Keeping Government Out of Your Business

https://cacm.acm.org/news/243729-keeping-government-out-of-your-business/fulltext

by NextGenLog • 6 years ago

73 78 6 years ago

cacm.acm.org

rhcom2• 6 years ago

Seems to be hugged to death: https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:keIYYf...

neonate• 6 years ago

https://archive.md/gQiFp

olivermarks• 6 years ago

Important article IMO

objektif5• 6 years ago

Until you beg for a bail out.

tathougies22• 6 years ago

I mean, the government shut down the economy, not the virus. Even after we all knew about it, spring breakers were still partying, people still wanted to go on vacation, people were still going out. The government had to shut the economy down with the threat of force.

That action alone should open the government up to civil tort liability. Like, if the government imprisoned me unjustly they would have to pay me when I sue them. The same should apply here. Without government intervention, the market would have still been going on strong. If the government orders an indefinite shut down, a huge violation of American's civil rights (but one that is warranted in my opinion), then they need to properly reimburse for that drastic change in civil rights.

If the government did not want to pay, they should have let the market decline due to people dying and then refuse to bail out corporations, because that would have been a problem of the market's own making. Now it is a problem of the government's making, and they have to compensate, period.

duxup7• 6 years ago

Wouldn't the result of your argument simply be that there be no effort on the government to stop / slow / or manage the spread of a dangerous disease to simply avoid the liability you describe?

ornornor• 6 years ago

The market is not a living being. It’s a concept. Why should The Market matter more than real people’s lives? We’ve seen how well letting The Market self regulate and its players self regulate goes... Tobacco is addictive and kills lots of people with totally preventable deaths. But for decades tobacco companies were allowed to profit while ruining people’s lives. Had there not been for laws restricting tobacco use, we would be a lot worse off. That’s one example. There are countless others.

save_ferris2• 6 years ago

Are you suggesting that the government acted inappropriately by shutting down public activity? This disease has the potential to kill millions, is health and human safety not a responsibility that falls on the government?

inopinatus• 6 years ago

Sounds great, how much do you want for your first amendment rights?

rexpop• 6 years ago

the government shut down the economy, not the virus.

This is not true. I put myself in self-isolation over a week before the State mandate came out. Many of us are doing this for ourselves, based on collective intelligence and agreement.

Teever• 6 years ago

That action alone should open the government up to civil tort liability.

I was under the impression that the US Gov't can decide whether or not it can be sued by a plaintiff. If that is the case I have a sneaking suspicion that the Government would decline to continue with any case against itself regarding this issue.

Do you think it would be any different?

0x8BADF00D• 6 years ago

These companies are not struggling because the government told them to shut down. They're struggling because they're levered to the hilt with cheap debt from the Fed. They should not be bailed out and allowed to fail, because the management was incompetent and did not save any money for a downturn.

As an aside, this used to be a site of entrepreneurs and hackers. Sadly, now it is filled with government cronies and apologists of bad behavior. It's shameful.

jariel4• 6 years ago

This is absurd.

If the government did not coordinate action, not only would 20% of need hospitalization and wouldn't get it (so we'd be dying in the streets), 'the economy' would fall apart quite quickly on its own.

The government's actions are quite literally saving the economy in the long run.

Yes, we need be wary of unnecessary intervention etc. but I'm just shocked to read this kind of stuff.

The government is using the legit powers it has, mostly for what it's supposed to do right now.

If anything, there could be a considerably more direct intervention in healthcare.

seb314• 6 years ago

seriously, are you trolling?

in general, measuring the cost of government decisions seems good.

But here, you seem to be suggesting that a) if the government acts, it should pay the income you'd had if you had kept working (and assuming corona hadn't stopped you anyway) or b) if it doesn't act, I guess you'd like to claim damages for that family member that got killed by corona because the goverent allowed the epidemic to get out of control?

triceratops• 6 years ago

they should have let the market decline due to people dying and then refuse to bail out corporations

That sounds great in theory. In practice, you'd have everyone who could work from home continuing to do so. And everyone who could not, forced to come to work, get sick and possibly die, under pain of losing their job (and therefore, their healthcare).

lordnacho• 6 years ago

I wonder if the case tracing for this virus will be used to promote a policy of "we need to know where everyone is, just in case". I can see someone putting that out and saying the information will only be used in this type of emergency.

rasteau• 6 years ago

No need to wonder. https://www.npr.org/2020/03/19/818327945/israel-begins-track...

"Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu ordered the country's Shin Bet domestic spy agency, usually tasked with monitoring Palestinian and Israeli extremists, to launch the cellphone surveillance. It locates people who could have the virus and messages them.

"Meanwhile, late Thursday Israel's Supreme Court stopped the police from using the data to enforce quarantines, which it had started doing. The court also said it could scrap the program unless it goes through parliament or if the country is put on a total lockdown."

notyourday2• 6 years ago

Living in NYC it was very eye-opening to me how readily supposedly fiercely independent and "how dare you, the government, theoretically infringe on my theoretical rights" population fell in line with the government orders that are just shy of rights suspension with the only bone thrown to the electorate being a suspension of evictions.

finnthehuman• 6 years ago

I'd expect to see it. People are already using the virus as a reason people shouldn't be allowed to have surveillance-free conversations:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/18/tech/whatsapp-coronavirus-mis...

slg• 6 years ago

Maybe this is intentional, but this is a bad headline considering it is using a less popular definition of business and there is an ongoing discussion of how involved the government should be in controlling and supporting businesses due to COVID-19 and the resulting economic downturn. Half the comments here are about that that alternative meaning instead of the topic in the actual article.

motohagiography• 6 years ago

So long as we accept that privacy is a technical problem, we consent to the legal impunity of people who vioate it. Tech is a poor substitute for freedom and associated rights. It keeps people distracted and believing that if only they knew more math they would be free.

We need to change the conversation.

Keeping Government Out of Your Business

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