Tesla Model 3 is equipped with a driver-facing camera

https://electrek.co/2017/08/01/tesla-model-3-driver-facing-camera-autopilot-tesla-network/

by prostoalex • 9 years ago

33 46 9 years ago

majormjr• 9 years ago

You wont own a Model 3, Tesla only lets you drive it around.

MBCook2• 9 years ago

Is this really that surprising? The article mentions what I would expect: it's likely to be used for tracking how engaged the driver is in the future.

I'm a little surprised that's not in there today.

Alternate theory: do we know what it's actually looking at? Could it be used to put a few of the back seat on the touchscreen so the driver can check on the kids easily? A number of cars these days have small mirrors up by the sunglass holder to allow drivers to do this.

scott_karana• 9 years ago

The backseat cam is a valid potential use case, but I'm surprised they wouldn't have put that on the larger S or X, if so. ;)

MBCook2• 9 years ago

Perhaps it wasn't ready and will be going into future revisions.

cbhl• 9 years ago

This seems like a great solution to the problem of driver distraction, except that most face-detection algorithms are biased (they work best on "white" people, and poorly on just about any other race/skin type).

We definitely should fix that before restricting access to a feature based on where your face is looking.

dingo_bat• 9 years ago

At least Google photos seems to work done with Indian faces. No recognition problems and even classifies photos by people. It even recognised my photo in which I was 3 years old.

mannykannot• 9 years ago

You make an interesting point, though I would guess that determining where the eyeballs are pointing would be the key to assessing attentiveness (sunglasses could be a problem.) I would hope they will use a broad enough training set (and my more cynical self notes that it is Caucasians who display the broadest range of eye color.)

http://cogweb.ucla.edu/ep/Frost_06.html

sixQuarks• 9 years ago

I see more value in being able to see who's riding in the car and if they're doing any damage while my car is in use as a taxi.

FRex• 9 years ago

For that a normal non-Musk camera will do just as well, not a hidden camera that will come on on its own after an unspecified update Tesla does remotely and then steam video to their servers.

alex-2• 9 years ago

Could the model 3 be a very expensive video conferencing platform?

IncRnd5• 9 years ago

We are all being phished to purchase an extremely expensive camera.

alex-2• 9 years ago

The future of meetings: starting them in SF and ending them in Tahoe. Maybe it's a cheap video conferencing platform :)

IncRnd5• 9 years ago

And, that camera will be the first thing covered after a purchase, just like cameras on a laptop.

https://smile.amazon.com/Webcam-Cover-Laptops-Pad-Devices/dp...

vanattab• 9 years ago

Until the car doesn't start or "auto pilot" features don't work because the car's ai does not detect an "alert human" at the wheel?

eternalban• 9 years ago

You are being paranoid. When you purchase the car it will be matched to your implanted chip and it can get your biometrics directly.

gruez• 9 years ago

Presumably you'd know about this prior to buying the car. In which case you can wait a few more years for full self driving car.

simonebrunozzi• 9 years ago

Here, a good idea of a product to sell on Amazon.com : a device that, applied to the camera, makes it think it's looking at the driver, while instead it's looking at some fake footage.

IncRnd5• 9 years ago

That's some pretty bad design on the part of the car manufacturer for a car to drive into pedestrians when someone covers an internal camera.

What about when the camera doesn't work due to defects? The card driving into buildings isn't an acceptable result.

mikeash3• 9 years ago

What's the point of this, when audio is likely to be far more sensitive? I haven't heard of anyone covering microphones, and 99% of us carry one around 24/7.

tedunangst• 9 years ago

Some people do threat modelling kind of like this: What are the threats I can stop? OK, those are my threats. I will stop them. All safe now.

wongarsu• 9 years ago

I have tried covering my notebooks microphone, but short of disconnecting it I haven't found anything that produces notable results.

But covering the camera still helps. Some thread scenarios are solved by covering the camera. Not all of them, but nobody is going to get 100% security anyways. No reason to give up.

code_duck• 9 years ago

I do. After I got a facebook friend suggestion related to an in-person voice conversation that I had just been part of, I started trying to cover my microphone as a habit.

iamshs• 9 years ago

Mark Zuckerberg covers microphone: https://twitter.com/topherolson/status/745294977064828929/ph...

mi100hael• 9 years ago

Some might be concerned about privacy. It’s something that the MIT research addressed. The collected data was kept on secure servers and people could never need to actually watch the footage.

Yeah, because a system like that has never before been compromised... ಠ_ಠ

gtirloni2• 9 years ago

That's the kind of argument they have to make to the general public. What else could they say to justify the technological need for that camera to be there? People in general don't respond to facts most of the time. It's a fear-based concern and they are saying "there there, it will be fine". And it works.

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/02/27/why-facts-dont-...

falcolas3• 9 years ago

So, nobody ever goes in to manually fine-tune the models? Or do they just review individual frames and call it "not watching the footage"?

And apparently they trust every sysadmin, every researcher, and every programmer that they currently and will hire... Someone always has the keys to the kingdom (or the capability of stealing said keys).

pdog• 9 years ago

Here you go:

https://www.amazon.com/EL7566-AW-Synthetic-Rubber-Electrical...

falcolas3• 9 years ago

Plain old scotch tape works stupidly well too.

mjsweet• 9 years ago

When I sleep I slump over almost into a fetal position. It's never comfortable for me to sleep in a car. My Mrs on the other hand appears to be awake and sitting up, the only subtle clue is a slight bobbing of the head if her sunglasses are on. I wonder how engagement detection would work in her case? There have been many times I have been having a grand old chat with her as I am driving and in my periphery and she is sound asleep. I predict that she could easily fool the system unto thinking she is awake.

gtirloni2• 9 years ago

Drowsiness detection with OpenCV

http://www.pyimagesearch.com/2017/05/08/drowsiness-detection...

super_mario• 9 years ago

My Mercedes E550 has it too, and it is used for drowsiness detection. The car suggests you should take a break if you look tired or like you will fall asleep. I have had warning to stop and take a break come on only once and I was indeed incredibly tired.

hangonhn• 9 years ago

Wow, I rented a MB once and it did that, which was absolutely the right call. The thing was that I initially ignored it and thought MB used a timer or something but 15 minutes later, I became aware of it and it was quite acute by the time I was aware of it.

I've always wondered how it knew that.

noxryan• 9 years ago

Do you have a source for this? My understanding is the Mercedes "Attention Assist" is based off driving behavior and not a camera pointed at the driver.

rgbrenner• 9 years ago

mb doesnt use a camera.. it's based on your steering wheel inputs.

There is at least one manufacturer doing it though: DS has "driver attention monitoring" which does use a driver facing camera.

wikipedia has a good list of what manufacturers are using: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Driver_drowsiness_detection

jamesred• 9 years ago

Theoretically it could be a good anti-theft device where certain facial profiles would only be allowed to access the vehicle.

Animats• 9 years ago

Well, you have to have surveillance coverage when people aren't looking at their phone and are away from their Samsung TV and Microsoft XBox 360.

"If you see something, say something."

hedora• 9 years ago

"If you see something, say nothing and drink to forget."

https://topatoco.com/collections/wtnv/products/cpb-wtnv-sees...

(No affiliation, just a fan of the podcast)

khed• 9 years ago

I cancelled my model 3 reservation over this. I found it very sleazy this wasn't mentioned in the official reveal.

djrogers• 9 years ago

Seems like this might be a good hedge against potential regulation. I could easily see some states or even a federal regulation or law requiring that level III autonomous cars have some sort of driver attention monitoring system.

Tesla Model 3 is equipped with a driver-facing camera

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