaurants or fast food in the terminals, nothing in between. (Granted, the advantages of Delta having never lost one of my bags nor cancelled a flight for bewildering reasons extended to her.)

Going forward, if I weren't buying a front-cabin ticket for her, I'd try to have her fly Southwest.

the_snooze• 2 years ago

Southwest has its faults, but they're far and away the most human-friendly and least-BS domestic airline in the US. The price is the price and you get reasonable accommodations even at the base fare. If your Southwest credits/vouchers expire, you can talk to an actual person who'll extend it by six months after expiration even if you don't have status. It doesn't feel bad giving Southwest your business.

Maybe other companies shouldn't completely optimize away the humanity in their services. Maybe have some core values beyond "make number go up."

someguydave• 2 years ago

Just buy her a A-group upgrade on southwest, she will be sitting near the front and will get on and off quickly

lvspiff2• 2 years ago

I have a SW story that has made me dedicate my business to them moving forward:

I had a trip to Austin where i was mid-flight when they cancelled all flights there a year or so ago. I was headed to Sacramento as a connection from PDX and when I landed I went to gate agent to let them know and they were already befuddled by other customers as everything east of colorado at that point was a mess, somehow though they found flights that would get me to Austin later that day that had not been cancelled as the forecast was to thaw, and all seemed good. Luckily i had only a carry on so no baggage worries. I just had to get to SNA then off to Austin. So i took the flight, with free drinks and internet now, to SNA and I land and cancelled again in mid air. So I'm thinking what the heck now. I get with the agent who was very understanding and we found a path to go see my parents instead in AZ (i figured since i was this far and hadn't seen them in a few years at their city might as well). They let me divert my destination for no charge, I did have to fly back up to San Jose and then from there to PHX. It was my longest domestic travel experience ever (5am-4pm) but every step the flight attendants, the pilots, the gate agents, everyone was awesome. After SNA I got free drinks, internet, and in the first boarding group from there. I somehow made it to PHX before 4pm. I was blown away at the compassion shown and the respect given even after some passengers blew up at some of these folks. They reset with me and I showed them a modicum of respect and they helped me out immensely. Thier people at every stop seemed to really enjoy their job when dealing with decent passengers and even the not so decent ones they owuld put up with and move along with a smile.

fckgw• 2 years ago

Southwest does still have amazing customer service.

bbarn• 2 years ago

I almost always fly SW, and it's my least favorite flying experience. Why do I fly it often then? It's not the cost, I am rarely paying out of pocket for the flights, as they're typically work related. It's just simple - they are my only option for direct flights for most of the travel I do that doesn't involve me driving 2 extra hours to go to the larger LAX airport.

bombcar2• 2 years ago

As I get older the price difference for direct flights to the airports I want becomes more and more attractive

rootsudo• 2 years ago

For the domestic airline, no that's not true, theres other airlines in the USA that have not declared bankruptcy, off the top of my head Alaska Airlines never has alongside several others. this seems to be a great, yet sadly non-exhaustive list: https://www.airlines.org/dataset/u-s-bankruptcies-and-servic...

I look at Southwest as an outlier, I don't mind them, but I don't really look for them, they used to fly to inconvinent airports.

ashconnor• 2 years ago

Some people hate the boarding procedure but as a mostly solo traveler I love it.

https://support.southwest.com/helpcenter/s/article/boarding-...

KorematsuFredt• 2 years ago

Other than garbage airlines like Frontier, I have never had reasons to complain about any American airlines that much. Competition is so fierce that they all are pretty bad in my opinion.

kstrauser• 2 years ago

My United Tariff is up to $400. That is, I add $400 to whatever their price is when I'm shopping for tickets. That's how much more I'm willing to pay anyone else to avoid flying United.

tssva2• 2 years ago

“As noted, they used to look like a worse value but only because of the way competition handled fees.”

They have consistently been by far the worse value from either of the airports in my area even after paying additional fees on other airlines such as checked baggage fees.

ljsprague• 2 years ago

Are you in the Southwest?

cljacoby• 2 years ago

Southwest is my favorite airline for domestic US travel. Two free checked bags by default is amazing. I also personally like the no assigned seats, and no first class.

I also had an experience with a delayed bag once, which took about an hour to come out on the carousel. It was long enough that I went to the help desk to get help and potentially report the bag as lost. I got a 300 dollar travel credit, and my bag turned up shortly after.

paulddraper• 2 years ago

Southwest has ZERO flight change fee.

That in itself is why I prefer it.

Tentative plans? Don't worry, book anyway. Plans change? Don't worry, just rebook. Life is good here.

(Unless I am flying with my family. Then I have to fight for seats during an already stressful time.)

hnburnsy7• 2 years ago

What was interesting is that Southwest has been part of GDS allowing agents and corporate travel bookers to compare fares. Always seemed consumer unfriendly.

