anondog

I'm not sure what all the fuss is about re: a man's right to choose death.

At the risk of sounding a bit nihilistic, we are just organisms on a spinning rock in space and (I guess) our purpose is to propagate our DNA? What if your DNA is shit, though? I've got an anxiety issue I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. Half of my days on this earth are spent in what can best be described as severe jet-lag due to anxiety-related sleep issues.

Because of this, I feel very little joy, have difficulty with a 9-5 job and my relationships suffer, big-time. Girls like me well enough, but I've chosen to stay single and not reproduce because I don't think anyone should have to go through what I've gone through. I fear passing my shit onto someone else.

On top of all that, the world we live in is just monstrously horrible. Most of the world's resources are held by a very, very small minority of the uber-rich and the rest of us are in pseudo-slavery to them. If a part of the world doesn't matter to this group, fuck it, let them die of ebola or whatever.

So getting back to the point, if I want to make a rational decision to kill myself, similar to my rational decision not to reproduce, why shouldn't I be able to do that? If my life doesn't bring me any joy and my presence is a net-negative to humanity, why wouldn't I do it?

I should note that I absolutely will not kill myself because I have family that would be devastated/scarred, including some young nephews and a niece. I won't do that to them. I've chosen to live it out and do whatever I can to minimize the pain.

No kidding. The horrible grammar is reminiscent of those letters, too.

How well did you know the cofounder beforehand?

This is very much part of my frustration. I put my pseudo-resume on CFL and got blasted with dozens of requests, so many that I had to put assholish "don't contact me unless" prerequisites on my profile. But here's the thing I've realized (and maybe you did, more painfully): I know not to get involved with a stranger or even an acquaintance that I haven't known for years. Finding someone who can produce at an obsessive, passionate level like you (hopefully) will is extremely difficult and riddled with risk. Heck, just finding someone who is a net positive is hard enough.

If you co-found with a non-bestie, not only are you taking all that risk on yourself, but investors are going to look the other way. They know it better than anyone: startup teams are like marriages. It can get ugly really, really quickly, completely obliterating the business in the process.

I have an unhealthy envy of some cofounding teams that just were, no work involved at all. It's like they took the undisputed hardest part of starting a company and just sidestepped it. Digital Ocean is a team of brothers, for example. Many big startups were formed out of happenstance high school or college buddies. But guess what? When you grow up in a tiny town in flyover country where entrepreneurship is unheard of, those people don't exist. I did go to a top-10 university, but it wasn't particularly entrepreneurial like Stanford or Berkeley. Everyone I knew there is now a banker, lawyer, doctor, etc. My only engineering buddy from college has been at Microsoft for 12 years and has two kids, and even still, I've made several unsuccessful runs at him (and others).

I'm allowing myself to be a little whinier than I would under a real account, so sorry if it sounds ultra-negative.

Meh, in for a penny...

Dear God I hate the concept of marriage. It has stolen all my friends and all my potential co-founders. I secretly celebrate divorce.

In my view, there are three strata of businesses that a person can start:

1. Small business - Bakery, barber shop, golf store 2. Lifestyle startup - Unique product, smallish market, little chance of liquidity event 3. Venture - Startups with the potential for massive, fast growth

Every time I think about starting #1, I dismiss it immediately. I see it as merely the illusion of freedom.

A girl from my hometown opened a Pure Barre. Sure, she doesn't have a "boss", per se, but she's still working like a dog to send most of her money to the .1% -- the rent she pays in the shopping center, the utility bills, the franchise fees, the Gatorade she sells from the fridge, the fridge itself, etc... and probably makes <$30k for herself.

There are exceptions, but generally I think the same thing is true of restaurants, bars, computer repair shops and franchisees of all stripes.

Having experienced #2, first-hand, I can tell you that it's much harder to do than it sounds. I think the universe wants growth or death in all things. Hanging out -- safely -- in equilibrium between them is a rare feat.

If you aim at a market that's a bit too large, you're going to get crushed by the big boys. In fact, there are myriad examples of large corporations butting into small markets first discovered by startups because, heck, why not? The big corporation has the resources to inject itself into the small market on the off chance that there's actually something there. It's like buying insurance.

If you aim at a market that's too small, then you don't make any money and you're on your own to pull it off because no (worthwhile) investor should want to get into a small market with MAYBE a $5m buyout years down the road. Ditto good co-founders and employees. If you're able to get investors and rock-star help, you're probably in "venture" territory, not "lifestyle".

