The Human Cost of Amazon’s Fast, Free Shipping

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/05/us/amazon-delivery-drivers-accidents.html

by elorant • 7 years ago

50 22 7 years ago

Seems to me that the real story here isn’t Amazon but the heartbreaking frequency of vehicular crashes. Always fun to pick on Amazon though.

x0x0• 7 years ago

The article pointed out -- at some length -- ways that the brave new gig job world is different: less training, more inexperienced drivers, more layers of contractors and subcontractors, drivers under very aggressive time pressure, drivers in vehicles with which they are unfamiliar, and drivers on routes with which they are unfamiliar. And for the coup de grâce, Amazon -- unlike Fedex, DHS, UPS, or the USPS -- worms out of liability for any of these accidents, eliminating pressure to reduce them.

Agree or disagree, but it's hard to see how you read the article and didn't see the extensive discussion of ways Amazon is more dangerous.

tomxor2• 7 years ago

the brave new gig job world is different: less training, more inexperienced drivers, more layers of contractors and subcontractors, drivers under very aggressive time pressure, drivers in vehicles with which they are unfamiliar, and drivers on routes with which they are unfamiliar.

This seems to apply to Uber drivers in the UK - I've never been in one, but as a pedestrian they are terrible drivers compared to taxis, I frequently witness them driving through zebra crossings and red lights while pedestrians are using them... taxis are the complete opposite, they go out of their way to be nice to pedestrians, after all they are potential customers.

gshdg• 7 years ago

Also poorly maintained vehicles

sundayedition• 7 years ago

One of my chief complaints about the "gig" economy; large corporations get to avoid certain risks and (some) people ignore (or may be ignorant of) these risks which means society sometimes shares the burden. For example, not paying the extra insurance premiums when using their vehicle for commercial purposes.

I think of it similar to working under the table; some think "I get paid more than minimum wage and save money on taxes!" But the employer often saves much more and the worker is often to naive to realize what they're losing out on (social security contributions, potential workers compensation benefits, potential recovery of wages, etc)

Amezarak• 7 years ago

According to the Buzzfeed investigation, Amazon set it up so as to not require a more stringent commercial driver’s license, and Amazon was exerting such pressure on their contracted startup delivery companies that the companies were telling their drivers not to wear seatbelts and the culture was to pee in bottles. There were even examples of dispatchers telling drivers to flee the scene of accidents to make sure they made their deliveries.

Stressing and driving untrained people that hard has a lot more with the sad frequency of vehicular delivery crashes. If Amazon used established companies with trained drivers instead like Fedex, USPS, and UPS, which take safety much more seriously, we wouldn't be talking about this.

Spooky23• 7 years ago

If you’re doing this argument, you should go the full HN and blame zoning.

Poor Amazon wouldn’t need drivers if only zoning rules allowed them to place warehouses anywhere. If silly regulations didn’t forbid Amazon from putting a container full of stuff in every driveway, rent free, countless lives would be saved.

flywithdolp• 7 years ago

Ofcourse Amazon will try to protect them selfs against lawsuits

I do think that Amazon have some moral issues, Since I came across Amazon M turk.

They basically have army of over 500,000 registered workers Those people make few cents per micro tasks while amazon make x10 that amount of each task and leave tiny slice of the cake for its core users.

ralusek• 7 years ago

I highly doubt Amazon makes 10x profit over what they pay their workers. My guess would be that they have very thin margins per worker, and just have a lot of workers.

wongarsu• 7 years ago

M'turk doesn't seem that hard too replicate, yet I am not aware of notable competitors (outside of specialized niches like design or captcha solving). If there were massive margins surely there would be highly advertised competitors trying to get in on these massive profits.

ptah2• 7 years ago

i think 10X is conservative tbh

WilTimSon• 7 years ago

I like how the comment above you is "I doubt they make as much as 10X" while you're saying they're making much more. I'd side with you, though, considering how scummy Amazon's practices can get. The way they treat their workers and "shave off costs" (read: make work conditions inhumane) is a capitalist wet dream and a worker's nightmare.

gbersac• 7 years ago

I doubt they can have such high margin while there is so much competition : https://www.g2.com/products/amazon-mechanical-turk/competito...

jrockway• 7 years ago

Previous discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20889204

(The link is different, but it's the ProPublica version of the same article, so the commentary is very relevant.)

The Human Cost of Amazon’s Fast, Free Shipping

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