Damned with Praise: The Meaning of Kendrick Lamar

https://www.economist.com/blogs/prospero/2017/04/damned-praise?fsrc=scn/fb/te/bl/ed/themeaningofkendricklamardamnedwithpraise

by ElonsMosque • 9 years ago

89 48 9 years ago

economist.com

btown• 9 years ago

Paywall can be bypassed by opening link in an incognito window, FYI.

brndnmtthws2• 9 years ago

I'd love it if this could be the default in browsers. I want to select individually which sites should be allowed to store any type of state.

unreal372• 9 years ago

Firefox, Chrome et al exist to serve ads. That's where they get their funding. That's who pulls the strings. Turning off cookies would kill that model for revenue.

nvr219• 9 years ago

In Firefox: https://i.imgur.com/DtI419U.png

uncheck "Accept cookies from websites" and then individually set your allowed sites in "Exceptions"

MaysonL• 9 years ago

Or by setting Safari preferences to open economist.com pages in Reader mode. Preferences -> Websites -> Reader

perfmode3• 9 years ago

the Jeff Dean of the rap game...

arionhardison4• 9 years ago

I 100% agree, and he is needed more now than ever as rap/hip hop are becoming diluted by non AA cultures. I remember the first time I heard To Pimp A Butterfly. I instantly got the feeling that this was made for us (AA). I have not felt that way since the first time I listened to "Makaveli". If anyone reading is not familiar with some of K.'s earlier work you should go checkout Hol Up, ADHD and rigamortis.

lostgame3• 9 years ago

> I remember the first time I heard To Pimp A Butterfly. I instantly got the feeling that this was made for us (AA).

I think, more importantly, it was also made specifically for white folks who needed to hear the message.

Sure, everyone I know in the AA community knows Kendrick...but they’re also already vehemently aware of the issues.

I’m glad TPAB had the reach it did. Not only is it, message-wise, one of the most important pieces of media in the last 10 years at least, but from a compositional, production standpoint, it still has yet to be surpassed. Many will try. I’ll be shocked if any succeed for the next decade.

What TPAB does, for white folk like me, who can’t directly relate to the message, is prove that we should be acknowledging these issues from the white community...as some of the most talented African-Americans in the world got together (Dr. See, Pharrel Williams, Flying Lotus, just to name a few?) to just project this hyper-clear message to everyone - the African-American community is intelligent, brilliant, socio-politically aware AF and are fully capable of putting forward a message in a far clearer way than I’ve seen most white folks do in the last decade.

I mean, let’s face it. Can we name one album from all the top 40 white producers or musicians that has meant half as much in the last ten years?

This is the most important message that TPAB brings.

For all the damage hip hop did to the AA image in the early 00’s, it’s worst era by far, TPAB is undoing.

alexashka2• 9 years ago

What are people getting out of this article?

For me, it read like a typical album review that has no point besides getting clicks from people who mistakenly look for insight from entertainment.

arionhardison4• 9 years ago

For me it provided insight on how white America views rap (specifically K.). As a long time fan of his I have always wondered of people outside of the AA community recognized his greatness or if it was generally accepted that Macklemore deserved to win that grammy.

weberc2• 9 years ago

I liked the article, but I didn't see anything in the article that I would be willing to project on more than a tiny slice of white Anericans. Certainly no valid generalizations.

snakeboy• 9 years ago

Do you really think that there is no insight to be gleaned from art?

alexashka2• 9 years ago

I said from entertainment - and the answer is yes, almost none, most of the time.

Every now and again, you get a movie like The Matrix, that's both entertaining and thought provoking. Those are entertainment unicorns, as evidenced by the sequels that had nothing thought provoking left, but were still somewhat entertaining.

When it comes to art - if you knew how much shit art gets made and never sees the light of day, you could argue entertainment and art are both equally devoid of almost any value, including insight, to anyone.

mlevental• 9 years ago

yea man no insight to be found whatsoever in war and peace, Iliad, 2001 space Odyssey, the wall, waiting for Godot, Lolita, Carmen. if it's not obvious I'm being facetious: there's immense insight in "entertainment". good kid maad city, tpab and damn are masterworks of poetry/song. just because you don't understand them doesn't mean they're not valuable.

robot197• 9 years ago

I think he agrees that there is some value in some entertainment. But not as much value as some claim there is.

Most entertainment, even the ones which pretend to have some "meaning" is just consumed for dopamine rush.

ElonsMosque2• 9 years ago

Let's take an example I read the other day about recent nobel prize winner in literature Kazuo Ishiguro.

He thought he was finsihed writing his book and coincidentally listened to a ballad by Tom waits which left such an impression on him that he changed the ending of the book that won him the nobel prize.

In his own words "The song is sung in the voice of a rough American hobo type utterly unaccustomed to wearing his emotions on his sleeve. And there comes a moment, when the singer declares his heart is breaking, that’s almost unbearably moving because of the tension between the sentiment itself and the huge resistance that’s obviously been overcome to utter it. Waits sings the line with cathartic magnificence, and you feel a lifetime of tough-guy stoicism crumbling in the face of overwhelming sadness."

This goes to show that insight can come from entertainment.

Also Kendrick has numerous songs with similar emotion evoking moments as the one described by Ishiguro.

munificent• 9 years ago

Here's the article:

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2014/dec/06/kazuo-ishiguro...

