No IE onboard Windows 7 in Europe

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8096701.stm

by surki • 17 years ago

22 32 17 years ago

news.bbc.co.uk

barredo• 17 years ago

How would people install Firefox/Chrome/Opera/Safari whatever then?

It's a shame that they choose to provide no browsers instead of providing a few

petercooper6• 17 years ago

I'm usually anti-Microsoft, but it's ridiculous that Internet Explorer was a problem to the EU to start with.

Why not unbundle Explorer? Why not unbundle the control panel? Isn't it unfair that Notepad is included? What about Calculator.. surely that's hurting Mathematica? (Before you think I'm going over the top here, IE compared to Firefox is like Calculator vs Mathematica IMHO..) These EU commissions are run by dim-witted politicos who fail to understand any of the realities of technology or business.

weavejester2• 17 years ago

It's not ridiculous at all. Microsoft were using their monopoly in desktop operating systems to gain browser market share. This doesn't benefit anyone apart from Microsoft.

weavejester2• 17 years ago

Presumably they'd use whatever browser was installed by the OEM.

petercooper6• 17 years ago

Who get paid to bundle certain applications on their machines..

vaksel• 17 years ago

Dell etc would probably have the stuff installed on all new computers.

DrJokepu• 17 years ago

Yeah as someone living in Europe, I'm not really happy about that. Internet Explorer is an excellent tool to download Chrome or Firefox. It's like a bootstrapping browser. Very useful.

jsonscripter3• 17 years ago

It would be nice if there was a dialog that lists a number of browsers that can be downloaded and installed automatically.

froo• 17 years ago

I'm curious if Europe will enforce the same policies on Apple - eg, ensuring that safari does not come pre-installed on snow leopard.

If not, blatant double standards given Apple's market share is increasing.

EDIT - another thought, since access to internet via phones is becoming more widespread, will the EU start imposing the same policies on mobile phone manufacturers...

EDIT #2 - Personally I think if the EU wants to force competition in the browser market, they should ensure that users get a choice of browsers with the pre-installed OS, otherwise with the browser not being included is potentially stumping the growth of internet availability to people who otherwise wouldn't have it.

Just to be clear, I'm not anti-Apple, I just dislike silly rulings that in themselves are anti-competitive, given they only apply to one company.

AlisdairO• 17 years ago

Anti monopoly rules are usually unfair sounding. Why shouldn't a larger company use its position and money to dominate a new market? The thing is, monopolies can be so damaging to society that treating them in a manner that seems instinctively fair is often bad for us. Like it or not, they are different, and they must be treated differently. It's important to remember that corporations are not people, so if they're treated unfairly the only reason it's a big deal is if society as a whole loses out as a result.

That said, I think the browser market is competitive enough nowadays that MS including a browser really is not that big a deal - OSes include browsers in the same way that cars come with steering wheels. I think this is more about punishing MS for past transgressions than anything else.

arthurk• 17 years ago

... by bundling its browser software in with its operating system.

I still don't understand why this is wrong. It's their os, let them do whatever they want with it. There are other operating systems around. They don't need to use Windows.

daleharvey• 17 years ago

My memory is pretty hazy, but wasnt it something to do with the fact they seperately charged for ie (while netscape was also non free).

Luc2• 17 years ago

If IE is bundled with the OS, their de facto monopoly in the OS market reduces innovation, competition and customer choice in the _browser_ market.

petercooper6• 17 years ago

Does the bundling of Command Prompt reduce innovation and competition in the command line client market? Does Windows Explorer reduce innovation and competition in the file browser market?

joel_feather• 17 years ago

There are several roads leading to rome, there is no need to use the highway.

rgoddard• 17 years ago

The problem steams from the fact that when Microsoft first starting bundling IE with the Windows, they had a monopoly on the OS market. The used their monopoly to dominate the Browser market and this is what got them into trouble. Apple does not have this problem because they only have a small fraction of the overall market.

Although in this point in time, I think the browser market has become competitive enough that people know of other choices and will make the effort to install them. A most people have come to expect that IE will be on the computer, and would be more annoyed if it did not, unless it came preinstalled with their browser of choice.

gscott2• 17 years ago

Netscape's ftp site was always handy, can't seem to find any ftp sites for any browsers now.

jsonscripter3• 17 years ago

ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/latest/

imp• 17 years ago

How do you get an ftp client without a browser?

halo• 17 years ago

Windows Explorer has an FTP client built-in.

gscott2• 17 years ago

With Windows you go to the Command Prompt and type ftp.

jeroen• 17 years ago

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=654414

The European Comission: "If the Commission were to find that Microsoft had committed an abuse, the Commission has suggested that consumers should be offered a choice of browser, not that Windows should be supplied without a browser at all."

That's quite a different situation than what MS imply with their response.

sounddust• 17 years ago

The article states that Microsoft will make it easy to find and download browsers, which is essentially the same thing as having a choice of browsers.

The EC is probably referring to Windows XP N, which didn't include a media player at all, and sort of left users in the dark as to how to play media files using it. I'm sure MS got some criticism from that from the EU and will not repeat the mistake.

hellweaver6662• 17 years ago

Why does it matter which browser has bigger market share as far as antitrust laws go? Nearly all browsers are free and have been for donkeys years, so does it really matter -business wise- if one company has the majority?

hellweaver6662• 17 years ago

Does this mean that AOL will finally have an excuse for sending out all those annoying CD's again?

No IE onboard Windows 7 in Europe

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