Encourage 'Dutch reach' to stop cyclists' car-door deaths

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/sep/11/encourage-dutch-reach-to-stop-cyclists-car-door-deaths-says-charity

by matthberg • 9 years ago

45 61 9 years ago

theguardian.com

microcolonel3• 9 years ago

Seems like a great solution. Unfortunately I don't see it working here in Toronto, the cabbies don't even follow the basic rules of the road, they can't be expected to make a pro-social effort of this sort.

It is encouraging that so few deaths have resulted from dooring though. Ever slightly over one per year, not to downplay the seriousness of any loss of life, seems very reasonable.

valuearb5• 9 years ago

Wow, when I rode road bikes, the onus on avoiding suddenly opening car doors was on me. If bike riders won’t pay attention to avoid car doors, expecting drivers to is a fools errand.

the_cat_kittles• 9 years ago

you can simultaneously encourage defensive biking and encourage drivers to use the dutch reach. not that hard!

daenney• 9 years ago

One does not exclude the other. If both are mindful about this, the chance of something going wrong goes way down. It's not that drivers have sole responsibility in this, it just helps to reduce the amount of injuries if they too adapt their behaviour.

kutkloon7• 9 years ago

Sometimes you just have to bicycle close to cars. Even if you take the effort to see inside parked cars (it is probably better to just watch the road), it is simply impossible to evade suddenly opening car doors if they are opened at just the wrong time.

Its a bit like saying that cyclists just have to avoid you if you would suddenly jump on the biking line.

valuearb5• 9 years ago

It is, I would never bike fast bear car doors that could open. I always biked defensively, trusting no one. Isn’t that common sense?

WalterBright3• 9 years ago

When I'm on the freeway in the carpool lane which is flowing well, and the rest of the lanes are clogged and moving slowly, I slow down, too, as someone might suddenly pull into the carpool lane from the clogged lane. I have the right of way, but I'd prefer not to rear end anyone with at 50 mph difference in speed.

The same when biking past a row of stopped cars. Slow down, as one might open their door. It's just self-preservation.

What's the point of being in the right if you're dead?

enraged_camel3• 9 years ago

As a cyclist you may have less than one second to avoid an opening car door. You can't always give a wide berth because bike lanes in the US are usually very narrow.

valuearb5• 9 years ago

You can have all the time you need, if you slow down.

mjhoy2• 9 years ago

You can't always give a wide berth because bike lanes in the US are usually very narrow.

That doesn't mean you can't give wide berth. Take the lane if the bike lane puts you too close to car doors. If there's one thing I've learned from biking in US cities, it is to never trust bike lanes to be safe.

wiredfool4• 9 years ago

Dooring, while dangerous, is a small percentage of the risk on the roads.

The most effective change would be to have a 3-5 foot (1-1.5m) passing rule. If it's not safe to go into the next lane to pass a cyclist, it's not safe to pass the cyclist at all.

(edit: and, if we're going to do the work to make people realize that they could be safer, make sure you're all the way past the cyclist before you pull in or turn right (left in the UK). Many motorists get their head past the cyclist and neglect the back half of their car, or the trailer they're towing)

microcolonel3• 9 years ago

Do people pass without entering the lane where you live? That's nuts!

webignition• 9 years ago

Drivers passing cyclists too closely is pretty common in the UK. When driving I rarely see other drivers passing cyclists correctly.

I always pass a cyclist in the same manner in which I would pass a car but it is easy for me to remember to do so as I also cycle on roads a fair amount.

When cycling I intentionally keep far from the curb in situations where I can see that it is not safe for a driver to pass correctly/safely. I try to find places to stop to allow traffic to pass as I also try to keep in mind the needs of all road users.

A bit of education in both sides would certainly help.

On a positive note, I often notice that when passing a cyclist correctly, the cars immediately behind me also do so. If you are concerned as a driver about the behaviour of other drivers, consider what you can do to reinforce a more safe experience on the roads for all.

Symbiote5• 9 years ago

The British police have done a few trials this year, where a plain-clothes officer rides a bicycle with a camera, and drivers overtaking with less than a 1.5m gap are stopped by another officer ahead [1].

