SpaceRyde, a Canadian microsat launcher, completes field trial of rocket carrier

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYKQP-A7468

by muunbo • 6 years ago

38 32 6 years ago

muunbo10• 6 years ago

Disclaimer: I am an Avionics Specialist at SpaceRyde. Ask questions!

elil17• 6 years ago

Could you explain what is going on in this video? Are you building a microsat launcher that gets sent off while hanging from a helicopter?

joewadcan• 6 years ago

enable accurate launch of the rocket from the balloon in the stratosphere. Even though Silverthrone is designed for launch from a balloon, its control capabilities were put to test in harsher conditions of the heavy downwash of the helicopter, to ensure it is ready for rocket launch.

Seems like this is testing the hardware that will be elevated using a balloon. The helicopter isn't part of launch plans.

bserge• 6 years ago

I believe it's similar to this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air-launch-to-orbit

The idea is to get the rocket as high as possible using conventional vehicles, which should make it easier for the rocket to reach orbit.

It was proposed as a way of launching rockets from countries that don't have access to the best spots on the planet.

I've followed ARCASpace with interest for a while, although it looks like nothing came out of it, sadly:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARCAspace

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IAR_111

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haas_(rocket)

muunbo10• 6 years ago

In the video, we show a flight test of our system hanging from a helicopter - however, our actual launches will happen while hanging from a high altitude balloon, not a helicopter. The helicopter test gives us a way to test the performance of our yaw control system (to point the rocket along a desired heading) without having to do a full blown balloon launch.

errantspark• 6 years ago

Awesome! Thanks for being here to answer questions, I've got a few for ya.

The big quad thing is just to ensure heading stability? Does that imply that the rocket lights and drops at roughly the same time so there's no chance for it to tumble out of it's desired orientation? Are you going to blast all the props immediately before launch to get it to swing into a more vertical position? How much control authority do you actually have with the air so thin up there?

muunbo10• 6 years ago

Hi, great questions! 1) Yes you're right - the 'big quad thing', a.k.a rocket carrier a.k.a gondola, stabilizes the heading of the rocket. 2) It does not necessarily imply that, but yes that would be a great way to do it so that the rocket control system doesn't need to correct for the tumble. 3) There are multiple ways to pitch up the rocket, and you are right that one of them is to use the props. Alternatives are to have thrusters on the rocket or have gimballing on the rocket nozzle. All are viable approaches. 4) This is a complex question as we have many variables to play with, such as choice of launch altitude, size and design of propellers, etc.

Taniwha2• 6 years ago

I have a question: So this is intended to maintain heading prior to launch (my friends who previously did balloon launch were doing something similar), and you intend to launch from baloons at a height where there's very little air .... how are the props going to work without air?

varjag• 6 years ago

If balloon remains buoyant it means there's air.

It's rarified but shouldn't be impossible to compensate with propeller rpm.

muunbo10• 6 years ago

So there's not "no air" but rather just low pressure. The props can be designed to work at certain high altitudes, although they will be less effective at higher altitudes. But this only means that it takes longer to change the yaw of the gondola to the desired heading.

progre• 6 years ago

Am I correct in thinking that the launch will be basically horizontal once the assembly has enough altitude?

muunbo10• 6 years ago

Most likely, yes, but it's not necessarily the case. We could pitch the rocket up slightly if it helps to achieve a specific target trajectory.

akavel• 6 years ago

What's the expected maximum payload weight and size? What's the expected maximum altitude? Tried searching for that info on the website but didn't seem to be able to find it at a glance (?)

ghostpepper• 6 years ago

Does it need to be carried by a manned helicopter? How high can you launch?

muunbo10• 6 years ago

The helicopter flight was a test of our gondola's ability to control the heading of the rocket. Our actual launches are not on a helicopter but rather on a high altitude balloon, which allows us to go up and launch from the stratosphere.

jagger27• 6 years ago

Are you hiring software developers in the Ottawa area?

muunbo10• 6 years ago

Hi! We are not currently hiring in Ottawa, only in Vaughan (close to Toronto): https://www.spaceryde.com/careers. Let your friends know!

aaron695• 6 years ago

Hydrogen or helium balloons?

And why did you chose that one over the other?

muunbo10• 6 years ago

We have no specific preference for hydrogen vs helium balloons at the moment

clscott• 6 years ago

This is very cool, I had no idea something like this was right in my back yard.

It's good to seeing the old Boeing facilities being put to good use!

ganafagol• 6 years ago

More space junk into orbit. Good use indeed!

muunbo10• 6 years ago

Thank you! :) Canada is a great place to build a space launch company

ttul• 6 years ago

The technology is described well on their web site: https://www.spaceryde.com/technology

"A stratospheric balloon takes satellites in a custom-designed, ultra-light rocket to high altitude, where it is launched in near vacuum conditions, avoiding the stress and costs of high speed travel through dense layers of the atmosphere."

chabons• 6 years ago

The common term for this is Rockoon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockoon

valuearb4• 6 years ago

Elon Musk once discussed why air launch from planes was not a good idea, and his criticisms apply to Rockoons as well.

“seems like...you're high up there and so surely that's good and you're going at...0.7 or 0.8 Mach and you've got some speed and altitude, you can use a higher expansion ratio on the nozzle, doesn't all that add up to a meaningful improvement in payload to orbit?

"The answer is no, it does not, unfortunately. It's quite a small improvement. It's maybe a 5% improvement in payload to orbit...and then you've got this humungous plane to deal with. Which is just like having a stage. From SpaceX's standpoint, would it make more sense to have a gigantic plane or to increase the size of the first stage by five percent? Uhh, I'll take option two.

"And then, once you get beyond a certain scale, you just can't make the plane big enough. When you drop...the rocket, you have the slight problem that you're not going the right direction. If you look at what Orbital Sciences did with Pegasus, they have a delta wing to do the turn maneuver but then you've got this big wing that's added a bunch of mass and you've able to mostly, but not entirely, convert your horizontal velocity into vertical velocity, or mostly vertical velocity, and the net is really not great.”

For SpaceRyde the extra height is a trivial benefit given that the velocity of reaching orbiting is the key part, altitude is a free byproduct of that velocity. The real benefit is being able to use a more efficient nozzle.

By not having to throttle for MaxQ, with a vacuum optimized nozzle, at most balloon launch adds 10%, at the cost of substantial size and payload limits.

One benefit of SpaceRyde over plane launch is the rocket can launch at a better orientation, not requiring the added weight/complexity of wings like Pegasus.

But the problem is that SpaceRyde lacks the single major benefits of airplane launch, the ability to launch almost regardless of weather by flying around it, and in a mission specific latitude that can be reached in flight from a home launch base. SoaceRyde is not launching in inclement weather, though it can be launched in different latitudes.

It’s sole advantage is going to be cost over other air launch systems (should be way less complex) and other ground launched small sat providers but is unlikely to be able to serve more than the tiniest payload sizes.

SpaceRyde, a Canadian microsat launcher, completes field trial of rocket carrier

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