foundron

Thank you. No need to be sorry. Not everyone needs to spin a narrative to justify their actions to make themselves feel good.

Looks like you do agree that at real scale it would have an impact. But whether you're an individual or a G20 leader, none of what we do matters?

I do agree we're locked into a web of incentives that discourages us from making sustainable choices. It's not any single person's fault. A few individuals giving up meat won't slow down climate change. At the same time, consuming more and more meat like we do now certainly helps accelerate it. Not to mention what we eat is only a small part of the equation. Now we're looking at changing our behaviours in many other areas too.

It's a predicament indeed. What can people actually do? They can continue business as usual, or worse, double down and consume even more, or they can change their behaviour. Each action is a vote. Just like in elections, one vote doesn't matter, a lot of votes do.

Yes it may not matter. Yes they might be hypocrites and just doing it to make their egos feel good. Or maybe they just want to be more compassionate and do what they can to contribute no matter how small. And in a violent world like ours, if there are people wanting to make compassionate choices, we should encourage them.

What about at scale? Meaning many individuals?

Yes you are right. But so have the majority of people alive today with phones connected to the Internet. It's hard to be perfect in today's world.

Unnecessary startup cash-grabs are no good indeed. Maybe one day they'll see it your way and abandon high-carbon pursuits. But for now if they're taking steps towards being sustainable, then let's encourage them.

If you don't want to be convinced then you won't be convinced regardless of any ethical arguments or data-backed evidence. That's fine, not everyone can be rational and open-minded, but please don't discourage others from making compassionate choices.

Oh wow you're right! Fossil-fueled industrialisation and athletes jetting around to participate in sporting events have released more carbon into the air, contributing to climate change! This is such an eye-opening insight!

Choosing not to have kids is still an uncommon stance. Are they really presenting themselves as martyrs, or just trying to normalise an unpopular idea that has merits? Is it helpful to dismiss them like that? Maybe they're not the same ones doing high carbon pursuits?

If it's really not a big deal, then we can just accept others' differences without getting annoyed.

All your points are great, but please don't discourage others to make ethical personal choices. Our culture needs to change and become more compassionate, sustainable and wise in terms the long-term impact of our actions.

How does a culture change? It starts with a courageous minority [1], composed of many individuals, who have "no impact as a consumer" but collectively they do have the power to influence the majority.

[1] https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dict...

It is not punishing to stop eating animals. It may seem that way if you're not used to it, but it is a fulfilling and healthy way to live with compassion for our planet and fellow living beings; who have consciousness, personality, love for their families and desire to live just like us.

Yes it is not effective if you're the only one in the world doing it, but it has always been about convincing others to drastically reduce or stop completely, whether through word of mouth or policy change.

Producing animal products is unsustainable and come with enormous environmental impacts [1][2]. We need both top-down and bottom-up approaches. So it's worthwhile what individuals and companies/governments choose to do. It's not one or the other.

[1] https://ourworldindata.org/environmental-impacts-of-food [2] https://ourworldindata.org/land-use