What really bothers me is "over a 90 minute period in Bournemouth ... issued seven tickets to motorists for using a mobile phone at the wheel, one driver had their vehicle seized for no insurance or licence and another received a fixed penalty notice for not having a valid MOT certificate."

When the level of lawbreaking is that high, and irrelevant to the cycling bit, it shouldn't be a 90-minute initiative done with great publicity once a year.

[1] https://www.dorset.police.uk/news-information/article/3222 -- just one example, there are at least 10 results in Google with very similar press releases.

jimworm• 9 years ago

Even if the roads are deemed sufficiently safe not to warrant increased enforcement, it seems that the public purse could benefit from it, at least in the short term.

LambdaComplex2• 9 years ago

If it's not safe to go into the next lane to pass a cyclist, it's not safe to pass the cyclist at all.

Cyclists may ride in the center of the lane when they want to force this.

The most effective change would be to have a 3-5 foot (1-1.5m) passing rule.

Assuming people actually follow that rule, that is.

From my (limited) experience as a cyclist, I think most motorists think they have more of a right to be on the road than bicycles do. This is false from a legal standpoint, but knowing the motorist was technically at fault probably won't make the cyclist feel any better when he's sitting in the hospital after getting hit by a car.

See this for more info: http://cyclingsavvy.org/hows-my-driving/

TaylorAlexander• 9 years ago

I had a friend who hated cyclists and thought “they should get out of the way”. She made no effort to accommodate them on the road.

I think improvements to culture can work, but I think laws of this nature have a pretty insignificant effect on the culture.

wiredfool4• 9 years ago

Yeah. I'm at 4k cycling miles in the last year.

Cyclists may ride in the center of the lane when they want to force this.

And at the same time, you might be surprised at the number of cars that will _still_ try to pass when there's oncoming traffic.

dghughes2• 9 years ago

That rule is new here in my town but it's pointless because the official bike lanes are just a bicycle symbol painted on what used to be the hard shoulder. No separation no barriers no way to keep vehicles and bicyclists separate.

The bike lanes are at their widest maybe 1m (~3 feet) and some parts ridiculously narrow maybe 15cm (~6 inches). Imagine if you are in the widest part of a bike lane riding in the middle that means a bicycle and vehicle are according to the bike law already too close. The vehicle can't move to the left into traffic but even so the burden is on the vehicle driver to not get too close to the bike. The bicyclist has no rules and can weave in the lane with impunity.

The law has consequences for drivers but none for bicyclists and the poorly "designed" (slapped together) bike lanes make conflicts and charges inevitable.

I ride a bike but I also drive a 4x4 that is as wide as the narrow streets in my small town (70,000 people). This law is designed seemingly to say people on bikes never drive vehicles and those who drive vehicles never ride bikes.

ghostly_s4• 9 years ago

The law has consequences for drivers but none for bicyclists and the poorly "designed" (slapped together) bike lanes make conflicts and charges inevitable.

Why should there be "consequences" for bicyclists when they are operating in what you fully acknowledge to be infrastructure inadequately designed for their needs? And maybe you should buy a less ridiculous car that is appropriately sized for the streets instead of putting other users in avoidable danger?

nightcracker3• 9 years ago

As a Dutch person the 'Dutch reach' is offensive. No one I know opens doors this way. We don't need some 'trick' to remind ourselves not to be assholes.

Just look before you open the door.

Symbiote5• 9 years ago

Don't you teach your children to open the door safely? Or people that aren't often in a car?

On my first day in Denmark,tThe taxi driver who picked me up at Copenhagen Airport reminded me to look for bikes before I opened the door. The director at my new job here, who drove me home on my first day, told me to open the door this way.

So, although I'm not Danish, I doubt calling it the "Danish rearch" would offend any Danes.

nightcracker3• 9 years ago

The key point is that the 'Dutch reach' is supposedly a specific technique (opening the door with the 'wrong' hand) that we teach, which prevents accidents.

But in reality this doesn't exist. No one uses it. We all learn to just look, and not through some trick. And we have other reasons (e.g. better street design) so our country is more cyclist friendly, but those are ignored in lieu of some silly trick that doesn't exist and isn't needed.

breakingcups• 9 years ago

I was taught this trick when getting my license.