What happens with a lifestyle biz is you end up turning a small profit and living on the edge, fearing that something doesn't go horribly wrong. One lawsuit... one legislative change... you, the lifeblood of the company, have a medical emergency... and it all goes poof.

Worst of all, you're stuck. Because it's a middling market, it's difficult to find anybody who could run it in your stead (they're at Google, etc), so it's always and forever on you.

Again, there are many exceptions. Like the guy who runs The Chive or the guy who runs Fark. It's possible, just harder than it sounds. If you're going to take all the risk and invest your time, why would you knowingly aim small like that?

No, for my money, #3, swinging for the fences, is the only way to go. Anything short of that is setting yourself up for years of anxiety and frustration with little chance of making real money. I'd rather put my money on red or black and see how it turns out quickly.

Did you get "never have to work again rich" through software?

It feels pretty stupid to reply to this as a "no", but to offset the incredibly depressing stories of random luck success, I figured I'd go ahead with it anyway.

No, I'm not rich. I'm 33 and dead broke, actually.

How did you do it?

I started my first company (a video-related SaaS B2B product) at age 22 and it should have been a home run. The idea and timing were perfect and I found product-market fit almost immediately, cold-calling my way to paying customers 10 months after quitting my previous job.

But I fucked it up. I was too young. My engineering was shitty (wasted all my time putting out fires), but more damningly, I tried to grow the business organically. I'd never been exposed to "real" entrepreneurship before and didn't know anything about venture funding. By the time I realized I needed to raise money (and actually going as far as signing a $1M+ term sheet with a group of shitty investors), it was already too late.

The old guard companies in the space I set out to bankrupt did, indeed, go bankrupt, but it was another startup with the same idea and technology as mine that put the screws to them. While I was trying to turn a profit and make payroll, these other startups just passed me by like I was standing still.

What did it feel like when you first realised it was going to be true that you would never have to work again if you didn't want to?

Re-interpreted as "what did it feel like when success slipped through your fingers?"

The business was doomed by 2006, but I "stuck with it" (following bad advice) and pivoted (more bad advice) until 2010 when I finally gave up. I wasn't exposed to the concept of failing fast until later.

There was no real moment in time I knew the dream was over, but I fell into a deep depression. Thinking funding was imminent, I'd borrowed money and found myself $75k in debt after all the work and sacrifice.

I finally pulled myself out of the depression and was able to pay back most of my debt within 2 years of being in the "working world".

How old were you?

Company started at 22, on life support by 27, ended at 30. 2 jobs and 2-3 more startup attempts since then (one was a pivot, really). Now I'm 34.

What was it specifically that made the cash that ended up in your pocket?

Like I said, I found product-market fit. Had I executed properly, as my competitors did, I'd be a multi-millionaire today.

I've tried to start 3 more companies since then, each better engineered and executed than the last, but none of them found the beginner's luck "fit" of the first.

What was different about the first? I experienced a pain point first hand in an obscure occupation. I don't want to get into specifics, but my first job out of college was as a peon in a non-tech industry. I saw a glaring inefficiency in one of the business processes and knew I could fix it with software.

Of my 3 product/usiness attempts since then, 2 solved problems I perceived from outside an industry that weren't really that problematic after all and 1 was/is a consumer product. For the consumer product, the problem I'm trying to solve is really a problem, but it's visible to many, many more people.

When you have a unique vantage point on an obscure problem, your chances of being the guy to solve it are much better.

Do you feel happy in your life?

No. It gets really dark sometimes.

When I was running my first company, I was energetic and blissfully self-confident. Now I'm a heap of bitter frustration and anxiety with crippling sleep problems.

After I finally gave up pivoting and "persevering" on that first business, I had a 2-year "working world" tenure that was so painful I can't even talk about it under an anon account.

Entrepreneurship courses through my veins and I can't turn it off. But I've gone through my Rolodex of acquaintances a thousand times and can't find a viable co-founder for a new business. No cofounder = no accelerator = constantly stuck in neutral. The thought of going back to a cube job makes me break out into a sweat -- literally. (Echoing an above poster.)

All I can do at this point is try to start new businesses on my own and get traction like I did the first time. There is no other viable path for me.

TL;DR I was a 22-year-old wunderkind whose company crashed, career melted and am now a 34-year-old has-been.

