Zhaoxin Unveiled Next-Generation x86 SoC Plans

https://fuse.wikichip.org/news/3138/zhaoxin-unveiled-next-generation-x86-soc-plans-32-core-servers-sub-7nm-client-designs/

by rbanffy • 7 years ago

73 50 7 years ago

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monocasa9• 7 years ago

For those who don't know, Zhaoxin is a continuation of the Via x86 line. Neat to see a third vendor still kicking.

ianai2• 7 years ago

How close to governmental organizations is it?

monocasa9• 7 years ago

It is a direct partnership with the Shaghai Municipal Government.

ComputerGuru• 7 years ago

Do they retain the legal agreements Via had for x86 usage?

monocasa9• 7 years ago

I assume so, but the contracts are private. It certainly looks like the world wide license that Via would have had was split into 'China' and 'not China', hence how difficult these chips are to get a hold of. That being said, it's pretty much impossible to know for sure.

JerryTy• 7 years ago

Fourth vendor actually! Centaur just announced a new core for the server market and even AVX-512 support.

See this https://fuse.wikichip.org/news/3099/centaur-unveils-its-new-...

monocasa9• 7 years ago

Awesome! And some tensor cores for inference, neat!

Honestly, wouldn't be surprised to see more vendors spring up out of nowhere soon. The base patents are about to expire on x86_64. Everyone keeps saying that Apple is going to release an ARM laptop, but IMO a homegrown x86_64 chip is way more likely.

baybal22• 7 years ago

Zhaoxin - is a design licenses from Via, the maker of Centaur

rasz9• 7 years ago

Same vendor actually :)

rasz9• 7 years ago

For those who don't know, Zhaoxin _never_ released any x86 product. Over the last 10? years their only output have been laughable roadmaps listing non existing processors.

ai_ja_nai• 7 years ago

seriously?

monocasa9• 7 years ago

I've gotten the sense that they're using them, you just can't buy them on the open market. The Chinese government has a ton of uses for passable x86 chips that they control the masks of and could easily consume the whole production line.

Nokinside• 7 years ago

Leonove ThinkPads with Zhaoxin prosessors have been spotted in China. https://imgur.com/a/kIK8bmw

bufferoverflow• 7 years ago

No pricing, unfortunately.

tpetry• 7 years ago

This cpu may never be sold. It's an effort by the chinese government to be less dependent on american companies.

rasz9• 7 years ago

More like effort by VIA to circumvent x86 license expiry with added bonus of National IC Investment Fund grants https://www.forbes.com/sites/willyshih/2019/11/22/chinas-lat...

jacquesm2• 7 years ago

I've used the previous generation of these for some machine control in very hostile environment (welding, plasmacutting), very reliable and cheap.

rasz9• 7 years ago

Which one exactly? Afaik all the CPUs on their roadmap never existed.

jacquesm2• 7 years ago

I still have the board somewhere, I will look it up when I get back.

kkmx• 7 years ago

They exist. You can buy a Lenovo Kaitian-series dekstop in China with a Zhaoxin chip. They also have a bunch of laptops. You can't outside of china because that's their agreement with Via. You can still find them on Alibaba sometimes.

ThinkBeat• 7 years ago

With the trade war and "national security" posture the US is doing its very best to stimulate China to become self-sufficient.

Vomzor• 7 years ago

China was already doing that. One of the aims of the trade war is trying to slow them down.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Made_in_China_2025

jorblumesea• 7 years ago

China was stealing enough tech to do that. Also, self sufficiency was already a long term strategic goal, thus the tech stealing. It forces the issue, but hardly changes the calculus.

tanilama• 7 years ago

Previous it is a cherry-on-top, now self sufficiency is their life line. A day and night difference.

But I guess those days will arrive no matter what, as semiconductor ended its exponential growth era, the West can't have an edge forever, no matter how hard they try.

vbezhenar• 7 years ago

Russia also producing their own CPUs recently. They are not very competitive in consumer space, but they are not ridiculously expensive either. It's awesome to see more competition.

3fe9a03ccd14ca5• 7 years ago

Producing CPU (and chips in general) are rightfully seen by all of these countries as a national security imperative.

api• 7 years ago

Good. I'm not convinced that a unipolar world is a good thing. As long as open war does not occur, some national rivalry stimulates innovation just as corporate competition does. A unipolar world is like a stagnant monopoly in the business sphere. Politically you can see the effect in any one party US state (regardless of party). The party in power gets corrupt and incompetent.

Maybe China vs USA will put humanity on Mars.

tambourine_man• 7 years ago

I’ve read about it many times but still can’t figure it out completely.

Can a x86 license holder always use any of its new features? For example, you had a license in the 90s, can you automatically use 256, 512 width vector instructions?

Are none of those licenses untransferable in case of the company purchase or just AMD’s?

Is the license policy from Intel a result from IBM’s pressure back in the day? Did they demand multiple providers or just one alternative (AMD)?

monocasa9• 7 years ago

Like all complex legal matters "it depends".

The enforcement is based on patents and contracts signed for licensing those patents. There tend to be a new set of patents for each new ISA feature. That's half the reason why the virtualization extensions are different on Intel and AMD for instance; they didn't cross license that piece.

The patents are obviously public, but we can't answer all the questions about the contracts since those tend to be private (we have seen a couple publicly due to law suits however).

toast0• 7 years ago

AMDs initial x86 processors were indeed as an IBM mandated second source, but I think their 386 class (and definitely 486 class) processors were independently developed. I suspect Intel won't cancel existing licenses for anti-trust reasons, but also would price a new license for a lot more than in the 486 days.

rasz9• 7 years ago

AMD 386 had directly copied microcode, Intel sued and lost due to previous cross licensing agreements.

rasz9• 7 years ago

VIA x86 license expired in 2013, thats the year Zhaoxin came into existence in mainland China.

Zhaoxin Unveiled Next-Generation x86 SoC Plans

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