'An explosion': what's behind a rise in girls questioning their gender identity?

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/nov/24/an-explosion-what-is-behind-the-rise-in-girls-questioning-their-gender-identity

by MilnerRoute • 4 years ago

19 55 4 years ago

theguardian.com

MilnerRoute• 4 years ago

The link for this submission...

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33744670

incomingpain2• 4 years ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endocrine_disruptor

There are endocrine disruptors all over in our food, in our environment, and even our clean water.

The government is intentionally not banning such chemicals.

josephcsible• 4 years ago

How long have they been present for? If more than a few years, then they can't be why, since the article says that 10 years ago, this wasn't a problem.

incomingpain2• 4 years ago

How long have they been present for? If more than a few years, then they can't be why, since the article says that 10 years ago, this wasn't a problem.

I doubt I'll be able to reply to you, quite downvoted.

In my source you'll find most dates are in the 2011-2013 era. Hence 10 years ago.

The allegation that "10 years ago it wasnt a problem" is quite inaccurate. Most of these problem are occurring during pregnancy and pre-puberty. Whereas the damage is done, but then you have to wait some period of time until gender dysphoria really occurs. So it's completely a delayed action. So this absolutely is a factor.

In terms of all endocrine blocker exposures. Some pre-exist 10 years ago like phytoestrogens in soy products; but most were greatly introduced about 10 years ago.

bediger40002• 4 years ago

That's easy. Any one can see that society demands more of women than of men. Clothing and behavioral norms are more elaborate. Women work and typically do more household chores and childcare. Younger women are expected to allow sometimes aggressive flirting. There's lots more, like potential jobs are more restricted and women get less pay. There's also a pink tax - products for women cost more.

If you see these limitations and restrictions on you, why would you go along with them, if an alternative exists?

pjkundert6• 4 years ago

Interesting observation.

Also “verboten” to ask, unfortunately.

You are not allowed to question whether someone “decided” to pursue such an option.

gyrovont8• 4 years ago

It may not have even been a conscious decision as such. Being constantly bombarded with messages of this is what a woman should be may well have this effect subconsciously.

frontman19882• 4 years ago

Gender envy works both ways. More women graduate college than men, women face less social isolation and women also live longer than men. The future is feminine, in developed countries it's way better to be a woman if you can become one rather than become a man. No one is forcing you to have kids or do household chores these days and gender pay gap is largely a myth. Rather these days you have women being preferred over similarly competent men in corporate companies to fullfill diversity quotas.

pjkundert6• 4 years ago

Is it possible that young girls are naturally somewhat open to suggestion by their peer group and authority figures?

Unfortunately, asking such a question is “verboten”.

This will not end well, unless addressed directly and forcefully.

mikkergp• 4 years ago

I guess what’s wrong with girls questioning their gender identity? I imagine both girls and boys are open to suggestion from their peer group. What will not end well? What needs to be addressed directly and forcefully?

Everyone going through a phase, temporary or permanent, where they question their identities, gender or otherwise seems like a positive change to me. I foresee a world where _not_ questioning these fundamental identities is the oddity.

hn_throwaway_996• 4 years ago

I think questioning ones gender identity is fine, and a good thing.

I have significant concerns when the "default" response to these questions leads to powerful drugs taken during puberty, or irreversible surgeries before one reaches adulthood.

jfengel4• 4 years ago

So... people criticizing your questions constitutes "forbidden", only in German for extra oomph.

But if they want to ask questions, it must be "addressed directly and forcefully".

They're learning about themselves. You want to apply "force". Would that not be a more apt application of the word "verboten"?

klyrs5• 4 years ago

Pink triangle represent. This was tried before.

https://www.teenvogue.com/story/lgbtq-institute-in-germany-w...

pjkundert6• 4 years ago

In Canada, it is literally forbidden to help children introspect about the reasons and consequences of such profound decisions as discussed here.

Forbidding assistance to youths, to introspect, must be forcefully rejected — it has disastrous consequences.

klyrs5• 4 years ago

Until recently, such gender deviance was almost uniformly met with shunning, violence, and involuntary commitment. NHS did not offer these services. Culture has changed to be more permissive. NHS now offers these services, and are seeing demand. PANIC!!!

sn0w_crash• 4 years ago

This is good news for big pharma. Transgender medicine presents a huge revenue opportunity.

Monetizing a human by charging them a subscription fee to be who they identify as is a new subscription model that can last a lifetime.

The LTV is huge. The issue is that not many folks identify as trans. If anything, it would be in the interest of Pfizer to encourage more kids to question their identity and transition.

salawat• 4 years ago

They already have that with ...most patients.

Didn't you read the Goldman Sachs analysis? Cures aren't good business. Symptom mitigation is where it's at.

DanBC7• 4 years ago

You're claiming that providing a cheap, unpatented, medication to 0.5% of the population is some kid of growth opportunity when the same meds are used for nearly 1 in 3 women?

frontman19882• 4 years ago

Won't be surprised to find chinese/russian influence in this as well. Tiktok which teenagers use is full of such themes. Transitioning permanently to another gender in majority of cases makes the person incapable of procreation which in turn might lead to a sizeable population collapse if such trends keep increasing.

hn_throwaway_996• 4 years ago

I kind of despise how so much of our current politics and tribalism often prevents what I call the "both of these things can, and likely are, true" hypotheses. Instead you have each side demanding that only their "thing" is true.

In this case, I think it's highly likely that both of these things are true:

1. A society that is much more accepting of trans and other gender identities means that young people who would have previously hidden or suppressed their feelings of gender dysphoria will now seek out help to navigate these feelings.

2. Everyone, especially young people and teenagers, want to feel special and stand out, and while non-traditional gender identities were previously demonized, they can now serve as a way to be special and demand attention in certain societal groups. This, some young people who are going through the confusing feelings of puberty may be much more likely to say they are trans or non-binary, even if this is something they may not feel as strongly about when they reach adulthood.

gyrovont8• 4 years ago

Could be, though neither of these explain quite why it is girls in particular who are attempting to identify out of their sex, in a much larger ratio than boys.

Perhaps one root cause is that girls are uncomfortably sexualised much more than boys (as in, the 'male gaze'), and some try to escape this by adopting a belief that they're not girls / young women.

raxxorraxor• 4 years ago

I do believe it is a way to evade expectations, which are in my opinion much higher than for boys in the current culture. But I doubt it is boys oogling them.

It isn't their fault and not the fault of boys. On the contrary, I believe the expectations are much more often expressed by peers and parents.

leephillips• 4 years ago

The book describing this phenomenon came out two years ago, and was called one of the best books of the year by the Economist and the London Times:

https://www.amazon.com/Irreversible-Damage-Transgender-Seduc...

gyrovont8• 4 years ago

It's a very good read. Helen Joyce's Trans and Kathleen Stock's Material Girls are also excellent critiques of this movement.

a_shovel4• 4 years ago

Helen Joyce is an eugenics advocate who has stated that she believes it is necessary to reduce the number of transgender people, even happily-transitioned ones, because she sees them as "damaged" and "a huge problem to a sane world" because they require "special accomodation".

DanBC7• 4 years ago

Joyce pushes an antisemitic conspiracy theory. She claims she made a simple error with the names of two charities. (George Soros made a very large donation to a human rights charity, and a very much smaller donation to a pro-trans charity, and Joyce swaps these around to make out Soros paid huge amounts to pro-trans organisations). But, we know it's an antisemitic conspiracy theory because we know where Joyce plagiarised it from - Jennifer Bilek.

'An explosion': what's behind a rise in girls questioning their gender identity?

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