Google employees on Reddit answers questions.

http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/clz1m/google_employees_on_reddit_fire_up_your_throwaway/

by pavs • 16 years ago

80 40 16 years ago

reddit.com

angusgr4• 16 years ago

I hate myself for being such a grammar nazi, I really do.

"Google employees on Reddit answer questions"

collapses in a heap

pavs• 16 years ago

Been awake for 21 hours, going to sleep soon. Sorry. Also, english is not my first language, but that not really an excuse, just lazy writing.

(not sure if the above sentences makes any sense either.)

apsurd• 16 years ago

maybe: "Google employees discuss what working at Google is really like (via Reddit)"

angusgr4• 16 years ago

Fair call, no need to apologise really. I'm glad I didn't have to learn English as a second language, explaining English idioms to non-native speakers is one of the hardest things I've ever tried to do. :).

ErrantX3• 16 years ago

Ummm. It's a perfectly ok sentence :) stylistically bad, perhaps.

tome• 16 years ago

No, the original is "Google employees on Reddit answers questions"

yason• 16 years ago

angusgr's or the original? At least the original is wrong: plural subject combined with a singular verb.

axod• 16 years ago

"Googles employees ons reddits answers questions"?

lionhearted2• 16 years ago

> I hate myself for being such a grammar nazi, I really do.

You'll make more money, be productive, and have a happier life if you just process the information and shrug. The point of language is to communicate, not to obey grammar. That sentence isn't pretty, but you get all the information - google employees, on reddit, answering questions.

Most of the wealthiest people I know use bad grammar because the extra 10% of time to clear it up doesn't add as much value as doing more stuff. Sure, edit carefully if it's going to be something timeless or very important, but some people are being cool and answering questions random strangers on the internet ask them.

hcho• 16 years ago

Or develop a piece of software(a Firefox extension?) which will fix bad grammar and raise to fame among grammar nazis. Scratching your own itch versus learning to live with it.

angusgr4• 16 years ago

You're entirely right. Which is why I really did hate myself a bit for posting it. I normally notice bad grammar (especially small errors like this), move on, and don't think again about it. Sometimes, though, the urge is too strong.

I do always notice, though. My mum is a former English teacher, and I have a history degree as well as a CS one. After you spend enough time editing text in your native language, it becomes second nature to notice errors and want to correct them. I accept it as the price for being able to write easily and clearly myself, without consciously worrying about grammar. In my opinion, this is a useful skill when you're a programmer. Plus I kind of like proof editing (when it's invited.)

The one thing that surprised me about your reply was the choice of 'money' as the metric that I can maximise by suppressing the habit. That has certainly never occurred to me. The thinking behind it seems interesting on a few levels.

(NB: The nature of this post, and the fact I had a few glasses of wine over dinner, mean that there is bound to be at least one grammatical error in this reply. Doh!)

huherto• 16 years ago

I appreciate the correction and you did it in a courteous manner. I am not native speaker and I was a little confused by the mistake. Bad grammar can mislead those of us that are learning. Also, it is understood that everybody makes mistakes and it is not a critique on the person that made the mistake.

minus12• 16 years ago

Someone mentions the bonuses Google gives for successful launches. Isn't this generally considered a bad way to motivate "knowledge workers"? Anyone on the inside have any thoughts?

andreyf3• 16 years ago

I'm trying to answer your question, but it seems a little vague. In general, I'd say this a good rule of thumb that doesn't apply in Google's culture/implementation of cash awards. To be more specific, I'd have to speculate about why such policy would be "generally considered a bad way to motivate". Maybe it would be better if you gave some specific reasons, instead?

_delirium• 16 years ago

I'm not the original poster, but he/she might be referring to reports like this one: http://www.management-issues.com/2006/8/24/research/bonuses-...

There's an absolutely gigantic literature in management, economics, and other areas on pros/cons of bonuses and specific bonus schemes in all sorts of contexts, though, so I'm not sure it's fair to say there's any consensus on them being considered bad for knowledge workers. My recollection is that there are some arguments about it coming from an intrinsic/extrinsic motivation perspective, arguing that knowledge workers are most motivated intrinsically (because they like the job, find it engaging, like problem-solving, etc.), and that extrinsic motivation like bonuses might not help, or might even harm motivation (there's evidence from some psych studies that the presence of extrinsic rewards can reduce previously existing intrinsic motivation).

minus12• 16 years ago

Sorry for the lack of specifics. I'm thinking of Daniel Pink's book, Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us. It references studies showing that the presence of a monetary reward in situations that require abstract thinking tend to result in worse performance than no reward at all.

Maybe my assumption that this is a widely held belief was wrong.

It seems to work for Google. I'm just curious what it is about their implementation or culture that makes this the case.

This TED talk summarizes the book: http://www.ted.com/talks/dan_pink_on_motivation.html

frognibble• 16 years ago

I think the awards are designed to keep people from leaving for startups, not to motivate people to do better work.

