Salesforce.com tells its customers to stop selling assault-style rifles

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2019/05/30/tech-giant-brings-software-gun-fight

by cVwEq • 7 years ago

64 51 7 years ago

washingtonpost.com

rogerkirkness• 7 years ago

I've been wondering when deplatforming would hit enterprise software companies. No longer shall I wonder.

anonuser123456• 7 years ago

"But we're the good guys."

toomuchtodo5• 7 years ago

There were never any good guys. Just different guys.

sincerely• 7 years ago

I believe this isn't even SF's first rodeo - a while back there was some controversy about SF having done custom work for Backpage

challenger227• 7 years ago

The question to me is whether salesforce executives really think they can stop their customers from selling guns, or whether they are just virtue signalling.

The reality is that retailers that sell guns will continue to sell guns, and salesforce will lose customers as a self-inflicted wound.

The argument "if you don't do it, someone else will" isn't valid here, because CRM software is not a necessary economic input for selling guns.

toomuchtodo5• 7 years ago

The question to me is whether salesforce executives really think they can stop their customers from selling guns, or whether they are just virtue signalling.

If Facebook and others can kick white supremacists off their platforms, why can't Salesforce kick gun sellers off of theirs?

because CRM software is not a necessary economic input for selling guns.

So what's the problem if Salesforce isn't necessary to sell this class of firearm?

challenger227• 7 years ago

If you accept the propositions from my first post, and suppose that the owners of Salesforce value this virtue signalling more than they value the profit they lose, there is no problem for them. But I would also argue that this would be silly ordering of preferences, especially considering that it is a publicly owned company.

writepub• 7 years ago

Henceforth Intel CPUs shall only compute on workloads deemed kosher by the cancel/activist/de-platform crowd.

akhilcacharya• 7 years ago

I like how the implicit premise is that virtue signaling is a "bad thing".

challenger227• 7 years ago

To me, when the social signal is valued more highly than the negative outcomes caused by the action, it becomes a bad thing. The action does not reduce gun violence, but hurts both customers and profits.

kilo_bravo_32• 7 years ago

The phrase "virtue signalling" is made-up nonsense that has been utilized, primarily by far-right commentators, to denigrate and ridicule any opinion or action that runs counter to their world-view.

Most bafflingly, people who use the phrase seem oblivious to the fact that its mere application is in and of itself an example of the phrase.

People who use the phrase "virtue signalling" in almost every context should be treated with the same deference and respect that someone who uses the phrase "genetic terminator" is due when discussing vaccines.

challenger227• 7 years ago

First, you claim that it virtue signalling is made-up nonsense. Then, you claim that use of the term virtue signalling is an instance of virtue signalling.

Your statements contradict themselves. Describe your position more accurately, please.

drewrv• 7 years ago

The question to me is whether salesforce executives really think they can stop their customers from selling guns, or whether they are just virtue signalling.

It's neither. There are a number of unsavory industries that people choose not participate in. The fact that apple doesn't allow porn in the app store doesn't mean they think they're going to stop porn, nor is it virtue signaling. They just don't want to be a part of it.

Kalium• 7 years ago

For Apple, it has branding value. It means they are known to legions of parents as a company that won't expose their children to porn.

commandlinefan• 7 years ago

because CRM software is not a necessary economic input

Well, even if it is, Salesforce isn't the only game in town. In fact, CRM isn't all that damned complicated - there are a lot of people who would be chomping at the bit to compete with Salesforce but don't because their incumbent status is too great. If Salesforce throws away customers, though, that gives somebody else a chance to get their foot in the door.

kyleblarson• 7 years ago

The journalistic ignorance around firearms is staggering: 'assault-style rifles', 'fully semi automatic', etc etc.

CydeWeys5• 7 years ago

What's wrong with "assault-style"? It correctly describes rifles that are designed to look like their actually select-fire military assault rifle counterparts, but that are just semi-automatic themselves. It reflects that what's being talked about is the aesthetics, nothing more.

What name would you recommend instead?

axaxs2• 7 years ago

Not OP, but, 'assault-style' is meaningless. Who cares that it -looks- like a black rifle, it's just a semi automatic rifle. Many airsoft and paintball guns look similar, are they also 'assault-style'? A lot of damage was done with the Mini 14, which I'm guessing nobody classifies as 'assault-style', or do they? The only difference is that one is wooden, and the other is metal/plastic, really. So when you boil it down to those differences, it seems rather silly.

If you are taking the stance of banning something, then one should be well versed to know what they are seeking to ban. Banning 'assault-style' is useless (see Mini 14). If you want to ban semi automatic rifles, say that. If you want to ban high capacity magazines, say that.

avn2109• 7 years ago

Not the OP, but obligatory and very relevant Popehat:

    Me: I don't want to take away dog owners' rights. But we need to do something about Rottweilers.
    You: So what do you propose?

    Me: I just think that there should be some sort of training or restrictions on owning an attack dog.
    You: Wait. What's an "attack dog?"

    Me: You know what I mean. Like military dogs.
    You: Huh? Rottweilers aren't military dogs. In fact "military dogs" isn't a thing. You mean like German Shepherds?

    Me: Don't be ridiculous. Nobody's trying to take away your German Shepherds. But civilians shouldn't own fighting dogs.
    You: I have no idea what dogs you're talking about now.

    Me: You're being both picky and obtuse. You know I mean hounds.
    You: What the fuck.

    Me: OK, maybe not actually ::air quotes:: hounds ::air quotes::. Maybe I have the terminology wrong. I'm not obsessed with vicious dogs like you. But we can identify kinds of dogs that civilians just don't need to own.
    You: Can we?

From https://www.popehat.com/2015/12/07/talking-productively-abou...

finnthehuman2• 7 years ago

What name would you recommend instead?

Tacti-cool

It reflects that what's being talked about is the aesthetics

No, not really. A lot of arguments against gun rights uses phrasing like “assault” or “assault style” to imply the difference between the scary gun they want to ban and a hunters gun are much bigger than cosmetics.

algaeontoast• 7 years ago

I guess international arms dealers now have an avenue to enter civilian markets haha.

The arrogance of these companies to impart what Americans can and cannot do is stunning.

finnthehuman2• 7 years ago

It’s a good thing Northern California has perfect morals, otherwise companies based there forcibly exporting them to the rest of the world might have some downsides.

armenarmen• 7 years ago

The world truly is fortunate to have NorCal as its shining city on the hill!

thrower1232• 7 years ago

Salesforce is really not a good enough product to be throwing it's weight around like that. It's expensive, it's clunky, and there are plenty of alternatives.

HeyLaughingBoy• 7 years ago

Do the alternatives sell nearly as well? I couldn't name a single one, but pretty much everyone knows the Salesforce name.

thrower1232• 7 years ago

I am not really sure, but we switched to Microsoft Dynamics a while back because Salesforce was overly expensive, and we got some steep discounts from Microsoft through a partner program. I don't use it much, but our sales people seem to have adjusted pretty easily; it was a bit of a pain to extract, clean, and import all the data that used to be in Salesforce, but far from insurmountable.

derivagral• 7 years ago

Hubspot wants to grow up into Salesforce but is still about an order smaller.

I worked there briefly but have since moved on.

masonic• 7 years ago

It's not about Salesforce per see; it's about Benioff's perceived suitability to be elected to political office in CA in the future.

Cyndre• 7 years ago

I am wondering how this will impact gun fanatics that don't sell guns. I can easily see this costing Salesforce more then just companies that sell guns. Companies owned by pro gun rights people will likely leave as well.

Salesforce.com tells its customers to stop selling assault-style rifles

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