Brazil Suspends WhatsApp Payments

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-06-23/brazil-s-central-bank-suspends-whatsapp-payments

by namanaggarwal • 6 years ago

89 46 6 years ago

sschueller• 6 years ago

Why doesn't Facebook do it in the US? Too much opposition from the large payment processing lobby?

They already have Facebook Pay on messenger, and WhatsApp is mostly unheard of. Maybe it doesn't make sense to launch it in the USA.

WhatsApp is however overwhelmingly used in Brazil, and highly lacking good Venmo-like apps. I did not like the Brazilian Fed getting in the way with regulations before it even launched. Sends the wrong message to foreign investors considering Brazil.

jamisteven• 6 years ago

Mostly unheard of?! Besides my parents, I dont know anyone that doesnt use WhatsApp in the US.

moon22• 6 years ago

and highly lacking good Venmo-like apps

There's a few popular apps that allow you to share payments in Brazil, such as:

PicPay Rappi Mercado Pago

JumpCrisscross2• 6 years ago

Why doesn't Facebook do it in the US?

Facebook just got bloodied by regulators and the Congress over Libra.

U.S. payment rules are also quite strict. Brazil’s are too, but Facebook was comfortable ignoring those.

Too much opposition from the large payment processing lobby?

If payments regulation worked like that, Stripe and PayPal and Venmo and Apple Pay wouldn’t exist.

cowpig• 6 years ago

If payments regulation worked like that, Stripe and PayPal and Venmo and Apple Pay wouldn’t exist.

I don't know how much of the complex regulatory barriers to the payments industry are designed by industry insiders with an explicit aim to stifle competition, but the fact that there are only a small number of actors in the space indicates that it's far from a "free market".

You can have a corrupt market full of lobby-influenced regulatory barriers and still have more than a pure monopoly. Sometimes you have a small number of competitors, or 1-2 firms with the lion's share of the market. Sometimes you have a cartel. Sometimes newcomers even break through regulatory barriers through innovation!

All that to say that your evidence doesn't do much to support your claim.

moon22• 6 years ago

The so-called "super apps", such as Rappi, are getting widely popular in Latin America. Maybe Facebook saw it as an opportunity for turning WhatsApp into their own super app.

It's also an opportunity to kill competition, since almost everybody uses WhatsApp.

f00zz4• 6 years ago

No surprises, the country is deeply hostile to capitalism and innovation. Brazil is not poor by accident. Too bad, as this could have been a boon to small businesses.

victords• 6 years ago

That's quite a jump to conclusion... I don't think that the issue here is Brazil's position on capitalism or innovation, there are other companies providing similar services there.

The issue seems to be a juggernaut company like Facebook, with all the flaws that it has, trying to enter the payment sector of a developing country without regulation or notice.

f00zz4• 6 years ago

a juggernaut company like Facebook

More likely Brazil's central bank doesn't want competition with its own payment system (Pix).

Dacod• 6 years ago

Honestly! It kind of reminds me of Marc Andreessen's "Anti-colonialism has been economically catastrophic for the Indian people for decades. Why stop now?” comment.

whb07• 6 years ago

Yep, only people to suffer will be the little ones whilst the larger players get to be piggish on the fat margins.

zekrioca• 6 years ago

"Deeply hostile to capitalism".

They are avoiding a monopoly to surge.

"Brazil is poor".

I guess one has to travel.

skuzye• 6 years ago

Speaking as a Brazilian - the country is an odd one. If you go by GDP it should be a rich country but it just isn't.

It's rightly classified as an emergent country. It has deep social and poverty problems that needs addressing even though it's a regional economic force.

Brazil is definitely capitalist but it's hard to do business there - 144th place in economic freedom index.

duaoebg2• 6 years ago

Brazil is a corrupt highly taxed basket case. I know plenty of people who left.

The govt there tried to buy some software from me and then tried to tax the international sale by %40 after the price was agreed. I added the tax on top and they pulled out.

I have a unofficial free for Latin America donation program for different software because of all the end users from there who can’t afford it. They write to me explaining their situation.

I think a distinction should be made, if at all possible, between capitalism and corporatism. Brazil is pro-corporatist and anti—capitalist. This is common in Latin America with its crazy wealth distribution.

f00zz4• 6 years ago

tax the international sale by %40

I'm not surprised. In general, import duties are around 60%, and that's not even the full story. The (foreign) company I work for sent me a development board once; when it arrived here I found out that, in addition to those 60%, I'd have to pay 18% state taxes. I was expecting this to add up to 78%, or even 1.6 * 1.18 = 89%, but in fact it's computed like (1.6 / (1 - 0.18)) = 95%.

Ostensibly, these tariffs are meant to protect the local industry from foreign competition. I heard that there are certain other countries trying to do the same; they should be careful what they wish for.

tchaffee2• 6 years ago

Taxes in Brazil are very low except for taxes on imports. It's not anti-capitalist within its own economy. The startup scene in Brazil is thriving.

tchaffee2• 6 years ago

Brazil has massive investments coming in from foreign investors on a steady basis because of the capitalism and innovation.

rbanffy2• 6 years ago

I believe this person probably thinks Brazil had two socialist presidents, Lula and Dilma (plus a socialist interim one, Michel Temer) prior to the God-chosen one it has now.

I wouldn't engage.

rescbr3• 6 years ago

the country is deeply hostile to capitalism and innovation

Sure, but payment processing, money transfers, e-wallets etc. are regulated matters in Brazil as they are in the EU and in the US.

Facebook is not registered as a financial institution and is not a participant in the Brazilian Payments System, unlike PayPal and other local and international players, so you can figure out why the Central Bank put a stop to Facebook's launch.

tehjoker• 6 years ago

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-brazil-politics-chicagobo...

Also as a reminder, Brasil had a military dictatorship overthrow a social democratic movement in order to implement economic privatization. Bolsonaro is famously a huge fan of the dictatorship years.

The dictatorship was US backed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1964_Brazilian_coup_d%27%C3%A9...

vertis• 6 years ago

Paywall: https://outline.com/thcKSd

iKlsR• 6 years ago

Press Esc within a second of loading the page to kill the paywall. Works for many other news sites that rely heavily on JS and don't partially fetch previews but just try to hide the content.

Brazil Suspends WhatsApp Payments

Related Stories