Once an employee has a certain amount of financial security and a track record of making things happen (traits shared by a number of Google employees), the employee might be motivated to leave for a startup where there is an opportunity for a big payday. The Google awards provide an opportunity for a big payday while staying at Google.

dotBen3• 16 years ago

I don't have a Reddit account as I've never found the inclination to be part of that community, but the two thoughts on the topic I would raise here (which pertain to engineering jobs):

1) For all the perks (http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/clz1m/google_empl...) I believe I can 'buy' them myself for <$10,000 year (expensive lunches, gym membership, pay someone to wash my clothes, etc). Given that Google only pays average wages, this means that so long as I am working somewhere that is paying me over $10k above average salary, then I'm doing better than a Googler.

2) On bonuses, Google will give several $million to key folks who were instrumental in the success of high-profile google products (eg Google Maps folks walked away with several $million each). Don't forget, though, that unlike a startup the tax situation on that is probably rough - normal income rather than capital gains.

I guess both of the above indicate that, for me at my stage in my career, money considerations are a key part of where I place myself as a resource over 'cool place to work' - which is a reason I don't work for Google.

swombat• 16 years ago

Agreed, but worth noting that a lot of places that pay more than average also suck your soul away in the bargain. That's of course not true of all places, but banks, for example, tend to be a whole lot less fun to work at than Google. The "is it a fun job" factor should not be underestimated (unless you really just care about money, which is the case for some people - and I'm not saying this as a negative).

dotBen3• 16 years ago

Sure, there are banks et al that suck your soul away.

But I've managed to keep successful career in Silicon Valley/SF with startups and SME-sized internet companies doing interesting things.

My point is there is a a lot of middle ground between the insular world of Google with it's average pay and the suckage of banks.

nostrademons• 16 years ago

> For all the perks (http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/clz1m/google_empl...) I believe I can 'buy' them myself for <$10,000 year (expensive lunches, gym membership, pay someone to wash my clothes, etc). Given that Google only pays average wages, this means that so long as I am working somewhere that is paying me over $10k above average salary, then I'm doing better than a Googler.

That is totally true, if your goal is strictly money & material goods.

Google offers the perks mostly as a way to build community. And in this respect, it seems to work. There are lots of employers in Silicon Valley that will pay me good money. There are very few functioning communities - particularly in Silicon Valley, where it seems everybody's out for the gigantic payday.

dotBen3• 16 years ago

Assuming you mean community in the sense of employee community/camaraderie than I think you are astute and absolutely right with your observations.

As an alternative to a gigantic payday or not, though, I wouldn't want to be part of the Google world. I interact with it directly and it seems very insular and elitist (I have friends who work there, I'm involved with a number of Google initiatives, I visit the 'Plex a few times a year, etc.).

My experience is that Googler's end up down a rabbit hole of their own self-importance and loose touch of the rest of the professional world. A bit like college students at an Ivy-League school loosing touch with the real world.

Yes, even without a gigantic payday, I'll take the option that isn't the 'Google community'.

Money and material good are not 'strictly' my goal but I think everyone involved in entrepreneurial activities has to be focused on wealth creation as a considerable driver. I'm also double digit years into my career and done the "big co" thing already.

gaius2• 16 years ago

It's simple maths. Let's say that in SF an average programmer makes $100k and works 50 hrs/week. If Google can spend $10k on perks and get its people to average 56 hrs/week then it's onto a winner.

In reality when you consider that Google will be buying said perks in bulk, and that people will stay even longer, it might be paying 5% more and getting 20% more work. At the end of the day Google is a corporation like any other. Just one with better PR.

ergo98• 16 years ago

>I believe I can 'buy' them myself for <$10,000 year

The simple convenience of having a lot of good food options onsite is of significant value. If you have to spend your life going to the dry cleaners, driving to lunch, driving to the gym, and on and on and on, it can really reduce your use and enjoyment of those facilities.

philjackson• 16 years ago

So it's high quality fudge that's the key to poaching a Googler...

jacquesm• 16 years ago

It would be great if google employees would simply answer questions on google, but it seems that if there is one thing that google really sucks at it is communicating with their customers. Especially adsense suffers from a total lack of attention on behalf of google, I can't recall a single time when I tried contacting them that I actually got a relevant and timely answer. If I did get an answer it usually was some totally non-related cut-and-paste stuff.

Invariably followed by a 'how did we do' email asking for some kind of biscuit.

Incredible.

jmcnevin• 16 years ago

Maybe a bit off topic, but every time I read a thread like this, it leaves me wondering why people in the US are so reticent to discuss actual solid numbers regarding how much money they make, but do everything to dance around real figures, even if posting anonymously. When it comes to discussing salaries, suddenly everyone becomes a politician.

I lived in Bulgaria for two years, and it was pretty common there for people to ask, straight up, "How much money do you make?" They'd seem genuinely perplexed if I didn't want to answer. Granted, Bulgaria's economic situation is pretty different than the US's, but there was something about those frank exchanges that made me wonder why we do what we do.

Any thoughts?

ahlatimer• 16 years ago

I would imagine a lot of Googlers have it written in their contract that they aren't supposed to talk about how much money they make. I know most of the companies I've worked for have at least had it in the employee handbook.

Personally, I was okay with divulging that information even when I was working for places that told me not to. I figure if a company is willing to fire or sue me over telling someone else how much they pay me, I wouldn't want to work there anyway. It seems like such a trivial bit of information.

Google employees on Reddit answers questions.

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