Anti-Xi protest spreads in China, worldwide as Chinese leader begins third term

https://lite.cnn.com/en/article/h_0e8345c361c017054fefa34b79a7e120

by rntn • 4 years ago

67 27 4 years ago

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3qz• 4 years ago

What’s the point of protesting when they don’t even have elections? Why can’t the government just ignore the protesters with no consequences?

dontbenebby• 4 years ago

What’s the point of protesting when they don’t even have elections?

Because people who aren't sociopaths experience psychic distress at the idea of violence. (That's absolutely an Always Sunny reference, BTW.)

brundolf2• 4 years ago

Even authoritarian regimes have to think about civil unrest. The people under them still have some power: they have the power to revolt. Dictators are terrified of this possibility. And a protest is a way of signaling "hey, the temperature is rising buddy".

A democracy by comparison functions as a gradual release valve: smaller amounts of unrest can affect smaller changes, without overthrowing the entire system.

alexvoda• 4 years ago

The feedback loop is slightly more complex. Dictators are also afraid of betrayal. And rising temperature creates opportunities for underlings to decide betrayal is profitable.

MuffinFlavored• 4 years ago

what’s the smallest protest in china that would actually stand any kind of chance of successful revolt/revolution?

A4ET8a8uTh06• 4 years ago

<< What’s the point of protesting when they don’t even have elections?

Huh? Elections just happened. They were not direct elections, but within the party system they were elections.

If I were to compare Chinese elections, I would maybe compare them to UK House of Lords.

As to your general point, "why do anything when you have no right to do it"?

Well, we are humans. Not all of us just roll over when we are told to.

matthewmacleod2• 4 years ago

If I were to compare Chinese elections, I would maybe compare them to UK House of Lords.

… the UK House of Lords which is famously unelected?

rasz• 4 years ago

Why can’t the government just ignore the protesters with no consequences?

Worked for Macron in France.

imiric3• 4 years ago

Naive rhetorical question: is there any chance that China could change to be a force of good in the world?

It's deeply unsettling that the most populated nation on Earth is ruled by one of the most corrupt governments on Earth, and that its culture is deeply xenophobic, irreverent of the environment, and any living organism other than their own.

As China becomes more powerful, is there anything other nations can do to make this transition more positive for everyone? I don't mean economically, but on an existential level.

dustymcp• 4 years ago

Im afraid not, revolt has to come from within to change something like that unless you like the war option..

A4ET8a8uTh06• 4 years ago

I am trying to take this comment at face value. Do you really think other governments are that much better in terms of values you described? There are differences and not small ones between major nation states, but, well, factors listed are not unique not China.

imiric3• 4 years ago

Ah, the inevitable whataboutism whenever China is discussed.

Other countries are not the topic here. But I'll engage: other countries and governments have similar issues, but the combination of factors I mentioned are unique to China.

oneoff786• 4 years ago

No. Though I would note their abysmal population pyramid and lack of immigration is a recipe for failure.

Nomentatus3• 4 years ago

Sure. Marxism doesn't compel their current behavior, and neither does any sane nationalism - however a shame culture (as China is) and nationalism can make for a volatile mix, as we've seen of late. But the CCP won't change it's current mix of stripes any time soon. Vietnam has gone through similar spasms, back and forth. They're assuming an existential threat from democracies that just isn't there. Internal division (which is a feature) prevents it, even if an elite class wanted an all out war of conquest, which they don't.

They will experiment with their society; they might find a useful course. But I vote with Walter Kerr, that no society can be both very well ordered and very creative/innovative. Which really limits China on its current course even if they somehow avoid all the traps that human leaders' unconscious selfishness has set for them.

How Not to Write a Play by former New York Times Drama Critic Walter Kerr came out in 1955 and is the best history of innovation I've ever read. It make it quite clear that periods of true innovation are quite rare, don't happen everywhere, and require disordered societies (to tolerate a writer who isn't going to pander to the prejudices and powers of the day, whatever they are.) Highly recommended.

He was also the husband of the person who wrote "Please Don't Eat the Daisies."

My guess is that the best-of-both-worlds society, and therefore the most likely society of the far future will be both Yin and Yang at the same time: having a large disordered creative enclave within a much larger well-ordered society that is isolated from the creatives (free speech within the enclave, only.)

AnimalMuppet• 4 years ago

Two comments.

First, democracies are an existential threat, just not in the way you're thinking. If western democracy is obviously more functional than Chinese authoritarianism, that's an existential threat, not to China, but to the CCP. Also to Putin, which is why he's so insane about not allowing culturally-adjacent Ukraine to have a successful democratic government.

Second, someone here on HN (too lazy to try to dig up who) said that Xi has the usual dictator-for-life's problem - people succeed by having Xi's approval, not by being better at their jobs than Xi is at his. This means that Xi hears more and more what he wants to hear, and less and less actual truth. The result is big decisions get made that don't - can't work, because they are not based on reality.

Anti-Xi protest spreads in China, worldwide as Chinese leader begins third term

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