I rarely use it though. Like you say, we prefer to jus pay attention to other road users :)

It helps that we have cycling lanes and what not.

Vinnl2• 9 years ago

As a Dutch person who doesn't have/need a driver's license, I just learned to look before opening the door.

That said, being offended by the name is a rather ridiculous response. (Especially considering the terms we're usually flattered with, such as "going Dutch", a "Dutch oven", etc.)

nightcracker3• 9 years ago

Maybe offensive is the wrong word. "It bothers me a bit" is more accurate.

armada651• 9 years ago

The 'Dutch Reach' isn't universally taught drivers in the Netherlands, I'm Dutch and I've never heard of it before. Though everyone is taught about the dangers of opening your car door without looking.

What's keeping cycling deaths low in the Netherlands is simply keeping cyclists off the road and putting them on separate bicycle paths.

The article links to an article with this video: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2016/dec/15/trans...

The traffic situation for cyclists in that video is what we would refer to here as a death trap. It's a busy road with not even a bicycle lane marked on the road. In the Netherlands you would either get off your bike and walk or risk a fine and cycle on the sidewalk.

Symbiote5• 9 years ago

In the Netherlands, you wouldn't have converted the once-beautiful "garden" outside your national parliament building into a five-lave gyratory system[1].

Khan has promised to pedestrianize it [2], and that seems more likely to actually happen after the terrorist attack.

There were plans to pedestrianize it a decade ago, but Boris Johnstone cancelled them as soon as he became mayor in 2008.

[1] https://www.google.dk/maps/@51.5005545,-0.1264029,143m/data=...

[2] https://www.standard.co.uk/news/mayor/sadiq-khan-i-ll-make-p...

Vinnl2• 9 years ago

https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2016/01/05/motorway-remov...

analog313• 9 years ago

Indeed, I don't think that particular video was a good choice for the article. Too many people will notice that the cyclist who got doored, and the one with the camera, were passing improperly.

Symbiote5• 9 years ago

What is the correct way, on that road?

The cycle lane resumes a hundred metres beyond the collision point.

mcaruso• 9 years ago

I have a driving theory book in front of me at the moment. It does actually teach you to open the door with the right hand:

https://i.imgur.com/9Aq9WQN.jpg

Though it isn't mentioned further, and there's no explanation given.

hondadriver• 9 years ago

I am Dutch and learned to open the door this way. But judging the comments of other Dutch people, it seems it is not universally taught. I am puzzled why it would be offensive to call it the Dutch reach. I see it as a compliment.

VeejayRampay• 9 years ago

Just force car manufacturers to make it so that the door is hard to open unless you're using the opposite hand, it should be easy enough.

blunte• 9 years ago

I've lived and driven in the Netherlands for five years, and until now I never heard of this. Neither have I observed Dutch drivers doing it. Not saying it isn't true, but...

bastijn• 9 years ago

This has been in and out of the news the past few years. Each time the Dutch, including me, feel obliged to respond that no dutchy opens his/her doors like that. We have mirrors, we use them. If we have fewer accidents it must be because we have a lot of bicycle lanes and our cyclists (every Dutchy) is a master evader by years of training in what we call large cities.

Dutchy out.

Drops mic.

Cycles away.

afarrell• 9 years ago

The door handle of the Mini Cooper affords doing the Dutch Reach.

It is a circle with a shelf that faces forward in a way that makes it awkward to use the hand nearest the door to open. So, you reach across your body with your other hand and in doing so, you turn your body and head and your peripheral vision can catch a moving cyclist.

JBlue42• 9 years ago

Won't stick with Angelenos. They'll continue to kick their car doors open w/o a thought as to whether bike or car is barreling down towards them.

devn0ll• 9 years ago

Even more dangerous to cyclists are the cyclists themselves.

At least in Amsterdam there is something called "Amsterdam Red" meaning: red does not neccesarily mean stop to cyclists.

When a car/truck is parked on the cycle lane they will happily move to the car lane without looking...

Helmets. They are not mandatory, and nobody uses them.

So yes, drivers need to look, but cyclists might want to start following rules and best practices as well.

Encourage 'Dutch reach' to stop cyclists' car-door deaths

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