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Epilogue: A friend of mine went to a state university and applied to his dream job at Microsoft upon graduating. He got rejected and ended up taking a position at his backup, Google... in 2002. Made a boatload (but not retirement money) in the IPO, was heavily recruited by the most hyped startup of the late 2000s (he admitted it was only because of the Google name), and is now an angel investor.

Life is fucked up and random, my friends. Signal and noise.

Brilliant point about the retirement homes. I'd never thought of them that way.

This is the $64,000 question and I actually believe there might be a business (or several) to be had in this space. As people increasingly forego marriage and pursue solo lives and careers, they need more alternatives for support and camaraderie. (And these people have disposable cash.)

Anyway, as it stands, I think the best option is to try to work at a place with other young, career-oriented (as opposed to family-oriented) people. I've tried young professionals associations and athletic teams, but they didn't work. The young professional stuff seemed too forced -- like singles dating -- and you don't get enough "talk time" with sports teams: you're too busy playing the game.

Truthfully, most of my friends in this city have come from playing Magic the Gathering. There were a few semi-normal, hygiene-conscious guys in the crowd and we get together on a semi-regular basis. We're not as close as my college buddies and I can't get them to go out doing the fun stuff I used to do, but it's good enough.

If you live in small town america, making friends might be difficult or impossible. I actually went to a therapist when I was really depressed and told him how much I hate this city. I told him I thought it was very cliquish (exclusive to newcomers like myself), that every girl worth having is married at 25 and that every guy friend I make gets stolen away by marriage.

I expected him to say "Suck it up. Go meet people." His response was actually "Ok so maybe you need to move to a place with more independent, career-minded folks like yourself." In other words, sometimes circumstances really are the problem, not you.

I want to reiterate my original point: I'm as white and normal as it gets. I can't blame any personality-related, aesthetic, racial or economic disadvantage, and yet I'm still a sometimes-depressed-and-unhappy loner.

The only thing left to blame is my introversion.

One last point: I, like many millennials, was raised by my parents and the media to believe I am the center of the universe. Accordingly, my empathy quotient has historically been crappy. Then I had some life events a few years ago that jarringly recalibrated my ego. As painful as these events were, I'm not as full of myself nor as big an asshole as I used to be and I'm finding it easier to relate to other people as well as make and keep friends.

Read articles and writings by David Wong (aka Jason Pargin). He's the patron saint of self-righteous millennial deprogramming.

(Anonymous bc this is a very honest comment.)

I'm a massive introvert who spends most of his time coding, playing video games or Magic the Gathering, and my life has devolved 3 times into full-blown WoW addiction -- the fool's gold life people take on when they feel their real one sucks.

I have almost no friends, hate making plans and, generally, would rather be alone. "Hell is other people" is my motto.

And of course, this lack of relationships makes me very sad sometimes. The short term desire to be alone leads to long term sadness.

But here's where our stories diverge: I'm a tall, likeable (when I want to be), charismatic, good-looking, athletic white guy and can pick up women at will.

And yet, even though I can turn on the charm at will and get what I want (coincidentally, I'm a sales engineer), I'm still totally alone most of the time. This makes me feel like an outsider, an outcast, a loner, etc and the sadness can get uncomfortably dark.

So here's my point: As someone said earlier it's our desire to be alone that's the real problem, not what you look like or what your accent sounds like.

Introversion is a constant sabotage of happiness. If you don't maintain and work at friendships consistently over a long period of time, they will deteriorate. And doing that is nearly impossible for a "hell is other people" introvert.

The best solution, I've found, is to take the plunge and join a structured organization or group that you can't easily get out of. Being in college, specifically a fraternity, was the best time of my life. It forced me to be social and interact with other people, even when I didn't really want to. I think a healthy work environment with other people your age can help, too. It did for me.

One other note: I felt the same "Why is everyone else out having fun and I'm not?" feeling very profoundly in my mid-to-late 20s. It was a consuming, jealous, rage-inducing feeling. But now I'm 33 and I haven't felt that in years now. I don't even know why. Did I stop thinking that was a desirable thing? Or did I just give up?

TL;DR

1. Don't blame your appearance or awkwardness. The real problem is your short term desire to be alone. 2. Join a social or work structure that forces you to interact with others. 3. The jealousy of others' social activity should dissipate with age. Mine did.

p.s. Also, get off of Facebook. People are only posting pictures of their happy times, so all you get is an artificial stream of happy happy happy. This will inevitably make you feel worse. Facebook image crafters are probably just as unhappy as everyone else. They're working awfully hard to prove otherwise, aren't they?