Nicholas_C• 2 years ago

They would likely argue it’s more consumer friendly since they don’t have to pass the GDS fees onto non-business travelers via higher fares.

cozzyd• 2 years ago

indeed, their flights have always been visible on my employer's travel booker...

eiiot• 2 years ago

Southwest even sues websites that display its schedules and fares without authorization

Why does Southwest even have any jurisdiction here? It seems like they won a preliminary case, but don't we have established president that scraping websites is legal, thanks to hiQ Labs v. LinkedIn?

nojvek• 2 years ago

Would love to read more about it, anyone got link to the court case?

Really thinking of doing a startup in scraping websites and turning it into filterable/sortable tables that can be queried via sql.

vikramkr• 2 years ago

Huh, I had no idea they weren't listed on these sites. I'd generally heard good things about them but they didn't really 'exist' as an option for me since I never saw a flight from them available. Wonder how many times I'd have chosen them if I knew/remembered they existed on a given route

avelis• 2 years ago

Southwest Airlines (SW) has still not made an investment in their scheduling and operations software and infrastructure. They will have more operational failures in the future if say a huge store system forces to many flights to be rescheduled. For something so critical to business continuity I find it astounding how little SW has done in that regard. SW also has lobbied alot to derail high speed rail in Texas. Although I am sure all airlines have done that to some degree.

frakt0x902• 2 years ago

How do you know what Southwest is investing in internally? Sounds like a large problem to solve that will take time. I haven't seen any info about this.

Also, yeah all companies lobby against competition.

adam_arthur2• 2 years ago

I've flown Southwest a few times out of necessity and it's always been a worse experience for me. I don't like the "hunger games" aspect of seating... I'd rather have the seat pre-selected and relax during boarding. I've also found it to be more expensive generally for the routes I fly.

Everyone has their own preferences, but I wonder is there a tangible advantage to flying Southwest to those that prefer it?

flying_kangaroo• 2 years ago

I used to give preference to Southwest for cross-country (US) flights, partly because of availability on particular routes, but over other direct flights because of the boarding experience. For $15-20 (not sure what it is now) I could pay for the automated check-in and be near-guaranteed a seat in the A group that was better, for cheaper, than trying to get an equivalent seat at an airline where they were picked ahead of time.

adam_arthur2• 2 years ago

That makes sense if you prefer to be close to the front/exit for quick deplaning.

I tend to just relax during both boarding/de-boarding since it's only a few minutes difference anyway and the effort/stress of trying to move quickly outweighs the few minutes savings. If the seat is pre-selected, I can simply wait for the line to go away and board last without standing for 10m. It seems to me that most people rush to board first even with pre-selected seating (perhaps optimizing for space in the overhead bins)

If you have a connecting flight with a short layover, is the exception where I want to be right near the exit. So I guess it's more of a preference thing

frakt0x902• 2 years ago

It depends on the route obviously but I find Southwest prices to be comparable to other non low cost airlines like Delta, American, etc. The few occasions I got bit by the $200 change fee on the others has made me consider Southwest much more. I refuse to fly the super cheap airlines.

lemoncucumber• 2 years ago

There are some minor advantages: checked bags are free, and canceling a flight for future credit has long been free on all tickets - once this became common among other airlines, they changed their policy to make the credit never expire to stay ahead of the competition (and allow transferring it to another person for some types of tickets).

dylan604• 2 years ago

is there a tangible advantage to flying Southwest

for those in Dallas, the trip to Lovefield instead of DFW is super convenient. playing "hunger games" as you put it to find a seat vs traveling to the larger airport can be worth it especially if traveling alone.

there's also free checked bags compared to the other lower price carriers.

the biggest negative is you might be flying on a MAX

hi-v-rocknroll• 2 years ago

tl;dr: Trains and boats are less terrible.

Not SW-specific, but air travel generally:

- Climate change: carbon footprint nearly 44% greater than a single occupancy vehicle but multiplied over thousands of miles

- Monetized misery with short seat pitches, junk fees, and preferential treatment with $$$

- Inconsistent, sometimes terrible customer service (About 10 years ago, I was stuck at Heathrow but Virgin Atlantic once showed me how to and let me use their booking terminal directly to find a flight on any carrier. They definitely had customer service.)

- Regular inconveniences like endless gate changes (AA pulled this 11x in 6 hours to me at DFW)

- Sketchy maintenance practices like offshoring MRO

- Close calls and ATC shortage

xnx• 2 years ago

4 reasons I've avoided Southwest: 1) Not in Google Flights 2) Not seatback charging 3) More expensive (for my flights) 4) Boarding procedure . Now that the first 2 are fixed, I'll give them more consideration.

Southwest Airlines now available on Google Flights

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