It's a great anecdote. I knew exactly what point in the book Kazuo was referring to.

supernumerary• 9 years ago

A better review: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIGINiBYxis

nanomoose2• 9 years ago

I don't know; I'm afraid it bored me and I didn't finish. I did read the lyrics of a few of the tracks recommended in other comments, but didn't see anything special. Maybe because I grew up in South Africa, the theme of "How much does a dollar cost" (but remove the grammar), although you might then suggest I might then be able to relate - that doesn't make it special. Maybe because rap does nothing for me. I usually can't stand it. The vocabulary alone is dire - "fuck, shit, nigga" all over the place. Each to their own I guess.

lostgame3• 9 years ago

Wow. Way to completely miss all of context for the dressing.

I’m a white, late 20’s woman and I still have found an inability to ignore K.Dot’s wisdom through the medium. His lyricism and presentation is unparalleled in modern mainstream music.

I imagine you’re not a fan of Kubrick, either, because he makes his points with brutal violence?

Seeing past the medium into the message is the quintessential hallmark of being a true, educated critic.

Otherwise you’re just commenting on your taste, which is fine, but contributes nothing to the conversation.

bardworx3• 9 years ago

This was fascinating.

When I was 15 I read Tupac's The Rose That Grew From Concrete, which helped me understand my neighborhood (I was the only white guy). Kendrick Lamar brought similar feelings in me. The toughest album to listen to is Section 80; It’s not polished but it’s powerful.

To find focus in this comment, I suggest that we all look for ways to improve our own understanding and compassion. If you've “made it”, please consider doing something for others. Monetary help is great but if just 1 in 100 people donates their time it might render higher impact. Teach code in a local school, sort clothing in good will, work in your particular house of worship, or lend a hand in a soup kitchen.

I apologize if I sound preachy, that is not my intent.

olalonde2• 9 years ago

Monetary help is great but if just 1 in 100 people donates their time it might render higher impact.

I believe this was debunked numerous times.

aantix• 9 years ago

Source?

perfmode3• 9 years ago

Education is what moves the needle, so there’s something to that.

bardworx3• 9 years ago

One thing to consider is that some folks don’t “trust” education. If you choose to volunteer, it will help with trust issues.

Disclaimer: I know this dude's cousin. Regardless, this is exactly what taking initiative looks like (with a large sprinkle of education). https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=IH9AruhN4X4

neocodesoftware• 9 years ago

except when it is educationism? http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20171219-the-hidden-judgemen...

krrishd2• 9 years ago

Super excited to see something hip-hop related at the top of HN, especially Kendrick.

For anyone looking to understand why he's likely one of the best lyricists/storytellers of our time, here's some recommended songs from him:

* Sing About Me, I'm Dying Of Thirst

* Momma

* Wesley's Theory

I'd recommend checking out his projects as a whole (Section.80, Good Kid m.a.a.d City, To Pimp a Butterfly), but those songs distill a lot of what's best in him.

ElonsMosque2• 9 years ago

Agreed, I would also add:

Collect Calls

The Art of Peer Pressure

How Much Dollar Cost (Obamas fabourite song)

Blacker The Berry

FEAR

krrishd2• 9 years ago

All good additions, totally agree. So much solid work to choose from.

lostgame3• 9 years ago

Up voting for ‘How Much A Dollar Cost.’ What a fucking track.

gt_• 9 years ago

and sourcing it didn't require venturing beyond economist.com

shams93• 9 years ago

His choice of side musicians is amazing as well, he had Joe Limberg who has been mixing jazz trumpet and hip hop since 1992, lots of really incredible musicians get to work on his records and you can hear it in the end result. Maybe I'm slightly biased because I played with Joe in a couple jazz groups in the 90s but this music is so exciting because LA has this long history of jazz and Lamar ties together that legacy with the future forward vision of hip hop. He's not necessarily the greatest rapper ever some of his stuff is over produced and over exaggerated, nobody is perfect but the way he ties together the history with the future is exciting.

andkon• 9 years ago

Robert Glasper, whose piano is all over To Pimp A Butterfly, is also extremely worth checking out. It's been great seeing him get more exposure with Kendrick. https://open.spotify.com/album/7M4DuL9Z6JqcNapcOUTPNS

gxespino• 9 years ago

Always get confused with punctuation outside of quotation marks. Then I realized I was reading The Economist.

sysalphUS• 9 years ago

The article actually gets some of the finer points of the content in the album. To Pimp A Butterfly was really refreshing but DAMN hit me way harder. I must have spent about 3 or 4 days listening to it on repeat. It has a lot of really deep meaning, complete with some hard hitting contradictions, which the article mentions. It made me say “damn!” out loud several times.

lokut• 9 years ago

I don't understand what people are getting out of this review. It seems like a shallow interpretation of the album in the context of his previous work, and just settles to make insightful-sounding claims with weak evidence to support. Making assumptions about the artist's motivation for the album with respect to current social environment is not a useful review; speculations don't add to the discussion. And, superficial statements such as "[h]is hypocrisy is part-performance, part-confession," are failed attempts at enlightened commentary that only serve to provide pseudo-sustenance to a post lacking real critical value. It's hard to point out the unbalance of the themes in this album, while comparing it to themes proposed in To Pimp a Butterfly, and attempt to claim that the juxtaposition of emotions in DAMN is really just "a sense of emotion overpowering the artist." Am I the only one seeing this, or is this article in need of some deeper analysis?

Damned with Praise: The Meaning of Kendrick Lamar

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